(PSN)Hopper_Orouk Posted October 31, 2023 Share Posted October 31, 2023 (edited) If the enemies are unabled to be picked up by the tentacles (e.g. enemies affected by Petrify or immune to crowd control), they need to be killed by the tentacles to drop additional loot. We're back to square one guys, we're back to the era where Hydroid's tentacles needs to kill enemies to drop extra loot, and it's even worse than before. not only that, they nerfed the tentacles' ability to make enemies drop extra loot just being in the vicinity, they have to be picked up. and they if they can't be picked up they have to be killed by the tentacles. guess what? the tentacles don't flap their arms for damage anymore, they just flail there helplessly. so you can't properly stack it With Ore gaze. Thanks DE amazing "rework"... Edited October 31, 2023 by (PSN)Hopper_Orouk 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turritopsis_Dohrnii Posted October 31, 2023 Share Posted October 31, 2023 Just bumping this with your post here in the Hydroid Feedback section: For more support and clarity reasons of course. Kind of surprised this hasn't popped up earlier with all the bug-like problems Tentacle Swarm had. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Hopper_Orouk Posted October 31, 2023 Author Share Posted October 31, 2023 5 minutes ago, Turritopsis_Dohrnii said: Just bumping this with your post here in the Hydroid Feedback section: For more support and clarity reasons of course. Kind of surprised this hasn't popped up earlier with all the bug-like problems Tentacle Swarm had. Sad how they nerfed everything about Hydroid and everything that made him Hydroid...for a plagiarized pillage... 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)GEN-Son_17 Posted October 31, 2023 Share Posted October 31, 2023 15 minutes ago, (PSN)Hopper_Orouk said: Sad how they nerfed everything about Hydroid and everything that made him Hydroid...for a plagiarized pillage... Uhhh, what!? Alright dude, point to the nerfs (the real ones) because the new Hydroid is an absolute MONSTER and is everything an ultra killer pirate captain ninja should be, IMO! He is a wicked destroyer, not giving any enemies a chance to fight back (no quarter), whether it's the constant stagger his 1 provides (steel navigator of storms), the toss & clutter style of his wave (master of the seven seas) or the tentacle swarm literally holding enemies still for easy quick kills (reign over the sea beasts). Add in enemy armor strip and self armor buff in one ability (pillage and plunder...only he takes lives), and I just don't get what this "square one" stuff is. That all said, I get the pilfering swarm issue you're having but that is significantly less than the level of strength you're giving the issue. 14 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SDGDen Posted October 31, 2023 Share Posted October 31, 2023 27 minutes ago, (PSN)Hopper_Orouk said: Sad how they nerfed everything about Hydroid and everything that made him Hydroid...for a plagiarized pillage... thiiiis, so much this. although personally i'd consider it more a dollar store defy. since it doesn't actually put out a radial armor stripping pulse, all it does for armor strip is turn the temporary armor strip from applied corrosive procs into a permanent one when uh... spoilers DE: once an enemy has been fully stripped, they tend to not live long enough for that strip duration to matter. and because of how it resets your armor and buffs when you cast it to do that armor strip plus it's reliance on spreading corrosive procs first, you are GENUINELY better off replacing it with roar for offense or defy for defense. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turritopsis_Dohrnii Posted October 31, 2023 Share Posted October 31, 2023 (edited) 11 minutes ago, (PSN)GEN-Son_17 said: Uhhh, what!? Alright dude, point to the nerfs (the real ones) because the new Hydroid is an absolute MONSTER and is everything an ultra killer pirate captain ninja should be, IMO! He is a wicked destroyer, not giving any enemies a chance to fight back (no quarter), whether it's the constant stagger his 1 provides (steel navigator of storms), the toss & clutter style of his wave (master of the seven seas) or the tentacle swarm literally holding enemies still for easy quick kills (reign over the sea beasts). Add in enemy armor strip and self armor buff in one ability (pillage and plunder...only he takes lives), and I just don't get what this "square one" stuff is. That all said, I get the pilfering swarm issue you're having but that is significantly less than the level of strength you're giving the issue. It would've been nice for them to also keep around the old stuff for the people who liked using the old abilities or combination thereof - or even making the old abilities unlockable in a super out of the way manner. It's cool that you find it fun, but what about the people who stuck it out with Hydroid before the rework and used him in our own ways? It's mutiny I tell you. Edited October 31, 2023 by Turritopsis_Dohrnii Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leqesai Posted October 31, 2023 Share Posted October 31, 2023 When pablo showed off the new powers I didn't like the ult. The tentacles are more or less nezha spears sticking out of the ground. They don't move around whatsoever. It's really a pity. The visuals on plunder are also pretty bad (nonexistant). Functionally it works okay but this update really was a nerf on hydroids animations/aesthetics if nothing else. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PR1D3 Posted October 31, 2023 Share Posted October 31, 2023 6 minutes ago, Turritopsis_Dohrnii said: It would've been nice for them to also keep around the old stuff for the people who liked using the old abilities or combination thereof - or even making the old abilities unlockable in a super out of the way manner. It's cool that you find it fun, but what about the people who stuck it out with Hydroid before the rework and used him in our own ways? It's mutiny I tell you. Undertow was garbage. Period. Every single person who's been whining about this is wrong. And anything you all say to the contrary is just cope. It's just a part of the long list of content in this game that needed to be updated or sunsetted. They don't need to waste time in finding ways to keep obsolete content in the game. Get rid of it. No one cares about your "investment". It's a video game not a 401k. It was a meme. A stale meme. Raising Hydroid up is way more important than you maintaining your "uniqueness" for using a garbage ability. There are way more important things, big and small, that actually impact some aspect of gameplay balance, flow, and user experience that is actually worth ringing an alarm on. This doesn't even appear on the list at all. Spoiler 14 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MutoManiac Posted October 31, 2023 Share Posted October 31, 2023 Hydroid Prime was the only Prime I never got since the regular version was not great for my play style. These days though, I’m genuinely happy to see one in a mission as they seem to be really good and generally make missions easier. Don’t know about the nerfs, but I’m going to try him out for sure. Since I never played him aside from getting his subsume, I might not be so disappointed in the rework. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Unstar Posted October 31, 2023 Share Posted October 31, 2023 Personally, I think it's fine. This gives Pilfering Swarm parity with Pilfering Strangledome (it also doesn't give loot to enemies not CC'd by it), and Pilfering Swarm still comes out as the victor because it has a 100% chance of loot as opposed to Strangledome's 65%. Beyond that, how often were enemies that were immune to CC being dealt their killing blow by the tentacles? I'm guessing that if you were waiting for enemies to be killed by the tentacles, you'd actually be reducing your loot rate, compared to just killing them promptly and increasing the rate of meat grinding. Considering that Hydroid is now a fully capable Warframe, I predict that the biggest change in the loot frame space will simply be that he has become a hands-down better choice than Khora. People will still use her because they enjoy her, and she's still valid, but Hydroid is looking like an objectively better pick from a results standpoint. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)zThulsaDoomz Posted October 31, 2023 Share Posted October 31, 2023 This community never fails to amuse with takes like this. It's like somehow overnight people have forgotten how buggy, annoying, and ineffectual his kit was. I fail to see why an enemy not affect by TS should proc PS. I don't expect enemies not picked up by Strangledome to be pilfered by the augment either, but details I guess. 11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voltage Posted October 31, 2023 Share Posted October 31, 2023 1 hour ago, (PSN)GEN-Son_17 said: Uhhh, what!? Alright dude, point to the nerfs (the real ones) because the new Hydroid is an absolute MONSTER and is everything an ultra killer pirate captain ninja should be, IMO! He is a wicked destroyer, not giving any enemies a chance to fight back (no quarter), whether it's the constant stagger his 1 provides (steel navigator of storms), the toss & clutter style of his wave (master of the seven seas) or the tentacle swarm literally holding enemies still for easy quick kills (reign over the sea beasts). Add in enemy armor strip and self armor buff in one ability (pillage and plunder...only he takes lives), and I just don't get what this "square one" stuff is. That all said, I get the pilfering swarm issue you're having but that is significantly less than the level of strength you're giving the issue. On the flip side, the Hydroid rework pushes him into the same direction that most new Warframe kits fall into, which can understandably make him feel bland and uninteresting in terms of his mechanical offerings. Hydroid isn't bad by any means, and I'm still agreeing with you on viability, but Warframes for years now have just been the same mechanically, and you're just swapping between "themes". What Hydroid now offers is 100% better than the 1-trick pony he was before, but he's hardly anything unique now (besides the water visuals behind what he brings to a mission), and his 1-trick pony playstyle did see changes. Honestly, the issue OP is having here is more bound to the absolute mess of inconsistent behavior around abilities, CC, and other things. It's the same deal with Overguard on enemies right now. If Hydroid could synergize with Ore Gaze more, then you'd have a proper alternative to the boring nature of Khora, but I digress. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turritopsis_Dohrnii Posted October 31, 2023 Share Posted October 31, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, PR1D3 said: Undertow was garbage. Period. Every single person who's been whining about this is wrong. And anything you all say to the contrary is just cope. It's just a part of the long list of content in this game that needed to be updated or sunsetted. They don't need to waste time in finding ways to keep obsolete content in the game. Get rid of it. No one cares about your "investment". It's a video game not a 401k. It was a meme. A stale meme. Raising Hydroid up is way more important than you maintaining your "uniqueness" for using a garbage ability. There are way more important things, big and small, that actually impact some aspect of gameplay balance, flow, and user experience that is actually worth ringing an alarm on. This doesn't even appear on the list at all. It's so easy to say that Undertow is this or that, but complaining about something I don't have anymore that didn't bother anyone else's fun in any meaningful way that I found fun to play in a game is not wrong. You can say it's cope or whatever but I find that as long as I keep my feelings for Undertow I should keep going. A game is obsolete once the fun is gone. Undertow was not obsolete. It also doesn't matter if anyone cared for my investment since I kept to myself most of the time and enjoyed my time. Raising Hydroid up is important of course, and as far as I know, I haven't blatantly said I hated the rework. It's a strong rework and I'm happy more people are using him and enjoying him in their own ways. But you have to also remember that it's a game. A game doesn't need to take things out to keep people happy, especially when the game had ways to keep both people happy. Gameplay balance, flow, and user experience is important of course. That's why I loved the old kit - I found a way to make it work well for me and enjoyed it. You can have the new one too and we can enjoy Warframe in our own ways. What's wrong with me wanting to keep what I enjoyed before? Edited October 31, 2023 by Turritopsis_Dohrnii 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Birdframe_Prime Posted October 31, 2023 Share Posted October 31, 2023 16 minutes ago, (XBOX)zThulsaDoomz said: I fail to see why an enemy not affect by TS should proc PS. Ahh, I think the problem is that we have other Looting abilities where the enemy actually does only have to be 'affected' by them, and any method of killing them while they're 'affected' is enough to drop the extra loot. Pilfering Swarm has always had this on-again-off-again problem where enemies actually have to be killed by Tentacle Swarm itself in order to trigger the loot drop. Now that the ability has been changed to not specifically damage enemies around it, only ones it's holding, that's a bit difficult for the ability. Of course... this really only affects people that are doing their grind on higher levels. If you're just Resource farming for the basics, like needing a lot of Plastids, then Pilfering Swarm works fine because you can do it on the Dark Sector of the planets that drop them at base levels and it's fine for a reasonably good level of enemies (especially when that's Infested or Grineer). I'm wanting to be realistic with this, buuuuu~uut, I can see where Hopper's coming from. We have Pilfering Strangledome to compare it with (and Khora can be built to be nearly immortal with incredible scaling damage too) alongside other Looting casts like Ore Gaze and Desecrate, that just perform Looting actions better. When Hydroid was the original Augment for more Loot that would allow Nekros to be a non-essential for long-run missions at the time... it seems silly to have him Reworked, only to leave his Looting function back in the proverbial stone age. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pizzarugi Posted October 31, 2023 Share Posted October 31, 2023 1 hour ago, (XBOX)zThulsaDoomz said: This community never fails to amuse with takes like this. It's like somehow overnight people have forgotten how buggy, annoying, and ineffectual his kit was. I fail to see why an enemy not affect by TS should proc PS. I don't expect enemies not picked up by Strangledome to be pilfered by the augment either, but details I guess. People upset they have to double dip on lootable corpses when they want to triple dip. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raarsi Posted October 31, 2023 Share Posted October 31, 2023 Hmm, unbelievably ineffective loot frame or buff frame that can actually kill things now. Yeah, I'll settle on the extra loot runs if it means Hydroid now feels like a badass. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Hopper_Orouk Posted October 31, 2023 Author Share Posted October 31, 2023 1 hour ago, Birdframe_Prime said: I'm wanting to be realistic with this, buuuuu~uut, I can see where Hopper's coming from. Major W when Birdframe Prime is backing your argument. And it's not even an argument it's a simple fact...they made an ability just worse. 🤷♂️ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Madurai-Prime Posted October 31, 2023 Share Posted October 31, 2023 And I got called negative for telling people about the monkeys paw of reworks. Told ya. Shoulda left well enough alone. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Hopper_Orouk Posted October 31, 2023 Author Share Posted October 31, 2023 2 hours ago, (XBOX)zThulsaDoomz said: This community never fails to amuse with takes like this. It's like somehow overnight people have forgotten how buggy, annoying, and ineffectual his kit was. There is no point for you to generalize and minimize the community into a singluar group that will always complain about updates no matter what...when you forgot to ask yourself if the things we're complaining about are actually worth complaining. Yes Hydroid was terrible and forgotten, but they irreversibly made terrible mistakes with him. Why rework tentacle swarm? Why fix things that wasn't broken? All you had to do is change it's damage type and call it a day, maybe even divide the tentacles to having 10 pick up enemies and 10 slap them...it just shows the lack of creativity and patience. You can't possibly ignore stuff like this. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Hopper_Orouk Posted October 31, 2023 Author Share Posted October 31, 2023 5 minutes ago, (PSN)Madurai-Prime said: And I got called negative for telling people about the monkeys paw of reworks. Told ya. Shoulda left well enough alone. This is the type of rework that despite our complaints will be swept under the carpet and never be touched again. Same with Ember and Wukong. The say they don't make large reworks anymore because people don't tocuh the frame anyway, but have they ever wondered if their rework ideas are actually terrible? This is decade of Hydroid feedback threads completely wasted. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)zThulsaDoomz Posted October 31, 2023 Share Posted October 31, 2023 36 minutes ago, (PSN)Hopper_Orouk said: Why rework tentacle swarm? Why fix things that wasn't broken? All you had to do is change it's damage type and call it a day, maybe even divide the tentacles to having 10 pick up enemies and 10 slap them...it just shows the lack of creativity and patience. You can't possibly ignore stuff like this. One of the biggest issues with TS was the flailing of enemies in random directions, and you want to bring it back for....? Another thing you bring up, simply changing the damage type. So...flailing enemies with a few corrosive stacks that can't be easily targeted? What's the point of removing armor from a target that can't be hit? Having memes for the sake of memes is a terrible idea. Seems to me that you're the one ignoring issues. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)robotwars7 Posted October 31, 2023 Share Posted October 31, 2023 it's a simple case of give and take, and no way are you getting a loot frame that also has that level of DPS/debuffing.; people wanted Hydroid to be viable for MORE than just being a loot farmer: now he can actually kick a$$, and another group appear saying "but muh farming frame!".. this is why we don't get nice things like reworks.. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Hopper_Orouk Posted October 31, 2023 Author Share Posted October 31, 2023 8 minutes ago, (PSN)robotwars7 said: it's a simple case of give and take, and no way are you getting a loot frame that also has that level of DPS/debuffing.; people wanted Hydroid to be viable for MORE than just being a loot farmer: now he can actually kick a$$, and another group appear saying "but muh farming frame!".. this is why we don't get nice things like reworks.. wait are you saying it's intentional? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)robotwars7 Posted October 31, 2023 Share Posted October 31, 2023 3 minutes ago, (PSN)Hopper_Orouk said: wait are you saying it's intentional? I'm saying you can't expect to have your cake and eat it, and if the trade was intended to be "Hydroid will now be very strong, but his looting ability won't be quite as good", I can guarantee you a lot of people, myself included, would respond with "that's absolutely fine by me, where do I sign?". only a very small handful of people care that much about farming abilities to discredit an entire rework over one thign that's now missing. I'm sure DE had no intention of irking you personally, or anyone who enjoys loot frames, so why take it personally? life's too short. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turritopsis_Dohrnii Posted October 31, 2023 Share Posted October 31, 2023 8 minutes ago, (PSN)Hopper_Orouk said: wait are you saying it's intentional? It seems that everyone is curving the topic. They think you want the Tentacle Swarm to perform 100% like it was like before in exchange for their rework and are misunderstanding I believe. I think you just want the Tentacle Swarm looting aspect to be back the way it was, no? 1 minute ago, (PSN)robotwars7 said: I'm saying you can't expect to have your cake and eat it, and if the trade was intended to be "Hydroid will now be very strong, but his looting ability won't be quite as good", I can guarantee you a lot of people, myself included, would respond with "that's absolutely fine by me, where do I sign?". only a very small handful of people care that much about farming abilities to discredit an entire rework over one thign that's now missing. I'm sure DE had no intention of irking you personally, or anyone who enjoys loot frames, so why take it personally? life's too short. If that's the case they should have made it clear when they revealed the rework then. Otherwise, it's hard to say if it's intentional or not. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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