Nightwave + alerts removal feedback

[HugintheCrow]

2 hours ago, (NSW)Ace-Bounty-Hunter said:

And I can say the exact same thing about all the crybabies complaining about Nightwave. Not worth the attention.

Which is precisely why you engaged in several-comments-long pissing contest. Yup, I see your point.

[Tellakey]

26 minutes ago, DerGreif2 said:

Warframe lacks meaningful rewards because we all have everything or buy it with plat... Nightwave and Emphermas are the right way. Just because some Snowflake want to have all things right now because "they exist" its not something to claim they are bad. Nightwave give us something to do. They dont force us like a lot of people claim. You dont need Umbral forma or the Armor. You dont need it for anything. People get it that put time and effort into it. Thats it.

In the same manner one could argue that you don't need Mesa Prime because Mesa is good enough, or Forma since an un-Formad weapon already kills well enough, and so on and so forth.

Players thirst for content, and in that sense Nightwave forces you to play if you're interested in new updates. It's like saying that you should completely ignore Fortuna, a year-worth of development that came at the expense of frequent updates, because nothing in Fortuna is a necessity. Well the entire game is not a necessity. What's even the point of playing if you don't consider the content in the game a must?

Edited April 1, 2019 by Tellakey

[RX-3DR]

By week 2, it was already quite apparent that the system is not going to be enjoyable in the long run when more than half the selection were objectives that just pointed you to a game mode and told you, "Just do whatever X number of times". Sustainability wasn't in mind when they made them which is why we have that extremely strange objective of "Gild an equipment".

[Chewarette]

Nightwave is not supposed to provide Challenge.

Edit: Plus, most of your challenges are not "requiring skill".

Edited April 1, 2019 by Chewarette

[M4T2E]

vor 22 Minuten schrieb Tellakey:

In the same manner one could argue that you don't need a prime Warframe, forma, etc...

Players thirst for content, and in that sense Nightwave forces you to play if you're interested in new updates. It's like saying that you should completely ignore Fortuna, a year-worth of development that came at the expense of frequent updates, because nothing in Fortuna is a necessity. Well the entire game is not a necessity. What's even the point of playing if you don't consider the content in the game a must?

The great differnce between a prime Warframe and the stuff from Nightwave ranks are the Mastery points.
Nightwave currently provides only cosmetic items or some other nice to have rewards, so you are more free to skip it.

[Tellakey]

6 minutes ago, M4T2E said:

The great differnce between a prime Warframe and the stuff from Nightwave ranks are the Mastery points.
Nightwave currently provides only cosmetic items or some other nice to have rewards, so you are more free to skip it.

That's just one factor. Pretty minimal, if you ask me. 

Edit: Some players don't care so much about MR. You can see plenty of veterans who never got beyond 20. For some fashion is end-game, therefore Nightwave is locking you outside pretty important stuff if you're not interested in pursuing tedious tasks every week.

Edited April 1, 2019 by Tellakey

[M4T2E]

Gerade eben schrieb Tellakey:

That's just one factor. Pretty minimal, if you ask me.

Maybe, but I think there are more than just a few players, just reacting if it's related to mastery fodder.

[DerGreif2]

My only feedback:

- Make Elite Challenges not part of the 60%

- Make Elite Challenges Harder

- Remove Wolf Creds from rewards (just after rank 30)

- Make those fugitives from 5 Wolf Creds each (or other special enemies in the future)

- Explain where to find or what to do to spawn the boss

 

The rest is fine. Maybe also 2 Daylies

[RX-3DR]

Just now, M4T2E said:

Maybe, but I think there are more than just a few players, just reacting if it's related to mastery fodder.

Same could be said about people who want to collect all the mods or cosmetics possible. Also, do note, you can trade for Prime Warframes or purchase Prime Access/Vaults when they are available. The comparisons are not quite the same due to that specific niche.

[CoreXCZ]

Demanding return of Alert system which would make our time in game less boring!

Who agrees, give upvote, applause or like!

Edited April 1, 2019 by CoreXCZ

[DerGreif2]

53 minutes ago, Tellakey said:

In the same manner one could argue that you don't need Mesa Prime because Mesa is good enough, or Forma since an un-Formad weapon already kills well enough, and so on and so forth.

And thats true. But you can get them via playing. Same with nightwave. Except armor or a special kind of forma are not the norm or needed because we have OTHER armor and NORMAL forma. Its not like we dont ave other options.

 

53 minutes ago, Tellakey said:

Players thirst for content, and in that sense Nightwave forces you to play if you're interested in new updates.

You dont have to. If you want then do it. They just changed a  broken system.

53 minutes ago, Tellakey said:

It's like saying that you should completely ignore Fortuna, a year-worth of development that came at the expense of frequent updates, because nothing in Fortuna is a necessity.

They have special guns and Warframes. So you COULD ignore it because you can buy them if you want.

53 minutes ago, Tellakey said:

Well the entire game is not a necessity. What's even the point of playing if you don't consider the content in the game a must?

Dude you are a Drama queen. You dont get the point. if you go this road then you can just stop playing.

 

Nightwave is something for players to do with rewards that really reward players that put the effort in it. It is aimed at all people but the last rewards are aimed for the veteran or semi casual players that have the time. Deal with it. Not everybody should get to rank 30. Thats the thing. Thats it what makes rewards relevant: not everyone have it. Like I said: warframe needs to have exclusive rewards. We have already so much that is for everyone so that they feel just normal or worthless. Do you get the point?

Edited April 1, 2019 by DerGreif2

[BombtailsTheFox]

3 hours ago, Atekron said:

That was fun for a while, but this week challenges did show us what true nature of nightwave is - couple of boring task randomly repeating, DE not even bother to make them unique and not repeat two times in a row, I will do them this and next week for armor set and it will be time to say to Nora "good night"

Took long enough to make people realize that, uh?

Even i have realized that, but why should i complain for "Duuh, Nightwave has the same challenge as the previous week"?

2 hours ago, Shadow-Spawn said:

Nightwave is such a bad system - it boggles the mind how it was just released by DE without asking its gaming community for feedback before launching it. DE should just bring back the quick alert system - that proved successful for 6 years in combination with the nightwave system - that way players can choose for themselves what they want to play. Furthermore, DE should never try forcing players to play acts they don't want to play - every player has a different play-style and favorite content that they prefer to play - just let them rank up in the system by playing what they enjoy playing.

I don't know, waiting for a certain alert to pop up is annoying. Considering the fact that before Nightwave, you had to wait 4 hours to get a nitain extract alert (which is annoying, since different warframes and weapons require nitain extract). Yes, Quick Alert system can co-exist with Nightwave, but even it has flaws.

Besides, you do realize that you can decide to not do certain challenges? You don't want to do Profit-Taker Orb with friends? Ok, that's your decision.

1 minute ago, CoreXCZ said:

Demanding return of Alert system which would make our time in game less boring!

I have a better idea: Why not make the alert system return, but implement it with Nightwave, so that when you get a quick alert, you can manage to complete a challenge?

[CoreXCZ]

Just now, BombtailsTheFox said:

I have a better idea: Why not make the alert system return, but implement it with Nightwave, so that when you get a quick alert, you can manage to complete a challenge?

Denied. You can complete a challenge in alert even if it will work as separate system. Stop mixing apples and pineapples together, please.

[Tellakey]

20 minutes ago, DerGreif2 said:

And thats true. But you can get them via playing. Same with nightwave. Except armor or a special kind of forma are not the norm or needed because we have OTHER armor and NORMAL forma. Its not like we dont ave other options.

8

I don't see how the availability of primes is relevant. If anything because Nightwave features exclusives it commits a bigger sin. And again, you decided that Umbral Forma is not as important. That's utterly subjective. To others fashion is more important so missing out on the exclusive armor set is undesirable. 

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You dont have to. If you want then do it. They just changes a  broken system.

They have special guns and Warframes. So you could ignore it because you can buy them if you want.

2

Again, DE isn't literally pointing a gun to my head, but I am forced in the sense that if I want to play the new content I have to suffer through a tedious system that's much worst than the game's regular grind because it is time-limited, therefore exerting pressure. Compare that to Fortuna, another grind-fest that A. has a much better time-investment to reward ratio, and B. could be played at your own pace. 

Quote

Dude you are a Drama queen. You dont get the point. if you go this road then you can just stop playing.

2

Ah, a classical ad-hominem followed with a typical "then don't play it" argument. Because negative feedback is forbidden nowadays.

Quote

Nightwave is something for players to do with rewards that really reward players that put the effort in it. It is aimed at all people but the last rewards are aimed for the veteran or semi casual players that have the time. Deal with it. Not everybody should get to rank 30. Thats the thing. Thats it what makes rewards relevant: not everyone have it. Like I said: warframe needs to have exclusive rewards. We have already so much that is for everyone so that they feel just normal or worthless. Do you get the point?

I have zero issues with exclusive rewards. My problem with Nightwave is its weekly pressure on veterans and casuals alike, and its enforcement of tedious chores that go by the false title of "challenges". I want an actual challenge in Warframe, therefore I criticize the game when it fails to implement it. But please, keep throwing those ad hominems because you cannot deal with disagreement.

Edited April 1, 2019 by Tellakey

[M4T2E]

Ok, I want to bring it back to constructiv feedback:

I would like to see a system with building up own challenge/difficulty.
You'll always have different players, with different play-styles so it needs a system that can be scaled by themself.
Just a quick base sample:
Earn 100 points by extermination missions (extermination lvl 60 enemies = 25 points; extermination lvl 30 enemies = 10 points; extermination lvl 10 enemies = 2 point).

[Veridian]

3 hours ago, Tellakey said:

Yea no. Go read the threads, my friend.

More importantly, the community is entitled to raise their dissatisfaction with aspects of the game. Are you into censorship? It's in vogue right now.

No, the community is entitled to express its entitled attitude.

Almost all of a dissatisfaction comes from the fact that some just want to get that sweet armor and forma for nothing and immediately.
Regardless of the fact that it has been stated, that nothing from Nightwave will be exclusive.
Coupled with the other side, which simply wants a reason to do something, DE is in a losing position no matter what they do.
All the diminutive reasoning akin to "its repetitive, boring...etc." is 0 feedback and is so specific, that not only can be applied to any part of the game, it can be applied to any game.
More items of issue that complaints bring up seem to absolutely omit how it was with alerts, E.G. potatoes and Nitain are hard to get - they always were.
And last, let's not forget about how almost anyone with a complaint likes to use the same half baked statements that they copied of other posts, akin to:

 

2 hours ago, Shadow-Spawn said:

bring back the quick alert system - that proved successful for 6 years

That right there is why most of the flakes that complain aren't being taken seriously.
I employ you to find 1 thread before Alert removal that said anything positive about those.
Because I can recall a whole bunch, that bashed on a *these are off the top of my head* outdated and badly RNG gated system with mostly useless rewards.

Nightwave does need a tweak here and there, but it's a good system, far better than alerts can ever hope to be.


INB4 the next series looks something like:
kill 1 000 Grenier
kill 1 000 Infested
kill 1 000 Corpus

for weekly missions because enough people complained they should get with no effort involved.

 

Just a quick jab here.

Every time something new comes out, the internet warriors come out of their holes. Not once and in any game has this been an exception.
Every single piece of content this game provides has been explained as badly designed and as unfair by some random tool, that doesn't want to do X type of activity. We'd be left with a blank page if DE catered to all these people.

 

Edited April 1, 2019 by Ver1dian

[RX-3DR]

1 hour ago, M4T2E said:

Ok, I want to bring it back to constructiv feedback:

I would like to see a system with building up own challenge/difficulty.
You'll always have different players, with different play-styles so it needs a system that can be scaled by themself.
Just a quick base sample:
Earn 100 points by extermination missions (extermination lvl 60 enemies = 25 points; extermination lvl 30 enemies = 10 points; extermination lvl 10 enemies = 2 point).

Which is exactly why I'm dissatisfied with many of the current Nightwave missions. There is no distinction between doing the bare minimum to get the rounds to count and going out of your way. Take for instance, if they had tweaked the Bounty mission to factor more than just being there when it is completed, you could have it so that you have the option of doing 1 or 2 Bounties at the highest tier or 7 at the lowest tier. It would at least bring back some level of limited choice for players while rewarding people for doing things better by having them not sit through 30 Bounties over the month.

But anytime any suggestion on how the conditions could have been done, you get a weird pushback from people who either claim "I can do them so they are fine and shouldn't be changed" or "If you don't like them, don't do them ". There is another thread specifically on this topic, just see the responses to suggestions yourself.

[Tellakey]

4 minutes ago, Ver1dian said:

No, the community is entitled to express its entitled attitude.

Almost all of a dissatisfaction comes from the fact that some just want to get that sweet armor and forma for nothing and immediately.
Regardless of the fact that it has been stated, that nothing from Nightwave will be exclusive.
Coupled with the other side, which simply wants a reason to do something, DE is in a losing position no matter what they do.
All the diminutive reasoning akin to "its repetitive, boring...etc." is 0 feedback and is so specific, that not only can be applied to any part of the game, it can be applied to any game.

3

3

Please just go to feedback and look up Nightwave criticism. There are some seriously intricate suggestions. This is the issue with overgeneralizing. You're contributing to forum hostility by regarding any form of criticism to Nightwave as "snowflakes whining". 

Edited April 1, 2019 by Tellakey

[DerGreif2]

15 minutes ago, Tellakey said:

And again, you decided that Umbral Forma is not as important. That's utterly subjective.

No. We can still build umbral build without umbral forma. No one has it jet and we still have umbral builds. Its just a nice to have. Maybe later in the new war it might be important but right now its just like "nice to have".

 

16 minutes ago, Tellakey said:

I don't see how the availability of primes is relevant.

They are not relevant. There is no frame that is so much better in a primed version that the normal part is not. No one cares if you use a Nova or a Nova Prime. Or a Rhino or Rhino Prime.

 

18 minutes ago, Tellakey said:

To others fashion is more important so missing out on the exclusive armor set is undesirable. 

Some some people. You could also say that Excalibur Prime is a sin. Its not. We need more exclusive stuff that matters.

 

20 minutes ago, Tellakey said:

Again, DE isn't literally pointing a gun to my head, but I am forced in the sense that if I want to play the new content I have to suffer through a tedious system that's much worst than the game's regular grind because it is time-limited, therefore exerting pressure. Compare that to Fortuna, another grind-fest that A. has a much better time-investment to reward ratio, and B. could be played at your own pace.

Warframe is and was a Grind game. Deal with it. It will not change. I agree that some things are to grindy (hello baruuk) but in the end DE is making the right choices. Or if you dont have time: buy them. Its still a f2p game.

 

21 minutes ago, Tellakey said:

Ah, a classical ad-hominem followed with a typical "then don't play it" argument. Because negative feedback is forbidden nowadays.

If you say that the game is not worth playing what kind of "feedback" is that? You dont offer solutions. Thats part of feedback. That is what people are forgetting.

 

23 minutes ago, Tellakey said:

I have zero issues with exclusive rewards. My problem with Nightwave is its weekly pressure on veterans and casuals alike, and its enforcement of tedious chores that go by the false title of "challenges"

Most of them you can complete them in one or two days within a few hours. Normally I need 3 days. Also you can skip up to 13k standing per week and still get to the end. Whats the problem?

24 minutes ago, Tellakey said:

I want an actual challenge in Warframe, therefore I criticize the game when it fails to implement it.

Nightwave is not for challenges. They not designed it for this. I also wait for it but Nightwave is not for that kind of players.

[Tellakey]

11 minutes ago, DerGreif2 said:

No. We can still build umbral build without umbral forma. No one has it jet and we still have umbral builds. Its just a nice to have. Maybe later in the new war it might be important but right now its just like "nice to have".

5

You had argued that Nightwave rewards are purely cosmetics and that even Umbral Forma is not that important. All I'm saying is that the game is so easy that even normal Forma is not a necessity for end-game, therefore making the worth of anything utterly subjective.

Quote

They are not relevant. There is no frame that is so much better in a primed version that the normal part is not. No one cares if you use a Nova or a Nova Prime. Or a Rhino or Rhino Prime.

 

Right, it's irrelevant, so I didn't understand why you included that in your argument.

Quote

Some some people. You could also say that Excalibur Prime is a sin. Its not. We need more exclusive stuff that matters.

3

Until DE provides the impossible statistic of what percentage of players prioritize what in the game "some players" is equal to who knows how many.

Quote

Warframe is and was a Grind game. Deal with it. It will not change. I agree that some things are to grindy (hello baruuk) but in the end DE is making the right choices. Or if you dont have time: buy them. Its still a f2p game.

6

Have you read my comparison to Fortuna? It is also a grind-fest, and as I already pointed, that's okay. But Fortuna doesn't pressure you with timed exclusives. That's where Nightwave commits the greatest disservice. Baruuk, too, is one of the mildest grinds in the game.

Quote

If you say that the game is not worth playing what kind of "feedback" is that? You dont offer solutions. Thats part of feedback. That is what people are forgetting.

2

Oh I don't offer solutions? How do you know that, good sir and or madam? Have you perhaps looked up my forum history? Because only this week I have provided two threads of feedback regarding Nightwave. But hey, keep on assuming. It does you wonders. Also, please quote me saying "The game is not worth playing." It feels to me that you are extrapolating from my comments something that is not there so it could suit your rebuttal.

Quote

Most of them you can complete them in one or two days within a few hours. Normally I need 3 days. Also you can skip up to 13k standing per week and still get to the end. Whats the problem?

Nightwave is not for challenges. They not designed it for this. I also wait for it but Nightwave is not for that kind of players.

The problem is that Nightwave diverts your attention from what you may want to prioritize and forces you, by virtue of its time-exclusivity, to focus on Nora's missions. If I have 5 hours a week to play, and I want to grind, say, Khora or Eidolons, I might not have the time anymore because Nora provides time-limited missions for me to complete or lose the rewards until further notice. Skipping as much as 40% of Nightwave will ensure you don't get the final rewards. Is that enough of a problem for you?

Edited April 1, 2019 by Tellakey

[Veridian]

16 minutes ago, Tellakey said:

Please just go to feedback and look up Nightwave criticism. There are some seriously intricate suggestions. This is the issue with overgeneralizing. You're basically creating a hostile forum by regarding any form of criticism to Nightwave as "snowflakes whining".  

 

Must've read a different 66 page topic then, because there's nothing intricate about suggestions that boil down to: " "how I can get stuff easier and not do X challenge", people attacking each other, blatant ignorance of what nightave's purpose is, demands that all challenges should fit their exact play style, as if the game should be tailored to them specifically and putting the rose tinted goggles any time alerts are mentioned.

 

The system is overall fine, some tweaks could be added, but either the return of alerts or general overhaul that seem to be suggested are entitlement short and simple.

[Atekron]

57 minutes ago, M4T2E said:

Ok, I want to bring it back to constructiv feedback:

I would like to see a system with building up own challenge/difficulty.
You'll always have different players, with different play-styles so it needs a system that can be scaled by themself.
Just a quick base sample:
Earn 100 points by extermination missions (extermination lvl 60 enemies = 25 points; extermination lvl 30 enemies = 10 points; extermination lvl 10 enemies = 2 point).

DE can at least better arrange challenges, make them more thematic, tied to planet, mission type, activity, or something like that

anyway my expectation for s2 is very low

[Steel_Rook]

Nitghtwave replaced Alerts as a source of cosmetics, Catalysts and Nitain for newer and less veteran players. Gating it behind fiddly twitch reflex challenges just goes to further undermine an already exclusionary system. No, thank you.

[M4T2E]

Currently Nightwave isn't that bad, but alerts wasn't that bad too.

I enoy that the pressure of missing items from timelimited alerts is gone.
On the other side, the alerts often carried me over some less interesting times, just by playing alert missions on chain.
Now I take a look into Nightwave and it needs around two days to play my weekly acts and skip the few ones I don't like.
The daily acts are done mostly in under 10 minutes.

So from playing I would prefer the Alerts, but from time pressure I would prefer Nightwave.

The only thing that worries me a bit is the low chance to encounter Wolf of Saturn Six (2x for me), but DE confirmed a higher chance later in this series.

Maybe some players mix up Nightwave Acts with Nightmare Mode.

Edited April 1, 2019 by M4T2E

[(XBOX)Tatakai no Kami]

9 hours ago, NezuHimeSama said:

Also, people keep saying you need to average 30k a week, out of 43k, and that's 60%, but it's not. It's 69.76, or 70%.

Either way, that's an absurd participation rate for what will be a daily/weekly grind, where you can't progress faster than X, but you still need to progress faster than Y.

 

You left out the bonus half week which brings it down to 63% without allowing for fugitives. Depending on your luck with fugitives it could push it down as far as 50% or less for some.

Apparently, some players were rank 29 going into week 5. I'm rank 20. I thought I had caught more from Fugitives in a previous post where I estimated the amount but it is only 12450points worth. That makes up 4% of what I need per week to reach rank 30 in 10 weeks. Others are doing much better, and I am sure there are people with much fewer captures.

Those maniacs who have reached rank 29 have caught 78,000 points worth of fugitives. Or 26% of what they needed to reach rank 30.

Maths is your friend. Learn it. Understand it. Embrace it.

The rest of your "legitimate" arguments against Nightwave equate to, "I Can't be bothered doing anything to earn them so give me all the rewards now."

Given the majority of your posts have been attacks on people who have gone out of their way to explain how people have misunderstood aspects of Nightwave, you're just trying to derail the thread. And pointing your fingers at others for what you yourself are doing.

I know people have asked you, but I haven't seen your answer. I may have missed it. But I'd love to know what rank you currently are? And if you have completed any of this week's activities yet?