Prime Time #126: Vandal Reaction Poll

[NightmareT12]

1 hour ago, Yaerion said:

*talks as a random member of this community, and founder*

Please stop with the "Founder was promised to stay exclusive" "DE is bound by contract/law" argument. We were also said that the access to the Design Council was exclusive (and in fact to me that IS/was the most valuable part of the Founder Pack, that's why I bought it in the first place), and we lost that. 

All accessories for Prime Accesses were called "Exclusive", and now they aren't anymore.

And there wasn't a revolution because these exclusivities were ended. Because... this is fine.

I don't see why the Founder pack or Vandal exclusive or any exclusive is a "forever no" for DE (the FAQ says "No active plan", not "Never. Ever. Again. Whatever. Happens. Until. The. End. Of. Times."). The word "exclusivity" (meaning "forever exclusive") has already been broken -multiple times- for Warframe, and since a long time. And I'm fine with it. Most of the Community is fine with it. I think it's positive for the Community to move forward and let go the unnecessary avarice.

 

The only thing "problematic" that DE has to face, is the MEANING of exclusive content. The players who got those items firsthand should have a way to display this "meaning" as fashion. Fashion causes no gap in the Codex, Mastery, gameplay, game as a whole, but is ideal to display messages. Like "Yeah, I'm a CBT".

And those players with formerly "exclusive" content do not even have to be salty about it: they would gain during the process: cosmetic accessories/features, usable on the whole family of the same item, the liberty to display proudly their feat on other weapons than the exclusive one that they barely use, and the satisfaction to make other people happy and to make the game complete again, finally.

 

I also think that the poll is useless, since the result is obvious, but Rebecca was clear about their intention here: discuss. The poll results won't mean that DE will obey to the majority on that matter. They just give us the opportunity to discuss the nub of matter, consequences, possibilities, feelings, etc. And that's what we're doing. So, please don't feel threatened by what is said on this thread (or my replies). None here wants the CBT to be thrown away in complete disrespect (or any other "exclusive content owner" group). :)

 

From the Void, with love.

Yes and no.

Prime Accessories were from the very start stated to be exclusive to the Prime Access program. Accessories are exclusive, because it means you have to pay a number in real money to obtain it that's never really inferior to what it was originally. At least there's never been the case yet.

Prime Founder stuff: I'm a Founder and I'll never stop saying it: I want those to be available again. Keep same prices (well, maybe Grandmaster tier pack would need to be reduced since no more DC access there), keep it always in, and finally solve the goddamn Excalibur Prime big issues that have been in this game for 3 years already: Codex entries missing because people can't stand not having the item (I want to see how Ash Prime looks with a Skana Prime. Why the heck can't I? XD), Founder stuff not being transferred to console, some even tried to get Mod cards portraits changed because Excalibur Prime was there.

We'd be able to finally ask for redesigns for Excalibur Prime and Frost Prime, we'd be able to finally touch on this subject dev-wise and not have that "we're afraid to go there because of the community uproar" reaction that sometimes I feel we get.

Closed Beta, Open Beta... They're all items. Items are easy to get over with. To put an example, as a Founder, I'll keep my sigils and icons and no one will ever take away those from me. And that's the digital swag, because DE did send us shirts and headbands and all that cool stuff no one will ever have again. Should those users be compensated somehow? Yes of course, there must be some detail that's only for them and them alone, to thank them for the job done testing this and put faith in the game.

Design Council? I have to say that was a bad decision from the start. I'm so happy DC is an open chance for the community right now. And I'm not saying this because I was given the chance myself (I'm a DC member now), but because there's really, REALLY creative people out here that may not have had the chance to leave their very well deserved grain of sand in Warframe.

This thread can be the real catalyst for a giant step for Warframe game-wise and community-wise, because if the community can keep this civil, we might get something out of this.

Excalibur Prime? Braton Vandal? Primed Chamber? Put it all back again here. What can't be earned in game under the same conditions (as much as possible), what can be earned in game can allow us to rework the endless missions reward pools and system, as well as End of Mission rewards for a number of things that right now feel stale once you get what you want.

So thanks to the DE team for asking this question, because it's a gilded opportunity for every single member of the community. Far more than what anyone here might think.

[Deshiel]

22 minutes ago, Prinny13 said:

Or CBT doods get exclusive badge, Syandana, Emblem, Landing Craft skin, Frame skins and attachment to weapons / frames and in return release the Vandal stuff to everyone and not make anything exclusive unless the doods done something most of us won't like what Founders did when they took the gamble on a game that they didn't know whither the game will survive or not.

Prisma / Vandal/ Wraith, everyone should get a go at them, IMHO.   

That's only delaying the problem. Eventualy others will want those extra gifts too.

[Sziklamester]

Just now, SilentCircle said:

Well, this thread is about 2 weapons and not "everything". What I'm arguing for is that progression (read: mastery) shouldn't depend on your signup date or how much (or when) you've put money into the game. I couldn't care less about a Cyan Braton, but I do care about equal game progression for everyone.

+1

 

"out of my upvotes"

[LogaMC1995]

19 minutes ago, -----LegioN----- said:

Given that some players want the choices, other the looks, and others just the mastery, adding a 5^th braton and a 4^th lato as placeholders sounds totally legit and won't make everything end in the same current situation.

I'd say give them some badges, like the one obtained in every event with a weapon that has came back before and maybe a profile badge too. Sigils, skins and syandanas might only give reasons to keep complaining about wanting "their" stuff.

I believe cosmetic replacement will also bring the issue. Remember that some people complained about Tennocon exclusive cosmetics and sigil only given to those attended the event. The same could repeat here.

[Teshin_Dax]

1 minute ago, Sziklamester said:

Yep but it is not a thing for burn a whole country. The ideal option is still what I wrote pages ago about this.

Yep .. if founder would get something other exclusive.. a big founder deal.. then there would be no border to sell These Founder items for Money again..
Original Founder´s get their rewards and disciples/hunters/masters are able to upgrade with money

[Deshiel]

2 minutes ago, SilentCircle said:

Well, this thread is about 2 weapons and not "everything". What I'm arguing for is that progression (read: mastery) shouldn't depend on your signup date or how much (or when) you've put money into the game. I couldn't care less about a Cyan Braton, but I do care about equal game progression for everyone.

You must realy hate those +5% mastery progress points missing in your mastery bar right now

Edited July 15, 2016 by Deshiel

[NPC]

3 hours ago, Symm3trIx said:

There were 2 ways to play the game then:

1: founders pack

2: Get an e-mail with CBT key.

You had to have these 2 in order to play the game to buy the braton vandal for 1 credit. 

So either way, I think braton vandal were for the devs to show their appreciation to players who CBT test their game. 

Lato vandal on the other hand was for OBT release which I think could be an anniversary thing if they wanted to bring it back.

I get ur point but my opinion is just that Founder's gear should be the only exclusive thing in Warframe. 

IMO the Vandal variants of the Braton and Lato shouldn't be as easily accessible as they were, but they shouldn't be straight up unobtainable. 

I may sound selfish but in my mind only Founder's are entitled to exclusivity. 

[_Rue_]

Please make the next poll about the primed chamber. Thanks!

[LogaMC1995]

2 minutes ago, Deshiel said:

That's only delaying the problem. Eventualy others will want those extra gifts too.

^This. 

 

I believe we can ''solve'' this issue with powercreep. Better variant of Braton and Lato will outshine Vandal variant. So players will care less about it.

[marelooke]

I don't feel like this poll should be open to just everyone. I feel that only the people who actually have these items should have a say in this.

For the record: I have neither of these weapons.

[Andrew016]

Yes, BUT make a different default skin for it so those who got it in closed beta have something "unique" from those who will eventually get it now.

[Stormdragon]

2 minutes ago, LogaMC1995 said:

I believe cosmetic replacement will also bring the issue. Remember that some people complained about Tennocon exclusive cosmetics and sigil only given to those attended the event. The same could repeat here.

That's exactly what I said, and why I said badges and maybe a profile badge like the founders' one.

1 minute ago, LogaMC1995 said:

^This. 

 

I believe we can ''solve'' this issue with powercreep. Better variant of Braton and Lato will outshine Vandal variant. So players will care less about it.

Isn't DE trying to get rid of powercreep? If they actually do it, complaints will come back anyways.

[Teshin_Dax]

7 minutes ago, NightmareT12 said:

Yes and no.

Prime Accessories were from the very start stated to be exclusive to the Prime Access program. Accessories are exclusive, because it means you have to pay a number in real money to obtain it that's never really inferior to what it was originally. At least there's never been the case yet.

Prime Founder stuff: I'm a Founder and I'll never stop saying it: I want those to be available again. Keep same prices (well, maybe Grandmaster tier pack would need to be reduced since no more DC access there), keep it always in, and finally solve the goddamn Excalibur Prime big issues that have been in this game for 3 years already: Codex entries missing because people can't stand not having the item (I want to see how Ash Prime looks with a Skana Prime. Why the heck can't I? XD), Founder stuff not being transferred to console, some even tried to get Mod cards portraits changed because Excalibur Prime was there.

We'd be able to finally ask for redesigns for Excalibur Prime and Frost Prime, we'd be able to finally touch on this subject dev-wise and not have that "we're afraid to go there because of the community uproar" reaction that sometimes I feel we get.

Closed Beta, Open Beta... They're all items. Items are easy to get over with. To put an example, as a Founder, I'll keep my sigils and icons and no one will ever take away those from me. And that's the digital swag, because DE did send us shirts and headbands and all that cool stuff no one will ever have again. Should those users be compensated somehow? Yes of course, there must be some detail that's only for them and them alone, to thank them for the job done testing this and put faith in the game.

Design Council? I have to say that was a bad decision from the start. I'm so happy DC is an open chance for the community right now. And I'm not saying this because I was given the chance myself (I'm a DC member now), but because there's really, REALLY creative people out here that may not have had the chance to leave their very well deserved grain of sand in Warframe.

This thread can be the real catalyst for a giant step for Warframe game-wise and community-wise, because if the community can keep this civil, we might get something out of this.

Excalibur Prime? Braton Vandal? Primed Chamber? Put it all back again here. What can't be earned in game under the same conditions (as much as possible), what can be earned in game can allow us to rework the endless missions reward pools and system, as well as End of Mission rewards for a number of things that right now feel stale once you get what you want.

So thanks to the DE team for asking this question, because it's a gilded opportunity for every single member of the community. Far more than what anyone here might think.

Yes and no ..

Items should be avaible again ..

Founder gear only for the same Money..

The real founders should get other exclusive swag as a reward.. each founder rank get´s more or less things ...starting from hunter to grandmaster

Edited July 15, 2016 by WaRsHooTer666

[NightmareT12]

2 minutes ago, WaRsHooTer666 said:

Yes and no ..

Items should be avaible again ..

Founder gear only for the same Money..

The real founders should get other exclusive swag as a reward.. each founder rank get´s more or less things ...starting from hunter to grandmaster

Exactly what I said, with the exception of the biggest tier pack because, well, lack of Design Council access (which I feel should not be gated at the money point again).

I'd like to know what grandmasters have to say about this though.

[BBOTAA]

4 minutes ago, LogaMC1995 said:

I made a separate thread because everyone repeating the same ''Yes release it again''. Also, so that this suggestion won't get burried under more ''Yes release it again''.

I didn't saw that repetition you saw.
Second your suggestion is one of the worst suggestions i saw on the topic already, simply because you should know the issue here its the mastery points those weapons give, and content blockage not allowing player to complete their collections, a thing your suggestion clearly don't solve.
Third can you now see why your suggestion should simply be burried under ''Yes release it again'' comments?

[Deshiel]

This is how I think that DE should proceed should they chose to enable CBT Vandals for the rest of the community.

First of all. These weapons shouldn't be mass produced and easily accesible to everyone. We should still honor and distinguish the CBT players.

This is how I believe that it should be done.

GIVE every eligible CBT player 5x Lato and Braton Vandal BLUEPRINTS, depending on which one they aquired, give both if they had both at some point (Player who was active during CBT and owned either Lato Vandal or Braton Vandal)

They can use these lato or braton blueprints to either sell them or give them to thier friends. CBT VANDALS should not be spread more beyond this point. This way CBT players will keep thier edge, they keep thier honor, thier achievement and they will recieve the respect they deserve because people will beg them for vandal blueprints.

People will be able to aquire the CBT Vandals from the CBT players themselves only! Thats what I call justice.

[marelooke]

Just now, LogaMC1995 said:

^This. 

 

I believe we can ''solve'' this issue with powercreep. Better variant of Braton and Lato will outshine Vandal variant. So players will care less about it.

I doubt it. Wonder how long after Excalibur Umbra release before people start going on about Prime again. It's just the idea that they can't have something that drives some people crazy.

Creating strictly superior variants of items would just be plain rude to the people that supported DE back then, creating something with the *same* stats, I could get behind that, so then those who were around get basically a unique skin to show off (though given how "popular" the Lato/Braton variants are I don't really see the point).

Though frankly, it's only mastery, as @LogaMC1995 said, at some point there will be enough gear for everyone to be able to be able to reach MR30, just people that supported DE earlier get there slightly faster...

[jinxeverything]

3 minutes ago, LogaMC1995 said:

I believe cosmetic replacement will also bring the issue. Remember that some people complained about Tennocon exclusive cosmetics and sigil only given to those attended the event. The same could repeat here.

Guess DE can't win no matter what.

What about making it a reward for a near impossible mission like the last alert of 299-900 alert? people who could complete that sort of the mission (legit, no power creep) or making it a skill based mission where we have to defeat enemies melee only will receive it as a reward?

We earn it rather than just hand it over to us?

Just now, LogaMC1995 said:

^This. 

 

I believe we can ''solve'' this issue with powercreep. Better variant of Braton and Lato will outshine Vandal variant. So players will care less about it.

These 2 guns are MR fodder at this point and will always is, giving us something else won't "erase" them :(

For example i still don't have Brakk, even if i get Prisma or Wraith i will still hunt it down, giving me better guns won't erase the older weaker types, we will always want to get our hands on as much MR fodder/ Affinity/ XP as we can to increase our MR. :(

[Sziklamester]

Founders should have been given statues, phones or tablets with wf logo, limited time, given some T-shirt or other valuable wears and npc's in game. 

I am still waiting for my Entropia founder statue reward.

[Teshin_Dax]

1 minute ago, NightmareT12 said:

Exactly what I said, with the exception of the biggest tier pack because, well, lack of Design Council access (which I feel should not be gated at the money point again).

I'd like to know what grandmasters have to say about this though.

We .. Masters.. had this Feature too .. we bought the design council access too .. Why should they reduce the Price? we paid for it and now it´s for free?
We did not receive other swag instead of the Design Council Access that is now open to everyone

[Deshiel]

I don't want Excal Prime back. He looks like somebody wired him to golden hourglass.

[Sziklamester]

1 minute ago, Deshiel said:

I don't want Excal Prime back. He looks like somebody wired him to golden hourglass.

I would like to play instead as Stalker. He looks more cool than EP.

Edited July 15, 2016 by Sziklamester

[cghawk]

32 minutes ago, cob_metallica said:

There is still a mastery issue without these braton vandal and lato vandal, so sorry but everybody should get them

there is no mastery ''issue'' you need mastery rank 12 to access everything in the game, that is very easily obtainable without exclusives, anything beyond mastery rank 12 is a bonus not a must.

[Morty2989]

At the end of the day it's a Lato and a Braton, we can stop lording it over people and just give them out again. 

I stupidly sold both of mine after the closed beta reset and had support refuse to refund them, (that's fine, my goof), and ended up buying the Stalker bundle just to get a Hate, (three years almost to the date and it never dropped), just to get the 300 affinity for MR22. The whole thing is kind of ludicrous. 

Anyway, tangent aside I would appreciate them being offered again, it's been years now, people have enough stuff to feel like a snowflake with.

[Teshin_Dax]

1 minute ago, Sziklamester said:

I would like to play instead as Stalker. He looks more cool than EP.

Everyone want´s to play as the Stalker .. for ages mate ...for ages :/

Edited July 15, 2016 by WaRsHooTer666