Am I imagining things, or did DE just nerf Void Sling and Zenurik?

[ShogunGunshow]

1 minute ago, (XBOX)YoungGunn82 said:

Ooooor now here me out. Give us BOTH?! 

 Players can have their “control sling” and other players can have there “omnidirectional dash”.  I mean if they want to make dash less spammable there are other ways they can do that without removing it. 

As disgusted as I am that I am now one of those people, yes.

If they're going to remove everything that made Sling different, then clearly they didn't have an actual design philosophy behind its changes. If that's the case, then yes, sure, both. 

[vanaukas]

2 hours ago, LSG501 said:

New version - slow transference due to stupid cooldown, slower void sling to player 1, press 1, sling to player 2, wait for cooldown, press 1 repeat for player 3 which takes considerably longer than the old version OR they all have to run to your exact spot, which in all honesty is completely stupid for the majority of maps where we're moving forwards towards the next objective/enemy.

I don't understand why people keep srpreading lies. The cooldown on transference only applies when you want to "chain" transference, first transference its always done instantly, there is zero cooldown going out the frame. Cooldown is also 1 sec, as operator you are invulnerable the whole cooldown too. T

here is no cooldown between uses for wellspring, I'm not sure why you are waiting so long between uses... In fact, they fixed a bug where you could recast the first wellspring instead enhancing it with the second one done in place.

I'm also not sure why you ar egiving your teammates energy like that, but welp, to each their own.

 

[(PSN)dday3six]

3 hours ago, (PSN)GEN-Son_17 said:

So, the operator wins by a huge margin then. I don't think many players would go the lengths you did just to be faster. 

Problem for me isn’t the speed of sling it’s self. It’s the transference delay and cooldown as well as not having omnidirectional movement.

[-Vahagn-]

6 hours ago, mrhapps said:

maybe more convenient, but hotfix today didn't improve its casting speed did it? if you want hardened wellspring you have to do 2 slow casts of it while being unable to move... i find that kind of annoying and wondering why it wasn't included in the hotfix today.

Not that I am aware of no, though one cast typically works for me.

5 hours ago, LSG501 said:

Not for me it isn't.... and I doubt it is for other players in the team if they want to use my energy drop.

To be really with you, I have not met anyone who wanted to use my energy drops, since they often have it themselves.

I can still see how its bad for teams but for me specifically I just use it for myself only. Which Is why I felt the the dash was useless as I have nowhere to go, I just want energy. Plus overall I need to press less buttons. Just 5 > 1 > 5 and boom, I am good to go.

[DoomFruit]

8 hours ago, vanaukas said:

I don't understand why people keep srpreading lies. The cooldown on transference only applies when you want to "chain" transference, first transference its always done instantly, there is zero cooldown going out the frame. Cooldown is also 1 sec, as operator you are invulnerable the whole cooldown too.

But there is cooldown going back into the frame. Most of my operator use is: pop out of operator mode, (put down bubble) or (shoot amp alt-fire to smash all crates in the area), pop back into warframe. That last bit has an enforced delay. That's the problem. I'm stuck standing around because the child refuses to get back in its box.

[(PSN)GEN-Son_17]

10 hours ago, Traumtulpe said:

Using the melee weapon as a stat stick is no loss, and Combat Disciplin + Arcane Avenger is the meta - so you'd use one Arcane slot to be faster than the Operator. Not exactly farfetched.

"Is the meta". 

I think the problem lies with that line. 

[(PSN)GEN-Son_17]

13 minutes ago, DoomFruit said:

But there is cooldown going back into the frame. Most of my operator use is: pop out of operator mode, (put down bubble) or (shoot amp alt-fire to smash all crates in the area), pop back into warframe. That last bit has an enforced delay. That's the problem. I'm stuck standing around because the child refuses to get back in its box.

I haven't experienced that at all. Also, the alt fire IS the source of delay.

[Lutesque]

12 hours ago, Traumtulpe said:

Void Dash casts faster now, but in turn it goes half the distance. So it's not faster after all, and just costs 2x as much energy per distance traveled.

Oh so it's not just my imagination.... It is Shorter 👀

12 hours ago, Traumtulpe said:

Also, I haven't used Vazarin and Unairu much, but did Caustic Strike and Void Snare always have such slow travel times, or were they nerfed as well?

As Expected...

Ask DE to fix one thing and they go around changing everything else....

If this was based on Feedback.... I didn't see any of it... 😐

9 hours ago, ShogunGunshow said:

As disgusted as I am that I am now one of those people, yes.

If they're going to remove everything that made Sling different, then clearly they didn't have an actual design philosophy behind its changes. If that's the case, then yes, sure, both. 

Yeah this is exactly why I am upset....

My first reaction to the change was: "Great.... Now I can Barely Control How Far I want to Go. 😐"

I mean.... DE wanted this Void Sling thing to work and I gave my Feedback based on how to make Sling Better not how to make Sling Rip Off Void Dash....

Digital Extremes said they wanted to give us more control and Interdirectionality.... That was their Idea... Not ours....  All I want is for them to just Follow Through with that Goal and I gave my Feedback based on the that....

Can you imagine if the samething happened to Coptering/Bullet Jump ?

7 hours ago, (PSN)dday3six said:

Problem for me isn’t the speed of sling it’s self. It’s the transference delay and cooldown as well as not having omnidirectional movement.

As Far as I can tell.... They only thing that actually has Cooldown/Delay is spamming Transference Itself.....

Every other action from Sling to Abilities to Shooting  can be performed immediately after Popping out of your Frame.... Which leaves Graffiti on the Floor For Reason 🤨

1 hour ago, DoomFruit said:

But there is cooldown going back into the frame.

This is only an Issue if all you want to do is Transfer in and out with Nothing In Between....and this is only an Issue in the First Place because of how the "Return To Warframe" Magus Arcanes are designed.... 

If you fix Magus Elevate to discourage Spam.... Then there's no Need To Spam.... In other words.... The Cool Down won't Matter....

1 hour ago, DoomFruit said:

pop back into warframe. That last bit has an enforced delay.

I've experienced no Delay after Slinging or Shooting.... I have experienced Delay after using an Ability though.... My guess is the delay isn't on the Transference itself.... But on the Recovery Animation of Whatever you were doing before Transference....

 

[SneakyErvin]

11 hours ago, vanaukas said:

I don't understand why people keep srpreading lies. The cooldown on transference only applies when you want to "chain" transference, first transference its always done instantly, there is zero cooldown going out the frame. Cooldown is also 1 sec, as operator you are invulnerable the whole cooldown too. T

here is no cooldown between uses for wellspring, I'm not sure why you are waiting so long between uses... In fact, they fixed a bug where you could recast the first wellspring instead enhancing it with the second one done in place.

I'm also not sure why you ar egiving your teammates energy like that, but welp, to each their own.

 

Because people always exaggerate when they want to scew things their way. It is with everything this patch, from slinging to eximus changes. CC being useless and yaddi-yaddi-yaddi made up stuff regarding other things. I'm still utterly amazed by the whole CC issue that people have regarding eximus units, as if they've never used CC outside of CCing a single target ever.

3 hours ago, DoomFruit said:

But there is cooldown going back into the frame. Most of my operator use is: pop out of operator mode, (put down bubble) or (shoot amp alt-fire to smash all crates in the area), pop back into warframe. That last bit has an enforced delay. That's the problem. I'm stuck standing around because the child refuses to get back in its box.

No you arent if you do the things you claim. I use caustic alot to speed up acolyte, boss kills or when "holy bird" hunting/killing Thrax on the Zariman, there is never a delay getting back in, unless I just spam my transference button.

[vanaukas]

5 hours ago, DoomFruit said:

But there is cooldown going back into the frame. Most of my operator use is: pop out of operator mode, (put down bubble) or (shoot amp alt-fire to smash all crates in the area), pop back into warframe. That last bit has an enforced delay. That's the problem. I'm stuck standing around because the child refuses to get back in its box.

Unless you can pull up all of those inputs without in less than a second then it's impossible to get any cooldown. I even forced the "cooldown" to see what the hell people were complaining and I can only press 3 times (usually 2) the transference button really fast (on keyboard) before I can enter again to the frame.

So, again, unless you are smashing transference button while at the same time shooting or activating an abilitym then there is no way to even notice the cooldown.

1 hour ago, SneakyErvin said:

Because people always exaggerate when they want to scew things their way. It is with everything this patch, from slinging to eximus changes. CC being useless and yaddi-yaddi-yaddi made up stuff regarding other things. I'm still utterly amazed by the whole CC issue that people have regarding eximus units, as if they've never used CC outside of CCing a single target ever.

Then they'll get mad because "DE doesn't listen the community"

[(XBOX)SwiftBMF]

17 hours ago, -Vahagn- said:

How did they nerf Zenurik? I personally find the operator cast to be more coinvent.

Well they removed all of its offensive abilities such as lightening dash which was my entire playstyle.

Zenurik got a huge nerf but seeing as people only ever used it for energy nobody cares about the rest of it.

 

[(PSN)dday3six]

On 2022-05-07 at 5:53 AM, Lutesque said:

As Far as I can tell.... They only thing that actually has Cooldown/Delay is spamming Transference Itself.....

Every other action from Sling to Abilities to Shooting  can be performed immediately after Popping out of your Frame.... Which leaves Graffiti on the Floor For Reason 🤨

Transference takes longer. There is a noticeable pause before inputs register again. Furthermore the cd on re-entering your frame doesn’t actually start until that delay finishes. Even with the slower sling it’s still possible to leave frame, sling, and then hit the cd before being able to re-enter. Not spamming for Elevate just ‘normal’ movement that was available before. For players, such as myself, who incorporated void dashing and even the momentum of transference heavily into how we moved around in game the movement of Warframe feels sluggish. 

The graffiti is for school spirit, btw. 
 

On 2022-05-07 at 9:59 AM, vanaukas said:

Unless you can pull up all of those inputs without in less than a second then it's impossible to get any cooldown. I even forced the "cooldown" to see what the hell people were complaining and I can only press 3 times (usually 2) the transference button really fast (on keyboard) before I can enter again to the frame.

So, again, unless you are smashing transference button while at the same time shooting or activating an abilitym then there is no way to even notice the cooldown.

This is just willful ignorance. 3 inputs a second is on the slow side of what players are capable of. 

[vanaukas]

42 minutes ago, (PSN)dday3six said:

This is just willful ignorance. 3 inputs a second is on the slow side of what players are capable of. 

Ok, prove it.

[(PSN)dday3six]

1 hour ago, vanaukas said:

Ok, prove it.

Surely you’re familiar with the concept of APM (actions per minute) in relationship to gaming? I know that it ruffles your feathers that players are complaining, but try to at least argue in good faith. You have to know that many, many players can input at a faster rate than 3 per second. 

[vanaukas]

10 minutes ago, (PSN)dday3six said:

Surely you’re familiar with the concept of APM (actions per minute) in relationship to gaming? I know that it ruffles your feathers that players are complaining, but try to at least argue in good faith. You have to know that many, many players can input at a faster rate than 3 per second. 

I'm waiting for this being proved in video and I'll believe you:

2 hours ago, (PSN)dday3six said:

Transference takes longer. There is a noticeable pause before inputs register again. Furthermore the cd on re-entering your frame doesn’t actually start until that delay finishes. Even with the slower sling it’s still possible to leave frame, sling, and then hit the cd before being able to re-enter. Not spamming for Elevate just ‘normal’ movement that was available before.

Othewise we have nothing to talk honestly.

[SneakyErvin]

13 minutes ago, (PSN)dday3six said:

Surely you’re familiar with the concept of APM (actions per minute) in relationship to gaming? I know that it ruffles your feathers that players are complaining, but try to at least argue in good faith. You have to know that many, many players can input at a faster rate than 3 per second. 

APM does not bypass hardcoded limitations though, limitations that have been part of amps since their implementation to the game. So doing the things mentioned in the post this is related to, there is no way to run into the CD of transfering back, since the amp itself would have a longer animation window than the CD. And the same goes for Zenurik buffs and Unairu debuffs. Since they are no longer based on dashing, the transfer out-in CD really only matters for Elevate spamming.

edit: If this was the old system, then yes the CD would likely result in hitches when placing buffs or debuffing, but this isnt the old system.

[(PSN)dday3six]

33 minutes ago, vanaukas said:

I'm waiting for this being proved in video and I'll believe you:

Othewise we have nothing to talk honestly.

Make muh vidya is pretty tired bait there bud. 

 

32 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

APM does not bypass hardcoded limitations though, limitations that have been part of amps since their implementation to the game. So doing the things mentioned in the post this is related to, there is no way to run into the CD of transfering back, since the amp itself would have a longer animation window than the CD. And the same goes for Zenurik buffs and Unairu debuffs. Since they are no longer based on dashing, the transfer out-in CD really only matters for Elevate spamming.

edit: If this was the old system, then yes the CD would likely result in hitches when placing buffs or debuffing, but this isnt the old system.

The poster was not presenting software as the limitation, rather physical capabilities of the user. 

Edit: As I understand it the person was going operator to open containers with the alt-fire on there amp then trying to go back to the frame quickly. I’m on PS5 and I can get ‘ability not ready’ trying to quickly go op > alt-fire > frame. Honestly I would just shoot or melee the containers, but yeah if you’re doing that the cd does pause you. 

[vanaukas]

34 minutes ago, (PSN)dday3six said:

Make muh vidya is pretty tired bait there bud. 

Wasn't a bait, maybe you are new here but we actualyl ask for factual evidence instead claims and most of the time those are solved by posting a video. I guess I'll have to do it myself, so you can stop spreading false claims.

[vanaukas]

58 minutes ago, (PSN)dday3six said:

Edit: As I understand it the person was going operator to open containers with the alt-fire on there amp then trying to go back to the frame quickly. I’m on PS5 and I can get ‘ability not ready’ trying to quickly go op > alt-fire > frame. Honestly I would just shoot or melee the containers, but yeah if you’re doing that the cd does pause you. 

 

3 hours ago, (PSN)dday3six said:

Transference takes longer. There is a noticeable pause before inputs register again. Furthermore the cd on re-entering your frame doesn’t actually start until that delay finishes. Even with the slower sling it’s still possible to leave frame, sling, and then hit the cd before being able to re-enter. Not spamming for Elevate just ‘normal’ movement that was available before. For players, such as myself, who incorporated void dashing and even the momentum of transference heavily into how we moved around in game the movement of Warframe feels sluggish. 

 

Oh no! The cooldowns! Oh no! (using Dissic scaffold since it's the "meta" for breaking crates)

(edit: I forgot to dash! I'll do another quick one right now)

Here, testing dash:

 

[(XBOX)Rez090]

On 2022-05-06 at 6:23 PM, Traumtulpe said:

 seeing how I would often slow Thrax enemies not in my field of view,

How can you even be sure enemies were slowed if you aren't even looking at them?

[Traumtulpe]

46 minutes ago, (XBOX)Rez090 said:

How can you even be sure enemies were slowed if you aren't even looking at them?

Because I used Temporal Drag on a Thrax in my field of view who just finished his invulnerability animation (where he becomes a ghost and spins around), killed him in 2 headshots, and turned around to the next Thrax who is marked on my map, only to find him slowed as well. It's not rocket science.

[SneakyErvin]

16 hours ago, Traumtulpe said:

Because I used Temporal Drag on a Thrax in my field of view who just finished his invulnerability animation (where he becomes a ghost and spins around), killed him in 2 headshots, and turned around to the next Thrax who is marked on my map, only to find him slowed as well. It's not rocket science.

What I wonder is how you slow them through their Overguard even?

[(XBOX)TheWayOfWisdom]

2 hours ago, SneakyErvin said:

What I wonder is how you slow them through their Overguard even?

Use it and find out.

[Toran]

Am 7.5.2022 um 03:02 schrieb (XBOX)YoungGunn82:

Ooooor now here me out. Give us BOTH?! 

 Players can have their “control sling” and other players can have there “omnidirectional dash”.  I mean if they want to make dash less spammable there are other ways they can do that without removing it. Why do stubborn with having both? 

I highly support this idea. It quickly would show how utterly lame Voidsling is in comparison and all the sleepwalking Voidsling lovers might start complaining that they can't keep up with those dazzling dashers.

Voiddash was second nature to me and one of the selling points to max out all focus schools. It mostly negated the speed difference between Warframes and added to the frenziful gameplay many love about Warframe. At age 46, I'm an old fart here, but with Voidsling I feel almost geriatric in this game.

Voidsling sucks.

[-Vahagn-]

On 2022-05-07 at 11:12 AM, (XBOX)SwiftBMF said:

Zenurik got a huge nerf but seeing as people only ever used it for energy nobody cares about the rest of it.

Sadly true, I admit I am in this same boat too.