Dev Workshop: Warframes Revisited

[Ailyene]

DE seems to overall feel this change makes Ember scale better from their response but as it was in the Devstream Ember couldn't last 5 minutes in Mot before dying, which was about mid-level sortie damage.  In my opinion as she is, she needs range and energy to use her other skills to survive in higher levels if that is what they are aiming on scaling her for.  (Not that many really use her for higher levels.)

While I am personally 'okay' overall with the upcoming changes; 1/2 radius is ~1/8th the volume which seems kind of harsh trade for the 2x damage that doesn't really push her WoF more than 10 levels past wherever we could currently use it, 2x energy drain on top discourages using her other skills to maintain WoF and is just kind of odd to nerf it twice.

I think if they gave WoF scaling damage mitigation on top of the planned changes and made Accelerant apply to elemental combos with Fire in it as well rather than base Fire element only, she would be in a good spot allowing players to use Flash Accelerant instead for scaling damage and WoF giving her some form of survival for higher levels.  This in my opinion does a better job of scaling her for high level stuff while still preventing her from contributing while afk.

[Archeyef]

I was kinda hoping for something for Trinity. Her kit's become rather dated. It'd be nice if she were more engaging to play.

[Nikitalebedin]

Another nerf is coming

But have you ever thought, that we just need some frames like Ember? When we come home late, when we are tired and just want to run through a couple low-lvl missions, when we have already spent 1000+ hours in this game and we just want to get something from alert, not having "fun" completing our million extermination. When I want to have fun, I can choose from 33 other frames and hundreds of missions, but why should I do that when I just want to complete an alert or when I don't have much time? Ember is perfect for “anything under level 30” and that makes her really useful. Hear me DE, don't kill Ember, "fun" can be different.

Цитата

World On Fire - 5 seconds after casting, a percentage will begin counting up on the ability icon. As this percentage scales from 0% to 100% over 10 seconds, the ability’s energy cost and damage dealt both grow to double, while the ability radius shrinks to half.

That could make an interesting augment for World On Fire, giving players more possible variants of Ember gameplay, instead of making the frame half-useless. If one frame is nerfed, everybody will use another frame for the same purposes, so nothing will change. 

[Shadedraxe]

I don’t know how to feel about ember’s change.  Doubling WoF isn’t much of a damage boost into late game. Even if enemies are affected by accelerant. It’s the WoF augment that made her a good cc in late Game. Why not increase its status chance too and buff heat procs in general. Both Toxic and slash DoTs stack on individual enemies, heat doesn’t and the cc it provides by making enemies flail is very minimal since they only effect one enemy when procced (radiation triggers surrounding enemies to target a radiated enemy, blast can knock over multiple enemies within its aoe, electricy chains across enemies). I’m not saying heat should gain stacks, but how about making it spread from enemy to enemy within a certain range up to a cap duration, like a slower but longer lasting electric proc chain? That way ember will spread fire procs to more than one enemy with each hit of WoF on individuals. And even while minimizing the range over time for the knockdown of the augment, the additional spread of the fire procs will still give some extra minor cc of flailing enemies outside of the reach of getting knocked down in WoF’s range. Also being able to spread fire procs in groups would make using WoF in shorter bursts with that energy increase still viable for some quick minor cc and decent damage along with accelerant.

[o.0-]

Awesome, I look forward to getting my hands on these changes!

And I have one request for Chroma, where Effigy and Spectral Scream trade places and gain any further changes from there. As the idea being that Spectral Scream could be considered as Exalted Blade, Hysteria or Razorwing, so acting as a fourth ability, that way Effigy could be comparable to other first abilities as well.

Next up for me, is seeing Vauban get some TLC (and some QoL on Nekros, but Nekros can certainly wait his turn!)

[ADDgamer45]

This is a pve grind game. op should only be used for sweeping the endgame. If you are op in the early game so what?

[(PSN)TertulSee]

1 hour ago, aligatorno said:

At the beginning, the damage and the range is at it is right now. After the 5 seconds it will shrink and it will start to increase in damage. 

 

World On Fire - 5 seconds after casting, a percentage will begin counting up on the ability icon. As this percentage scales from 0% to 100% over 10 seconds, the ability’s energy cost and damage dealt both grow to double, while the ability radius shrinks to half.

 

 

Well, 2 new negatives and 1 positive plus the fact that the rest of her kit is basically useless. It makes what does that make Ember? Useless. To be honest, the Range debuff is too much. How about if it gave more range to start with and when it shrinks, it will be it’s current size?

Edited February 3, 2018 by (PS4)godlysparta

[peterc3]

Perhaps you can explain this.

Impact potentially throwing enemies away is bad (let's just ignore people reacting to Sonicor). Pull and Ripline are too powerful and make people go way past your feet, so you have to chase them down.

Why would I ever use Push? How would Push be different from Sonic Boom?

[(PSN)Ozymandias-13-]

 Haha no. 

She needs to be reworked.  Don't throw around the word nerf as if it makes it any more valid a point. She is getting stronger with this rework, as any true fan of hers will appreciate. 

[PsiWarp]

A way to collect shards and utilize them (concentrate them) into Magnetize would definitely be welcomed. A lot of shards just go to waste because they're out of range of Magnetize or there are just too few on the ground for you to want to take advantage of them. Passive vacuum sucking up shards is a good one.

Considering that Mag has a magnetic personality (hehe), it would be interesting if she can store stacks of shards by having them orbit around her like Energy and Health Conversion, which then gets used when you cast Magnetize on a new target.

[(PSN)LoisGordils]

Dropped by to put the "Haha" reaction

 

Joking aside, WoF deserved that nerf and any good Ember player knows Accelerant (Flash Accelerant to be precise) is her star ability :p

[HarrodTasker]

I feel that Ember was not deserving of being included in the upcoming nerfs.  Sleep Equinox continues to be absolute broken amounts of focus but instead of addressing that at all they are nerfing every single Hydron or Bere aoe build.

The damage for world on fire is so low that multiplying it by 2 won't change anything.  So really this change simply doubles the cost and halves the area.  How does this help anyone at all?  Why is Ember even an issue?

[theMongoose]

I look forward to getting my Zephyr on! Can't wait.

Also have a suggestion for a future Atlas augment. An augment that turns your Rumblers into walking paralyzing totems. Essentially an aura version of ore gaze that starts at a certain range. Just another way to help accumulate those rubble stacks.

Edited February 2, 2018 by theMongoose

[Asbyn]

Sorry, but Atlas needs more than just "synergy"; at least, as written. This would be yet another Saryn rework: sure, Atlas would be a bit more "cool" to play as, which will increase his usability some, but he still won't actually be useful for anything significant or end-game related, making the changes all but superficial.

Even if you want to go the synergy route, I think you guys need to take it even further, maybe by giving Landslide synergy with Tectonics, to where if you hit one of his bulwarks with his punch, it turns them into an AoE or cone-shaped attack that deals the combined damage of his punch and a Tectonics boulder. Giving Petrify the ability to heal Tectonics' bulwarks, in addition to also buffing his Rumblers' armor and agro, would be a nice touch, as well.

 

[AlekVen]

1 час назад, Sajochi сказал:

They said on the workshop stream that she's getting a buff to her energy. One Primed Flow will have her at 700 for prime. I say prime because that's what was showcased. They also said they may change polarize aug since it is now redundant with the crush change. These details could have been put in the workshop. 

Redundant? So Crush will grant Overshields?

That's good news.

EDIT: Also makes you wonder why it's still called "Crush".

Edited February 2, 2018 by AlekVen

[mkoo33]

Just now, No_Quarter said:

cause if you place her on Sedna she would still be useless against anything over lvl 30 duh

Obviously you don't play Ember.
Having the enemy knocked off their feet and not being able to one shoot kill you, thanks to WoF + Augment. That is not something to  call "useless".

 As i said before, Ember is not a killing machine over lvl 30,  but a very nice CC frame.

[Testiculitis]

36 minutes ago, No_Quarter said:

use reading when you can, I said later on that if they keep the Chroma unintentionally overbuffed they have to buff others, and if they buff them they have to buff enemies which is stupid as you only end up working with huge numbers - goal is to have certain relations.

So in this case, buffing Eidolon would rip other warframes, and that woul dbe stupid, but your answer is to buff, sure, let's buff everything and what we get at the end?  2 hour duration abilities that do 98 zillions of damage and enemies with  with quadrillions of armor.... that is what you are suggesting as game would have to have same relations and things would only be done larger numbers that are beyond ability for most people to do quick math with them.

so nerfing Chroma to put him in line is the same as buffing everything else, in terms of gameplay it is perfectly the same as you would get same combat effectiveness, this way you are also having it described with readable numbers. Not many people know math, it's sad how loud are those people

Literally NOTHING in either of your posts is relevant at all. You're pulling points out of thin air, as if people are requesting the bad things that you're mention would be a good thing.

He didn't say anything about buffing the Teralyst.

He didn't say anything about buffing everything.

Neither of us suggested to buff anything that is already strong to even stronger levels as you're suggesting.

Edited February 2, 2018 by Synikal

[hodagacz]

I love playing Ember on Sorties, but if it wasn't for WoF with Firequake's CC abilities I would never get her close to one. I run Stretch and Streamline and Primed Continuity and Auger Message and Reach to keep WoF up as long as possible and as big a radius as possible to keep from being turned to a thick greasy paste as soon as the Big Boys show up.

[peterc3]

If you are just using her to clear low level trash... how will this change significantly alter this? Now I can only clear 3 rooms away instead of 6, oh the humanity. The energy cost was irrelevant and will continue to be irrelevant.

[Radagosh]

vor 3 Minuten schrieb (PS4)Riko_113:

 Haha no. 

She needs to be reworked.  Don't throw around the word nerf as if it makes it any more valid a point. She is getting stronger with this rework, as any true fan of hers will appreciate. 

to counteract her range nerf one has to use overextended, this in return lowers the buff of flash accelerant, I highly doubt this results in higher damage than before, but have to get my hands on it before I can say for sure.

Also, this is anything but a rework. It is just a blatant nerf to her 4 her useless abilities weren't touched whatsoever.

[ADDgamer45]

Just because your endgame happens to be a mastery farm spot that is under ember

Just now, mkoo33 said:

Obviously you don't play Ember.
Having the enemy knocked off their feet and not being able to one shoot kill you, thanks to WoF + Augment. That is not something to  call "useless".

 As i said before, Ember is not a killing machine over lvl 30,  but a very nice CC frame.

Not anymore if this goes through

[No_Quarter]

Just now, Synikal said:

Literally NOTHING in either of your posts is relevant at all. You're pulling points out of thin air as if people are requesting what you're saying would be a bad idea.

He didn't say anything about buffing the Teralyst.

He didn't say anything about buffing everything.

Neither of us suggested to buff anything that is already strong to even stronger levels as you're suggesting.

but you said that game should never nerf but only buff, I explained where that leads..... hard to remember what you are talking about when your only goal is to win argument, cheers

[LSG501]

3 minutes ago, (PS4)Riko_113 said:

 Haha no. 

She needs to be reworked.  Don't throw around the word nerf as if it makes it any more valid a point. She is getting stronger with this rework, as any true fan of hers will appreciate. 

the thing is this rework is a MASSIVE nerf for players who build ember around crowd control using firequake augment, big range and low power strength. 

While the rework will have very little impact on the star map, she'll still be a press 4 frame even with the rework, it really doesn't do much for high level content where she's used in a completely different way. 

[Kimimoto]

The only way Ember can reliably survive in 100+ content is by using Firequake with some decent range, this change nerfing her range over time will DESTROY her. You need to add survivability somewhere else or she will not be played in high level missions.

[Testiculitis]

1 minute ago, No_Quarter said:

but you said that game should never nerf but only buff, I explained where that leads..... hard to remember what you are talking about when your only goal is to win argument, cheers

Oh, really? Please show me where.