Bring back the "difficult" eidolons!

[nooneyouknow13]

14 hours ago, Nordia said:

 

Until recently, it was even bought at 160 at warframe.market, but now the price has dropped significantly

Energize was 220 average before Nightwave S1 on warframe market.

[NorthernDarkIceSoul]

10 часов назад, Test-995 сказал:

There shouldn't really be any difference for 300cap+ hunters since you were able to one shot eidolons anyway, but it makes big difference for newbies, and i think that's a good thing.

It's still endgame since you need some serious coordination and cooperation, damage dealing for limbs/heads are less than 5% aspect of eidolon hunt IMO.

 

I don’t know about you, but in my region everyone has long known what needs to be done, and this does not require any coordination

[NorthernDarkIceSoul]

53 минуты назад, nooneyouknow13 сказал:

Energize was 220 average before Nightwave S1 on warframe market.

 

Really? To mine, before the appearance of the wave, the price of grace and energize was stable around 150 :/

[DrivaMain]

The changes are A BUG. Don’t worry OP, everything will return to normal after another hotfix or two. 

But in the meantime, I am hunting Eidolons with Gauss + Redeemer lol.

Edited September 6, 2019 by DrivaMain

[TeaHawk]

15 hours ago, -Icarus- said:

lso I don't think Eidolons were changed on purpose, like amps deal less damage to shields but it's easier to blow off limbs. For your average eidolon hunter this isn't easier in any way, any competent DPS already blew off synovias in less than half a second but less damage to Eido shields means EVERYONE kills them slower than before.

Personally, I hate those changes. You had to go hunting with dmg-buffing squad. Now you can just grab rubico and one-shot any limb. But it is so long to take out shields. It's simply dull. And it's stupid as there's no way to boost it intelligently (except tiny help of Volt). You have basically just to shoot and shoot and shoot with amp again. That's just stupid and does not require any cooperation between players. I'm really sad they made those changes.


 

[Ayures]

16 hours ago, Nordia said:

Dear developers, because you made eidolons too weak, the prices for arcanes such as grace and energize have fallen, so the business of players like me started to crumble! I find this insulting and urge you to roll back the changes! 

 

I have never before questioned your competence, but if you really think that the eidolons were too strong, then at least go to YouTube and see how to properly kill(capture) them, it's not at all difficult.

You should have seen how much the prices dropped when arcanes went from BPs to being dropped fully built! It was almost as bad as the drop when eidolons started dropping the BPs!

Deal with it.

 

[GPrime96]

I did a Solo Tridolon Capture yesterday and something is definitely wrong with their Tankiness. Normally in my Solo runs as Trinity Prime, i use Shattering Impact to lower their DR but not remove their Armor of course. But now, their Limbs is going down in 4 - 5 shots without SI. Didn't have to use my Sarpa once so they are a lot less tanky than before. I can see doing a 4x3 or 5x3 being cheesy now with how low their DR is without any type of armor stripping which means 12 or 15 arcanes per night easily.

[(PSN)Hopper_Orouk]

On 2019-09-05 at 5:26 PM, Nordia said:

, so the business of players like me started to crumble

sells riven for 30 plat once

you know? I'm something of a businessman myself 🙂

[Libpea]

On 2019-09-05 at 10:26 PM, Nordia said:

Dear developers, because you made eidolons too weak, the prices for arcanes such as grace and energize have fallen, so the business of players like me started to crumble! I find this insulting and urge you to roll back the changes! 

 

I have never before questioned your competence, but if you really think that the eidolons were too strong, then at least go to YouTube and see how to properly kill(capture) them, it's not at all difficult.

Dont want to be offensive, but you are wrong. They didnt make eidolons weaker, but they made weapons stronger. Yeah, it was very enjoyable in hunting, team coordination, warframe management, etc... until they released the Rubico prime, and with good riven u dont even need buff on dps frame to do 5x3. And with stronger amps so u dont need Virtuos Shadow anymore, which requires skill and practice to proc. And since rubico prime, I gradually lost interest in hunting and moving into doing other things, it;s a good thing in the end. And this has not much to do with the arcanes' price going down, the price going down because more people are doing hunting now, and more weapons and frames to choose (chroma, ivara, garuda, mirage), which can be used with or even without rivens to do 5x3.

"the business of players like me started to crumble", i suppose it's just a playstyle of some people who are on the "high class" of the game: Keep hunting and hunting and selling for tons of plat, then use plat to buy top tier rivens, then use those rivens a bit, then back to countless repetitive hunting.

I got thousands of plat from hunting, but have nothing to spend on except deluxe skins. I like to get and unveil riven on my own, farming kuva and rolling, it;s really fun and pays off when u got a good roll, which will keep u playing the weapons for a long time. And so far, i only bought a few unrolled rivens below 600p. That;s how I enjoy the game, doing many things like that. Not stuck on 1 thing and exchange for other things.

[(XBOX)Erudite Prime]

Eidolons aren't too weak, it's more that we're too strong. Don't get me wrong, I don't want any nerfs at all, but with the way Warframe works, difficult content is impossible to make. If Eidolons had double health or whatever, the fight wouldn't be harder, it'd just take longer. 

[Aesthier]

On 2019-09-05 at 5:26 PM, Nordia said:

Dear developers, because you made eidolons too weak, the prices for arcanes such as grace and energize have fallen, so the business of players like me started to crumble! I find this insulting and urge you to roll back the changes! 

 

I have never before questioned your competence, but if you really think that the eidolons were too strong, then at least go to YouTube and see how to properly kill(capture) them, it's not at all difficult.

So wait a minute here...

 

Your saying that DE should raise the difficulty of eidolons because too many players are now able to successfully enjoy and complete the content and no longer feel forced to purchase the resulting drops from you?

Edited September 8, 2019 by D20

[Steel_Rook]

Honestly, I have very little sympathy for this. Bugs aside, this comes across as "Developers, please make this thing more exclusive so I can scalp people on Warframe.market easier."

[TheKazz91]

On 2019-09-05 at 10:27 AM, Gabbynaru said:

Please, if you can't adapt to an ever changing market, leave it! You're clearly not cut out to be a "business player".

This ^

Markets change if you want to make money you change with them. Hydrolysts have been in-game for over a year. People that have access to hunt them increases exponentially over time because it's just a big domino effect. Example: I have three friends who want to start hunting Eidolons so I help them gear up and get started and show them how to do it. A week or two later each of them are proficient and doing it without me. They all have 3 other friends and each of them shows 3 more people how to do it and this cycle repeats. Who is going to pay 300+ play for something they can just go acquire them selves? 

If eidolons have been nerfed it's a result of a bug or just the power level of the game as a whole increasings so relative to the rest of the game and the maximum power level they are lower on that sliding scale. 

What you are asking for is for DE to pull the rug out from under players that are getting started in Eidolon hunting so that you can profit of them. It's akin to big pharmacy companies lobbying against medical marijuana because it's a direct competitor and they want to keep their advantage over the new comer.

[ReaverKane]

On 2019-09-05 at 4:26 PM, Nordia said:

Dear developers, because you made eidolons too weak, the prices for arcanes such as grace and energize have fallen, so the business of players like me started to crumble! I find this insulting and urge you to roll back the changes! 

 

I have never before questioned your competence, but if you really think that the eidolons were too strong, then at least go to YouTube and see how to properly kill(capture) them, it's not at all difficult.

TLDR: Mah plat!

It's not that Eidolons are easier, it's that more people are getting good at killing them. You know, there was a time (like when you were selling Arcanes for a ton of plat) that only a few people had the builds and knowledge of how to kill them, but PoE was years ago, so not only will the market end up saturated, but more people don't need to buy stuff from you because they can get it themselves.

[Peter]

I don't know what you're talking about, I have 1700 captures and the hunts are still the same.

The price of the arcane has fallen because of the night wave, they are giving arcane like candy on halloween.

I've been reading the comments, about them having weakened the eidolons I prefer it to be as it is, I believe this has helped more who wants to do 2x3 or 3x3, who wants to do 5x3 + still needs strong coordination, today I lost a capture because of the mistakes and slowness.

And lastly we must remember that the hardest thing is not to break the synovia, but to remove the shield in the shortest time possible.

In short, stop crying and let new players have fun, nothing will change for those on top of the hunt.

On platinum, I still sell everything normally except for arcane grace thanks to the dumb decision to put on the nightwave.

Edited September 9, 2019 by Peter

[Avienas]

On 2019-09-05 at 11:32 AM, (PS4)smb-twisted said:

speaking from ps4 not pc [so i don't know if there are changes afoot] but the price of energize and grace have dropped because of being given out free from nightwave.

Just because a single arcane was given out, is not going to make a drastic price drop. Before eidolons came around, those arcanes were hell-uva priced in the 200~300s on singles or even more if i recall back in the days of raids. Once shrines came around, people just found the most cheesey ways to mass murder the things to where people niched out particular setups even with likely even more viable ones present (Oberon, Wisp, Rhino, Octavia, etc.) especially when we got certain items (Adaptation) that nullified the excuse of certain frames being too squishie or what not.

 

On 2019-09-05 at 11:32 AM, (PS4)smb-twisted said:

if there are changes to make the eidolons easier coming then maybe this is the beginning of the end for me, eidolons are the only content i still really enjoy doing

The better approach is instead of making eidolons easier or harder, its to restrain how many people can do every 2~3 hours. Hard end of the stick would be a cooldown that prevents people doing more then 1 hydrolyst such as preventing rewards spawning for them or something or if they just regulated eidolon hunting to the special matchmaking board (aka they do not spawn otherwise), just prevent people from being able to que up for those, maybe be allowed to do the single teralyst version at the very least still.

More relaxed version would be maybe restraint people up to 3 hydrolysts a `night` by letting people respawn the teralyst after the hydrolyst is taken down by poking the shrine (and would not consume an item this time or just use one of the volmyst standing shards instead). This would make people actually take thar time with the fights then mach killing tridolons in less then 7 or something minutes and actually not mind as much to bring players new to the content along since its not like they can get more then 3 a night with a elite-ist group anymore.

Plus if people were to complain on the limiting of it, then that would only be the crazy elites who spent thousands of plat on expensive as fk rivens and so on when its D.E.`s decision if people are gang-banging a content with too much cheese, which they already did with Adarza Kavats on operators, why not do the same with volt shield on amps if they clearly want to have operators be as immune as possible to non-operator based interactions with pets & warframes (seriously d.e. let operators get radar from warframes/animals/auras already!). 

Course on that same note i wish d.e. would just restrict people to only be allowed to trade 1 riven a day to maybe kill the b.s. that goes on with riven marketing so maybe people are funneling plat into normal stuff instead of scrapping it so hard because they broke themselves buying expensive as fk rivens.

[Avienas]

2 hours ago, Peter said:

I don't know what you're talking about, I have 1700 captures and the hunts are still the same.

Its not the hunt itself changed, its just MOST players that want to host groups have gotten so fking elit-ist that they require people to have 300 or more hydrolyst captures or gtfo. Which kind of is contradictive because most either want to farm it for focus shards (meaning they would not of done that many) or to make plat off the arcanes (which is basically the new middle man way of making plat cause riven mods succ the high quality plat earning these days).

This makes it more difficult for the less experienced or the more casual eidolon hunters to get a group, which is why one of my previous comments suggest the idea of restraining how many dons one can do a night so people are FORCED to be more casual about it then expect everyone to run perfect builds down the the correct aura, arcanes & even duration value (namely harrow & trinity 4ths being short to prevent `issues`)

2 hours ago, Peter said:

The price of the arcane has fallen because of the night wave, they are giving arcane like candy on halloween.

They have been falling even before night wave came about. Just Nightwave helped speed it up a good deal, even if it was not what started the land-slide of price degradation.

2 hours ago, Peter said:

And lastly we must remember that the hardest thing is not to break the synovia, but to remove the shield in the shortest time possible.

Most abused the fk outta Adarza kavats to get the job done easier, though some build guides were under the impression that primary fire shotgun shot (shakrsan i believe?) alongside status chance virtuoso arcane were the most useful, till people realized secondary fire amp shots changed that story, alongside the crit damage bonus was way higher then projected due to a funky interaction with crit damage against the eidolon`s unique damage resistance.

Of course it does not help most volts likely have no idea how to shield place and that itself turns into a major nuance for eidolon busting that sometimes it seems like i solo bust a shield before the volt learns how to properly place its shields. Which basically makes the only reason volt exists is to buff the limb breaker then, effectively making a rhino, oberon or even wisp a much more useful choice to buff the guns.

2 hours ago, Peter said:

In short, stop crying and let new players have fun, nothing will change for those on top of the hunt.

If they restricted it to 3 hydrolysts only a night, then those on top will likely think less about speed killing them and more about better ways to manage the fight. Plus more frame options that could be used due to that flexibility= more freedom for newer players to get involved since frames like Rhino, Nidus, Octavia, Oberon and some other damage buffing frames would see more play, especially if people do not need to care as much to bring volts to speed bust the shields if that matters alot less due to having more time to do them.

[Peter]

21 minutes ago, Avienas said:

If they restricted it to 3 hydrolysts only a night, then those on top will likely think less about speed killing them and more about better ways to manage the fight...

No, they will continue to recruit 300 caps + to make eidolons, no one wants to waste time on it.

There are hunts for all types of players, play with your group, this exists in any online game and will be no different here.

Who recruits 300+ is because they invested a lot and want the best, it has nothing to do with elitism.

Edited September 9, 2019 by Peter

[Avienas]

9 minutes ago, Peter said:

No, they will continue to recruit 300 caps + to make eidolons, no one wants to waste time on it.

They do not want to waste time if they can do more of them in that period of 50 minutes. But if they are can only do 3 tri-dons in that 50 minutes period only. Then it will fall in line more to how raids were restricted to a daily cap, same as sortie technically also. People will be less restrictive on what people bring, as long as it meets the min criteria to handle it easy.

Plus we already have Oberons/Volts/Trinities who can outright solo tridolons in 10 minutes. Its not exactly that hard to achieve similar results and this was before oberon could self smite infusion himself. Below being a video of it being possible to do this with Volt, aka not needing a Trinity to keep the lures alive

P.S. if you say its because of the vigilante cheese or vigorous swap, you can go on youtube and i believe you can find some videos where people did similar results on solo without using such things at all. Some even being BEFORE arbitration was a thing.

Edited September 9, 2019 by Avienas

[Peter]

2 minutes ago, Avienas said:

They do not want to waste time if they can do more of them in that period of 50 minutes. But if they are can only do 3 tri-dons in that 50 minutes period only. Then it will fall in line more to how raids were restricted to a daily cap, same as sortie technically also. People will be less restrictive on what people bring, as long as it meets the min criteria to handle it easy.

Plus we already have Oberons/Volts/Trinities who can outright solo tridolons in 10 minutes. Its not exactly that hard to achieve similar results and this was before oberon could self smite infusion himself. Below being a video of it being possible to do this with Volt, aka not needing a Trinity to keep the lures alive

 

U got 0 caps and instead to fix this you prefer to complain on the forum while i'm doing 5x3 exactly now.

I think the problem is not on the Eidolons itself 🙂

[(PSN)smb-twisted]

2 hours ago, Avienas said:

The better approach is instead of making eidolons easier or harder, its to restrain how many people can do every 2~3 hours....

Plus if people were to complain on the limiting of it, then that would only be the crazy elites who spent thousands of plat on expensive as fk rivens and so on when its D.E.`s decision.....

some people enjoy some content, taknig that away from them isn't a good idea just because you don't like it

[Avienas]

13 hours ago, Peter said:

U got 0 caps and instead to fix this you prefer to complain on the forum while i'm doing 5x3 exactly now.

I think the problem is not on the Eidolons itself 🙂

my hydrolyst count is a little over 50 honestly because i do not mass grind them to gamble like how sortie rewards & riven cycling is to farm them. I do not exactly keep around a dedicated team to easy do 5 dons every 3 hours, nor can i rely on constantly getting players of great skill to guarantee quick flow rounds. Its honestly rather boring to farm them since i already have a sizable amount of plat so chasing energize/barrier/aegis/grace/avenger arcanes which in single pieces will not amount to much if i can even find a buyer without spending hours wading thru people wanting them for 25 or less platinum, and only maybe 5 focus skills are left between vazarin, naramon and unairu are left to max which are mostly just void mode/blast/dash augments that are quite literal useless garbage in any content except maybe me trying to solo earth maps with operator only.

Only real time i get to actively enjoy them is when clan members want to run them and they give 0 fks on build comps so we can enjoy some real fun setups which ignore the so-called mandatory need for chroma/harrow/volt and still get around 3 hydrolysts long as everyone knows what they are doing. Which honestly if you are going past 3 hydrolyst in a night then you are already running some serious speed cheese that clearly show you just want to be that thirsty for arcanes despite them having such low chance odds of dropping.

 

12 hours ago, (PS4)smb-twisted said:

some people enjoy some content, taknig that away from them isn't a good idea just because you don't like it

People complained that nightwave was a serious burn out so d.e. was `forced` to change it by getting rid of alot of the quests, simpilified them and reduce the number you get a week while upping the gain. Same could be said to how people demand and continue to demand that ephemera have such ridiculous low drop rates while having to get into rotation C in arbitations/ESO just to reach the bare entrance to obtain them and going deeper does not up the odds as the difficulty rises to continue. Very sure plenty of people were having a sheet storm over how grindie dog days were, though maybe not as much when plague star came, but were probably complaining on multiple things such as host migration screwing up the missions and costing people resources and other things.

Difference between `taking away content` and putting a actual leash on it so people do not need to chase the thing all over a animal park to catch up to it. Some people like to do other things then just constantly chase one content to over-exhaustion when no limit is put in place, very sure if operators were to get buffed people would want 7 to 9 or more tridolon captures a round, plus players with low capture counts would get further clucked in being able to play it, especially once look-link/mod-link shows up and people will fking tell you to piss off if you do not have the exact mod-link loadout, especially those that constantly demand a 300+ or more hydrolyst capture count to even be allowed to do runs with them.

 

 

Plenty of reasons exist why people want `more difficult eidolons` is because it turned into a speed clearing rush of abusing things like resetting the instance to slurp up more runs in those 50 minutes then people likely do in a week back when it was just raids people did for `arcane hunting`. But least raids had more things like massive credit dumps, rare boxes and even those special blue prints to be able to just straight up craft rare resources which were nice for people who were not fans of mass stock ups when they were a couple short on crafting something.

It pretty much devolved from it being a trial of showing off your skill by being able to down a teralyst by yourself to if you do not have this many hydrolyst captures under your belt, your some stupid pleb who do not even get to hang out with us on a capture session (which makes up most of recruit chat, easily 20~30 minutes before a plains nightfall).

[sinnae]

On 2019-09-05 at 9:26 AM, Nordia said:

Dear developers, because you made eidolons too weak, the prices for arcanes such as grace and energize have fallen, so the business of players like me started to crumble! I find this insulting and urge you to roll back the changes! 

 

I have never before questioned your competence, but if you really think that the eidolons were too strong, then at least go to YouTube and see how to properly kill(capture) them, it's not at all difficult.

If you make all your income off of 3rd party trading for a F2P game then you can't be surprised if balance changes leave you without a job. DE has no obligation to help a minority of players make money off of other players who don't/can't/won't play their content. It's in their best interest to make content accessible to a wider range of people.

However, from a gameplay perspective, eidolons are a fun/challenging boss, nerfing them too hard would be boring. They're one of maybe two or three activities in the whole game where your loadout and investment actually make an appreciable concrete difference.

[Peter]

43 minutes ago, Avienas said:

my hydrolyst count is a little over 50 honestly because i do not mass grind them to gamble like how sortie rewards & riven cycling is to farm them. (1000 words of bs).

Dude, you got 0 caps, neither 1 nor 2, just 0. I can't take you seriously, sorry.

If you want to contribute feedback at least understand the subject you want to discuss.

Next.

Edited September 9, 2019 by Peter

[(PSN)smb-twisted]

43 minutes ago, Avienas said:

It pretty much devolved from it being a trial of showing off your skill by being able to down a teralyst by yourself to if you do not have this many hydrolyst captures under your belt, your some stupid pleb who do not even get to hang out with us on a capture session (which makes up most of recruit chat, easily 20~30 minutes before a plains nightfall).

 

i get this, i really do, as someone who has been and still is regularly on both sides of this lol.

but like so much of this stuff, if you don't like being a solo player who relies on public to get things done, if you want to play the team content, then a clan solves all this angst. i've taught tons of my clanmates how to do it, regularly carry people through and help them with builds etc etc.

but i also want to do damn smooth 3/4/5 in a night runs too