I am suprised people have a problem with Index excal.

[AshenHaze]

I always divided Index into three primary archetypes: Striker, Goalie, Piggybank

Strikers just go around killing things, but due to their relative glass-cannon-ness it's best a Piggybank pick up the coins.

Goalies are like what you mentioned with Gara/Atlas.

Piggybanks are Rhino  or Inaros or another character that is super tanky or can just run around collecting index coins.

If you have two Strikers, one Goalie, and one Piggybank then I've found it streamlines the Index to the point of being a non-challenge.

[musicalsocks23]

6 hours ago, Birdframe_Prime said:

Excal Umbra is a bot. You jump out, do your own thing as an Operator, maybe even use all those nice powers to buff your team or provide energy regen or healing, or even turn them all invisible with massive damage reduction. Meanwhile your Excal is running around and playing the game for you.

This, I understand, is a AFK cheese ability. However, OP mentions that Rhino and Nezha using their tanking abilities as provided to them in their kit is a cheese AFK ability as well, which is bothersome because you still need to play the game in order to complete the objective in the Index. This would immediately disqualify them as "cheese" frames and makes 95% of his original point invalid.

[nslay]

1 minute ago, musicalsocks23 said:

This, I understand, is a AFK cheese ability. However, OP mentions that Rhino and Nezha using their tanking abilities as provided to them in their kit is a cheese AFK ability as well, which is bothersome because you still need to play the game in order to complete the objective in the Index. This would immediately disqualify them as "cheese" frames and makes 95% of his original point invalid.

And Revenant... 

[SneakyErvin]

7 hours ago, (NSW)TeddyTalks said:

All these warframes either AFK the game, remove challenge, or make farming braindead simple. Excalibur just happened to be the best at it with kohm builds.

None of them afk the game and none of them are actual cheese tactics (well besides Gara and Atlas maybe since the AI is dead dumb), they are all just viable tactics to tackle the game mode. Nova with a sniper is an amazing killer, so is Mesa, but can leave points a bit scattered. Rhino and Nezha simply use their skills to counter the health drain of points, that is the whole idea behind the game mode, finding the best frame for the best duty.

Saryn nuking is also probably on of the worst ideas in Index because you have zero idea where the enemies died, except for the Saryn that does the killing. This can lead to bad situations where Gara and Atlas go from cheese tactics to babysit-saryn-who-effed-up tactics.

[Birdframe_Prime]

5 hours ago, (NSW)TeddyTalks said:

Why is it frowned upon. Because it is low effort? That is less of a valid complaint and more of a personal gripe. Warframe done efficiently is a mindless grinding game to get better at grinding in many cases, as there is no endgame. An AFK farm is just max efficiency. The game already stupid easy with the right knowledge, so the problem is not the challenge. If people object because they simply do not like it then idk. I don't really care for emotion based arguments.

Okay, to explain, what's frowned on is not interacting with the game to get your rewards. Whether that's resources or the end-mission and end-wave rewards.

While there are frames that allow you to put in minimal effort to achieve a specific goal, such as playing a Slow Nova with a high-strength Saryn in ESO can pretty much do all the work for you, you are still having to actually do something. Somebody is casting, somebody is moving, somebody is shooting. While you can summon a Spectre to do your work for you too, that costs resources and one-time-use blueprints, and the spectre you summon is only ever scaled to the current level you're at, meaning unless you're getting that Ancient Healer out for damage mitigation, little spectre is definitely going to die, and has no interest in actually defending objectives.

What you can't do with other frames, you see, is stand still and let them do all the work. None of them work like that anymore. Not Mesa, not Saryn (seriously, outside of ESO those Spores of hers really don't last all that long unless you maintain them manually), Ember got a massive nerf to her 4 because of it... You can't AFK play the game.

Unless it's Umbra. Who will play for you. With you doing absolutely nothing for any length of time you decide on and only ever pressing a button when you want him to come back to where you are and start again.

[EmberStar]

8 hours ago, Loza03 said:

World has roadblock monsters? Certainly not for Solo where Monsters are dramatically nerfed from their co-op counterparts.

 

Sass aside, maybe that'll change with Iceborne. They are adding in Narga and Tigrex, and certainly if the angry dragon tiger T-Rex train was derailed in what's been explicitly called out as the 'G-rank equivalent' people would be angry.

And, yeah, I played through 4U and Generations, so I'm probably spoiled on the new player experience to World.

If someone isn't good at recognizing the tells right away, potentially any of the monsters is an insta-death roadblock.  Oh, that animation means that this monster is going to use a breath weapon, but that slightly different one means it's going to jump backwards and tailwhip.  For the first one, if you're in front of it then you die.  For the second one, if you're *behind* it then you die.  And if someone doesn't pick up on the slight difference between them, then it's just a BS random insta-death monster that they can only beat through sheer luck.

If you've been playing for ages, you won't have that problem.  But I know someone who got as far as Rathalos and decided that nope, screw this.  I think that's the name of it.  It's a very dragon-ish looking one, anyway.  I keep meaning to play the game  more, but I've only ever gotten as far as the one that looks kind of like a deranged chicken that digs up rocks and throws them at you.

[Lutesque]

7 hours ago, nslay said:

Are you sure it's not just a problem with the people who play Index? I really enjoy my specter team mates in high risk index. They don't talk or steal your points (usually) or anything... 

Nope... Definitely the index.... I don't like how this is the one and only place to get a decent amount of Credits.

[Alaeacus]

10 hours ago, Birdframe_Prime said:

Unlike any other cheese strat, this is a genuine AFK strat, and those are frowned on heavily.

Meh.  Saryn and Volt players in other modes can stand in one place tapping a single button while having another hand free to...do whatever they want.  At this point, it's ridiculous to even split hairs.  

Edited May 14, 2019 by Alaeacus

[TeddyTalker]

1 hour ago, Lutesque said:

Nope... Definitely the index.... I don't like how this is the one and only place to get a decent amount of Credits.

DE nerf credit gains so this is pretty much the only spot.

[TeddyTalker]

1 hour ago, EmberStar said:

If someone isn't good at recognizing the tells right away, potentially any of the monsters is an insta-death roadblock.  Oh, that animation means that this monster is going to use a breath weapon, but that slightly different one means it's going to jump backwards and tailwhip.  For the first one, if you're in front of it then you die.  For the second one, if you're *behind* it then you die.  And if someone doesn't pick up on the slight difference between them, then it's just a BS random insta-death monster that they can only beat through sheer luck.

If you've been playing for ages, you won't have that problem.  But I know someone who got as far as Rathalos and decided that nope, screw this.  I think that's the name of it.  It's a very dragon-ish looking one, anyway.  I keep meaning to play the game  more, but I've only ever gotten as far as the one that looks kind of like a deranged chicken that digs up rocks and throws them at you.

It really just people who are elitists telling others that the game is easy, after they played for 1k hours. The games are harder, more knowledge extensive and execution heavy then the souls games, which are a popular benchmark for something that is to hard.

Edited May 14, 2019 by (NSW)TeddyTalks

[(NSW)Evilpricetag]

This thread is about monster hunter?

I love 3u.

[Lutesque]

4 hours ago, (NSW)TeddyTalks said:

DE nerf credit gains so this is pretty much the only spot.

Why though ? 

Was it because they didn't have faith that index was going to be succeful so they pressured everyone into doing it ?

[EmberStar]

Is it the only spot?  I thought killing Profit Taker provided a huge pile of credits as one of the reward options?  I don't really know, they changed it after I slogged through it to unlock the reputation, and I haven't really been back.  But I thought people were pretty much standing in line to shoot her in the face during the double credits weekend because it was the fastest way to make crazy amounts of credits.

[MythicPulse]

The only time there is a problem with AFK in index is when it's done with a random squad, and nobody is gathering points.

A plurality of Mesas and Umbras with no Inaros or Rhino can result in loads of loose points sitting on the floor and nobody who is confident enough to go pick those up.

[(XBOX)ReDGamingUK]

If you cant beat em join em lad limbo n stasis is a nice defensive cheese too provided you have a decent carrier 😉 let enemy in cataclysm they pick up the point bang stasis on kill rinse n repeat then summon your carrier to deposit all 100 in one go our squads fast top tier run was 2 min 14sec 😂😂

[Marvelous_A]

Excalibur Umbra is the only reason I'd ever play Index

[makaloff95]

Beacuse the other frames actually requires you to play your frame. I had to carry 2 AFKing Excal umbra yesterday, which was mildly annoying to say the least

[Test-995]

Meanwhile we can use octavia/w solo and let spectres do everything.

[IceFire909]

lol hildryn is the proper choice for index.

you no longer have to concern yourself with death