Voltage

I know what you're implying and I'm just not falling for it. OP is asking for a system that intentionally undermines existing, current, and future content progression. The message the other guy posted was asking for grind to be respected. There is value to that. Warframe's gameplay and core loop is about the journey. What brought me to quote you is to outline a massive issue here on the Forums with trying to unravel and discuss the respect behind farmed portions of the game. Warframe is a collective farm of achievement based gear acquisition. This is a corrosive approach, plain and simple. It's no different than the corrosive comments found within the Heirloom Collection megathread.

Holy man. I didn't expect to see Primed Reach in a Gotva Prime discussion. Equipment availability is of course important, and I did consider it. If you don't have Primed Mods or Galvanized Mods, you simply swap to non-Primed or equivalent mods. Do you mind sharing your build? Lots of context is missing here. General purpose builds for weapons in Warframe have become highly homogenized. What changes up the mods is when you decide "I want to mod this weapon for just Demolishers" or "I want to use this weapon while only using Chroma". In those cases, you of course shift your mindset to the optimization of one particular use case. For general usage, you're considering all factions and mission types, in which case Gotva Prime is just another hybrid rifle with a flavor passive. That's why my build looks endgame and unoptimized, because it's optimizing on homogenized performance in general content, not specializing in something specific. I'm just abusing Hunter Munitions with Primed faction damage.

You're choosing to read it that way. I can also claim he's saying: "If the game perpetually reduces the significance and time associated with progression, I rather play something else that better respects that". We're both just showing our bias in reading that. You're not automatically asking players to suffer because you wish for time investments to be honored to maintain the significance of completion associated to the specific grind.

Given you criticized an earlier comment for their choice of Rifle Aptitude, I assumed you were looking for optimized modding (in the context of general usage). In this case, just slot whatever you want and this thread is pretty much pointless.

This is how I have Gotva Prime modded. I often don't use Hammer Shot because of the opportunity cost of slots. If we had an Amalgam Hammer Shot with another bonus, or an "intermediate" version with 5 ranks and higher stats, I would just replace Vital Sense with it. Most of my weapons are modded for general usage. I'm not really an avid user of Gotva Prime.

The way to revitalize the relevancy of older "one-and-done" content is by adding incentives to farm there. An example of this (while simple) is Omega Isotopes/Cryptographic Alu or Helminth for vanilla Warframes. Giving wealthy players (which isn't really that much of a minority) the option to invalidate new content through previous content completely kills the progression of whatever new mode is added. What would be the point of DE making an intricate standing system like Necralisk if I could convert my 26,000 Medical Bonds instead? I totally understand the reason you're writing this post, but it would only further divide matchmaking as players who have wealthier inventories would almost entirely skip out unless the newest content was restricted from this system, in which case it would be pointless like taiiat mentioned.

While on paper this sounds positive, this would further destroy revisiting content. Warframe isn't a linear game, so even though things are so spread out, they're still all relevant in the grand scheme of gear and Mastery Rank. Such a system as this would also heavily reward old players to not farm new currencies added in new content and just convert their wealthy inventory over. That's the entire reason Warframe adds new currencies and resources every new update, it's to put older and newer players on the same foot and not invalidate the content on release.

That'd be cool. I don't know what the landing craft ability would be, but that concept would be awesome aesthetically.

I don't mind the numbers, but I think a system to change them or hide them (like the way you can toggle this view on newer Call of Duty titles) would be neat. I'd enjoy being Voltage#000 or #001.

The value of an achievement is the same as the Grand Master badge you wear. Especially in a game like Warframe, it's nice to have a trackable list of achievements that are up to date with the current state of the game. I'm not sure how achievements can be seen as pointless when the game has many systems that encourage this time of completionism (Mastery Rank, the Codex for enemies and mods, Fragments/Prex Cards/Somachords, etc.) It is a bit disappointing how out of date most of the achievements are.

"Not necessarily" sure, but DE already shows through their published drop chances that it's still dataminers forcing their hand on transparency every once in a while. DE hosting a wiki is mostly community work, but it being their platform means they are to a degree responsible.

Then the first party is then liable and responsible for the information and its accuracy. It makes sense why stuff like this is passed off.

There are quite a few missions more efficient solo (like Bounties). The comment you quoted does have merit. It's why we don't have any co-op Nightwave challenges or why "solo clans" are considered (even though by definition, that's not a real clan). Squads being more efficient is often more of a hypothetical based on the ideal scenario where players are as fast (or faster) as you. When Archon Spy or Disruption comes up, I end up doing a majority of the objectives and waiting at extraction first. That's just how it is. Warframe matchmaking is a blessing and a curse. On one hand, the fast pick up games are great. However, on the other hand, console spawns and a deceased clan/alliance system makes it really hard to create proper groups unless you're a player doing only new content (like me), or a player in a clan full of players at earlier stages in the game.

Between a season and an intermission, there was a period of no Nightwave whatsoever. The 24 days I mentioned was between Season 1 and Intermission 1. Nothing was active. They've done this every Nightwave transition by having an amount of time with no Nightwave at all, which is crushing towards a newer player who needs the valuable items offered or key progression items like Nitain Extract.

That's pretty fair. I can see how this is the average interpretation for most people. For me, I had the same reaction, but when there was absolutely no Nightwave for 3 weeks (24 days exactly) between Season 1 and Intermission 1, and then added an intermission at all before jumping into Season 2. That is where my "proof this was doomed" came from. You said this was unreasonable, but was it reasonable to give players who need Alert rewards 24 days of nothing? What about the fact that it took until 2023 just to see Efficient Beams return? Nightwave isn't absolutely better than Alerts, it's only partially. The negative feelings that a 2:43 AM Vauban Neuroptics Alert brought to a player are still present in Nightwave, which is a major failure. I've never believed Nightwave was "dead", but I knew it failed its core objective since that moment. I do enjoy Warframe quests/stories, but I don't rank that higher in importance than what the update does for the game systematically. It's absolutely clear that Nightwave's core criticisms and the stories they brought are separate discussions, but the resources and deliverance of that content is intertwined between the two. The reason I have an assertive distaste for battle passes (even with how tame Nightwave is) is how it tarnishes what the actual good bits are that it brings. A good comparison to this is Veilbreaker. Archon Hunts and Veilbreaker are nice story continuations from The New War, but that experience is degraded from the failings of the Archon Shard system and the structure of Kahl's Garrison. The same happened to Nightwave. Glassmaker gets the most flak for the failings within Nightwave itself, but those issues were present in The Emissary and Wolf of Saturn Six as well.

The storytelling is entirely separate from how Nightwave is going. No where am I asking for less or no episodic additions or even criticizing them at all. The only thing I ever disliked about the story content were the scheduled enemy spawns that could pump your rank way higher than someone else even if they did all the challenges (as I am someone who does all my challenges for maximum rank, in the off chance they add a cosmetic or way to represent Nightwave participation). I would very much appreciate new side stories that focused on characters that could definitely be fleshed out more (since DE is often adding new characters and hardly ever building off very old ones besides the select few "main story" characters). All my feedback in this thread is purely in regards to how it's going and the issues we've arrived at. If I wanted to go on a blind hatred spree, I would be bringing up the leaked "Act Boosters" that DE said essentially "oops, you weren't supposed to see that we actually considered monetizing Nightwave progress". I'm only criticizing the failed nature of intermissions and the structure of Nightwave never looking sustainable (which was hinted at [not proven yet] when we saw Intermission 1). What I am bringing up here and quoting comments on is that Nightwave is failing its objective, and this is completely unrelated to the nice stories they've added in their "real seasons". This system was originally meant to replace Alerts and Alert rewards, a system that was heavily punishing for someone looking for specific items. They moved to a very fair take on the battle pass system so many games have adopted (and this is still a very fair system given the leeway the player has in what challenges they choose to do). With that said, there are still glaring issues that aren't actually super hard to address, but it would mean restructuring Nightwave purely for the betterment of those engaging with it and not to squeeze engagement metrics or include any FOMO (like we see with some of these new Duviri challenges and the continuous addition of exclusive weapon augments). Nightwave has effectively become one in the same with Riven Mod Disposition towards how players are served "updates" to it. The core fundamentals of the system are completely fine, but there is an unnecessary amount of manual upkeep that is taking place which serves no good purpose to the alternative. What Nightwave should be is an automated vendor that a player earns a currency for by completing rotating challenges to buy rewards in a rotating fashion. That is as far as the time-gating should reach. Reward "refreshments" would occur on some kind of determined schedule to interest players to return and make sure there isn't years between item availability (just like Baro Ki'teer). While this automated system is running, DE has the chance (whenever they have the resources available) to release a story-told Nightwave Series that would have its own reward track (separate from the automated vendor system that replaces Alerts) and progressional scenes to further the story. Once the story is concluded, the story is visible through the "Tune In" page, and after a pre-determined amount of time (let's say 90 days to match a Prime Access), the themed rewards would be pushed into the rotating (and always available) vendor shop. There shouldn't be seasons, there shouldn't be ranks, players who show up later in Nightwave shouldn't feel rushed before it ends, and there shouldn't be Creds that have an infinite number of variations that all expire. I think you're misreading my concerns as somehow attached to disliking every part of Nightwave at the same time. My earlier comments merely eluded to the writing on the wall that this system was flawed from the start and learned none of the lessons of Sortie Seasons. There's a reason the infamous "Sortie Token System" Forums thread was being referenced from The Second Dream right up until The War Within. The base concerns and propositions were exactly what Nightwave should have offered, not partially implemented with a twist to include unnecessary FOMO and manual revision which makes the system feel like a drag and wasted potential more often than not. We're both on the same team here. Hopefully that clears it up. I didn't mean to come off as dismissive, argumentative, or disagreeing to your points, I only wanted to add the notion of the issues Nightwave has being present well before Glassmaker. Glassmaker received fair criticism at the time, but like most things in Warframe (honestly many other games too), many players only look at a current issue in isolation or on the surface. Glassmaker had some rough edges yes, but most of the criticism it received were core problems with Nightwave itself, not the substance of the Glassmaker season as a story addition.

It's not. We've been through 6, soon 7 intermissions with over half a dozen different FOMO currencies. A permanently rotating vendor shop where challenges just give Creds with no seasons, ranks, or downtime would be a massive improvement to what we have now and also gives DE the freedom to add new rewards whenever they have the chance. In the worst case scenario they could focus on other new content with no pressure to return to Nightwave, and it would just be what it originally was supposed to be: a better version of the Alerts system.

The FOMO trap is the function of seasonal currency and time-limited store options. We are finally getting some of these augments and cosmetics back, but it's still been years. The fact intermission 1 only lasted 3 weeks is completely irrelevant.

How is this unreasonable? The intermission between is the length of the season already running. If you need to force players to spend some FOMO currency to then wait for an intermission with little substance, to then wait for Season 2, you're already posting a red flag. Intermission 1 was not long or a huge deal, but it was definitely the writing on the wall.

I think the reality check and proof that this entire system was doomed was the first Intermission after the very first season.

@GinKenshin Welcome back :). It's nice to see familiar faces. On the topic of Helminth, it's like anything in Warframe. It unlocks immense power and new build opportunities, but you're by no means forced into using it. Unfortunately though, there are some abilities in there that are almost universally beneficial to swap for that one ability you wouldn't use much anyway. If you're avid on avoiding Helminth, I would look into the more recent Warframes added to the roster. DE has (for a couple years now) been making new Warframe kits jack-of-all-trades with armor strips, crits, and defensive abilities all in one package. In that regard, there's several options that don't require Helminth to be effective in that department (even if I personally feel that this trend is getting overused). Helminth for me was a fantastic way to get me (someone at the end of the road in content) to earn all the vanilla Warframes a second time. I would really love for DE to expand Helminth in a way where it eats weapons to unlock that weapon's skin/reload/model for that weapon family/class. The prospect of rewarding players with more customization for engaging in a pseudo-new-game+ farm is enjoyable to me (because I do still enjoy Warframe's core gameplay and gear collection aspect).

Archwing used to have a reason to play it, between missions to farm Arch-weapons and Elytron to The Jordas Verdict for Arcane Energize. DE decided to remove all that to fast-track players and remove the need to really engage with Archwing much. Railjack is cool and all, but if all that development was spent on Archwing, we could have just had a better Archwing instead of Railjack becoming just another Archwing, if that makes sense. It also doesn't help that DE added Necramechs, K-Drives and Kaithe as well. Variety in vehicles is cool and all, but none of them are really fleshed out. As much as I enjoy Archwing for what it is, I have the impression about many things in Warframe that the ship has since sailed for revisiting them. In a way Archwing feels the same to me as Riven Mods , Arbitrations or Sanctuary Onslaught. They're these very old systems that revisiting just doesn't have much prospect towards given how long they've been ignored. DE is too focused on whatever is new, and whatever a new player first encounters. Everything in between is a graveyard or a minefield, depending on your view of things (or both :D).

I feel you there. I'm a bit concerned that we are going to have some kind of content going forward where the advantage is very noticeable (like the upcoming Operation) or something. I doubt they will drop support for Nintendo Switch to be honest.

It wasn't glassmaker's fault, it was the entire illusion that they thought Nightwave wouldn't follow the same fate as Sorties. DE don't have the time or manpower for constantly upkeeping and maintaining old content. Nightwave should have always been automated from the get go and not even be seasonal. You should just get Creds for challenges and the shop rotates like any other automated vendor. Devoting resources to Nightwave is just wasted compared to the rest of the game that could use it.