Do people believe Universal Vacuum will encourage players to use pets?

[Endorphinz]

Companions need a lot of reworking, that's for sure. I also think there should be options for players that DO NOT want to take companions along in a mission.

[Hypernaut1]

5 minutes ago, Endorphinz said:

Companions need a lot of reworking, that's for sure. I also think there should be options for players that DO NOT want to take companions along in a mission.

I think you can unequip companions

[AuroraSonicBoom]

It doesn't matter. If Zephyr had Sonar, would that encourage more people to play her? Yeah, but it would make the game overall worse.

Pets already have for the most part already powerful niches cut out for them, and those that underperform in their respective roles can definitely be worked on, but not by giving them a convenience mechanic that should honestly never have left the Sentinel it was introduced with. There was talk about giving players more control over pets with commands and team tactics, and I think if DE worked a bit on the AI, which is easily the largest unfair drawback, I think they'll be just fine where they are.

Vacuum might be a nice perk to have when equipped but is unnecessary for general gameplay and while it has have some combat related perks(faster energy/oxygen pickup) it's nowhere near essential for anyone to progress through the game at a reasonable pace.

The biggest reason why I usually only use one pet is because switching is very inconvenient, leading me to rather not defrost my Huras for one mission, keep Shade equipped and adapt my playstyle a little. I'd definitely use more of my Kubrows and other Kavat if more of them could be active at once, but I don't mind too much that this is not the case.

[Vesiga]

I'd use my infested pet a lot more if universal was a thing, it's a pretty useful pet. I've had that thing ripline so many heavy gunners, bombards, and wardens that were about to activate the rescue targets deaths.

[Jobistober]

Vacuum is a bandaid.

The loot system in general needs a rework and DE needs to really rethink how loot is dropped/rewarded. IMO, all loot should be automatically awarded to your account save for some special drops like reactant, ayatan stars, etc. All the running around for loot and subsequent debate about vacuum is tiresome.

[Wiz3rd]

I absolutely hate it when someone brings up the point of vacuum not being necessary.
It is absolutely not necessary, true.
BUT
It makes the game so much more enjoyable to me.
If someone likes playing the game then they are more likely to spend their money on it.
Everybody wins.
What could go wrong with a passive vacuum anyway?

[Tsunero]

NOTHING will make me switch from Sentinels. Other pets are just a gimmick requiring too much work and investment.

[Zeclem]

3 hours ago, Arkvold said:

You say that now, but wait until you miss something like a Vengeful Revenant or a Hate blueprint or some other stupid-ungodly-rare item because it got stuck in a wall or adhered to the side of a pit that you can't drop down without getting teleported.

Fact is, Vacuum helps avoid these unfortunate situations, and collects resources for you over a wide area safely.  Things you might have to pass over because it's too dangerous to go out and get them, can be collected with vacuum without having to worry about a companion running out and getting shot, or drawing fire to your location.

Sentinels already have a ton of advantages over mobile companions.  They're durable w/o relying on your Warframe's own stats (My Carrier's going to be just as tough as always, no matter if I'm running it with Nova or I'm running it with Inaros), they're never attacked directly (only AoEs and auras will ever hurt your sentinel unless it physically occupies the path of an enemy's shot when it's aiming for you), they have outstanding mods that help both your survivability and quality-of-life and theirs (Medi-Ray, Shield Charger, Primed Regen, Sacrifice, Ammo Case, and of course Vacuum), they utilize ranged attacks with weapons that can be individually modded, they don't require maintenance, and since they follow your position religiously, they will never get stuck or caught on terrain, or have their AI derp out and become nonfunctional like other companions can.

There's a huge gap between Sentinels and virtually any other companion type, for a number of reasons.  Making full-strength Vacuum inherent to your Warframe will just be removing one of the oldest and most onerous inequalities.  It's not going to be the only change necessary to bring other companions in line with Sentinel performance, but it's one of the biggest, and IMO most important steps, and should be one of the first taken.

Once that's done, Sentinels and Companions can finally be reevaluated without this Sword of Damocles hanging over the discussion.

I've said it before and I'll say it again - full-strength universal warframe vacuum is nothing but a good decision for DE to make.  If it convinces even one person to buy cosmetics from the Market for a companion that they wouldn't otherwise use, they've made money off it.  They're not making any money off the Vacuum mod.

this entire reply is flat out stupid.

1-you can still gather those resources. in a game thats based on mobility, you already would walk over a vast majority of loots you'd gather anyway. and quite a good amount of ppl in this game already stopped needing a very good part of the resources in the game.

2-im sorry but what? even with the lowest hp frame kavats will be tankier than sentinels. thats not an "advantage" for a sentinel. its the opposite. and being able to revive them is a MASSIVE durability boost so stop making stuff up.

3-aoes are everywhere in game. also, kavats dont draw that much fire if their owner is alive. 

4-medi-ray is useless with how slow it heals. shield charger is useless cus shields are useless. primed regen? yeah kavats dont need to waste a mod slot, endo and forma on being reviveable and they can do it infinitely. sacrifice is useless cus your sentinel WILL die before it resses you. ammo case is a niche mod, not every weapon has a crap ammo economy. and ammo pads exist. having seperate weapons isnt exactly useful since it will cost you even more resources of forma and more mods and more endo to lvl those mods. and most of those weapons are useless so dont pretend it gives customization.

>talks about maintenance

>shows seperate guns that need seperate modding as an advantage.

lol. kavats "maintenance" is nothing more than a 25k credits every week. thats absolutely nothing.

5-my adarza only gets stuck between waves. when there are things to kill around, shes almost never stuck. and between waves its still pretty rare. idk why forums are always claiming it like kavats spend %85 of the mission stuck in terrain and the rest staring at a wall. it just doesnt happen to me or anybody i know.

you listed all the "perks" of sentinels. lemme list adarza kavats.

1-aoe armor shred that procs fairly often.

2-actual durability.

3-aoe attacks that do massive dmg(every attack of a kavat is an aoe with the mod)

4-can be revived

5-an aoe stun that isnt exactly common but opens enemies to finishers

6-%60 flat crit chance to your entire squad and their pets.

entirety of sentinels benefits cant even compare to the last one if youre playing for longer than a month. vacuum is good, but its severely overrated cus playerbase is just lazy and wants every piece of loot that they know they wont make any use of. and since vastly huge percent of the people doesnt bother doing stuff that are above lvl 40, they dont see the value that crit chance brings and just go with vacuum. i can understand that, but what i wont understand is making claims such as these in the reply ive quoted.

[Music4Therapy]

1 hour ago, Hypernaut1 said:

Pet temperament is a wonderful idea

In my OP I offer that suggestion in the form of aura mods for pets. Last paragraph I believe.

[Vox_Preliator]

I find myself agreeing.  Kubrows and Kavats don't offer me enough to swap away from Carrier or Helios, even were Vacuum not a factor.

Either effectively infinite ammo or automatic scanning, coupled with constant free Cold procs from Atrax pretty much have me covered.  I deal far more than enough damage, to the point that a companion trying to help can be actively detrimental.  Add in that Companions require any upkeep at all and I don't see myself seriously using one over a Sentinel any time soon.

As for the Sentinel dying, if mine dies then either I'm doing something wrong, or I don't care about it anyway and move on without it.

[Kronxito]

I only use vacuum to collect energy or ammo.

[Sador1978]

So let me tell you a story.

I've run Oberon-only since the rework, like to the point of forgetting the finer points of Nova or some of the other frames I have.  A few days ago, I cloned my first Sahasa kubrow.  You know, the one that digs up supplies?  I fitted him with all the mods from my other pets and then maxed out his Dig mod.  Prior to this I would have to cycle Rejuve off every few minutes to refill my energy reserves.  Since I started running around with Murph, I'm tripping over the little blue balls of goodness and I can do longer survival runs without having to power down to reload.  Never mind this giant hellpuppy will grapple the larger baddies so I can torch them easier, assuming he doesn't kill them first.  So if you added a universal vacuum to that, it would be broken.  But I'd get lazy too.

Just my two cents.

[Music4Therapy]

Just now, Sador1978 said:

So let me tell you a story.

I've run Oberon-only since the rework, like to the point of forgetting the finer points of Nova or some of the other frames I have.  A few days ago, I cloned my first Sahasa kubrow.  You know, the one that digs up supplies?  I fitted him with all the mods from my other pets and then maxed out his Dig mod.  Prior to this I would have to cycle Rejuve off every few minutes to refill my energy reserves.  Since I started running around with Murph, I'm tripping over the little blue balls of goodness and I can do longer survival runs without having to power down to reload.  Never mind this giant hellpuppy will grapple the larger baddies so I can torch them easier, assuming he doesn't kill them first.  So if you added a universal vacuum to that, it would be broken.  But I'd get lazy too.

Just my two cents.

Literally in the same boat, Oberon + Sahasa has been my combo since the rework.

[Sador1978]

It's amazing, if there's down time at any point during a mission, *POOF!* there's 75 energy for you.  Hell, I've seen him do it combat, I'll be healing someone and my energy will be going UP!

[Endorphinz]

3 hours ago, Hypernaut1 said:

I think you can unequip companions

Well no duh. But by not bringing a companion, you are handicapping yourself of useful buffs and utilities. Maybe there could be some bonuses for players who elect not to equip a companion for missions.

[(PSN)Oreic-Reynier]

I use my Adarza religiously, cuz red crits for dayz. 

[Midrib]

Definitely, I would even use the attention whoring kubrows & the Ebola doge more if they had vacuum, In most cases i actually prefer dogs abilities more than sentinels, but I just end up running with Taxon or Diriga

[Hypernaut1]

13 minutes ago, Music4Therapy said:

Literally in the same boat, Oberon + Sahasa has been my combo since the rework.

17 minutes ago, Sador1978 said:

 

So let me tell you a story.

I've run Oberon-only since the rework, like to the point of forgetting the finer points of Nova or some of the other frames I have.  A few days ago, I cloned my first Sahasa kubrow.  You know, the one that digs up supplies?  I fitted him with all the mods from my other pets and then maxed out his Dig mod.  Prior to this I would have to cycle Rejuve off every few minutes to refill my energy reserves.  Since I started running around with Murph, I'm tripping over the little blue balls of goodness and I can do longer survival runs without having to power down to reload.  Never mind this giant hellpuppy will grapple the larger baddies so I can torch them easier, assuming he doesn't kill them first.  So if you added a universal vacuum to that, it would be broken.  But I'd get lazy too.

Just my two cents.

i need thaw out my Sahasa to try this combo.

I found that Kubrow very useful and reliable when i did use it. I dont see why a Kubrow that actually CREATES its own drops is seen as a huge disadvantage to one that merely vacuums in random drops. Sure, i see the advantages to vacuum with some builds, but this ideas that vacuum alone outclasses everything else is ridiculous.

it only irks me because as a new player, the forums made me afraid of Kubrows- only to find out later on that Kubrows are actually very helpful.

[Tesseract7777]

Universal Vacuum is one of those completely unnecessary things that a bunch of people somehow think is absolutely needed for the game, and they are so intense about it. 

These same people tend to want to have their cake and eat it too. They want to have vacuum on their warframe, or on pets, etc, without using any mods. They want the utility of vacuum without having to mod for it at all, or without having to make a choice, like using a weaker and less survivable sentinel over a doge or a kitty. It comes down to people wanting to have everything at once. 

I am tired of this whole thing. Vacuum should be removed completely from the game IMO, it just promotes laziness. 

[(XBOX)YoungGunn82]

Scrub vacuum for companions all together. Make vacuum innate on Warframes ( Example: bullet jumping to suck loot/gather loot) give mag a fresh passive. Done. 

Easy fix to a stupid problem that should have never been a problem. 

Kubrows are rather stupid, not useless. They need s massive AI buff/rework. 

With that said. To OPs topic, Yes I believe it will.

Edited May 24, 2017 by (XB1)FCastle74

[Music4Therapy]

Lets make sure we all stay on topic. The question posed was:

"Do people believe Universal Vacuum will encourage players to use pets?"

Not about the usefulness of Vacuum, but rather a direct comparison of Kubrows/Kavats and Sentinels assuming both had Vacuum. It is my opinion that Kubrows/Kavats are held back by inconsistency and AI and an update to that would go a long ways.

[Pavelord]

23 minutes ago, Hypernaut1 said:

i need thaw out my Sahasa to try this combo.

I found that Kubrow very useful and reliable when i did use it. I dont see why a Kubrow that actually CREATES its own drops is seen as a huge disadvantage to one that merely vacuums in random drops. Sure, i see the advantages to vacuum with some builds, but this ideas that vacuum alone outclasses everything else is ridiculous.

it only irks me because as a new player, the forums made me afraid of Kubrows- only to find out later on that Kubrows are actually very helpful.

Another good one to try if you are doing infested missions, is the chesa, with its neutralize abilty, it disarms infested moas, that means much less poison clouds, corrosive goo on the floor and infested spores. And very rarely have I ever found a companion stuck on looking at the wall.

As for the OP, I don´t think all players would trade their formaed sentinel weapons for companions attacks.

[Music4Therapy]

Just now, Pavelord said:

Another good one to try if you are doing infested missions, is the chesa, with its neutralize abilty, it disarms infested moas, that means much less poison clouds, corrosive goo on the floor and infested spores. And very rarely have I ever found a companion stuck on looking at the wall.

As for the OP, I don´t think all players would trade their formaed sentinel weapons for companions attacks.

Agreed, what I'm trying to get at in the thread is that Universal Vacuum will change very little about actual gameplay. It won't be so bad when the sentinel dies is all.

Kubrows and Kavats both have great *POTENTIAL*, but fall short due to issues with AI and not enough benefit to warrant the maintenance/forma required.

[Tyrian3k]

48 minutes ago, Sador1978 said:

So let me tell you a story.

I've run Oberon-only since the rework, like to the point of forgetting the finer points of Nova or some of the other frames I have.  A few days ago, I cloned my first Sahasa kubrow.  You know, the one that digs up supplies?  I fitted him with all the mods from my other pets and then maxed out his Dig mod.  Prior to this I would have to cycle Rejuve off every few minutes to refill my energy reserves.  Since I started running around with Murph, I'm tripping over the little blue balls of goodness and I can do longer survival runs without having to power down to reload.  Never mind this giant hellpuppy will grapple the larger baddies so I can torch them easier, assuming he doesn't kill them first.  So if you added a universal vacuum to that, it would be broken.  But I'd get lazy too.

Just my two cents.

How would it be broken? You say you have no trouble keeping yourself up, so how would vacuum change anything to make it more powerful?

 

16 minutes ago, Music4Therapy said:

"Do people believe Universal Vacuum will encourage players to use pets?"

The answer is yes. If vacuum wasn't a factor, I would run around with my kitty all day.

 

29 minutes ago, Tesseract7777 said:

Universal Vacuum is one of those completely unnecessary things that a bunch of people somehow think is absolutely needed for the game, and they are so intense about it. 

These same people tend to want to have their cake and eat it too. They want to have vacuum on their warframe, or on pets, etc, without using any mods. They want the utility of vacuum without having to mod for it at all, or without having to make a choice, like using a weaker and less survivable sentinel over a doge or a kitty. It comes down to people wanting to have everything at once. 

I am tired of this whole thing. Vacuum should be removed completely from the game IMO, it just promotes laziness. 

Yes, just like bullet jumps are also just something unnecessary that some people think are absolutely needed, so let's remove our "universal bulletjumps" and force players to equip those handy bullet jump mods to be allowed to perform them.

But hey, wanting to have bullet jumps without mods is just wanting to have your cake and eat it too.

If you want to remove it entirely, the amount of drops needs to change drastically. I'm not spending 90% of the mission just to try and feed my weapon with ammo.

[Teljaxx]

I think universal vaccuum would be nice (though with less range would be best, I think), but even without the vaccuum advantage, I would still use my sentinels more than my other pets.

Give me a kubrow or Kavat with something comparable to the Guardian+Shield Charger+Medi-Ray+Molecular Conversion combo and I might switch. Currently, the closest thing Kubros get is the Raksa's Protect ability. Though, if you are lucky, and your Kubrow actually uses it when you need it, it only replenishes a maximum of 300 shields. And most of the time they use it the instant you lose even a single point of shields and wastes it. At least with Molecular Conversion, even if your Sentinel uses it when you don't need shields, it still does damage.

For me to use Kubrows and Kavats more often, they would need to be able to use Guardian, Medi-Ray, and Shield Charger or get similar mods for themselves, among other improvements, like better AI, and at least some sort of basic commands like attack/defend/hold position.

So at least for me, universal vaccuum would not encourage me to use pets other than Sentinels.