Khora's Planned Changes

[----AncientHunter----]

15 minutes ago, Ijaa-Aden said:

DE already stated that whip was a no go. Whip would be similar to Exalted Blade (Excalibur), Exalted Claws (Valkyr's Hysteria), Exalted Staff (Wukong), Exalted Pistols (Mesa), Exalted Bow (Ivara), Exalted Archwing (Titania). "PLS NO MORE" as you say.

then we need new one more like no spamable for the win as old frames ideas,, something like new ranged skill or ultimate 4th like MESA or even anything than that Strangledome

[ThatBoxNid]

I actually like the jungle gym of doom (Strangledome). I'm not too excited about Venari's change though. As many people already said, at higher level you'll be either getting stripped of an ability or spend every few seconds trying to revive Venari so you don't lose her.

[----AncientHunter----]

that funny we are in khora propaganda i see let the frame delayed again or ditch her at all and make sure give people there plat back for buying that mess`d up abomination ..  the cycle of releasing frames was supposed to be male gender warframe why we are getting anther female frame after Gara (sadly few people uses her ) that will be totaly mess`d up

[Zeyez558]

The changes being made are already good to hear however, I have a couple of personal things just to make Khora more interesting, specifically pertaining to her third ability. It would be fun to see Khora be able to directly possess Venari and have the player romp about as a Kavat, whether this be duration or energy over time. Quick melee could be a slash type attack, while activating third deactivates the direct control. 1 could be the cc chain attack Venari already does, 2 the knockdown disarm ability and 4 the AOE heal. I doubt this will happen but it'd still be fun to see implemented into the game.

[Synpai]

2 minutes ago, Zeyez558 said:

The changes being made are already good to hear however, I have a couple of personal things just to make Khora more interesting, specifically pertaining to her third ability. It would be fun to see Khora be able to directly possess Venari and have the player romp about as a Kavat, whether this be duration or energy over time. Quick melee could be a slash type attack, while activating third deactivates the direct control. 1 could be the cc chain attack Venari already does, 2 the knockdown disarm ability and 4 the AOE heal. I doubt this will happen but it'd still be fun to see implemented into the game.

Thought about this too, but allowing a player to control a pet is a-whole-nother mountain to climb.

[ThatBoxNid]

Oh also. Please let Venari use warframe pallets for colouring. Not having her able to match Khora's colours makes me sad.

[Zeyez558]

Maybe Khora could transform into venari, removing the pet from the map and once finished, spawning them back? Agreed though, it is a whole other ball game. Especially with changing the ability when controlling Venari and such

[Synpai]

12 minutes ago, Zeyez558 said:

Maybe Khora could transform into venari, removing the pet from the map and once finished, spawning them back? Agreed though, it is a whole other ball game. Especially with changing the ability when controlling Venari and such

It's not the body count that's the issue so much as the movemnt and actions in said form. New animation control and the like.

[Yulfan]

Regarding her dome, I propose to completely remove the damage over time but all melee attacks on the chains distribute the damage on all the enemies hooked in, possibly according to a percentages depending on the Ability Strength.

[Azamagon]

On 2018-04-24 at 1:51 AM, [DE]Rebecca said:

 

• Ability casting times have been shortened across the board - Natural Talent is always great, but the base animations needed shortening.

 

• Whipclaw
  • Whipclaw will apply to and benefit from the combo counter.
  • All enemies caught in the Strangledome will take half of Whipclaw’s attack damage when one enemy in the Strangledome is hit with Whipclaw.
  • Hitting an Ensnared enemy with Whipclaw will cause the living metal to propagate.
• Ensnare
  • Ensnare affects multiple enemies. When an enemy is ensnared, the living metal will propagate and pull in every enemy within range. The living metal ensnaring enemies will then propagate a second time to pull in another wave of enemies within range.
  • Procs no longer wake up ensnared enemies.

• Venari
• Venari is now a passive ability - Venari is simply there, no casting required. When she dies, she will be revived when you Revive (*it's very likely you'll have the opportunity to revive Venari like other companions, but in the event you miss that window it'll be gone until you revive)
  • Venari fights independently until she receives a command. Khora’s third ability overrides Venari’s target and changes her battle posture at an energy cost.
  • Kavat mods like Animal Instinct have been fixed so they will work properly on Venari.
  • Venari deals slash damage to enemies instead of impact damage.
• Strangledome
  • Once an enemy dies in the Strangledome, they will drop to the floor, making room for new victims.
  • We have other plans that are too in-progress to share yet - we'll update here with more information as we get it!

 

• Ability casting times sped up - Sounds good
• Whipclaw
  • Combo counter benefit is great
  • Sounds ok, even if it's forced synergy
  • Ensnare+Whipclaw propagation - What if the target dies? Does it counts towards the 2 base propagations, or as an additional one?
  • Sidenote: Wukong's Iron Jab is looking even worse and more boring now...
• Ensnare
  • While it's making the ability more streamlined and similar to Larva, this is still a GREAT change, considering this is a horde shooter
  • Good bugfix
• Venari
  • Passive eh? Interesting. But the new revival mechanic sounds like it's just another companion - not an ability. If we could, on top of what's suggested, revive a killed Venari with energy, I think it would be perfect!
  • Changing posture costs energy? Considering the cycling mechanic this sounds, to be perfectly frank, like a really stupid mechanic. If there is some way to differentiate cycle and casting (like tap/hold), I guess it would be perfectly fine, otherwise it indeed sounds really bad.
  • Mod fixing sounds good.
  • Slash damage is nice, as long as it can proc status at a decent rate too
  • Extra thoughts: The different postures still seem rather ... underwhelming, to be honest. I'd suggest these buffs/changes:
    • Offensive - Venari now adds to and benefits from the melee combo counter (wonderful natural synergy with Whipclaw)
    • Defensive - Oneway lifelink between Khora and Venari -> Any damage Khora suffers is now heavily distributed towards Venari instead (allows her to go into the fray and to be a bit more tanky). However, if Venari suffers damage, it suffers full damage. To aid with this "tankyness" ability, the Defensive posture could also grant some decent amount of armor to Venari.
    • Healing - Change the heal into a healing aura, which heals any ally inside its radius (Khora and Venari itself, included ofc)
• Strangledome
  • This is lovely! Would love to see this in other abilities too (such as Zephyr's Tornado), as you can't quickly see the difference between a dead enemy and a ragdolled enemy.
  • Eager to hear these additional changes!

 

Overall, very good changes. Can't wait to see them come to fruition :)

[DeepskyScorpion]

A step in the right direction. These changes could make her viable, but only in terms of the nubmers she can pop out. The next step could be to make her 4 an exalted whip and make the either the charged attack or the slide attack perform a nerfed version of the current strangledome, similar to how Excalibur's Exalted blade slide attack performs a tiny radiant blind. Her 3 can be totally replaced by the full size strangledome or leave as is but give the kitty a buff of some sort. Then her abilities would be worth it to wait for the cast times that feels like a few decades.

Edit: didn't know the problem of kitty dying since I rarely use a pet. Maybe makeing her HP link with Khora herself would be a better way to implement this. Just to make sure non of them die without another. Also, holding it should allow Khora to un-summon the kitty cat so that it wouldn't just be a moving target in high level content. Her AI will need to know about shields and protection spell from other warframes, say volt, and she need to know to hide on the same side as her master. Also, how the kitty would interact with buff from another source, say Ash's smoke screen, or Octavia's 3, would be interesting. Would love to see those buff applied striaght to the kitty if they are applied to Khora, but I am sure you will work something out.

[ThatBoxNid]

Linked HP would be a horrible idea. Pets like to stand there and get nuked. I don't want to suddenly drop dead for no reason.

[Zjemcim]

Venari will die a lot, other kavats have some sort of survivality, like deflecting damage or invisibility. So if i go on higher levels, i will have to revive Venari every 4 seconds. I don't have idea how to fix that, maybe Venari needs a passive, or mods. Personally, I think Venari should be stronger than normal kavats. Sorry for my english.

[purrieTheBrightStar]

On 4/24/2018 at 1:51 AM, [DE]Rebecca said:

Venari is now a passive ability - Venari is simply there, no casting required. When she dies, she will be revived when you Revive (*it's very likely you'll have the opportunity to revive Venari like other companions, but in the event you miss that window it'll be gone until you revive)

When Venari dies, Khora loses 1/4th of her toolkit, leaving her with only 3 abilities. And since Kavat AI can be more than wonky at times and lots of enemies have ability to one shot or otherwise quickly kill Kavats on higher levels, I imagine it would happen often, especially in thick of combat where it is too chaotic to find your pet in time. I don't think any other warframe loses their abilities during the game at any point too so that would be a major disadvantage.

Though, I find the idea amusing since the only way to get her back would be to jump in front of enemy fire. I already see myself jumping in front of a bombard missile because my kitty died. Kind of like an adventure into Hades to get her back, except instead of the adventure you jump into a group of enemies and wait for them to kill you. 

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

Why have WhipClaw scale of the combo counter? It’s not Atlas Landslide where you’re actively moving from target to target, dealing damage. It feels like you have to play Khora Melee only just to make WhipClaw good with this Change.

Also, why remove the ability to resummon Venari? Why make her like every other Kavat that dies and needs to be revived? Why intentionally make it possible to have one of your abilities killed and the only way to get it back is by dying yourself? WHY!?

[Regulator-Zero]

I still say Venari as he was at launch was fine.  I guess I don't understand the idea to make him like every other pet.  For example the regular pets each have their own special skills.  Venari can be resummoned, that is his special ability.    It makes him more versatile.  Even for solo.  Want to be stealthy, no Venari.  Oops messed up and need some help?  Summon Venari.  

I know I mentioned a blade storm like attack for him, but how about instead a free revive from him.

Honestly he doesn't need anything more, it is the rest of Khora's abilities that needs help.

[(PSN)thebatmantyler]

Or u can case Venari to revive her if she is dead it will cost 100 - 150 energy that is just my idea but I it’s been that  using your own revive to get Venari back

[SSI_Seraph]

il y a 33 minutes, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 a dit :

Why have WhipClaw scale of the combo counter? It’s not Atlas Landslide where you’re actively moving from target to target, dealing damage. It feels like you have to play Khora Melee only just to make WhipClaw good with this Change.

Also, why remove the ability to resummon Venari? Why make her like every other Kavat that dies and needs to be revived? Why intentionally make it possible to have one of your abilities killed and the only way to get it back is by dying yourself? WHY!?

whipClaw also bulds up the combo counter, you don't need to melee

il y a 6 minutes, (PS4)thebatmantyler a dit :

Or u can case Venari to revive her if she is dead it will cost 100 - 150 energy that is just my idea but I it’s been that  using your own revive to get Venari back

Afterplaying with Venari a lot, trust me she isn't worth 100-150 since she drops in no time past level 50 (even squishier than a normal kavat)

If they put absurd restrictions on her rez, people are just gonna let her die since tbh her modes are not that useful.

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

3 minutes ago, SSI_Seraph said:

whipClaw also bulds up the combo counter, you don't need to melee

You kind of have to. Like I said and will now repeat. IT IS NOT ATLAS’S LANDSLIDE. WhipClaw leaves you stationary. You’re not moving around while casting it meaning you’re limiting. The damage output if you are solely relying on it for the combo counter

[00OF00]

My 2 cents here -

Replace strangledome with something else. My suggestion would be fusing her with venari, and plays something like bladewolf (from MGR) and while it is active her 3 changes a bit.

Or maybe comebine this and strangledome (???)

[EnbyAshy]

I don't feel that Venari should be permanently dead if you fail to revive her, that feels like it would ruin Khora's entire kit and be too grave a punishment (being that Venari is Khora's survivability, a source of damage as well as armor from her passive, it's too much to lose all at once).

For starters, you are basically forcing players to go out of their way to rescue a pet that is likely buried deep in an enemy wave. At high levels this isn't very feasible, neither is making a player play with only three abilities because they failed to properly rescue their pet. People would waste revives at this stage just to get Venari back and likely lose her again because Venari is not super tanky at high levels.

One way that this can be combated is if Venari was to die, she would go on a medium length cooldown (3-5 minutes or so) then would revive automatically.

Another would be to have Venari be revived if a sufficient number of enemy deaths were to occur near her, similar to Inaros' passive.
 

[(XBOX)Evilpricetag]

On ‎4‎/‎23‎/‎2018 at 4:57 PM, Diarmut said:

I felt this exactly when I saw these changes, how can Wukong go unchanged when this ability will scale superbly now. RIP Monkey King, your form in Smite fares far better.

Son Goku's rework will be legendary.

[(XBOX)Evilpricetag]

54 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:

You kind of have to. Like I said and will now repeat. IT IS NOT ATLAS’S LANDSLIDE. WhipClaw leaves you stationary. You’re not moving around while casting it meaning you’re limiting. The damage output if you are solely relying on it for the combo counter

Its going to cost energy, remind me why we dont channel

[Cerryn]

Sounds pretty good, except for the Venari. First, if you want to make the posture switching costs energy, don't make us spend twice more energy to switch from Attack to Heal (for exemple). And secondly, allow us to get the Venari back if it dies.

 

Suggestions :

- For the posture switching : Add a timer a 2 seconds that starts after the player presses 3. The player can press the 3 as much as he wants without energy cost to choose a posture. When the timer is over, if the player has enough energy, the postuge switching takes effect and the energy is taken.

- To get a dead Venari back : Casting 3rd ability will get the Venari back but it will be dangerous or expensive. It could be something like Inaros Scarab armor : Khora stay immobile when her energy or health is drained. The more energy/health you sacrifice, the more health the Venari will have when it comes back.

 

Sorry for bad english

[PsiWarp]

1 hour ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:

You kind of have to. Like I said and will now repeat. IT IS NOT ATLAS’S LANDSLIDE. WhipClaw leaves you stationary. You’re not moving around while casting it meaning you’re limiting. The damage output if you are solely relying on it for the combo counter

Actually Whipclaw is an upper-body animation, so you can move, jump, bullet jump, etc during it. Also the impact point is locked at the location you aimed at when you activate the ability (press 1 on PC), so you can even move away and look away in the other direction, and Whipclaw will still land at that spot.

Since they made casting animations faster, I am hoping they also made the whip land faster. ATM, Natural Talent doesn't speed up how fast the whip actually lands, so Whipclaw feels clunky to use. With damage benefiting from and adding hits to the combo counter, a Body Count or Drifting Contact (I prefer this one since Whipclaw has status chance) makes Whipclaw able to scale much better.