Amesha in Railjack has become the "Itzal of open worlds pre-blink-rework"

[Thexlawx]

I had much fun and love a lot of action in Railjack Missions on Earth and Saturn. The last zone Veil Proxima is sad disappointed, I didnt expected too many 100% Archwing Missions. The Railjack is parking since the start and every goes with Amesha to complete mission. They didnt die once time.
You dont need to invest a penny for your Railjack, if you have good Amesha build, you are basically invulnerable.

I know, I should bring my own Railjack but some upgrades/component are still on research and the cost is immense high.

[CuChulainnWD]

Who ever thinks Amesha needs a nerf has rocks in their heads. You do not get energy back from your 4 if your 1 is active. It is active systems management with Amesha or you die. Amesha works perfectly well as a serviceable Archwing. It is not "OP" especially when you go beyond Earth. Amesha is pretty much the equivalent of Nova. If Amesha were to be nerfed, then Nova needs a nerf too. Heck why not nerf everything into the ground while we are at it?

Instead lets talk about buffing the other three Archwings.

Itzle: How about doubling or tripling its normal flight speed over other Archwings. That way Iztle remains the Ferrari of the Archwing world.  Give it an Ivara style invisibility but with out the speed reduction. Increase Cosmic Crush to be the equivalent of a RailJack. Have it's ripline tether imobilise the target boggie.

Elytron: Should be a flying tank. Buff up its damage, increase the fire rate and velocity of its munitions, if not make it hit scan. Beef up its health and armour. Make Bloomer a fast seeking missile. Have core Vent be useful by being able to support a Railjack in flight with a sizeable radius of effect, maybe repelling boarding sleds. Increase the radius and damage of Thumper. Make the "Plodding" missile of Warhead be a Hypersonic nuke of death.

Odinata: Is a flying pig. Pigs fly now I guess, so anything is possible for this flying piece of rubbish. Increase the energy shell ability bubble to encompass a rail Jack and make it durable enough to sustain more than a few hits from Fighters and or Crew Ships. Make it's disarray more useful by expanding its range and make it work in Railjack. Make its homing missile able to actually track and keep up with enemy fighters. Make it's repel actually work in Railjack with a substantial AOE boost in range.

All of these buffs would improve each of these Archwings viable for support to the Archwings, as Railjack intrinsics and some Avionics are meant to support the Archwings.

Edited December 19, 2019 by CuChulainnWD

[(PSN)psycofang]

On 2019-12-16 at 2:25 PM, Jarriaga said:

DE introducing something into the game, leaving it completely broken but not concerned because it's not widely used or popular unless the game itself introduces something else that makes it extremely relevant without a single adjustment.

Chroma? Eidolon smasher king (rip)

[SneakyErvin]

14 hours ago, PyrrhoOfElis said:

That's a lot of people sitting around doing nothing. You really don't need  an entire person dedicated to gunning and nothing else, and you definitely don't need an entire person dedicated to AFK slingshot waiting for crewships to spawn. It takes maybe 10-15 seconds to down a crewship and warp back to the ship. I prefer the pilot or engineer just do it.

I'd even rather have 1 person just out collecting rss instead of sitting on the ship doing something that the engie/pilot can easily do in their spare time.

As for taking over crewships, that stops being useful after you get some intrinsics and leave earth. It's just a fun thing to do on the early missions & not a serious tactical option in the Veil. I do wish they would make intrinsics apply to crewships. Would make them pretty useful later on.

You really only need a pilot & engineer to finish Veil missions. Third person should go on Amesha duty. The 4th person should be gunner and crewship killer, and that's only because there isn't anything else for them to do, but they could actually just be a 2nd Amesha or go collect rss by themselves and let the engie/pilot take care of gunning & crewships.

Point being that nerfing Amesha is going to kill an entire role and make RJ extremely boring because there just isn't a need for 4 people on the ship unless there are also changes made to RJ operations. I prefer to prioritize fun in game that isn't serious or competitive anyway. Having people sitting around with fewer tasks to attend is not fun.

That depends if you wanna clear the mission as fast as possible or not, so people can focus on loot quicker. Two constant gunners in an appropriately geared out RJ is useful because you cover every fighter 24/7. You dont really need the 4th to do anything, that is why he can chill as the slingshot and possibly take the engi role aswell.

Crewships are still useful in the Veil, but I also never said you were supposed to camp in them. You can use them as an extra tank and damage layer in between destroying the crewships since the soak up far more attention than an archwing. Though it is often unneeded because the RJ is mostly strong enough to handle itself with a crew in the middle of it all when you hit veil. 

And the people that say that someone should just play Amesha instead of being a second gunner gives me the feel you've been on RJs with horrible builds and weapon loadouts. With the right guns and avionics the RJ is much stronger than anything an AW can bring.

Also, Amesha shouldnt get nerfed, the rest of the AWs should get buffed along with their weapons.

[Azrael_V]

I don't mind Amesha. You still get one shotted from a Cruiseship later on anyways.Why are the other Archwings even more useless is my question. Odonata Prime which is a Prime can only carry you so far. The other Archwings need a serious buff or we end up with a Saryn in ESO situation. Only one viable option. (Of course you can make others work but Cmon). On the other hand why do people now suddenly care about using only Amesha. Its not like Archwing was a thing. Not on the forums anyway...

Edited December 19, 2019 by Azrael_V

[Chappie]

On 2019-12-16 at 1:37 PM, Pr1A said:

Nothing wrong with that, but Amesha is pretty much the only viable option if you don't want to get instakilled.

Considering that DE needed to get this launched for the holiday season...I am fine with it. 

I know Archwing will be overhauled going forward, so I will just play the "meta" as it is right now and move on from there.    Right now I am actually enjoying archwing in railjack coupled with wisp.   It is extremely fast paced and highly active especially with the Tac4 recall.     Coupled with the fact that a lot of people tend to stay on the ship...being the forward guard/assault team is a hoot.

[Smilomaniac]

The incessant calls for nerfs never cease to amaze me.

At the moment you die as soon as you leave the ship (in the veil), unless you use the slow as molasses slingshot or use your 1 in Amesha.

Nerfing Amesha does not solve this issue, namely that all the small craft, outriders and crewships should not be able to hurt you in the first 3-5 seconds of exiting anything on the map.
The second issue is that none of these should be able to one-shot you in the first place, even if it makes sense that you shouldn't survive a missile that's bigger than you.

Yes the Amesha will remain as powerful as its always been, but now you can use all the other ones as well and have fun with those without being forced to use one. As a bonus, the rest of us who don't want to sit in archwing for more than A-to-B play can comfortably sit with our 1st ability on and get to the crewship without drama.

For the love of everything that makes this game good, stop calling for nerfs.

Edited December 19, 2019 by Smilomaniac

[kuryux]

No, just no. For the love of mother Lotus, just dont.

Difficult is easy peasy already, no need for more nerfs. Amesha is good rn so that the noobs can help a bit. I keep using itzal though, slingshot gets the job done fast n easy on cs and its better for farming in the end

[vegetosayajin]

56 minutes ago, Smilomaniac said:

stop calling for nerfs

Nobody called for nerfs on the catchmoon, de did it themselves based on the usage stats.Same with Itzal (universal blink is a nerf to itzal, yes).Same with a lot of weapons and frames (how vets remember the tonkor for example).
It's like this - if something is really fun and useful it will eventually get nerfed, so enjoy how many months you have left with it.

[nslay]

14 minutes ago, vegetosayajin said:

It's like this - if something is really fun and useful it will eventually get nerfed, so enjoy how many months you have left with it.

Or years left of it.

[vegetosayajin]

Hopefully, yes. Positivism is always welcome.

[Sapphirya]

Suggestion that might be unpopular: perhaps leave Amesha the way it is, buff the other archwings to be more in line with it in their respective specializations, but also prevent archguns from damaging fighters in these missions to discourage people from going out to fight them? I'm not sure what else DE could do at this point. I already one-shot fighters in the veil with my cryo gun, so I don't think buffing the railjack's damage is the solution.

[Melanholic7]

inc "Either nerf Amesha" and thats all. =/// 

Idk, im dieing in railjack archwing in like 10-15 second. WIth itzal or elytron. This so frustrating, i wont ever fly outside ship now. Or maybe will try Amesha....

[HexxyTheGrouch]

The funny thing about all this is that I've been ahead of the curve since the Amesha dropped. The first skill alone on cooldown makes it tough to kill. I'm not the most agile player, so being able to tank some hits is a big plus.
I built the phaedra because 'slightly inaccurate bullet hose with a massive clip' sounded just right even though the fluctus and grattler were my previous picks.

Yes, I spent time and forma maxing both of those out in regular old unpopular archwing missions.

It's all amusing to me because I'm ahead of the tryhard meta curve on accident because the playstyle felt right and now that the meta curve moved the salt is real. I'm sure DE will eventually nerf it pretty hard and then it'll be a discussion of how to stop dying in archwing with the response chorus of get gud. In short, another day on the Warframe forum. -___-

[(XBOX)D devil117]

If you a&*hats get my only archwing nerfed that I've been using since it came out for archwing missions I'm going to riot. It's fine if you can't grind nightwave to get it don't cry because you see other people using it. It's abilities are highly valuable in archwing missions since it's pretty much the trinity of archwing. Please think about other people who aren't playing railjack... you'd be nerfing a vital role needed in those mission types. So where's your thread asking for a trinity nerd? She's got the same exact abilities with a few tweaks. Infinite energy, health and o.p. damage reduction.  

Edited December 24, 2019 by (XB1)D devil117

[(PSN)psycofang]

If Amesha gets nerfed i will make a massive as hell post demanding Trinity to be reworked or deleted. Dont make me do this... i have a lot of whiskey and im not afraid to wield its mighty power.

Edited December 24, 2019 by (PS4)psycofang

[ILOHARTA]

premise: I don't intend to take join the RJ fray (well, not until months and months of polishing will have passed)

BUT(T): have you gentlemen considered that maybe the frustration on RJ's missions is 'by design'? I mean, it would be an effective way to make players feel inadequate for the New War, would give the enemy faction the upper hand needed for the Tenno to actually feel threatened.

...or it could just be bad design

 

[GrimSinner]

On 2019-12-16 at 11:20 PM, (PS4)Aneres_Omega said:

Point is don't go wanting a nerf for the only half decent tool we have left to deal with this broken RJ content.

This!  Half my fun in Railjack is being a support archwing doing space fighter dogfights, slowing fighters for RJ gunners, boarding crewships, searching for that unique unit that might drop a good mod, etc.  I tried it with other archwings and got insta-killed to the point if Amesha didn't exist, I would never join the outside world space battles and just sit in the back doing engineering.  The most fun aspect of the game, imo, would be dead the instant DE nerfs the Amesha.

So my vote is to rework the other archwings to make them viable in RJ rather than nerf Amesha and destroy a big part of what is fun in Railjack.

[GrimSinner]

On 2019-12-19 at 10:32 AM, Sapphirya said:

prevent archguns from damaging fighters in these missions to discourage people from going out to fight them?

This better be a joke.  A huge part of the railjack experience is space fighter dogfights.  Nerfing Amesha will ruin it, disabling archguns will ruin it.