Nightwave is an entertaining way to take away catalysts and reactors

[KiteoHatto]

TBH, I dont think DE released nightwave as a "SHOP".

Hear me out, you know how everyone treats it as a shop where you HAVE to buy one of everything ? Why not just see it as a trader that sells stuff that you might need for your collection ?

Shop sells potatoes ? OMG i have to get as much as possible...with(extremely limited) wolf creds  [But you know there are other ways to get platinum...to buy said potatoes]

Shop sells Vauban. OMG I need so many wolf credits. [But you know there is a prime version of said frame, which make the base version obsolete other than mastery filler, in which case it's not an urgent priority unless you literally have nothing else to build in this game. That's not even touching the fact on how unpopular Booben has become]

Shop sells weapon BPs. OMG that's 9 weapons and a lot of credits for those. [You know...that's 27k mastery, do you absolutely, positively, 1000% need it RIGHT.THIS.MOMENT. ?]

IMO the best things from the shop are Nitain (thank god no more cache farming for like 5% drop chance or waiting on an alert app to notify you that there is an alert out and you are at work or..sleeping).

 

Nightwave gives much needed stuff to new players via slots and aura mods and some free forma. For older players its just a trader that lets them complete their "mastery filler" collection.

 

Those 9 weapons aren't going to get removed from the game, nor it's the only way to get potatoes. What's the rush ?

Edited March 28, 2019 by KiteoHatto

[Kaotyke]

1 hour ago, (PS4)watt4hem said:

Fyi, gifts of the lotus are also a once per 2 weeks kinda deal. And potatoe alert are so rare, clanmates would usually chirp in in all caps whenever one actually pop up.

Kind of a shame we cant yell "BLUTATO ALERT INCOMING!" in chat anymore. It now happens for Invasions only.

[Kaotyke]

9 minutes ago, KiteoHatto said:

Shop sells Vauban. OMG I need so many wolf credits. [But you know there is a prime version of said frame, which make the base version obsolete other than mastery filler, in which case it's not an urgent priority unless you literally have nothing else to build in this game. That's not even touching the fact on how unpopular Booben has become]

I dont think this argument holds weigth when you consider that Vauban Prime is vaulted and has the same inflation of Vaulted Primes.

[HexOmega111x]

il y a une heure, Test-995 a dit :

Based off of what I found on the wiki, I did the math to figure out how long it would take to buy everything in the cred shop

But you don't need all alt helmets. And then, you don't need that many nitains. You will now buy the one you will craft and use.

You don't need all the mods, some of them are just useless.

You don't need all weapons skin. Even less if you don't have the weapon. 

So your math may be accurate, they do not fit any gamers reality. 

Of course, we agree on the fact that a faster access to more cred is needed but you should not consider that everything in the shop is useful or mandatory. 

Edited March 28, 2019 by HexOmega111x

[(PSN)AllOrNothinDays]

I was surprised we weren't getting some resource rewards on top of the standing. I don't need them but it would make sense that after completing a challenge you got something. It doesn't solve your catalyst problem but it falls in line with DE taking something away from new players and not truly making up for with what they might need to help push them forward.

[KiteoHatto]

12 minutes ago, Kaotyke said:

I dont think this argument holds weigth when you consider that Vauban Prime is vaulted and has the same inflation of Vaulted Primes.

Vauban P set is 200plat right now. People are fine paying this much if not more for average rivens....

The only reason you would even want Vauban or his prime is for mastery. He has been so powercreeped lately that I can't even think of a reason where he has his niche.

 

I could understand if it was mesa p, chroma, rhino or trinity in the shop, but...vauban ? One of the worst frames that nobody cared about, but now everyone suddenly wants him ?

[Teljaxx]

22 minutes ago, (PS4)drpunk-yo said:

Really?

Cannae afford to miss a helmet?

Cannae afford to miss Infested Impedance?

Come on!

Why we pretending there's good stuff in that shop? Most of it's junk.

Even though I do agree, and l already have pretty much all the good stuff from before Nightwave, just because you or I don't want it, doesn't mean nobody wants it. This is a decision that everyone has to make now, though. And that is the point I was making, is that with alerts you didn't have to decide between one reward or another. The simple act of taking one reward from an alert did not lock you out of getting another. But with the Cred shop, if you spend your limited Creds on one thing, you can no longer get something else. So you better know what you really want, and what is worth getting, before you spend any Creds.

 

8 minutes ago, HexOmega111x said:

But you don't need all alt helmets. And then, you don't need that many nitains. You will now buy the one you will craft and use.

You don't need all the mods, some of them are just useless.

You don't need all weapons skin. Even less if you don't have the weapon. 

So your math may be accurate, they do not fit any gamers reality. 

Of course, we agree on the fact that a faster access to more cred is needed but you should not consider that everything in the shop is useful or mandatory. 

I was simply giving some info on a possible, relevant scenario. Plus, I was curious about it myself, and hadn't seen anyone else posting that kind of info. I know it isn't super likely that most players will want to get every single thing from the shop. But some people will. Just look at how obsessed people got with alerts. Using the app to track them 24-7, and disrupting their lives outside of the game just to grab that one thing they really wanted. Some people take this kind of thing way too seriously sometimes.

Personally, I simply took what I could when I could with alerts. If there was something I wanted when I logged in, it was a nice surprise and I would grab it. But if not, then oh well, maybe later. And yet, even with this lax attitude, I still managed to get everything I wanted from it. This is the big problem with Nightwave compared to alerts, it doesn't allow for "maybe later". If you don't manage to get everything you want from this season, when will you get another chance at it? This is why looking at just how long it can take to get everything does matter. If it already takes ten seasons to get all the stuff in the Cred shop, what happens if they keep adding more to it? How much can you afford to miss before you simply cannot keep up?

[AN01M3]

They should add police officers who give you the search mission of fugitives and thus win pass credits not only that they appear without random sense. If you pay attention: what do pass missions have to do with the plot of Saturn Six?

I mention cops because I imagine they are not warframes that protect the jails of Saturn Six 🤣

Edited March 28, 2019 by AN01M3

[(PSN)drpunk-yo]

26 minutes ago, Teljaxx said:

Even though I do agree, and l already have pretty much all the good stuff from before Nightwave, just because you or I don't want it, doesn't mean nobody wants it. This is a decision that everyone has to make now, though. And that is the point I was making, is that with alerts you didn't have to decide between one reward or another. The simple act of taking one reward from an alert did not lock you out of getting another. But with the Cred shop, if you spend your limited Creds on one thing, you can no longer get something else. So you better know what you really want, and what is worth getting, before you spend any Creds.

Probably better to voice your own personal experiences instead of inventing someone.

And "no longer get something else" is missing "until you earn more credits". 

 

[FlusteredFerret]

1 hour ago, KiteoHatto said:

TBH, I dont think DE released nightwave as a "SHOP".

Hear me out, you know how everyone treats it as a shop where you HAVE to buy one of everything ? Why not just see it as a trader that sells stuff that you might need for your collection ?

Shop sells potatoes ? OMG i have to get as much as possible...with(extremely limited) wolf creds  [But you know there are other ways to get platinum...to buy said potatoes]

Shop sells Vauban. OMG I need so many wolf credits. [But you know there is a prime version of said frame, which make the base version obsolete other than mastery filler, in which case it's not an urgent priority unless you literally have nothing else to build in this game. That's not even touching the fact on how unpopular Booben has become]

Shop sells weapon BPs. OMG that's 9 weapons and a lot of credits for those. [You know...that's 27k mastery, do you absolutely, positively, 1000% need it RIGHT.THIS.MOMENT. ?]

IMO the best things from the shop are Nitain (thank god no more cache farming for like 5% drop chance or waiting on an alert app to notify you that there is an alert out and you are at work or..sleeping).

 

Nightwave gives much needed stuff to new players via slots and aura mods and some free forma. For older players its just a trader that lets them complete their "mastery filler" collection.

 

Those 9 weapons aren't going to get removed from the game, nor it's the only way to get potatoes. What's the rush ?

Good points.

But the FOMO is strong with many players. They see stuff and simply have to get it all, as fast as possible (because they forget, or don't realise there will be other events after WoSS).

 

[SneakyErvin]

You can get alot more catalysts or reactors over ten weeks of Nightwave than you could possibly get from alerts. You simply need to be creative with the things that are given as rewards, you dont even need to spend wolf creds to get them.

Just grind out the 30 ranks, sell your Energize and buy cats or reactors with it. Spend your creds on alt helmets, auras and nitain.

[(PSN)drpunk-yo]

3 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

sell your Energize 

Market's gonna be crazy when more and more start hitting that rank.

It's scary.

[DoomFruit]

2 hours ago, KiteoHatto said:

Vauban P set is 200plat right now. People are fine paying this much if not more for average rivens....

The only reason you would even want Vauban or his prime is for mastery. He has been so powercreeped lately that I can't even think of a reason where he has his niche.

 

I could understand if it was mesa p, chroma, rhino or trinity in the shop, but...vauban ? One of the worst frames that nobody cared about, but now everyone suddenly wants him ?

The riven market is ridiculous and really should not be used as a guide to reasonable spending patterns.

[HexOmega111x]

il y a une heure, Teljaxx a dit :

If it already takes ten seasons to get all the stuff in the Cred shop, what happens if they keep adding more to it? How much can you afford to miss before you simply cannot keep up?

This is a fair point but it is true only if DE keeps nightwaves as it is. I can image that DE did made the same maths as you did. It could be logical then that they decided to give just a few creds for season 1 with the intention to balance for the next season based on feedback. 

If they had decided to give too much CREDS to start with, the players would have screamed even louder if DE had decided to decrease the amount of CREDS for the next season as it would have been necessary to balance the other way.

What makes this situation tricky is that a season last for 10 weeks and during that time, we can only presume that DE will make the right changes for the next season. Until then, everything will be assumptions. 

[Lutesque]

Yeah just got the very last Wolf Cred earlier and all that gets me is 4 Potatoes 😞

I already bought one for Gram Prime... and after 24 Radiant Lith T1s I finally got Tigris Prime. So later on I'l be getting another one for that one too.

 

[Purrfessor]

4 hours ago, DeckChairVonBananaCamel said:

Yeah true, a lot of the elite weeklies are not exactly new-player friendly

its an ELITE weekly  why would a new player be able to do an ELITE weekly?

[Test-995]

4 hours ago, Purrfessor said:

its an ELITE weekly  why would a new player be able to do an ELITE weekly?

Because wolf creds are better than alert only when you do all the challenges?

I didn't do math and i'm not exactly sure.

[(PSN)IroncladBomber]

I don't quiet get how people think that Nightwave is a "cash grab" when you can't buy ranks in it. And the only way to get Catalysts with any Reliability before WAS to buy them, or wait till they were given as a GOTL or as a Random Sortie Reward.

[aswitz87]

13 hours ago, Teljaxx said:

Based off of what I found on the wiki, I did the math to figure out how long it would take to buy everything in the cred shop:

160 nitain - 15 Creds each - 480 total

18 mods - 20 Creds each - 360 total

10 weapon skins - 30 Creds each - 300 Total

9 weapons - 50 Creds each - 450 total

3 Vauban parts - 25 Creds each - 75 total

38 alt helmets - 35 Creds each - 1,330 total

That's 2,995 credits for everything in the shop. But notice how I didn't include catalysts of reactors? That's because everyone needs a different amount of those, so I had no way of accurately quantifying their total cost.

Even without including them, if you are a brand new player and still need everything in the shop, it will most likely take you about TEN SEASONS to get everything on offer. Assuming about ten weeks per season, this means it will will take you just about TWO YEARS to get it all. This is also assuming 300 Creds per season, since I have not been able to find any solid info on just how many extra Creds you can get after rank 30. And of course, a new player will most likely have trouble even getting to rank 30 at all, since many of the challenges are not possible until you get fairly far into the game. So it will probably take them even longer than that.

Then add to all that an extra 75 Creds for a potato whenever you need another one, and it will take even longer. Even if you were to buy nothing but potatoes, you could only get four of them with the 300 base Creds per season. And that is assuming that you are okay with getting absolutely nothing but four potatoes all season, which seems unlikely.

So yeah, we could really use quite a few more Creds per season. For this, and other reasons, I have suggested before that all rank based rewards get moved into the Cred shop, and be replaced with nothing but Creds per rank. Something like 20~25 per rank, with a larger 50~60 bundle every 5 ranks. Along with this, remove the maximum rank per season, and just let everyone see how far they can get. This would speed things up to what seems like a much more reasonable acquisition rate, as well as giving everyone much more choice over what they get and when. Adding some Cred rewards to things like capturing fugitives, and defeating the Wolf wouldn't hurt, either.

That is faster than one could achieve the same previously, assuming a couple hours playtime (all that is needed to unlock all the credit options on nightwave).

I’ve been here three years and still don’t have all the items available. 

 

Now i I do buy potatoes for plat, but that is because after my first year I decided no more selling weapons, just keep everything.  Pokémon syndrome I call it (really it’s just my OCD).  But either method, now or past, there was no way to get that many catalysts.

 

edit: That said I would not be opposed to more creds being added.  Save me some plat....

Edited March 29, 2019 by aswitz87

[DisasterIncarnate]

8 hours ago, Purrfessor said:

its an ELITE weekly  why would a new player be able to do an ELITE weekly?

why are they even given that as a task instead of something else thats still difficult but actually possible for them.

[aswitz87]

2 minutes ago, DisasterIncarnate said:

why are they even given that as a task instead of something else thats still difficult but actually possible for them.

Maybe because new players are not meant to get the top items right now from the nightwave?  It’s not like they can even make use of umbra formas until after The Sacrifice, and there may be other content gates for the area where the umbra mods begin to shine (Tau).

[trst]

The problem with adjusting cred gains is that the entire system becomes obsolete eventually and increasing gains simply accelerates that.

Nightwave already seems faster, and a Hek of a lot more forgiving, for getting the items that you need, and it'll be even faster for every player who can reach the prestige ranks.

 

As far as "new" players who won't be able to reach the prestige ranks then they'll be able to work on them next season. Alerts required new players to get a taxi to nodes they didn't have and even required getting entirely carried through the mission which was an awfully bad practice. New players aren't, and shouldn't, be expected to get everything right away and will eventually reach the point where they can easily prestige just as every "older" player can.

[DisasterIncarnate]

Just now, aswitz87 said:

Maybe because new players are not meant to get the top items right now from the nightwave?  It’s not like they can even make use of umbra formas until after The Sacrifice, and there may be other content gates for the area where the umbra mods begin to shine (Tau).

they gain standing not a direct reward, this whole system should not be excluding chunks newer players cant access or handle, it should favor them more than older players given that most stuff in that shop is stuff new players need and older ones look at and mostly ignore because they own nearly everything in there.

[aswitz87]

Just now, DisasterIncarnate said:

they gain standing not a direct reward, this whole system should not be excluding chunks newer players cant access or handle, it should favor them more than older players given that most stuff in that shop is stuff new players need and older ones look at and mostly ignore because they own nearly everything in there.

Avoiding every single elite (most likely to contain stuff they cannot do) and they can still get more than half the ranks done, getting plenty of things they “need”.

[DisasterIncarnate]

3 minutes ago, aswitz87 said:

Avoiding every single elite (most likely to contain stuff they cannot do) and they can still get more than half the ranks done, getting plenty of things they “need”.

its a pretty backward system where old players who own nearly everything in there can get rewards quicker, rewards they typically dont even need, and new players take longer to get anything they need, it is yet again a system that leans towards people already invested/hooked on the game rather than trying to encourage newer players to stick around and often ending up frustrating them as consequence.

Edited March 29, 2019 by DisasterIncarnate