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Riven Disposition Guidelines


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Greetings Tenno!

Players who have completed The War Within quest will be familiar with Riven Mods. These special weapon Mods with randomized stat rolls offer powerful customization options from the mysterious Cephalon Samodeus. Those who have been with us a bit longer may have noticed that the stats on these Mods can change over time - we wanted to outline the reasons for that, and share some Riven facts you may not already know!

Each weapon has a unique “Disposition”, applied as a multiplier on your Riven’s stat rolls. Any weapon that you own a Riven for will have Riven Disposition “dots” in the Arsenal, indicating strength - the higher the number, the stronger the stats. 
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These numbers are curated by our developers during each Prime Access release, to help gently maintain the top-end balance of weapon power levels. Since Rivens can be high value trade commodities, we have developed a number of rules to keep things as fair as possible, so everybody knows what to expect.

Here’s everything you need to know about Riven Dispositions!

THE BASICS:

  • Riven Dispositions generally span from 0.5 to 1.5. The Arsenal dots are not a static representation of these numbers, but representative of percentages - so a weapon with 1 dot is in the bottom 20% of Dispositions, while a weapon with 5 dots is in the top 20%.
  • Newly released weapons start at the minimum of 0.5. This gives us the opportunity to see how a weapon performs in players’ hands, so that we can make educated changes instead of starting at an artificially higher number. This saves us, and players, from having to constantly reduce new weapons after release. 
  • Although Rivens can be equipped to an entire “weapon family”, Dispositions are given to each individual weapon. You can equip the same Riven Mod onto Braton, Braton Prime and Braton Vandal, but the stats of the Riven may differ slightly depending on which weapon you are modding. 
  • In the Riven Cycle screen, you can see how stats differ between weapon types you own by changing the option in the bottom right.
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  • We will only make adjustments to Riven Dispositions during Prime Access releases, roughly once every 3 months. Since these updates release simultaneously across all platforms, this makes it impossible for traders to gain an unfair advantage using knowledge gained from other platforms.

THE NUMBERS:

  • For each set of adjustments, we generate a “recommended” value for each weapon. This number is based 50% on usage stats from players at high Mastery Rank, and 50% from an “internal ranking”.
  • These internal rankings are maintained by Digital Extremes developers based on a weapon’s perceived strength, and are adjusted when opinions change, or when a stronger variant of a weapon is released. Internal rankings are applied per family of weapon - this allows us to keep Dispositions within a family relatively close to each other, to avoid a situation where a weaker weapon becomes the stronger choice once a Riven is applied. 
  • Any change will adjust the number by at least 0.05. If the suggested change is smaller, then we leave the number as-is.
  • We will never reduce a Disposition by more than 0.2 at one time. There is no upper limit on how much we increase a weapon’s Disposition, allowing us to bring a new weapon up to speed quickly if it is underperforming.
  • All Disposition changes are reviewed by several people within the company. Changes are only approved if we believe they are good for the game overall.

Warframe has a long history of reworks and system changes that can shift the power dynamic drastically over time. This is why Rivens are an ever-changing system: Tenno should have a reason to use their favorite weapons, instead of choosing solely based on power. With the knowledge that these Riven Mods can change over time, we encourage Tenno to remain flexible and experiment in response to changes, to truly master their Arsenals even further.

Thanks for reading Tenno!

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Pretty concise description on the riven disposition. 

As far as I can tell, no new information or key information was left out of post.

Can't wait to see what weapons got riven disposition changes once Garuda Prime Launches! 

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yes, we know. but for the love of everything that is holy, PLEASE add a fast way to farm kuva + a way to LOCK the stats of the rivens so we can work up to something we want, and not always be a slave to RNG in it's purest form. 

it's a quadra layer of RNG. 

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Additive stat changes instead of percentage based ones? The issue with the current system is it fails at bringing up really weak weapons since they have nothing to increase with a percentage.

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1 minute ago, mikakor said:

yes, we know. but for the love of everything that is holy, PLEASE add a fast way to farm kuva + a way to LOCK the stats of the rivens so we can work up to something we want, and not always be a slave to RNG in it's purest form. 

it's a quadra layer of RNG. 

What's the point? I mean... It would be easier for us to get god riven. But... Making something that is already broken... More broken? We all know that rivens (god rivens for meta weapons) are totally overkill most of the times. So why make it easier?

 

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Just now, PappaJerry said:

What's the point? I mean... It would be easier for us to get god riven. But... Making something that is already broken... More broken? We all know that rivens (god rivens for meta weapons) are totally overkill most of the times. So why make it easier?

 

the point is that people can individually work toward their ideal riven with times. be less reliant on RNG. which is ALWAYS a good thing. 

and anyway low dispo wepaons sitll will have barely any good rivens, so. 

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how about showing precise dispo value on hovering, instead of vague dots?

also might be nice to send inbox message, indicating that owned weapons might have their dispo changed - i remember that happening a while ago

Edited by SilentMashiko
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So, how does this explain the sudden disposition nerf on Paracesis? 
Right after Scarlet Spear, the disposition got nuked by .15 points. It wasn't even meta back then, and it was only because SS promoted the use of it. It really felt like a planned thing to nerf its disposition.
In my opinion, disposition still needs better ways to be calculated, AND new weapons starting at the lowest disposition possible simply disincentives people from getting / playing around rivens. Continuing that logic, even to this day, there's dispositions that makes values so low that they aren't even worth slotting. 
While on paper i agree to the way disposition is calculated now, there are still issues in this system that i wished it would be looked at more.

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9 minutes ago, mikakor said:

yes, we know. but for the love of everything that is holy, PLEASE add a fast way to farm kuva + a way to LOCK the stats of the rivens so we can work up to something we want, and not always be a slave to RNG in it's purest form. 

it's a quadra layer of RNG. 

I agree not everyone wants to do the same thing 30 times in attempt to get something worth using it takes away from the experience and re rolling rivens is a double edged sword no way to guarantee its for a weapon you like nor keep the one stat on the riven that makes it worth it I would love to see some kind of lock mechanic atleast a one stat lock 🔐  option per 3 rerolls like it only stays locked 3 times then all stats roll again that way its only marginally better and not overly broken 

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1 hour ago, Vavency said:

Additive stat changes instead of percentage based ones? The issue with the current system is it fails at bringing up really weak weapons since they have nothing to increase with a percentage.

In the post, it says there is no upper limit to dispo raises, only a cap on reducing them by at much as 0.2 per cycle.

 

Thank you for the guideline. I personally think the internal ranking is out-of-touch with many weapons however, especially assault rifles (too low) and beams (too high).

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With thousands of combinations and no way to lock a stat, this riven system does not respect the player's time, and that is the reason why i try to avoid rivens as much as possible. Thankfully you don't need rivens to use any weapon in the game for any content. This system needs a rework, long overdue

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43 minutes ago, [DE]Connor said:

This number is based 50% on usage stats from players

You need to eliminate the usage stat variable in your balancing, because that is one of the most incorrect metrics to use when it comes to weapon balancing. You should instead be looking at raw numbers, and not the popularity of a weapon.

That said, I still believe the whole Riven system in the game simply needs to be removed, and replaced with a proper balancing pass across all weapons to bring everything inline with each other, instead of how some weapons (Namely AoE based ones) overshadow those that only deal damage to single targets, and the likes.

Edited by SephirothWS
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10 minutes ago, ReddyDisco said:

With thousands of combinations and no way to lock a stat, this riven system does not respect the player's time, and that is the reason why i try to avoid rivens as much as possible. Thankfully you don't need rivens to use any weapon in the game for any content. This system needs a rework, long overdue

there's been a video by sabuuchi like a few days ago that clearly shown how Kuva is an atrocious mechanic no? 

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Thank you very much for the summary.

51 minutes ago, [DE]Connor said:

We will only make adjustments to Riven Dispositions during Prime Access releases, roughly once every 3 months. Since these updates release simultaneously across all platforms, this makes it impossible for traders to gain an unfair advantage using knowledge gained from other platforms.

There have been times it appears that dispo updates have been missed for very new weapons.  For instance, during the last update, Strun Prime and Magnus Prime.  Hopefully these are getting an increase this time.  If they don't, I'd be really, really curious to know the reasoning.  Speaking of which, you used to give us a few explanations for specific weapon dispo changes.  I know your time is limited, and there's no particular advantage to DE in doing so, but it would be great to get these  back to any extent.

Also occasionally new versions of old weapons have inherited the old dispos, either in reality or apparently--I'm not sure.  Sometimes these get corrected fast, and sometimes not.  Like, you might want to check Knell Prime has the dispo you want, and doublecheck Nagantaka Prime before the update.   Mistakes happen, but I'm sure  there are people who get taken advantage of or disappointed when these corrections occur after the fact.  The dispo system has some of this harshness inherently, so I think it's even more important to reduce the errors.

Finally I'll just say there's a lot of room to improve the riven system.  Without getting into big overhauls, one thing that is worth looking at is increasing the dispo multiplier range at the top end.  This would allow finer graduation between weapons that are not that great, and for the those with the least potential to get a bit closer to the rest.

 

Edited by Tiltskillet
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I don't see  anything that most regular players didn't already know,

Was there a reason for this post?

40 minutes ago, [DE]Connor said:

Riven Dispositions generally span from 0.5 to 1.5. The Arsenal dots are not a static representation of these numbers, but representative of percentages - so a weapon with 1 dot is in the bottom 20% of Dispositions, while a weapon with 5 dots is in the top 20%.

This is something i have a personal problem with. could you please make it less varied such that we get whole numbers instead of fractions in the riven description? It just ... feels unpolished.

 

44 minutes ago, [DE]Connor said:

For each set of adjustments, we generate a “recommended” value for each weapon. This number is based 50% on usage stats from players at high Mastery Rank, and 50% from an “internal ranking”.

This doesnt really explain much , it just translates to " we will make an arbitrary decision based on popularity " which is fine , its your game.

But if you already know the weapons are weak / overpowered , wouldnt it make sense to change the weapons themselves?

Kind of a roundabout way to do things and then trying to justify it.

I have no problem with Rivens by themselves , just dont try to push it as a means to experiment.

 

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Rivens and Kuva as a whole need some change, it's been untouched for a while, it almost feels like a dead system, and the amount of time it takes (3 months) to see changes on the disposition of weapons makes this issue even worse.

Some bad ideas that maybe could be looked into.

-New possible stats on the rolls (chance to get creative, or at least put stats like %crit chance on headshot for guns, like melee has with slide attacks)
-Locking riven stats, or similar kind of checkpoint systems to improve the feel of the grind, stat changers as a possible reward from any other game mode could be a much needed QoL for rivens.
-Riven selectors as a "pity system", where if you open X amount of Shotgun riven mods, you can then choose 1 from a list.
-changing the disposition system to go from 0,5 -1,5 to 1-1,5. Hell, even increase it to 1,0-2,0. So that the lowest dispositions feel better to equip, while the weakest weapons with the highest dispositions get a bigger boost if they truly deserve it.

As it stands, rivens right now for me, and probably for many others aren't worth the time and frustration.

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What's the point of non-meta weapons with a good riven disposition if it comes with a ridiculous and boring rng with absurd grind? I've lost count of how many rivens I rerolled with 100k+ Kuva and the frustration of not having anything interesting !!!

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Riven disposition changes for newer weapons should trend less on usage stats since there will be people using them just to get mastery or it is the brand new thing, especially since you mentioned it only looks at the higher mastery ranks. This could also be impacted by how hard or easy the weapon is to acquire as that can also dictate the usage stats of one weapon over another.

A good weapon example of this is the Ghoul Saw, an easy to acquire weapon and one that was almost agreed to be universally bad got no disposition changes on its first pass whereas prime weapons usually get a riven disposition increase on their first pass since they are usually a little bit harder to acquire so the usage stats would show up less, in which people also argue should get a higher riven disposition change on their pass as well, which they do and on at least one subsequent pass most of the time,

I think a 25% usage, 75% internal ranking split for weapons heading into their first riven disposition could be a good proposal to fix this without radically changing the entire system.

Edited by XHADgaming
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46 минут назад, mikakor сказал:

be less reliant on RNG. which is ALWAYS a good thing. 
 

Wrong game, bud. Expecting less rng here is the same as expecting less rng in gacha stuff 

Edited by Emilias
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45 minutes ago, [DE]Connor said:

We will never reduce a Disposition by more than 0.2 at one time. There is no upper limit on how much we increase a weapon’s Disposition, allowing us to bring a new weapon up to speed quickly if it is underperforming.

If you know a weapon is underperforming why not directly increasing its base stats, instead of its riven? Isn't it in the interest of game diversity to have more or less equally performing weapons for everyone to try instead that for riven owners only?

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16 minutes ago, DebrisFlow said:

If you know a weapon is underperforming why not directly increasing its base stats, instead of its riven? Isn't it in the interest of game diversity to have more or less equally performing weapons for everyone to try instead that for riven owners only?

it would take way more time than just letting the riven do their thing and pretend they care :P it's way too much time. if they ACTUALLY wanted low rank weapon to perform well, they would personally buff them out to be on par with modern weapons. 

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3 hours ago, SephirothWS said:

You need to eliminate the usage stat variable in your balancing, because that is one of the most incorrect metrics to use when it comes to weapon balancing. You should instead be looking at raw numbers, and not the popularity of a weapon.

 

3 hours ago, XHADgaming said:

Riven disposition changes for newer weapons should trend less on usage stats since there will be people using them just to get mastery or it is the brand new thing

The 2021 usage stats thread revealed DE only measure usage while the weapon is at Rank 30+. This means forma usage time or mastery farming time don't count. People have to fully rank it and stick with it while fully ranked to affect usage stats.

Now they are mentioning it's measured among high MR players; those who have farmed/owned more weapons and content to compare against. This results in power level measurement closely resembling usage and stats patterns. There are 2 levels of filtering here, so I think it's an accurate measurement of performance ballparks.

3 hours ago, DebrisFlow said:

If you know a weapon is underperforming why not directly increasing its base stats, instead of its riven? Isn't it in the interest of game diversity to have more or less equally performing weapons for everyone to try instead that for riven owners only?

I'd presume that's because what you are suggesting means a double buff considering the new revised stats would be further amplified by Rivens due to their percentage bonus nature even if the Rivens themselves don't change. Also, DE have said in the past they themselves categorize weapon MR based on performance tier brackets: https://forums.warframe.com/topic/918482-shrine-of-the-eidolon-update-22120/

Quote

We are revisiting all weapons and adjusting their stats to fit into some Mastery Rank grouping guidelines based on DPS and Crit/Status split total. With this in mind, we are buffing a lot of the weapons you know and love!

 We calculate DPS based on sustained DPS which also takes Critical and Status values into account

That section means weapons are meant to be outclassed the wider the MR bracket gap is.

Edited by Jarriaga
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This guideline is nice, but for years and years the elephant in the room is still not addressed. Disposition has little to no influence on what people are using. Inversely, YouTube and social media has a massively artificial effect on usage. We saw this with Kronen Prime. You guys nerfed Kronen Prime's Disposition for spiked usage when the weapon was still "balanced" in your system before YouTube and the playerbase at large created hype. Then, while Kronen was being lowered, you guys buffed the Disposition of Ohma, a weapon with access to the same Sovereign Outcast stance and comparable stats. I am not going to say buffing Ohma was a mistake, but the situation was entirely arbitrary. People still use Kronen, still use Kuva Nukor, still use Kuva Bramma/Zarr/Ogris, because those weapons are good to begin with. The average person isn't using Rivens, and the way Rivens are treated internally only punish those interested in Rivens. It would be alot easier if Disposition simply didn't exist and time was spent on lowering/increasing base stats when applicable every 3 months to keep things fresh. You can play with the weapon power ceiling without hurting the players that go through the grindiest system in the game despite it being 6 years old now.

There's also many smaller issues within the system like stats exclusive to Archgun Rivens when that category does not have a vanilla mod representing said stat (Damage to Grineer/Corpus, Zoom, etc.), or the lack of +/- Impact/Puncture/Slash on weapons that had their base damage changed to include those. Likewise, many secondaries roll Projectile Speed despite being hitscan.

Edited by Voltage
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