Plains of Eidolon: Facts & Fundamentals of Focus 2.0

[letir]

I'm not looking forward to new Energize Dash. Call me lazy, unimaginative casual, I don't want to interrupt my 40+ Survival run every 30 second. It will be good buff for stationary and semi-stationary missions like Defense/Mobile Defense, but amount of hassle to place bubble will outweight usefulness in the end.

[tnccs215]

1 hour ago, phoenix1992 said:

 - in a Horde rush game, you will burn trough your energy pool in negative time. If it was proper channeled ability with preset drain (like let's say 3-4), it would see a lot more use.

YUsually I go "wait, why did my energy reserves went to zero? 

... 

Oh yeah. 

I thought about Channeling." 

[Kaotyke]

18 minutes ago, letir said:

I'm not looking forward to new Energize Dash. Call me lazy, unimaginative casual, I don't want to interrupt my 40+ Survival run every 30 second. It will be good buff for stationary and semi-stationary missions like Defense/Mobile Defense, but amount of hassle to place bubble will outweight usefulness in the end.

Dude, thats 150 energy, and the other passive allows us to get 37,5 energy per Energy Orb (25 at once and 50% of it over 5s), this will only bother if you spam like no tommorrow or wants your energy topped at all damn times.

[phoenix1992]

1 minute ago, tnccs215 said:

YUsually I go "wait, why did my energy reserves went to zero? 

... 

Oh yeah. 

I thought about Channeling." 

I love my Orthos Prime.
I like how channeling looks.
My energy total does not like Orthos Prime or channeling.
@Kaotyke i was just joking damn it.

[tnccs215]

6 minutes ago, phoenix1992 said:

I love my Orthos Prime.
I like how channeling looks.
My energy total does not like Orthos Prime or channeling.
@Kaotyke i was just joking damn it.

Your energy does not like any melee weapon tbh. Except maybe the Fragor Prime. And even that is just tolerance. 

[Chroia]

Nothing to see here.

[Chroia]

5 hours ago, phoenix1992 said:

I meant that on base mod building, I can't make Titania go under 1.25 energy per second for some reason. But I can go down to 0.85 with Ember and Valk, I was not aware that for some frames there is additional limiter.

If I'm missing some context (haven't read the thread), please pardon me.

It depends on the ability's base energy cost.

Like all abilities, you're capped at -75% energy cost; or 25% base cost.
World on Fire has a base of 3/sec, which means it can be modded down to (3 * 0.25 =) 0.75 e/s.
Similarly, Hysteria has an initial base of 2.5/sec, for a moddable (2.5 * 0.25 =) 0.625 e/s

Razorwing, otoh, has a base cost of 5/sec. 5*0.25 = 1.25 e/s, which is why you can't mod lower - you've already hit the capped minimum value.

[Eldnacpeek]

9 hours ago, [DE]Danielle said:

On the one hand - right now is that enough life? Possibly not.

 

It's not. Channeling is still greatly flawed. The only thing useful it grants is Life Strike, and even then that still requires use of a mod slot. I'm glad it's being acknowledged though, hopefully we won't have to wait long.

[Archwizard]

Took some notes on each of the Focus trees, so here you go:

• Each tree will require 100 capacity from the focus "Pool" up top in order to cap out, which took about 5 million focus to do, excluding the costs of nodes
• Each tree has 2 "Residuals", one of which is always the starting node, the other will be a single-node branch
  • Residuals are proc effects that are activated by entering Operator mode or using your Operator ability, and remain active for the remainder of the mission
  • Residual nodes are hexagonal
• Each tree has branches for the Void Dash, Blast (melee) and Mode (stealth crouch), respectively
  • These nodes will increase the energy cost of affected abilities in addition to the bonuses provided
  • Nodes on these branches are circular and are unlocked with the War Within
• Each tree has a branch with two "Way-bound" nodes 
  • Way-bound nodes are Operator passives that, as their capstone rank, can be "unbound" to use with any Focus school active
  • Capping (or "unbinding") the final rank of each Way-bound effect requires a "Brilliant Eidolon Shard" to unlock, in addition to 1 million Focus
  • Way-bound nodes are also hexagonal
• Once unlocked, individual nodes of the tree can be deactivated at no additional cost
• Unlocking nodes will no longer increase the cooldown of your Operator ability
• Transitioning to/from your Operator occurs more quickly, and Operators will inherit momentum from your Warframe if you switch mid-parkour
  • Operators can now slide and have new death animations
  • Ability energy is now separated from the Void Beam ammo, and features a new UI element
• Amp weapons for your Operator affect the beam attack, and can apparently be ranked up; no other information is provided
• Some of the passives available in the previous iteration of Focus will be available as Arcanes (although which have not been specified - here's hoping for Shadow Step)
• I didn't provide the growth values, because all provided values are subject to change

NARAMON

Spoiler

Starting node (RESIDUAL):
Affinity Spike (6 ranks) - Increased Affinity from Melee kills

Branch 1 (RESIDUAL):
Power Spike (4 ranks) - Increased melee damage Changed to "The melee count will decay by a maximum amount over time"

Branch 2:
Executing Dash (4 ranks) - Instead of throwing enemies, Void Dash opens them to finishers and increases finisher damage taken
Surging Dash (6 ranks) - Void Dash base damage and damage radius (ie width) are increased

Branch 3:
Disorienting Blast (4 ranks) - Void Blast has a chance to Confuse enemies (a la Mind Spike, Chaos, Irradiating Disarm)
Disarming Blast (6 ranks) - Void Blast has a chance to Disarm enemies (a la Radial Disarm, Nyx's passive)

Branch 4:
Void Stalker (4 ranks) - Entering Void Mode increases melee Crit Chance (stacks a la Point Strike) over 5 sec, but this bonus diminishes over 20 sec upon exiting Void Mode
Void Hunter (4 ranks) - Enemies within range can be seen through walls while in Void Mode (a la Zenith)

Branch 5 (WAY-BOUND):
Mind Step (4 ranks + capstone) - Increased Operator movement speed (including slide speed)
Mind Sprint (4 ranks + capstone) - Increased Void Dash travel distance

VAZARIN

Spoiler

Starting node (RESIDUAL):
Mending Unity (4 ranks) - Increases Affinity range

Branch 1 (RESIDUAL):
Mending Soul (4 ranks) - The next X revives after activating Operator will be instantaneous

Branch 2:
Protective Dash (4 ranks) - Void Dash grants damage immunity to allies it passes through (including the user)
Sonic Dash (4 ranks) - Instead of throwing enemies, Void Dash releases a traveling shockwave that stuns enemies

Branch 3:
Guardian Shell (6 ranks) - Void Blast can be charged to create a barrier that drains Operator energy when struck, instead of health
Guardian Blast (4 ranks) - Void Blast restores a flat amount of shields to allies struck

Branch 4:
Void Regen (4 ranks) - Void Mode periodically heals the user while active
Void Aegis (4 ranks) - Void Mode emits a protective barrier that grows to a maximum size over 5 sec

Branch 5 (WAY-BOUND):
Enduring Tides (4 ranks + capstone) - Increased Operator health pool
Rejuvenating Tides (4 ranks + capstone) - Operator regenerates health every second

UNAIRU

Spoiler

Starting node (RESIDUAL):
Mirror Flare (6 ranks) - Passively reflects a percentage of taken back to attackers

Branch 1 (RESIDUAL):
Stone Skin (4 ranks) - Operator and Warframe armor are increased (stacks a la Steel Fiber)

Branch 2:
Sundering Dash (6 ranks) - Void Dash will reduce armor of enemies it passes through
Crippling Dash (4 ranks) - Void Dash will reduce damage dealt by enemies it passes through

Branch 3:
Magnetic Blast (4 ranks) - Void Blast places a personal Bullet Attractor on enemies struck for a limited period
Unairu Wisp (4 ranks) - Void Blast has a chance to summon a Wisp that can be picked up by allies to increase their Operator damage dealt

Branch 4: 
Void Shadow (4 ranks) - Void Mode grants invisibility to allies within range
Void Chrysalis (4 ranks) - While you channel Void Mode, invisible allies within range gain mitigation

Branch 5 (WAY-BOUND):
Basilisk Scales (4 ranks + capstone) - Increased Operator armor
Basilisk Gaze (4 ranks + capstone) - Increased Void Blast effect radius

ZENURIK

Spoiler

Starting node (RESIDUAL):  
Energy Pulse (6 ranks) - Energy Orbs grant a percentage of bonus energy over (inversely affected) time

Branch 1 (RESIDUAL):
Inner Might (6 ranks) - Increased Channeling efficiency on melee attacks

Branch 2:
Energizing Dash (6 ranks) - Void Dash leaves behind a zone that grants an energy regeneration buff to allies who pass through it (a la the armor buff from Hallowed Ground) for 30 sec; players can stack the effects of multiple Zenurik users' zones at once
Lightning Dash (4 ranks) - Void Dash creates ball lightning that travels slowly and zaps nearby enemies

Branch 3:
Temporal Blast (6 ranks) - Void Blast slows enemies for a period
Voltaic Blast (4 ranks) - Void Blast chains to nearby enemies for increased damage

Branch 4:
Void Static (4 ranks) - Void Mode emits electrical pulses throughout the duration that deal Electrical damage in a radius
Void Singularity (4 ranks) - Void Mode pulls enemies within range towards the Operator while active

Branch 5 (WAY-BOUND):
Void Siphon (6 ranks + capstone) - Increased Operator Energy regeneration
Void Flow (6 ranks + capstone) - Increased Operator Energy capacity

MADURAI

Spoiler

Starting node (RESIDUAL):
Phoenix Talons (4 ranks) - Increases all Physical damage dealt

Branch 1 (RESIDUAL):
Phoenix Spirit (4 ranks) - Increases all Elemental damage dealt

Branch 2:
Blazing Dash (6 ranks) - Void Dash leaves a trail of fire (a la Nezha) that deals Heat damage over time
Meteoric Dash (4 ranks) - Void Dash deals a flat amount of additional damage to enemies

Branch 3:
Flame Blast (4 ranks) - Void Blast shoots a Fireball that explodes after a delay period, dealing a multiple of the initial Blast's damage
Rising Blast (4 ranks) - Void Blast's base damage increases, and it can be charged for additional damage

Branch 4:
Void Radiance (4 ranks) - Temporarily Blinds enemies within range after leaving Void Mode
Void Strike (6 ranks) - Void Mode generates a buff to your Operator's next damaging attack outside of the cloak, which stacks for every second that the Operator was cloaked

Branch 5 (WAY-BOUND): 
Inner Gaze (4 ranks + capstone) - Increased Void Beam/Amp ammo capacity
Eternal Gaze (6 ranks + capstone) - Increased Void Beam/Amp reload speed

 

[(PSN)Stealth_Cobra]

Now that you bring that up, having an innate life strike on channeling on the focus skill tree would be sweet. Nowadays I don't really equip life strike anymore because melee weapons have too many essential mods (point strike, prime fury or berserker, condition overload,combo counter bandaid mod , two elements, a riven mod... That leaves one mod slot free with so many candidates (Crit,more speed,more range, blood rush, maiming strike, spoiled strike, life strike).

[Kinetos]

19 minutes ago, Archwizard said:

Took some notes on each of the Focus trees, so here you go:

This is what I think the OP should have been from the start. 

[OniDax]

8 hours ago, Kaotyke said:

What are you talking about? 

Void Dash uses the same mechanic as Bullet Jumping. The only reason you dont see the Void Mode is the same as why you dont see yourself crouch before Bullet Jumping: fast button press.

Well, guess I saw it wrong. No need to be an &#! about it.

I guess I still won't be playing much of the Operator system since they obviously don't care about greatly improving the mechanics of using abilities. Glad others are excited for it, but I just can't get excited for it.

[Zeata]

So after watching the Devstream, we gain 5 energy per second for 30 seconds. A total of 150 energy in 30 seconds.

MEANWHILE, large energy pads give 400 energy over the same amount of time. You have to stay in that area for 30 seconds, but get a lot more energy in the same amount of time, for the cost of a few easily acquired resources, and a blueprint. What's the reasoning behind them giving more energy, or the operator energy bubble not giving more energy? It seems they're an equal amount of time to deploy now (which is great news for the operator), but the operator gives less energy.

[Archwizard]

12 minutes ago, Zeata said:

What's the reasoning behind them giving more energy, or the operator energy bubble not giving more energy?

Operator energy bubbles are free, and are in infinite supply.

Energy pads are crafted consumables.

If energy bubbles were more valuable than energy pads, you would literally never craft or use pads.

[Zeata]

3 minutes ago, Archwizard said:

Operator energy bubbles are free, and are in infinite supply.

Energy pads are crafted consumables.

Those crafted consumables are in such a high supply, built with easy to acquire resources it seems to be a moot point they're consumables.

But if the pads are better than the bubbles, why should I invest the few hundred thousand focus to get to the 5 energy per second when I could just use the pads for less than half the effort?

[Archwizard]

8 minutes ago, Zeata said:

it seems to be a moot point they're consumables.

Not really? You can only bring as many as you've crafted into the mission with you.
Sure you can build a hundred and bring them all in, and you probably won't use more than 10 in a Defense if you go 40 waves, but the costs eventually add up for things you can only use once each.

The basic thinking is, if you're desperate for energy right now, you pop a consumable and tap your ultimate.
Otherwise you can get free regeneration from the Operator just to top yourself off, since there is zero cost to using the Operator.
Think "super-fast Energy Siphon."

[Zeata]

2 minutes ago, Archwizard said:

Not really? You can only bring as many as you've crafted into the mission with you.

The basic thinking is, if you're desperate for energy right now, you pop a consumable and tap your ultimate.
Otherwise you can get free regeneration from the Operator just to top yourself off, since there is zero cost to using the Operator.

With them be so very easy to craft, it's easy to have a stockpile of over 100 energy pads with you per mission, and if you're on any of the planets that drop Polymer or Nano Spores you can probably craft even more when you're done. The probability of running out of energy pads is almost none for players who are able to run those missions. I don't want the bubble to be much better, 10 energy per second over 30 seconds, and if they change the pads to give out the energy over 5 seconds rather than 30 people would have reason to use both.

 

(please don't bring up the counter point 'well what if you can't farm them' because if you can get lenses and affinity enough to invest into a tree, you can farm them easily enough)

[tnccs215]

Have you considered the possibility that maybe isn't Zenurik that should be buffed, but energy pads that should get nerfed? By getting a cooldown or something? 

[Archwizard]

15 minutes ago, Zeata said:

With them be so very easy to craft, it's easy to have a stockpile of over 100 energy pads with you per mission, and if you're on any of the planets that drop Polymer or Nano Spores you can probably craft even more when you're done. The probability of running out of energy pads is almost none for players who are able to run those missions. I don't want the bubble to be much better, 10 energy per second over 30 seconds, and if they change the pads to give out the energy over 5 seconds rather than 30 people would have reason to use both.

You're ignoring the point.

Once you've sunk the cost once, Operator bubbles are free to use, forever.
It's one very expensive, but reusable energy pad.

If I'm not using a channeling-based Warframe, I probably spend an energy pad for every 4-5 waves of a Defense.
So, mathematically, let's say I spend 400 energy every four waves - assuming I'm running Flow with that build and actually retain the full 400 energy in one sitting, rather than letting half of those pulses go to waste.
If I chose to use Operator bubbles more frequently than that to keep myself topped off consistently, rather than a pad every 4 waves, I'd just need to use 3 bubbles over the course of approximately a minute and a half.
I would not need to use energy pads unless I'm facing an Energy Leech Eximus. 

Each time you invest the cost for a consumable, you get one charge for that consumable, and you have to decide whether to use it now, or later.
Yes each individual unit is cheap, so a player who has invested a hundred hours in the game probably isn't worried about the cost of one unit at a time - but it's a constant upkeep cost that adds up over time, especially if you're bringing in one or two hundred units.

If I'm desperate for energy now, I pop a pad, maybe even two. If not, I just need to make a bubble right before or after I recast my buffs.

I'm giving you the explanation you asked for, and in terms of game balance, the explanation I have given is a reasonable one.

[Kaotyke]

1 minute ago, tnccs215 said:

Have you considered the possibility that maybe isn't Zenurik that should be buffed, but energy pads that should get nerfed? By getting a cooldown or something? 

Dont they already?

Wait 7,5s for each pulse in the same place.

Othewise you have to spam the button to top yourself in a second, and waste all the other pulses.

"But I have resources! I can spam them!"

Good for you, now allow me to use the other option because I dont waste resources.

[Zeata]

11 minutes ago, tnccs215 said:

Have you considered the possibility that maybe isn't Zenurik that should be buffed, but energy pads that should get nerfed? By getting a cooldown or something? 

They have a cooldown. 7.5 seconds between waves. They still give more energy in the same amount of time, using only 1.

[jwya]

No shadow step replacement?

 

Tho in other news, would the other schools have buffs that apply to both self and allies? The bubble for Zenurik was cool, but all the buffs for Madurai seem to be personal

[Archwizard]

Just now, jwya said:

No shadow step replacement?

 

Tho in other news, would the other schools have buffs that apply to both self and allies? The bubble for Zenurik was cool, but all the buffs for Madurai seem to be personal

I gotchu, fam.

[Zeata]

18 minutes ago, Archwizard said:

You're ignoring the point.

Once you've sunk the cost once, Operator bubbles are free to use, forever.
It's one very expensive, but reusable energy pad.

If I'm not using a channeling-based Warframe, I probably spend an energy pad for every 4-5 waves of a Defense.
So, mathematically, let's say I spend 400 energy every four waves - assuming I'm running Flow with that build and actually retain the full 400 energy in one sitting.
If I chose to use Operator bubbles more frequently than that to keep myself topped off consistently, rather than a pad every 4 waves, I'd just need to use 3 bubbles over the course of approximately a minute and a half.
I would not need to use energy pads unless I'm facing an Energy Leech Eximus. 

Each time you invest the cost for a consumable, you get one charge for that consumable, and you have to decide whether to use it now, or later.
Yes each individual unit is cheap, so a player who has invested a hundred hours in the game probably isn't worried about the cost of one unit at a time - but it's a constant upkeep cost that adds up over time, especially if you're bringing in one or two hundred units.

I'm giving you the explanation you asked for, and in terms of game balance, the explanation I have given is a reasonable one.

You're right, it's reasonable. I'm not saying it's not. But I LIKE playing energy hungry frames, Mesa, Ember, Banshee and even Chroma (high power strength, 90% efficiency, takes ~130 energy per 60 seconds [yes, operator bubbles work for that] ) and they're all relatively fragile (chroma again being an exception) or don't do a whole lot other than shoot their guns,without energy to use their abilities

[tnccs215]

9 minutes ago, Kaotyke said:

Dont they already?

Wait 7,5s for each pulse in the same place.

Othewise you have to spam the button to top yourself in a second, and waste all the other pulses.

"But I have resources! I can spam them!"

Good for you, now allow me to use the other option because I dont waste resources.

But the option is there. That's the thing. Energy pads are so shockingly cheap to produce that their cost per unit, on most cases, justifies spamming. 

One cannot pretend it does not allow that just because it isn't convenient for their point.