Melee Changes: Phase 1

[AtoKitsune]

Is the Paracesis going to be replaced into two-handed nikana? As it has a scabbard that is currently unused and as a single-edged heavy-weapon would be perfect for such a moveset.

Also Blind Justice's animations for idle and standing are still broken, playing just the normal Nikana stance animations.

[Silescere]

I'd welcome if the game would fully recognise Garuda's Talons as a melee weapon. Since switching to them requires me to leave my melee slot open. Don't want anything else like additional slot or something unreasonable. It just was strange to notice that they aren't counted as such. For example in mastery tests.
It was pretty confusing being told, that I have no melee equipped, when said weapon is literally a part of my frame.

In addition, I mostly leave stance mods on swords and daggers unslotted, because they follow a fixed set of animations. And once one movement is started, I have to wait for it to finish. Sure, stances add capacity, but at the cost of me jumping, dashing and flailing about instead of slashing and changing directions in the blink of an eye.

[GrimAtrament]

On 2019-02-25 at 2:35 PM, RhythmScript said:

I’ll second this and add that the easiest, most natural approach is to give a lifting launch to the bullet jump. Void Dash already works in sort of this way, it just displaces enemies with physics while void dash doesn’t impart momentum by default. 

Bullet Jumps are already something we’re comfortable doing, they already have a ground hitbox (that isn’t all that useful), it’d be cool to have bullet jumping next to an enemy fling them into the air along with you, leaving them right next to you in air when you go to perform your air attacks.

Thirded this is a need.

[Eldnacpeek]

On 2019-02-22 at 1:00 PM, [DE]Rebecca said:

OPTIONS:
We are adding a toggle to preserve one aspect of the older melee system. You will be able to toggle an option, allowing you to continue melee attacks with the left mouse button once in melee mode.

 

Aye, thank you. This has been my main concern since the instant switch announcement was made. I am way more comfortable having all attacks (excluding abilities of course) on my mouse, and having to go back to my old keybind of melee on F would be too great a change, though I'd then just have to move around weapon swap and whatnot and have to get used to it.

Glad to know this was addressed right off the bat.

[Certainly-Syrix]

Why can't switching to secondaries be instantaneous as well, while we're at it?

[(PSN)Wildoutlaw7]

Sorry if answered before but my question is how does this apply to PS4 Controls?

[(XBOX)Natfrog123]

So great that we were told to ask questions here but as of now not a single reply? What's up with that?

[Hhd667]

On 2019-02-26 at 1:28 PM, Lorechill said:

Now the only thing we need after offset is implemented are "weave"/strong attacks in combos to compliment the system. Wait... strong attacks weren't even covered yet just normal combos and ground slams. I'm getting goosebumps on the possibilities. Not to mention "void trigger mode".

Like how (I vaguely remember) the Redeemer shoots mid combo if you hold the key? It would be a massive drag giving all weapons "extended" attacks for all moves though.

I'd love to have launches and dashes. Say, backwards+attack launches target upwards (holding makes you follow) and forward+attack is a gap closer (holding transitions into a combo).

On a more high-on-sugar train of thought, imagine the following - Dash towards target > almost full combo and uppercut > follow > combo midair > finishing combo > operator pops out from above the target > HEY KIDDO *void blasts target face first against the floor *

Hek, just make them QuadGrakatas and their stance Love is Clem

[CRAZY_PsYcho]

With melee 3.0....   can you make sword and shields more usefull.   Like using the shields while aiming with a pistol?   or a bonus armor or a shields thats regenerate....

[csaszar]

Dear DE!

You are planning building and implementing an arcade style "beat em up" melee in Warframe which is (or was) a horde shootet.

In a game where instead dps we use kps (kills per second) this will hurt badly. It will change so much more than melee.

Dont implement this as a nerf - currently it is - because you will loose so much then.

Please thread carefully.

[TL_Hail]

Slightly sad to see manual blocking go away. I'm one of those edgy 'melee mains', and I rely on blocking for some expanded mobility, like Block-gliding (aim gliding with melee. Good if you dont want the zoom in you get from aim-gliding with a gun.), and the ability to rapidly change the direction of my rolls (Blocking or aiming while rolling allows you to change the direction of your roll really easily.).

Personally, I REALLY like most of the changes, but I would rather be able to choose when to block.

 

Blood for the Blood god and all that.

[Restartmind111]

So melee changes coming with mainline next week?

No direct mention of them here https://imgur.com/lmEQsw9

 

[Soulden]

Would love to see what changes look like on Claw weapons.  My Ripkas are interested on some fun.

[LegendaryNeurotoxin]

Great stuff! @[DE]Rebecca There are two *CRITICAL* changes that are missing from Melee 3.0, still yet unconfirmed:

1) Camera Pitch must affect melee angle. Weapons like Twin Krokhur don't hit enemies below waist level very well, so when descending a ramp or staircase, it is easy to get stuck swinging over the heads of enemies. This should likewise apply when looking up, so nearby hovering enemies can be hit with combos rather than using a less-reliable jump attack. 

2) Allow disabling for Finishers as an Options Menu setting. When someone is playing a build designed around finishers, they make sense to use. When someone is playing a build designed around crashing through a pile of enemies and comboing through them, being forced into a finisher -even once- breaks the flow, breaks the combo, and exposes them to danger because nearby enemies will be trained on them after the finisher completes. Alternatively, a variation on a common melee mod that disables finishers would do the job, like Relentless Berserker that ramps a bit faster than standard Berserker (37.5% at max perhaps) but has the same max threshold for speed increase. 

I've mentioned these a few times, as they are the biggest issues with melee for me. If we got these instead of Melee 3.0, I'd still be way happier about the overall melee experience. Instant weapon draw is great, directed ground slams are great, all this other stuff is great.... but without being able to look down and smack ankle-biters, or being able to avoid interruption by finisher-vulnerable enemies, melee 3.0 is still ringing a bit hollow for me. 

[maddragonmaster]

1 hour ago, LegendaryNeurotoxin said:

Great stuff! @[DE]Rebecca There are two *CRITICAL* changes that are missing from Melee 3.0, still yet unconfirmed:

1) Camera Pitch must affect melee angle. Weapons like Twin Krokhur don't hit enemies below waist level very well, so when descending a ramp or staircase, it is easy to get stuck swinging over the heads of enemies. This should likewise apply when looking up, so nearby hovering enemies can be hit with combos rather than using a less-reliable jump attack. 

2) Allow disabling for Finishers as an Options Menu setting. When someone is playing a build designed around finishers, they make sense to use. When someone is playing a build designed around crashing through a pile of enemies and comboing through them, being forced into a finisher -even once- breaks the flow, breaks the combo, and exposes them to danger because nearby enemies will be trained on them after the finisher completes. Alternatively, a variation on a common melee mod that disables finishers would do the job, like Relentless Berserker that ramps a bit faster than standard Berserker (37.5% at max perhaps) but has the same max threshold for speed increase. 

I've mentioned these a few times, as they are the biggest issues with melee for me. If we got these instead of Melee 3.0, I'd still be way happier about the overall melee experience. Instant weapon draw is great, directed ground slams are great, all this other stuff is great.... but without being able to look down and smack ankle-biters, or being able to avoid interruption by finisher-vulnerable enemies, melee 3.0 is still ringing a bit hollow for me. 

that would be better solved if DE would make multi mob finishers when having more then 1 mob stunned and ready for finisher.

[LegendaryNeurotoxin]

3 hours ago, maddragonmaster said:

that would be better solved if DE would make multi mob finishers when having more then 1 mob stunned and ready for finisher.

I like the idea, but I still don't get anything from being slowed down and having control taken away temporarily. Between Berserker, Arcane Strike, and my rivened Twin Krohkur already one-shotting most of whatever they touch up to 80 or so (100+ once ramped up), I'm already a blender of doom, and the rate of killing stuff is often more limited by my getting to them rather than damage required to kill them. 

[maddragonmaster]

13 hours ago, LegendaryNeurotoxin said:

I like the idea, but I still don't get anything from being slowed down and having control taken away temporarily. Between Berserker, Arcane Strike, and my rivened Twin Krohkur already one-shotting most of whatever they touch up to 80 or so (100+ once ramped up), I'm already a blender of doom, and the rate of killing stuff is often more limited by my getting to them rather than damage required to kill them. 

i see if only there was a way to speed up these finishers. just had a thought of finishers working like that fear takedown thing in batman arkham knight. they just need to be brief enough. i can see how to speed up dagger finishers. hmmm now that i think about it with heavy weapons if the group of finisher targets are in a nice little group in range of melee the it would be could if we could to just one horizontal chop to finish them. 

yes agree the finishers are a bit slow and they need to be increased in speed. 

 

 

[Kalvorax]

On 2019-02-22 at 10:00 AM, [DE]Rebecca said:

BLOCKING

Blocking with a melee weapon is no longer keybound, it is automatic when facing enemies who are dealing damage to you in melee mode. Your Reticle determines all!

a la excal's exalted blade.

How will this work with non channeled parries and executions? Particularly with FRONTAL executions not being a thing....for a majority of enemies that SHOULD have them (most infested for example)

 

On 2019-02-22 at 10:00 AM, [DE]Rebecca said:

CHANNELING
Channeling is now a toggle set to your alt-fire button when in melee mode.

I hope to god you guys look at getting rid of energy drain on channeled blocking....its horrible

[Aeron216]

On 2019-02-26 at 11:33 AM, Aphyxia0 said:

I'm a little worried about these changes killing sprinting polearm attacks. Going fast with Volt while flinging around my polearm is a favourite pasttime for me. Having a stance equipped, which, I'm assuming, the instant switching means, ruins the feeling (and usefulness, to be honest) completely.

 

Yeah this one one of my main concerns and one of the issues I've talked about in the past. Seems like they are totally unaware of it.................... 

[(PSN)jaggerwanderer]

I hate those excal that spam howl. I can already one shot those mobs now I can one shot those mobs with style that takes 5 seconds to do then leaves me open to the group. If we can't have the option to disable melee finishers, can we have stances that don't have them? I still want those stealth finishers, those are useful, just not the melee finisher or those knockdown finishers.

[YazMatazO]

New control scheme is bad. 

Some improvements, but the controls feel gutted. 

Just too tired to say pretty much anything else now... except--May I, please, please, have my old control scheme back?...

[DKPXR]

REPORTING HUGE PROBLEM ABOUT MELEE 3.0 PHASE 1:

Hi, I'm an Excalibur main.

In this update, melee 3.0 phase 1, I can see there is huge combat flow improvement and potential. Like instant melee/gun change(Good for doing arbitration as an Excalibur), directional slam attack.

Those fx are cool, but they are QoF changes.

The huge problem tho...in an Excalibur main perspective.

Is the Glide/Block mechanic.

We always used to use our right mouse button to glide and block, but now, DE make right mouse button constantly as an range weapon aim button.

This is a direct nerf to us, Excalibur players, as we can no longer glide AND BLOCK with our Exalted blade.

It will be much better if we can still do blocking manually.

Problem No.1: Need manual blocking keybind back.

Secondly, channeling. I JUST DON'T KNOW WHY, DE is taking away the "Hold to channel" option, now I can only toggle channeling instead of hold to channel, and that is extremely annoying.

Problem No.2: Need Hold to channel keybind back.

 

EDIT 1: In short: Phase 1 fked up my excal. Unplayable.

EDIT 2:

Some suggestions that I believe will help Warframe to have a much better melee system.

1. I'm looking forward to future melee phases update. One of them is spamming melee attack IN THE AIR.

Like, imagine if Excal can spam sword waves in the air instead of only 1 swing, that will be so beautiful.

So, No.1, we need separate keybinds for "Slam attack" and "Air attack".

2. Melee finisher keybind. We all know that that is annoying when we don't want to perform a melee finisher. It will be cool if melee finisher is optional and have a keybind.

3. Excalibur 3rd's augment. No one in the team can see the enemy is affected by the 300% finisher damage. There is no any mark to show that.

Need mark above enemies that affect by Excalibur 3rd's augment.

EDIT 3:

Bug report:

1. When insert data mass in MD mission while Exalted blade is on, after inserting, the frame hold gun and exalted blade at the same time.

2. After activate Exalted blade and press "switch weapons", it has an deactivate exalted blade animate, which I assume that it shouldn't be there.

EDIT 4:

Directional slam is awesome! And I do have an Devil May Cry dream in Warframe, DE, will it happen??

We have directional slam now, and we need 2 more things...

1. separate slam and air attack, and spamable air attack. Like, we can spam air attack while facing down.(Maybe just becuz we're just above the enemy in the air)

2. Melee attack that can drive enemy in the air with Controllable Physics.

So that we can Drive enemy in the air>spam air attack>fire>spam air attack>fire>facing upward slash dash with holding glide key>fire>slam!

[alexutopia]

As I understand it the goal of the new system was to unify weapon and melee control instead of switching between two modes. The problem is that we are still switching between two distinctive modes, only that we have no control over it anymore. If I want to block now I have to perform a senseless melee attack in the air and wait in order to switch to melee mode after which the game starts automatically blocking for me (of course at this point it is to late to block the bullet I intended to block), as long as I don't accidentally aim glide for a split second unconsciously, which breaks my melee mode and I stop blocking. Same thing is true for the channeling, I can never be sure if I'm channeling or not. The only way for me to confirm if I'm allowed to channel or block right now is to take my eyes from the enemy or the next corner, look at my character in order to see if my weapon is out. It feels clunky and I'm fighting with the mechanics more than against the enemies.

Instead of making it fluid there are still two distinct modes of being in the game only now I have to mentally keep track of them and keep struggling to find out what I can or can not do in a given situation. Either you give me control over systems like blocking or channeling, with a button, so I know when I'm doing it, or I for one suggest to scrap blocking and channeling from the game completely, at the moment they are nothing but a distraction.

F to switch weapons is also unreliable now, because I can never be sure if it actually does what I want it to do. If I made a melee attack 10 seconds ago, forgot about it and still running about in 'melee-mode' with my sword out and tab F it will not do what you claim it does, it won't switch exclusively from primary to secondary and back, it will put my sword back when I'm in melee-mode, which is unnecessary now. So I have to press F twice in order to switch my weapon, but only sometimes, depending on if I made a quick melee attack or aim glided before. It sure guarantees that I can not be sure anymore what happens when I press the button, unless I have kept track of what mode I'm in or visually confirm on screen if my weapon is out or not.
 

 

[RecklessXplorer]

Melee changes aren't working for my PS$ controller. I had found a way to quit using Steam's Big Picture Mode and everything was fine, finally. So after this update, I log in, draw my melee weapon and can't attack. I tried different weapons and settings. Reluctantly turned on Big Picture Mode, no luck. Please help, patch, something, but hopefully I won't have to go back to that God Awful Big Picture Mode. Big pain in the …...

thank you 😰

[TrigrH]

I cant even enjoy the new content due to this melee update 😞

Forcing autoblock then making channeling a toggle which drains your energy instantly is the sole reason why I avoided exalted blade in the first place 😞

Can we have options to disable both autoblock and toggled channelling please? Autoblock makes my frame unplayable. (Life strike)