No Valk invincibility but Wukong is a-okay?

[(PSN)EVILFLUFFMONSTER]

Basically, just use Chroma *wink*.

Who uses Wukong? Only person I ever see is myself.

[Neptlude]

They removed valk's invincibility?

[Alcatraz]

2 minutes ago, Neptlude said:

They removed valk's invincibility?

No just people play her still with low energy and low efficiency is all. Sucks her energy too fast because it has a energy scale which scales up to be using 100% more energy the longer you use the skill.

I.E Blind Rage.

[Neptlude]

3 minutes ago, Alcatraz said:

No just people play her still with low energy and low efficiency is all. Sucks her energy too fast because it has a energy scale which scales up to be using 100% more energy the longer you use the skill.

I.E Blind Rage.

Derp... `-` I thought they removed due to the title..

Havent played her a while so i tested her out and its till the same `-` Much stronger tho due to my RNG cat gave her red crits on hysteria mode... lol 

[Dobermann92]

Because almost nobody plays as Wukong, that is why.

[Jamescell]

Solution: Nerf both and make them useful in other ways.

[VisionAndVoice]

1 hour ago, Brachion said:

Defy quickly becomes far less useful at high levels since you'll be "dying" so fast that you'll run out of energy in seconds. In addition, without Defy, Wukong's fairly squishy, so he needs it to do any sort of tanking.

If you have Rage it becomse the other way around though. He performs better under stronger fire as enemies hit him hard enough to instantly replenish energy, mitigating any losses from the ability, allowing him to use Defy for longer without toggling it.

[rawr1254]

And we also like to ignore the fact that:

Amesha was just released and has psuedo godmode.

Hydroid has godmode in undertow

Loki has "godmode" in invisibility

Trinity has demi-god mode

And Zephyr has psuedo godmode with Turbulence

And EVERY frame has godmode with Naramon

But yea lets just ignore that fact that Valkyr pretty much is to the point we cant use Hysteria anymore.

 

If this is truly "rage" mode then duration should be re-added to the ability. If it's truly a rage mode it shouldnt be able to be channeled infinitely. But instead lets kills increase the duration similar to eternal wars. Only each kill starts with say 2 seconds per kill and every 5 kills decreases the duration increase by .5.

 

[FreezerFlare]

1 hour ago, AurumandArgentum said:

They want you to use her four, just not for a whole mission the entire damn time.

This.

I like using the Orthos with Eternal war for just stupid AOE damage. and then jumping into hysteria whenever I need to heal.

[Eldnacpeek]

He gets a free pass to be immortal because there is nothing he can do with it anyway; his other abilities are so ineffective and crappy that Defy ends up being used as pity points. "Aww, the poor thing thinks he's helping; maybe he actually will one day."

He's squishy as hell and incredibly slow, so Defy is his only saving grace, Cloud Walker terrible enough to be considered irrelevant. The very second Wukong runs out of energy signs his death warrant. Damn, this seems very opinionated, sorry about that.

[taiiat]

1 hour ago, Damageplay said:

Valkyr is the "melee/berserker" frame yet they want you to NOT use her 4? wut

being nigh indestructible outright doesn't match the Berserker Archetype anyways, if you want to go by Archetype designs.

[Grimlock84]

15 minutes ago, rawr1254 said:

Amesha was just released and has psuedo godmode.

All of the archwings are op asf when compared to warframes

16 minutes ago, rawr1254 said:

Hydroid has godmode in undertow

HaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHa. don't graps at straws it weakens your argument

17 minutes ago, rawr1254 said:

Loki has "godmode" in invisibility

No he has lack of detection, he can still very easily die.

18 minutes ago, rawr1254 said:

Trinity has demi-god mode

No she has damage reduction, invincibility lets you survive levels 150-200. the damage reduction will not

19 minutes ago, rawr1254 said:

And Zephyr has psuedo godmode with Turbulence

It's a high cost duration based glitchy ability that must be recast every 30ish seconds

21 minutes ago, rawr1254 said:

And EVERY frame has godmode with Naramon

Which includes valkyr so this one means absolutly nothing in an "Valkyr is bad now" setting

22 minutes ago, rawr1254 said:

But yea lets just ignore that fact that Valkyr pretty much is to the point we cant use Hysteria anymore.

my 0 reactor and 0 forma valkyr can keep a hysteria up on just her base energy for 35 seconds. so yeah enjoy the 30 seconds of pure godmode that can be extended even further through actual modding and extended by energy pickups

[Xgomme]

Defy should attract mobs to wukong, beside that it's fine

[Evanescent]

Of course not. Invincibility abilities in general are just lazy.

[achromos]

2 hours ago, Damageplay said:

When you use Defy, you get some invincibility time. You can use that to readjust yourself and get a second to breathe. That little bit of invincibility time is all he needs honestly. 

 

Iron skin can do the SAME if not better with the proper setup then defy.  Lets nerf that.

 

Invisibility can do the same thing technically as long as you are aware of positioning, so let's nerf that for loki and ivara.

 

You can be rather hard to kill by utilizing Mag's magnitize ability and stepping inside it.

 

Mesa can be pretty much invulnerable with barely any power strength invnestment while using shatter shield, AND for melee enemies just pop shooting gallary and be amazed. 

 

Defy is the lowest level of 'invincibility'

 

so... yea.

[(PSN)Tactless_Ninja]

37 minutes ago, rawr1254 said:

Hydroid has godmode in undertow

Ever see that Tales from the Crypt episode where this guy dies but he's aware of everything happening around him?

[Rolunde]

As someone that really wanted to make Hydroid work and had some fun playing him for a while, God mod?! Are Serious?! Hydroid kinda sucks.

Laying in a puddle doing nothing but maybe trolling a few mobs and while Leeches can still leech, ahahaha.... god of puddles I guess?

Honestly IMO his "wave" ability (Tidal Surge) is better than his puddle, and that's probably not really saying much. 

And as to Loki, no, no god mode there either, to really run out the Stealth he's almost certainly going to sacrifice any and all other forms of Survival. It's super easy to catch stray rounds meant for someone else, or even worse get caught in AoEs not even meant for you. Even if you stay highly mobile and work at not getting caught in the crossfire, again if there are leeches around you can find your energy running out and no Stealth means a very bad time.

Plus he has other powers that are great and require energy, if you're not using those powers, well IMO you're doing it wrong. Decoy has value and Disarm is amazing!
But "higher level" disarmed mobs can still give you a good whack in melee if you're out of Invis.

Get lit on fire, he's toast!

Never heard of Zephyr listed as a God mode, Invulnerable frame before.  Did you count Mesa on there too then? And yeah Chroma too.

Trinity, hasn't the poor galbeen through enough already?! 

 

[Senketsu_]

what happened to Valkyr?

[achromos]

1 minute ago, Senketsu_ said:

what happened to Valkyr?

 

People don't know that they have to actually forma once or twice and switch their mods up a bit to still use hysteria.

[Senketsu_]

Just now, achromos said:

 

People don't know that they have to actually forma once or twice and switch their mods up a bit to still use hysteria.

but what was changed?

[(PSN)Tactless_Ninja]

Maybe they can rework Hydroid so he can transform into a squid while in the puddle. You're a kid, he's a squid now!

Edited July 27, 2016 by (PS4)Tactless_Ninja

[achromos]

Just now, Senketsu_ said:

but what was changed?

Valkyr Changes
•    Hysteria is Valkyr's Rage Mode - we teased and released her as a Berserker frame and we've iterated on Hysteria a couple of times since release. We are returning to this power to reign in its issues but still thematically invoke her ultimate rage. 

•    The relationship between time spent in Hysteria and energy & incoming damage has changed in two ways.

•    Firstly, the longer you stay in Hysteria, the more Energy it'll cost you. (but the energy drain ramp up is capped). 

•    Secondly, while in Hysteria you are still invulnerable - the current Hysteria indicator on the UI tells you how much incoming damage you've absorbed and mitigated. The longer you stay in Hysteria, the less effective the mitigation of incoming damage is on the 'End Hysteria' phase. Ending your Hysteria session should be done with care - ensuring no enemies are in the range of Valkyrs Hysteria Aura (20 meters max, they have to be able to see you), or you will take the damage. How you choose to dispose of these enemies is up to you - either kill them, or get a safe distance away to deactivate Hysteria.

[Eldnacpeek]

23 minutes ago, Evanescent said:

Of course not. Invincibility abilities in general are just lazy.

 

Quite so. Something like Hysteria, where it grants you invincibility but also puts you in a standalone melee stance is fun. General invincibility that does nothing more than that isn't exciting at all. While I personally think Defy should just be replaced with something actually fun to use, I think Wukong can use a rework/second look entirely.

No, I don't find Defy overpowered; just a snore of an ability that could have been something unique and enjoyable.

Edited July 27, 2016 by LazerSkink

[Jicematoro]

Hysteria and Defy share common ground, they're both about keeping the frame alive, but ultimately work different.

Hysteria is a Drain ability that lasts until either Valkyr runs out of energy (Valkyr gets up to 425 Energy with a Primed Flow), or is deactivated (by Pressing 4 or getting Dispel'd), In it, Valkyr is completely invulnerable to Damage and Procs, and gets what might be the strongest meele weapon in the game. Unnefective against almost anything that requires aiming (Try killing Sargas Ruk or Lephantis using only Hysteria) but effective against Low to moderarely High leveled mobs (Even Ospreys if you have Auto-Melee targetting ON and Perform a Slide Attack). She's good at killing single targets.

The more you use it without Re-casting the more energy it'll consume (starts at 0,625 energy per second, Capping at 100%, 3,75 energy per second), meaning you probably want to deactivate and cast it again often to save energy, but if you do it mindlessly or run out of energy, there's a good chance you'll die in the spot. While on Hysteria, Valkyr can only recover energy through Energy Orbs (Only through RNG, Basically)

Defy on the other hand does not protect Wukong from anything, but revitalizes him when his health hits 0, the more he dies, the less Health he gets each time (By the third time getting back less than 50% health), each time he dies, he loses 25% of his current Energy but gets a couple of Seconds of invincivility, the ability lasts up to 14,1 seconds with max duration, and drains 1.25 energy per second (Just as Valkyr, he's got a maximum pool of 425 Energy with Primed Flow). While on Defy, Wukong can only restore energy through Energy spheres, and by receiving damage with Rage equipped, which yes, can effectively make a small loop, but it's weakened every single time he dies. In combo with a Life Strike Melee it can be extended, but just barely against High-Leveled Mobs. Deactivating and Recasting defy has absolutely no penalty (Of course, that does not mean you can do that in the middle of fire fight without dying).

Defy is not as durable, nor as efficient as Hysteria, BUT you have access to all your weapons while on it (Meaning you can hit enemies at a distance and not necessarily focus on a single target), and as long as you don't remain stationary, you should be able to sponge enough damage, making it slightly more versatile.

That said, Valkyr IS less likely to die, so she can Revive allies or Hack consoles at any moment, while Wukong can only do it on low to mid leveled maps. An Invincible Mano a Mano frame vs a Durable All ranges frame.

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong anywhere.

Edited July 27, 2016 by Jicematoro
Fixing some numbers here and there.

[DeMonkey]

7 minutes ago, LazerSkink said:

Quite so. Something like Hysteria, where it grants you invincibility but also puts you in a unique melee stance is fun. General invincibility that does nothing more than that isn't fun at all. While I personally think Defy should just be replaced with something actually fun to use, I think Wukong can use a rework/second look entirely.

No, I don't find Defy overpowered; just a snore of an ability that could have been something unique and enjoyable.

I don't think there's been a single Wukong change since he was released.

Oh, wait they fixed the bug where you could roll whilst in CW, so you have to move at a snail pace.

Hopefully he gets reworked one day, I like Primal Fury, I like the idea of CW and I like poking enemies into space. Defy is bleh. But it will likely stay that way for another year at least. 

Look at Chroma for instance, well over a year and his firs ability is still irrelevant.