Nihil boss fight

[(XBOX)YoungGunn82]

1 minute ago, Naaiers said:

Why does DE keep making these non-warframe fights?

Because power my doode. A player like myself would sneeze on him and he would be toast. DE has designed themselves into a corner where this is the only direction they can go none Warframe fights

[(PSN)Silverback73]

3 hours ago, BornWithTeeth said:

Ok, I've beaten the fight, it's never going to be a problem again, I shall chill out and say something nice.

- Very cool that you only need to do the fight once to get the blueprint, thanks DE.
- I do in fact appreciate that this fight is 100% the same for every player, no matter how OP or anaemic their build is, I get it. That's not an entirely bad call.
- Nihil's visual design is gorgeous.
- I do like that it doesn't completely hold your hand about remembering which symbols tie in to which individual Nihil's talking about.

 

There. I came back and said nice things. Can we now acknowledge that DE ripped this from Fall Guys?

Lol, I can’t get Donkey Kong out of my head since I haven’t seen it yet.

[Naaiers]

16 minutes ago, (XB1)YoungGunn82 said:

Because power my doode. A player like myself would sneeze on him and he would be toast. DE has designed themselves into a corner where this is the only direction they can go none Warframe fights

There are many, many mechanics that can be used to accomplish the same effect. They just picked the absolute worst I've seen to date. Last Nightwave was a perfect example. Having to collect things and only be able to damage him in the light combined with health gating accomplished that admirably. The new fight with Jackal in the new Corpus space tileset is another. Those fights were done really well in my opinion, but this fight is a direct rip from other platforms not done even slightly well. If you have lag, you are screwed. Being one-shot by the sword attack that you can't avoid because you happen to be playing on a potato during quarantine makes this a miserable slog of uninspired gameplay. 

[Yakhul]

I wonder if there is an option for having nora do her transmissions showing her face, now that she has shown it.

[(PSN)Silverback73]

25 minutes ago, Naaiers said:

Why does DE keep making these non-warframe fights? If I wanted to play a S***y platformer, I would play a S***ty platformer. What happened to the ingenuity from the last nightwave? That boss had fun, new mechanics, and most importantly, it was Warframe, not some 2000's era platforming bulls*** I love you DE, but you f***ed this up.

I sometimes wonder if the designers sit in brainstorm sessions and try to draw on past game design experience and shoehorn it into the game as a “game mode” because it’s relatively inexpensive (content) to implement vs working on combat.

Everytime I see a Vent Kid I just imagine Scott, Steve and the gang all enjoying a “recreational smoke” and then all simultaneously turning at once to look at Daryl (British and Boyish in looks) who suddenly looks worried...

In Unison:  ”Hey Daryl, you were lead on that Snowboarding X Game that came out in 2006, right?”

😆

 

 

[Hyohakusha]

There's absolutely no skill involved in this mess of a fight. It's purely random dumb luck for him to actually fire shards you can throw back, same with him aiming at the platforms, same with whether or not he fires the shards at angle where they'll actually land on the platform. Get lucky, he swings at nothing, you don't lose a triangle wedge of platform, he shoots consistently and you can actually kill him. Get unlucky, you're screwed. The shards go sailing past the platform wedges, he destroys half the wedges in a single swing, he teleports when you throw it, the shard completely misses the terrible hitbox on the crystals, he's too far away... ugh. Horrible design and a complete lack of playtesting on top of "mechanics" that were outdated at the end of the PS1 era.

[Navorion]

I hate it. I tried it 3 times and now i don't have enough Cephalite to try it again. Why can't we skip the anoying story part when we did it once and why do i have to farm them again? The whole glas story was interesting but annoying as hell. Why is there even a boss fight? Just tell me the end of the story and give me the blueprint. If i want to play a jump 'n' run game i would be playing super mario insted.

I'm so mad right now that i'm done with the game for the next couple of days. 

[Naaiers]

9 minutes ago, Hyohakusha said:

There's absolutely no skill involved in this mess of a fight. It's purely random dumb luck for him to actually fire shards you can throw back, same with him aiming at the platforms, same with whether or not he fires the shards at angle where they'll actually land on the platform. Get lucky, he swings at nothing, you don't lose a triangle wedge of platform, he shoots consistently and you can actually kill him. Get unlucky, you're screwed. The shards go sailing past the platform wedges, he destroys half the wedges in a single swing, he teleports when you throw it, the shard completely misses the terrible hitbox on the crystals, he's too far away... ugh. Horrible design and a complete lack of playtesting on top of "mechanics" that were outdated at the end of the PS1 era.

This ... add lag into the mix from a crap machine and it's the pinnacle of garbage. I reiterate, DE can do these things well. Last Nightwave boss fight was boss and the new Jackal are proof that they can. Which is why this sucks so much. 

[nslay]

This boss fight, the new Jackal, etc... are this way because there are too many frames or weapons that can cheese bosses in one way or another. Even if they try to do something obnoxious like Necramechs... there's a frame like Octavia to make it trivial! Status immunity, Sortie modifiers, Steel Path... even the new Jackal with its Parazon mechanic... still cheesable.

This one? Can't cheese it. But it's also not the game Warframe...

[Navorion]

Yeah. Why do they have to make content where the player can't use warframe abilities or weapons ? Just to make it a challange?  Why do they have to take everything away what we like and make a stupid boss where we have to play a different game because otherwise it would be cheesable? It feels like the new Monster Hunter Iceborn content. Look here is a new thing but the way to get it will completely annoy you and you have to farm things to try it again, which is even more annoying.

[Naaiers]

Mostly it's just disappointing. If this is a taste of things to come, I'm not sure I want to bother at all. ANOTHER completely isolated silo like railjack, Warframe is becoming like shattered glass, all these different parts separated from themselves. Instead of new innovations that can be spread to other areas of the game, like future nodes/fights, mastery tests, and game modes, we get no hope of any of these things, or worse, are we going to be seeing more of this non-warframe platforming? Fans of platformers rejoice, but I for one explicitly play Warframe to get away from suffocating lack of mobility and diverse gameplay. 

[Acos]

I thought it was pretty easy, but a few tips for people struggling: 
1) It's not enough to just dodge the shards of glass, you need to bait them towards you. Standing still and then double-jump + gliding after he tosses them is fine. 
2) The first hit of glass removes your shields, the second hit will kill you. If you get hit, just run around for a bit until your shield is back. 
3) Sword is a one shot, try to keep your distance from him. 
4)Falling into the abyss spawns you onto a platform that he'll teleport over to destroy. If you need to duck into the abyss to avoid a sword strike, go for it. Just remember to move shortly after you respawn. 
5) Thrown glass has travel time; Throwing it closer to your target makes it a lot easier to hit with it. 

Hope that helps! You can do it Tenno! 

[(PSN)sister-hawk]

2 hours ago, IainG10 said:

How nice for you; I did not grow up on platformers and I absolutely detest them. I have played many other games; usually strategy games: how would you platformer fanatics like a boss fight that was actually 45 miuntes of carefully managing resources, building up a good defensive line, then steamrolling over the boss with a sea of units? Or maybe a MOBA-style boss, where you use only your mouse to move and attack, and you have to carefully position around a boss for 10 minutes avoiding projectiles and floor zones.

Bruh what are you talking about. Platforming has been a part of warframe ever since parkour was introduced. Just because you choose not to engage with it doesn’t mean it’s not part of the game’s design.

Also “platformer fanatics?” As if I’m incapable of playing other kinds of games.

You’re being a bit overly dramatic about all of this. You only have to do the fight once. Get it done and move on like why come to the forums to moan about it?

[Naaiers]

13 minutes ago, (PS4)sister-hawk said:

You’re being a bit overly dramatic about all of this. You only have to do the fight once. Get it done and move on like why come to the forums to moan about it?

If DE rocks hard and delivers great new content, they should be exalted. If they f*** that up, they should be told so too. Otherwise, they do more of this s***, and the game goes downhill. I give dollars for great new content and complaints for issues. Praise to reinforce positive changes and complaint to correct negative changes is what it's all about. I don't want to see Warframe become a 2000's era uninspired copy-of-another-game platforming s***show. I want it to be what it (usually) does best, innovate and dazzle.

[nslay]

8 minutes ago, Naaiers said:

Mostly it's just disappointing. If this is a taste of things to come, I'm not sure I want to bother at all. ANOTHER completely isolated silo like railjack, Warframe is becoming like shattered glass, all these different parts separated from themselves. Instead of new innovations that can be spread to other areas of the game, like future nodes/fights, mastery tests, and game modes, we get no hope of any of these things, or worse, are we going to be seeing more of this non-warframe platforming? Fans of platformers rejoice, but I for one explicitly play Warframe to get away from suffocating lack of mobility and diverse gameplay. 

If they want to balance bosses while also letting players use their weapons and abilities... I think one approach is to look at giving some bosses a modified Mesmer Skin. Maybe with a fight-specific mechanic to strip more of the charges. Put a damage time gate on it (player-wide rather than shooter-specific like it is on Revenant*), remove damage reflection (because nobody likes it on Necramechs) and voila... now you have an uncheesable boss because that's how good Mesmer Skin is.

* So if you want clarity on what this means... Take your Revenant to a Void mission and stand in front of an Orokin Sentry (the little robot statues that shoot). Witness the discrepancy in fire rate and charge loss. Charge loss is slower than fire rate... so the Mesmer Skin has a shooter-specific time gate. There are a few exceptions to this though (Tusk Bolkor, Condor Dropship, Profit Taker/Exploiter underbelly cannon)!

[(PSN)robotwars7]

went in with zero expectations. turned out to be a platform fight. not the worst design of fight, certainly better than invul phases and weak points, but not my favourite either. just glad you only have to do it once. definitely would have liked more shooting, but at this point any boss that's supposed to be taken as a serious threat for the sake of the story is gonna have a fight more like this, where we can't just one-shot them or CC them with our insane gear and abilities.

mark my words, more fights will be like this. if you enjoyed the fight, good, if not, you're probably not gonna like future bosses very much. my favourite part was just getting the Vitrica BP.

 

 

[OniDax]

4 hours ago, (PS4)caoshen0625 said:

That will be a complete different game. Nothing in warframe can be translated to dual. They will have to build melee from ground up. And warframe is awful with the timed attack mechanics. Even in solo shet lagging all over the place.

Games like Ghost of Tsushima and Fallen Order have a combo-based melee system, where there are different combos you perform based on your key/button presses. The difference is how melee enemies respond to your attacks and how you can respond to theirs. Blocking, for example, actually means something in those games. It's really not different from Warframe, except that in Warframe, blocking doesn't do anything, your combos don't have any impact on enemies other than dealing damage to them. They don't stagger back or anything, and enemies can't really block your attacks unless they just have an auto block that makes you stagger back. Enemies just hack and slash. There's nothing deeper than that. Warframe can maintain its same core melee gameplay, but by changing how blocking works and changing how enemies react to your melee attacks, Warframe's melee combat can be a little deeper, which would help make the gameplay more satisfying and help make melee boss fights more interesting.

1 hour ago, (PS4)Silverback73 said:

I sometimes wonder if the designers sit in brainstorm sessions and try to draw on past game design experience and shoehorn it into the game as a “game mode” because it’s relatively inexpensive (content) to implement vs working on combat.

Everytime I see a Vent Kid I just imagine Scott, Steve and the gang all enjoying a “recreational smoke” and then all simultaneously turning at once to look at Daryl (British and Boyish in looks) who suddenly looks worried...

In Unison:  ”Hey Daryl, you were lead on that Snowboarding X Game that came out in 2006, right?”

😆

 

 

Look at the games DE has released and ask that question again with a straight face. DE game design experience outdated experience. I don't want Warframe's usual boss fights with this. I don't want to be able to cheese this. I want something more, something better from Warframe. I'm one of the few that doesn't like Warframe's mobility because I don't like a movement system that's built around essentially drifting in the air. If Warframe had actual parkour, that'd be great. But it doesn't, so this boss fight doesn't do it for me. I'm also tired of hopping from platform to platform avoid big waves of attacks.

I want something more engaging. An actual duel is more engaging, and it could absolutely fit with Warframe. A system like what is in Ghost of Tsushima could absolutely work here. That game and even games like Fallen Order and Assassin's Creed still have combo-based hack and slash, like Warframe does (even if they don't let you choose between different sets of combos - i.e. stances). But they differ in how enemies can engage you and interrupt your attacks. Aka parrying. Block serves a function that's more than just being another combo trigger. Blocking actually blocks enemy melee attacks, opening up timed parries. Ghost of Tsushima, Fallen Order, Assassin's Creed, For Honor, etc. all do this quite well. Warframe doesn't have to be as complex and restrictive as For Honor, but they can do some of what Ghost of Tsushima does. And that would've been a better boss fight than what we got today.

[EmberStar]

Just tried it.  WOW, does that mission design absolutely SUCK.  I think I already hate it more than just about anything else DE has made.  (And that's compared to Exploiter, the massively bad design of Thumpers, and Eidolons, which I already deeply despise.)  Oh, hey, lets base an entire fight around a totally new mechanic.  No, we're not going to tell the players what that mechanic IS, that would be cheating.

I'm a collector.  I have every single weapon and Warframe.  But you know what?  Screw this boss, and forget this weapon.  It is NOT worth it.

[EmberStar]

4 hours ago, Ailia_Grimm said:

I feel like people like you just can't enjoy things as they are

Not everything is for everyone, that should be common sense. Don't like it? Then this boss is just not for you, you've done it once & you got your blueprint right? That means you can ignore it now

Nope, it means I've done it once, he spazzed out and wiped an entire *platform* in a single attack.  I can't possibly leap over the gap, and because they didn't playtest the fight worth a damn he spent the rest of the time alternating between throwing shards into infinity and slowly wiping out the remaining ledges.  Somehow not a single one of the things I threw back at him actually HIT him, and I eventually ran out of lives.  So now I have to do the whole hateful mess AGAIN.  And possibly again after that.  Here's a thought - if I *wanted* to fight unfair, brutal puzzle bosses, I wouldn't have IGNORED every single "souls like" on Steam.  I play Warframe because I want to *play Warframe..*  That means that every single one of these fights where the "challenge" is NOT using my Warframe?  Yeah, that's exactly NOT what I play this game for.

[TARINunit9]

7 hours ago, Megalomaniakaal said:

I'd say it was pretty annoying, but then I didn't expect having to remember elements of previous investigations that i had done a long ass time ago.

You kind of don't. I was able to get past phase 1 throwing randomly (long story short, i was trying to hit the episode 5 clues and hit the pobber floof on accident), then after that I just waited until he talked. He said something about "capitalism" and "profit", so I chose the corpus helmet and it worked. He said something about "the comfort of warm [animal meat] on a cold plains night", so I chose the ostron symbol and it worked

[TARINunit9]

35 minutes ago, EmberStar said:

Just tried it.  WOW, does that mission design absolutely SUCK.  I think I already hate it more than just about anything else DE has made.  (And that's compared to Exploiter, the massively bad design of Thumpers, and Eidolons, which I already deeply despise.)  Oh, hey, lets base an entire fight around a totally new mechanic.  No, we're not going to tell the players what that mechanic IS, that would be cheating.

It's not really new, but they once again fall into the trap of expecting you to have done EVERYTHING in the game before now. Because the mechanic is the same as Exploiter Orb: throw stuff. The only new part is a boss with giant instakill hitboxes. And THAT'S the part I agree is annoying and terrible

[EmberStar]

1 minute ago, TARINunit9 said:

It's not really new, but they once again fall into the trap of expecting you to have done EVERYTHING in the game before now. Because the mechanic is the same as Exploiter Orb: throw stuff. The only new part is a boss with giant instakill hitboxes. And THAT'S the part I agree is annoying and terrible

I wouldn't know, I've fought Exploiter something like exactly ten times.  Three times to get Hildryn (I lucked out and got a different part each time) and then the rest to get Hildryn again to feed to Helminth.  It's a boss fight I deeply dislike and think about as little as possible.

[Shimmershell]

I don't think it was difficult at all.
Hit him three times.
Dodge the gems.

2nd Phase, Dodge gem, shoot gem. Throw yourself into the abyss. Repeat three times. His sword cant hit you if your falling off the ledge.
Only shoot him when he's in the middle.

3rd phase. Read above. Just shoot him wherever now.

It would be nice if you could jump or slide under the blade, but throwing yourself into the void works fine.
Got him on my 3rd attempt.

Crystals to break, Teddybear, Mask and I didn't actually see the 3rd gem I probably just got lucky.  2nd phase is the hardest, but when you get used to just stage diving it's a cake walk.

[(PSN)Silverback73]

1 hour ago, OniDax said:

Games like Ghost of Tsushima and Fallen Order have a combo-based melee system, where there are different combos you perform based on your key/button presses. The difference is how melee enemies respond to your attacks and how you can respond to theirs. Blocking, for example, actually means something in those games. It's really not different from Warframe, except that in Warframe, blocking doesn't do anything, your combos don't have any impact on enemies other than dealing damage to them. They don't stagger back or anything, and enemies can't really block your attacks unless they just have an auto block that makes you stagger back. Enemies just hack and slash. There's nothing deeper than that. Warframe can maintain its same core melee gameplay, but by changing how blocking works and changing how enemies react to your melee attacks, Warframe's melee combat can be a little deeper, which would help make the gameplay more satisfying and help make melee boss fights more interesting.

Look at the games DE has released and ask that question again with a straight face. DE game design experience outdated experience. I don't want Warframe's usual boss fights with this. I don't want to be able to cheese this. I want something more, something better from Warframe. I'm one of the few that doesn't like Warframe's mobility because I don't like a movement system that's built around essentially drifting in the air. If Warframe had actual parkour, that'd be great. But it doesn't, so this boss fight doesn't do it for me. I'm also tired of hopping from platform to platform avoid big waves of attacks.

I want something more engaging. An actual duel is more engaging, and it could absolutely fit with Warframe. A system like what is in Ghost of Tsushima could absolutely work here. That game and even games like Fallen Order and Assassin's Creed still have combo-based hack and slash, like Warframe does (even if they don't let you choose between different sets of combos - i.e. stances). But they differ in how enemies can engage you and interrupt your attacks. Aka parrying. Block serves a function that's more than just being another combo trigger. Blocking actually blocks enemy melee attacks, opening up timed parries. Ghost of Tsushima, Fallen Order, Assassin's Creed, For Honor, etc. all do this quite well. Warframe doesn't have to be as complex and restrictive as For Honor, but they can do some of what Ghost of Tsushima does. And that would've been a better boss fight than what we got today.

Improvements to the combat?  Sign me up!

Instead I’ve spent two visits to a room where I walk through molasses to find 2/5 trinkets and a blurb about a statue after walking in circles staring at lighting from the game engine for a combined 35 minutes because I dared try to “play” the content instead of going to YouTube.  Shameful waste of my time so far.

An alliance member just commented it took him 45 minutes to find the “shackles”...

Off to YouTube.  Or wherever it shows these objects.

[RazerXPrime]

Hm, I wasn't expecting people to complain about having to use your warframe jumping skills to beat a boss. I mean you use jump, double jump, bullet jump all the time right? right? am I wrong here? Do most people just walk from a to b and wonder how they will ever get across a large hole in the ground? A lot of the games puzzles and such (Lua) require you to be at least not retarded when it comes to platforming. This boss is extremely easy when it comes to platforming. All you need to do is remember he has three moves and how to dodge them. It's really that simple. Granted the first time he instakilled me I was like wtf is this S#&$. But yea the animation is extremely telegraphed and the jumping part is 100% forgiving. You don't eve die falling off a platform. You can keep going!