Fix Wisp's Motes, and other Buffs so they aren't forced down our throat. (add opt-out)

[Joezone619]

I hate wisp for 1 reason... the fire-rate mote. shes a good frame but it always screws up my aim with recoil, and my shooting dynamic.

They should add a "press X to collect" so that your not forced to take the damn thing. most wisps put them in doorways or important places so you have no choice but to collect them. or some way to opt-out of buffs you dont want.

 

  

On 2020-06-27 at 7:53 PM, Tehcaro said:

What about adding a third section to the Gear/Emote Menu? This section would list all the buffs given by members of the squad.

Then each can be toggled on/off by each player during the mission.

This is probably the best way in my opinion to solve issues like these for not only wisp but all other buffs and future frames..

Edited June 30, 2020 by Joezone619
Expanding

[DeMonkey]

Agreed, the increased speed is more detrimental than beneficial to me.

[Tehcaro]

I've been playing a lot with Chroma recently and the shock mote does get in the way.

Maybe allowing backflip to remove the buff, just like you can do with volts speed?

[Joezone619]

see what i mean? her buffs are more distracting then helpful for me, shock mote? kill stealing. speed mote? well now i cant use guns cuz my whole dynamic is screwed up. healing mote? honesly, WAY to strong in my opinion at least for also having a healing factor doubled on top.

[Tehcaro]

I've nothing against Wisp, i think she is a great frame. Total frame synergy in Warframe is probably impossible and will always be an issue with so many Warframe+abilities and build variety.

[Joezone619]

yeah i wont deny shes a good frame. but damn do those motes piss me off sometimes.

[Hello]

This is a good example of why I wish there was opt-in for most if not all "buffs". Although I don't know how they could do this, it would be cluttered in the settings menu if it was for each individual frame. With Wisp, I like the health mote. I don't like the shock or movement motes.

Damage buffs are fine as is. It's the forced movement ones that bother me. Especially with Volt, the need to backflip every 5 seconds is annoying and why I am playing solo more again. With another Volt example, but this could apply to Wisp if they give the option. Backflip to get rid of it should last the duration of the mission at the bare minimum. As it stands, I would rather abort the mission than deal with these type of players. I should also make it clear, I'm never the host. So when I abort the mission I'm not causing a host migration that screws over other people in the group.

[Voltage]

28 minutes ago, Joezone619 said:

They should add a "press X to collect"

If Hasten Coil on Volt taught us anything, this is a terrible idea.

[Genoscythe]

Getting close to a type of mote and pressing the interaction button to permanently disable this kind of buff and buff re-acquisition for the mission might be a good solution, having to backflip every three seconds because motes are everywhere in an endless mission might be pretty annoying.

Edited June 27, 2020 by Genoscythe

[IceColdHawk]

Just another example that we urgently need content that makes people appreciate buffs and not despise them. 

[phoenix1992]

4 minutes ago, IceColdHawk said:

Just another example that we urgently need content that makes people appreciate buffs and not despise them. 

Some people don't appreciate turning into vibrators due fire rate or swing speed buffs.

I am not one of them, however I can see how it can be tilting.

[taiiat]

uh, sure i guess, Interacting is good enough for this i guess. hopefully a radial sort of activation so you can take all of the Motes you're standing inside the Range of at once, rather than having to select them separately or some sort of fanagling of trying to select one Mote but another you already took blocking your activation. so a radial activation for Motes would be much preferable.

23 minutes ago, Tehcaro said:

Maybe allowing backflip to remove the buff, just like you can do with volts speed?

can we not? there's so many better ways to handle things than to lock people out of Parkour.

 

9 minutes ago, Voltage said:

If Hasten Coil on Volt taught us anything, this is a terrible idea.

i think this is a different sort of scenario, it's a static thing that you go to, pressing interact once taking them while you're in Range of them seems alright to me, since it's something you already have to intentionally go to anyways, eh?

[Voltage]

1 minute ago, taiiat said:

uh, sure i guess, Interacting is good enough for this i guess. hopefully a radial sort of activation so you can take all of the Motes you're standing inside the Range of at once, rather than having to select them separately or some sort of fanagling of trying to select one Mote but another you already took blocking your activation. so a radial activation for Motes would be much preferable.

can we not? there's so many better ways to handle things than to lock people out of Parkour.

i think this is a different sort of scenario, it's a static thing that you go to, pressing interact once taking them while you're in Range of them seems alright to me, since it's something you already have to intentionally go to anyways, eh?

I would much rather have a checklist in my options menu where I can toggle buffs if I had to take some solution for this "problem". Having to have any extra inputs just to recieve a radial buff (or remove one) is clunky gameplay. If Zephyr was more popular, we would have a similar thread pop up about Jet Stream. I've seen this exact thread for Volt, Valkyr, and now Wisp. I feel like this comes down to not liking another pace for this game and wanting a way to tone it down for yourself. That's not a big deal, but making these interactions more annoying for those who do want these buffs for the people who want to ignore them doesn't sound great.

If we do get interaction required for Wisp's Motes though, I will wait for the "I casted my Haste Mote and then stabbed a Larvling on accident" thread.

[Joezone619]

2 minutes ago, Voltage said:

If we do get interaction required for Wisp's Motes though, I will wait for the "I casted my Haste Mote and then stabbed a Larvling on accident" thread.

at that point... wouldn't it just be the wisps fault for placing the motes next to the larvling? or not placing them somewhere else if the larvling went in range? at that point though just make stab kuva larvling a hold X instead of just press.

[CrimsonSpawn]

They could fix the circumference of her reservoirs (instead of being altered by range mods) while also placing a condition that you have to roll through it or sprint through the reservoir to gain its effects (this doesn't have to apply towards defense objectives, they would just have to be near it; to gain its effects). And if you accidentally grab the effects, then you can always roll or sprint through it again; to have it de buffed.

I think this would be far simpler than forcing players to press X or some other kind of interaction.

Edited June 27, 2020 by CrimsonSpawn

[Marthrym]

Just make it so that people who want to opt out are the ones who have to interact with the motes, since they're the ones who want to not benefit from the buffs. Doing the opposite seems rather nonsensical to me. An option to disable the prompt for those who want the buffs would be nice too, to avoid accidents. That or giving the action a specific keybinding, that would work too.

[rawr1254]

Give haste mote a recoil reduction as well as fire rate. boom problem solved

But in all seriousness Ive never once not liked any buff I get from someone whether that be Wisp, Volt, etc.. Idk maybe I dont use enough Call of Duty weapons to let recoil matter any

Edited June 27, 2020 by rawr1254

[LSG501]

Honestly, in most cases I have far less issue from wisp's 'speed' mote than I do when a high power short duration volt keeps spamming their 2... (yes I know I can backflip out of volt but if they keep spamming it...).  Even a high speed wisp doesn't seem to be as bad as most volt buffs.

Shooting isn't my issue and in most cases (usually volt more than wisp), it's more to do with stupidly fast sprinting (I already have most frames set at the speed I want), my timing for bullet jumps is thrown off and if I happen to use titania flying is annoying due to even more of the 'back glow' we get when flying and the fact it seems to make titania even worse to do 'small movements' when 'sprinting', that's already bad enough without a buff due to the on/off nature of her movement now (how I miss the 'acceleration' of the old version)....

 

Shock mote can be a little annoying on the wrong type of map (spy for example) but normally it's pretty handy if you're using melee and condition overload.  Having said that not all wisp users sling down shock when they know it will adversely affect things. 

 

I think it's kind of getting to that point where DE might need to consider adding in some toggles relating to whether we want to be affected by 'buffs' from certain frames, because it seems that most players with buffs just assume 'everyone' likes things they same as the person buffing does....

[KochDerFrettchen]

Better: Add recoil reduction, some ammo efficiency, or both to fire rate buffs so that they're always positive

[LuckyCharm]

I like all the motes, im happy when theres a wisp on my team cus gotta go fassst. That said i feel that wisp herself needs the shock mote more than most other frames. Its really her main crowd control for me so backflipping for removal or needing to press x etc will hurt her more than most. I think an option in the menu is the simplest thing

[taiiat]

2 hours ago, Voltage said:

I would much rather have a checklist in my options menu where I can toggle buffs if I had to take some solution for this "problem". Having to have any extra inputs just to recieve a radial buff (or remove one) is clunky gameplay.

If Zephyr was more popular, we would have a similar thread pop up about Jet Stream. I've seen this exact thread for Volt, Valkyr, and now Wisp.

If we do get interaction required for Wisp's Motes though, I will wait for the "I casted my Haste Mote and then stabbed a Larvling on accident" thread.

having to open a Menu to change it sounds clunkier to me than a no-animation button press while you're inside of the circle(s), shrug.
just simply one specific situation where you have to go to it by design already, making it more possible to do something than for any other Abilities.

yeah but those Abilities don't have any easy answers that doesn't end up nerfing Players in some way, so just makes it an impasse.

and i'd be right with you laughing at whoever Posted a Thread like that.

[Tehcaro]

What about adding a third section to the Gear/Emote Menu? This section would list all the buffs given by members of the squad.

Then each can be toggled on/off by each player during the mission.

[LSG501]

Actually had a little time thinking on how we could get a way to 'remove buffs'.... now I admit this isn't really a complete solution as it all or nothing aproach but it's far less work code wise imo than a toggle in a menu and as such something we could get sooner rather than later.  .

The easiest option for keyboard players is obviously a keybind which when pressed cancels any buffs you might have picked up, but this is an issue for controllers because obviously they don't have as many buttons and are already struggling with space iirc.

So I thought what about a gear wheel 'toggle', we can stick it in our gear wheels and then activate it if we want to disable all buffs (say we have a volt spamming it's 2 like I mentioned earlier) and then select it again to enable buffs in that mission.  Like I say not perfect but as a quick fix I think it's a viable option to consider.

[Joezone619]

4 hours ago, Tehcaro said:

What about adding a third section to the Gear/Emote Menu? This section would list all the buffs given by members of the squad.

Then each can be toggled on/off by each player during the mission.

to me this honestly seems like probably the best way to do this, and solve the problem for future frames.

[Steel_Rook]

17 hours ago, IceColdHawk said:

Just another example that we urgently need content that makes people appreciate buffs and not despise them. 

Regardless of what content you create, "buffs" which fundamentally alter the way our characters work will never be appreciated. Movement speed buffs, melee attack speed buffs and weapon rate of fire buffs always need an opt-out because they are intrusive. Something like bonus damage, bonus armour, bonus energy, etc. would be considered non-intrusive. Yes, there are situations where those might be problematic, but by and large they only affect our performance, not the effects of our control inputs. Bonuses like the various "speeds," however, affect what our controls do and so aren't everyone's cup of tea. Having some way to cancel out of these buffs when they're unwanted would be a positive action.