what's the point of Nekros (serious)?

[Hawk_of_the_Reborn]

1 hour ago, Ikyr0 said:

Lolwut. I have for 1200 hours, never felt like I was grinding slower. Endo farm on Sedna has been replaced by long Arbies for me, so what else?

Never said anything about grinding slower. Where do you assume that at? Without a nekros, you're only shooting yourself in the foot. There should be no reason to not have any nekros in one's arsenal if one can have a nekros. Just go kill Lephantis a few times and never worry about needing any resource ever again

[Cody]

Each farming frame in my personal opinion is situational now

 

[TARINunit9]

3 hours ago, DrakeWurrum said:

And sustained survival. Desecrate and Despoil force more health and energy orbs to drop, as well as ammo and life support. His minions aren't really there for dealing damage, but for taking damage.

I chose my words carefully: ASIDE FROM Desecrate

[Hawk_of_the_Reborn]

2 hours ago, TARINunit9 said:

I chose my words carefully: ASIDE FROM Desecrate

Soul Survivor: Need to rez your friend or companion, but can't because enemies won't let you?! Bam, free insta rez from as far as your power range will let you! Suck it, Vazarin!

Shield of Shadows: Having problems staying alive, despite being the incarnation of Death itself?! Say no more! Now you can have all your undead slaves die for you instead!

Creeping Terrify: Do you like being the thing that goes *bump* in the night, but your victims buddies are always just a smidge too fast for you to catch up to them after doing them a spook? Say no more, as you can now ooga booga them so hard that they turn into deer stuck in headlights!

I mean, since the Nekros rework, there's no reason to ever assume that he's only good for his 3 anymore.

Edited July 17, 2019 by Hawk_of_the_Reborn

[SneakyErvin]

6 hours ago, kgabor said:

My bad, i would have sweared i seen Khora's augment having a better drop chance multiplier number than Nekros's 55% but as usual my memory never fails to disappoint.

I personally don't find Hydroid's Pilfering Swarm to be that restrictive with positive range, works well enough for Survivals and most tilesets aren't that big anyways so it easily covers a whole room even in the Kuva tilesets or a corridor for tactical use.

The armor strip from Hydroid's augmented barrage is also useful, but the rest of Hydroid's kit isn't much.

Yeah, Prowl's usefulness is situational.

I don't really find a resource multiplying ability that isn't consistent all that useful as resources are usually never much of a problem anyways and if you're farming for something special and rare like a rare mod, you pick Hydroid or Ivara anyways, but for multiplying your gained credits in a passive farm it's good.

Hydroid is good when you have several of him at a time when hunting for rare mods etc. A single Hydroid is a big bust if you are there for more/rare loot because his tentacles are extremely limited. That means one single nuke frame can pretty much render him pointless because he misses so many mobs during a run. Nekros however is just there, no matter if a massive nuker is present or not, Nekros will make use of all the corpses either way.

[Gurpgork]

6 hours ago, ShadowExodus said:

I would call false on both of theses statements.His 4 teleports his shadows to himself and the animation isn't as long as when summoning them, you don't even have to be past 50 meteres for the teleport to kick in. And his energy economy is easily circumvented with equilibrium, you can even forgo adding an efficiency granted that your negative efficiency is not ridiculous (min/maxing). 

Well the thing about the energy economy is that (assuming base ability values) it's a 100 base cost ability that you have to recast every 30 seconds to counteract the health drain alone, and then you need additional recasts when your shadows take too much damage, and you also need to recast it if you move too far away from your shadows. 

And you're right about negative efficiency. None of this is a problem with good efficiency. The energy economy here would honestly not be a problem at all if Shield of Shadows didn't cap at a whopping 214% strength, or at the very least, if the cost of recasting was proportionate to the health you restored with it. But no. We're left with a 100 base cost ability that you have to cast very frequently and almost demands you to use Blind Rage to make the most of it. 

Tl;dr: Mobility would not be a problem if it wasn't a drain on the energy economy, and the energy economy would not be an issue if SotD had a sensible DR cap. 

Edited July 17, 2019 by Gurpgork

[(XBOX)Knight Raime]

It'll never happen but I do wish we had a death/necromancer frame that actually does stuff with that theme.  Rather than be a frame relegated to being a farm bot.  I'd ask DE to retool his entire kit to fit that since we've got plenty of other loot options now but I severely doubt the community would accept that.

[(PSN)robotwars7]

well, he can do some things, but like a lot of Warframes, there's a couple parts of his kit which need looking at again: not necessarily a FULL rework, but tweaking nonetheless:

- Soul Punch is garbage, let's get that out of the way first. I'm not sure how literally punching a person's soul (or Oro, in Warframe's universe) should result in anything other than an instant kill, but this would be a bit ludicrous so replacing it outright would probably be best. I think an ability that marks an enemy for death by highlighting them and stripping their armour and/or providing a damage buff against that specific enemy would be a good alternative: no more getting bullied by heavies and Eximus units hiding behind their comrades, you could point your teammates to that SOB and take him down a lot faster.

- Terrify is... kinda situational. I used to use it all the time when i first played Nekros as my "fook arf" button for when I was on low health, but with adaptation and/or Shield of Shadows there's no need for it really. I think making it so that terrified enemies drop their weapons and start literally cowering in fear on the spot would make for an interesting and viable crowd control ability. let's be honest, going up against any Warframe would be scary, but one that looks like Nekros? let's get the enemies as terrified as that one guy from his Prime Trailer!

- Desecrate works fine, but lets face it, nobody runs a desecrate build without the Despoil Augment because otherwise it's too energy intensive; you may not even get back the energy you spend on a cast, so Despoil is kinda mandatory. in fact, it's probably one of, if not the top, MOST mandatory Augments. it makes far more sense therefore to just make Despoil part of Desecrate as standard and then change the augment to do something else, like making AoE damage spots where corpses are laid. something that doesn't force every Nekros user to get the augment just so they can feel useful with him.

- Shadows of the Dead kinda works better now, but the minion cap was a blow to those wanting a true undead army. the Shadows are a bit stronger now though, but Shield of Shadows is, again, one of those must haves (unless you have Adaptation, I find that actually works better for high level toroid farming, though my build won't support both Adaptation and SoS, else I lose power stats). perhaps making SoS standard and adjusting the augment to do something else would be a welcome change. not sure what that could be though... maybe have the shadows be able to heal each other and the player/allies?

TL;DR: Nekros is NOT a bad frame, but considering that most people just use him for the loot and we have newer frames like Revenant with similar powers, I think his kit could do with an update.

 

[(XBOX)CaligulaTwily]

I slap Power Donation on Nekros, he's my pillow queen frame 

[khazlol]

One of those relics of ancient warframe balance.

anyone remember when Trinity could make the whole team immortal with unlimited range?

[FlyingDice]

People say "loot", but the real purpose of Nekros is using Soul Punch to yeet enemies into the skybox.

[Hawk_of_the_Reborn]

6 minutes ago, khazlol said:

One of those relics of ancient warframe balance.

anyone remember when Trinity could make the whole team immortal with unlimited range?

Ah the good ol days

2 minutes ago, FlyingDice said:

People say "loot", but the real purpose of Nekros is using Soul Punch to yeet enemies into the skybox.

Yes

[(XBOX)Salty Ginger]

Eh I already had him so i sold mine for the extra slot lol

[DaMasque]

People can be as colorful as they want with him but being "serious" here, there is nothing redeemable about him.

Nekros as a tank? Needs 4 essential mods (Despoil, Shields of Shadow, Equilibrium, and Health conversion), a arcane (Guardian), and even then you can still push for a 3rd DR source (Adaptation). All mods that are usually a bit far into the game, unless you're buying them outright. 
Performance? His shadows are more an annoyance then actual help for you teammates, so if you have that kind of conscience, play someone else.

Nekros as a looter? In his natural habitat. Max range and run around, throw on Despoil and Equilibrium for infinite looting, otherwise vanilla Desecrate will eat your energy like no tomorrow.

Any other build? None that would matter. 

Creeping Terrify? Only if you want to play support Nekros, otherwise NEVER press vanilla 2. 
What about late game? Heck man use whatever you want but you're here to read about "serious" Nekros, so why are you using him late game other then showing off his fashionframe?A

A honest IMO, (and I have him as my most used frame), he's only for aesthetics and who doesn't like running around as a frame of death.. heck look at his prime trailer, ITS FREAKIN GLORIOUS!

[TARINunit9]

2 hours ago, Hawk_of_the_Reborn said:

Soul Survivor: Need to rez your friend or companion, but can't because enemies won't let you?! Bam, free insta rez from as far as your power range will let you! Suck it, Vazarin!

Shield of Shadows: Having problems staying alive, despite being the incarnation of Death itself?! Say no more! Now you can have all your undead slaves die for you instead!

Creeping Terrify: Do you like being the thing that goes *bump* in the night, but your victims buddies are always just a smidge too fast for you to catch up to them after doing them a spook? Say no more, as you can now ooga booga them so hard that they turn into deer stuck in headlights!

I mean, since the Nekros rework, there's no reason to ever assume that he's only good for his 3 anymore.

Again, I chose my words very carefully in my original post: "As it stands, he is only good for his augments", a point you have happily proven for me

[Hawk_of_the_Reborn]

12 minutes ago, DaMasque said:

People can be as colorful as they want with him but being "serious" here, there is nothing redeemable about him.

Nekros as a tank? Needs 4 essential mods (Despoil, Shields of Shadow, Equilibrium, and Health conversion), a arcane (Guardian), and even then you can still push for a 3rd DR source (Adaptation). All mods that are usually a bit far into the game, unless you're buying them outright. 
Performance? His shadows are more an annoyance then actual help for you teammates, so if you have that kind of conscience, play someone else.

Nekros as a looter? In his natural habitat. Max range and run around, throw on Despoil and Equilibrium for infinite looting, otherwise vanilla Desecrate will eat your energy like no tomorrow.

Any other build? None that would matter. 

Creeping Terrify? Only if you want to play support Nekros, otherwise NEVER press vanilla 2. 
What about late game? Heck man use whatever you want but you're here to read about "serious" Nekros, so why are you using him late game other then showing off his fashionframe?A

A honest IMO, (and I have him as my most used frame), he's only for aesthetics and who doesn't like running around as a frame of death.. heck look at his prime trailer, ITS FREAKIN GLORIOUS!

1 - Wrong. Since Adaptation, I can tank as a base Banshee.

2 - While being pretty darn essential, Despoil is utterly not required. It's like saying "putting any mod on any warframe is mandatory and it's unfair" Equilibrium really helps with that too, so in the end you really don't "need" despoil, it's just recommended as it doesn't use up energy that is needed for more important things, like using your other abilities.

3 - That's the whole point of that augment. Even with the augment, do you really think anybody uses his 2 enough to worry about it? Hek, I only use it to scatter mobs away so I can rez allies in peace. The augment turns a utility defensive ability into a viable utility offensive one.

4 - Exactly, that's the point of Nekros even in the in-game lore. He's death, like literally.

[DrakeWurrum]

19 minutes ago, DaMasque said:

Nekros as a tank? Needs 4 essential mods (Despoil, Shields of Shadow, Equilibrium, and Health conversion), a arcane (Guardian), and even then you can still push for a 3rd DR source (Adaptation). All mods that are usually a bit far into the game, unless you're buying them outright.

I only use 2 of those on mine. O_o

Though I guess I'm not one of those people who enjoy sitting in a mission for 3 hours declaring that it's "hard" when really it's just... tedious.

[Hawk_of_the_Reborn]

8 minutes ago, TARINunit9 said:

Again, I chose my words very carefully in my original post: "As it stands, he is only good for his augments", a point you have happily proven for me

Whatever helps you sleep at night. Nekros is actually better without any augments, but at the cost of very heavy lack of any utility at all.

[GrandRiser]

11 hours ago, Ikyr0 said:

got my free prime and im wondering what this guy brings to the table. from a first look, it seems he is basically a tank frame without any nuking abilities. as someone who mains Nidus and Nova, I'm not sure what to do with him, as he solely relies on weapon kills. i know he also enhances farming with Despoil. anything I'm missing here?

edit: thanks guys. beyond Despoil, Nekros is pretty redundant given the frames i already use. just MR fodder for me.

Nekros is good for survival and farming:

1. It forces additional loot to drop, such as farming argon in Void or more air supply during survival missions.
2. gives you troop to fight back in survival, defense, mobile defense missions,etc.

[TARINunit9]

21 minutes ago, Hawk_of_the_Reborn said:

Whatever helps you sleep at night. Nekros is actually better without any augments, but at the cost of very heavy lack of any utility at all.

I fail to see literally anything interesting or powerful about him in such a build. Soul Punch? Terrify? Random AI units that deal no damage and can just about draw aggro

And this is not me being smug, this is me not wanting to be right and daring you to prove me wrong

[(PSN)thowed]

He allows me to solo survival arbitrations with his tankiness and life support.  Just bring a catchmoon and you're good to go.

[Gurpgork]

1 hour ago, Hawk_of_the_Reborn said:

Whatever helps you sleep at night. Nekros is actually better without any augments, but at the cost of very heavy lack of any utility at all.

That makes no sense. Utility is pretty much all that Nekros can give you. Why would the version that lacks utility be better than the version that has decent utility? 

[Hawk_of_the_Reborn]

1 minute ago, Gurpgork said:

That makes no sense. Utility is pretty much all that Nekros can give you. Why would the version that lacks utility be better than the version that has decent utility? 

More mod slots for more varied builds. You're sacrificing some form of either survivability or ability efficiency/range with more than 1 augment mod at any given time with Nekros 

[-Vahagn-]

Yea he's just the loot frame in the loot game.

There is a decent Shadows of the Dead build I saw somewhere if you wanna try that out.

 

Though I only use him for framing.

[Ikyr0]

1 hour ago, WH1735S0W said:

Yea he's just the loot frame in the loot game.

There is a decent Shadows of the Dead build I saw somewhere if you wanna try that out.

 

Though I only use him for framing.

Thanks. Nah I'm good. I have a few tanky frames in my roster that nuke hard, cc, and provide a lot of utility all in one package. Seems like I'd be just settling, with Nekros.