[PC] C̶̹̃h̴̊̍̐͜i̶͓̩͛̽m̸̨̈́͘e̴̤̒ŕ̸͉͋̕å̸̙̭͕: Update 23.10 - Arbitrations: Lethal Alerts Feedback Megathread

[WhimsicalPacifist]

16 hours ago, ScPhantom said:

Just tried my first arbitration with excalibur. The new drones were immune to exalted blade which made it very annoying to play (or is it only immune to elemental dmg since i use chromatic blade?)

EDIT: Just found out they are supposed to be immune to warframe abilities, i guess exalted blade excalibur is out of the question for this game mode then

Well at least Excalibur has some modicum of survivability stats outside of using Exalted Blade.  Titania on the other hand has been balanced around having Razorwing and CC... and the drones are immune to her Razorwing weapons and the drones eliminate her CC.

[MistressMoonpaw]

The "rewards" are an insulting joke. Way too much endo and ayatan statues. Who the hell even needs those? Certainly no one who seriously does these arbitration missions. Takes way too damn long too. Just did a def on Urass Uranus, of course, and took 40 minutes to reach 20, and all that mundane crap for a crap statue and 1600 endo. Woopidity damn doo. That was certainly worth my time, NOT

[atejas]

Has anyone else noticed that the str/damage/range bonuses for weapons and frames don't appear to apply to primes or other variants? I....really hope that's unintended.

[A-Midnight-Shanking]

• The start of the arbitration's always feel slow with the reduced enemy spawns.
• The arbitration drones are too close to the ground. Spin2Win Atterax can still take them out with a slide attack, effectively making them pointless.

[mikakor]

1 hour ago, MistressMoonpaw said:

The "rewards" are an insulting joke. Way too much endo and ayatan statues. Who the hell even needs those? Certainly no one who seriously does these arbitration missions. Takes way too damn long too. Just did a def on Urass Uranus, of course, and took 40 minutes to reach 20, and all that mundane crap for a crap statue and 1600 endo. Woopidity damn doo. That was certainly worth my time, NOT

i do take these missions seriously, and i STILL Need endo, so NO, these rewards are not an insulting joke, thanks.

[Palizar]

• First day of update great gameplay, only high MR players who already had unlocked all nodes.
• Today just started seeing MR 17 player with MR 0 banshee and weapons on it....whats the point in alowing warframes and weapons with MR 0? People join to get rewards or for a challenge, others join to be leveled faster. Hope DE puts a MR 30 requirement on frames and weapons.
• Defence missions take to long....way to long.

Edited October 13, 2018 by Palizar

[Leqesai]

11 minutes ago, Palizar said:

• First day of update great gameplay, only high MR players who already had unlocked all nodes.
• Today just started seeing MR 17 player with MR 0 banshee and weapons on it....whats the point in alowing warframes and weapons with MR 0? People join the get rewards or for a challenge, others join to be leveled faster. Hope DE puts a MR 30 requirement on frames and weapons.
• Defence missions take to long....way to long.

How was a mastery rank 0 in an arbitration? You have to clear star chart and have a level 30 frame. During their clearing of the star chart they never thought to do a mastery rank test?

Isn't there mastery rank requirement for some quests?

[atejas]

24 minutes ago, Palizar said:

Defence missions take to long....way to long.

This is mostly because of pathfinding issues that have been around for years. DE needs to either fix them, reduce the round counter for defense, or set defense arbitrations in smaller maps like Hydron. Taking more than 30 minutes to do one ABC rotation is unacceptable.

[Sasparillatango]

Defense missions move too slowly.  Were looking at 14m for 10 waves on one of the grineer asteroid mining tilesets (ceres?) and 22m(!) for 10 waves on Europa.  Can we get higher density earlier in these missions to move through them faster? 

 

Survival seems fine?  someone pretty much needs to bring a Nekros, but I think that's fine, these are supposed to be more tuned for 'meta' play imo.

 

Excavation seems reasonable?  I only got a chance to play one map of Excavation yesterday, no one ese in squad was really playing to the  meta, we got to C then started losing excavators left and right and bailed.

 

Assuming ~10m to A rotation, rewards seem too high by probably a 10-20%.  5m on mot gives you 25% chance or 400 endo, so like 100 endo (or 2m on heiracon for 100 endo)  the A rotation giving 1300 endo is crazy good, Rathuum can give as much as 50-500 for 90s of work so, there are ways to abuse the system and get good endo, so its nice to have something that is more interesting, but even so they seem high.

Edited October 13, 2018 by Sasparillatango

[Sasparillatango]

1 hour ago, MistressMoonpaw said:

The "rewards" are an insulting joke. Way too much endo and ayatan statues. Who the hell even needs those? Certainly no one who seriously does these arbitration missions. Takes way too damn long too. Just did a def on Urass Uranus, of course, and took 40 minutes to reach 20, and all that mundane crap for a crap statue and 1600 endo. Woopidity damn doo. That was certainly worth my time, NOT

The defense takes too long true, but if we look at something like survival for about where the time should be (~10m per rotation) and we look at the amount of endo you get.  It is objectively more generous compared to other modes of farming endo.

[Renzo]

Defense mode in arbitrations is way too long. I just exited a 25min 10 wave defense on an ice planet. Considering already too long 10min survivals would have rewarded me with two things in this same time, I have to say I will pass all the defense from now on just because of the time it takes to finish those 10 waves. Yeah and about those survivals, they should be shorter as well.

Edited October 13, 2018 by runx0

[Synpai]

Also, if Rivens haven't taught us enough, % increases (on weapons) are a non factor. +1000% on the furis is still under-performing vs +300% on already decent weapons.

[Clemchower]

I have to say that i am not a big fan of this new alert. Too long mission time to finish which makes really hard to keep up with public squad. People either gets tired and only wants to do A cycle or i get tired first from slow repetitive mission. I would rather have half length mission with stronger enemies.
I think it is not aligned with the decision made last time when DE decided to reduce reward cycle from 10 rounds or 10 minutes etc.. to a half (5 rounds or 5 minutes).
I wish future events are not necessarily bound to long length of mission finish time if it is repetitive missions such as survival, defense etc..

 

[Namastyler]

Feedback about Arbitrations.

What do you like?

• A different warframe\weapon bonus each mission

What do you dislike?

• the extremely slow flow of enemies (I see the Onslaught rate better suited for this mode);
• the lack of worthy rewards, in quantity and quality;
• "Rewards are earned at double-the-usual interval" it's bad in Onslaught, here it's even worse (which being not worth the risk\time makes me wonder why I'm playing it);
• secondary rewards locked behind vidus essence are not worth the effort;
• the "shoot the flying thing first or they are invulnerable even to being stuck inside a wall" mechanics;
• the cheap feeling I got after I compared this mode to Onslaught (there is no actual reason for Arbitrations to be there in the first place);
• lack of bleedout on the ground (why taking that away in the first place? I get the "one live" thing but bleedout should stay there);
• a random lucky hit can one-shot me without even knowing from who (at least tell me who was like in the Index and with how much damage);
• while protecting someone risking to die any second I should be able to tell the target to stay in a place or not;
• let me choose if I want endo or kuva or any low-end reward at least;
• mostly boring, feels like a cheap ripoff of a normal mission.

What is the issue?

• I totally get the concept "here, have something to chew on" while waiting for Fortuna, but it doesn't taste good and I already chewed something really similar until now, so now I'm bored already with something new which is not amusing or interesting, lore side and play side;
• lack of mission variety;
• there are no sentients waves\missions.

How would you fix/improve it?

• I don't know honestly, I don't like this new mechanics. I would just throw away the immortality thing linked to enemies, transforming it in "they received the blessing but are now enraged by it, so they'll be faster, stronger and hit harder until you destroy the flying thing";
• Sure thing is, I would delete the "rewards earned at double interval" taking the reward from 100% every 10 to 60% every 5, this way every 10 we would get a 20% more from before, still far away from farming endo, but at least it's better suited to the "you can die right now" mechanics;
• Being able to select which faction I want to fight would be cool;
• If by design I have to stay in mission for 30-40m for a defense, I don't see why I should be ok to go right into it waiting 20-30m. Let me go out first, then I'll do stuff before going back to it.

After aving said all that, thanks for the bone to chew on, but I don't like the taste very much.




 

[Tyreaus]

Not sure if already suggested but maybe we could have 3 arbitrations running per hour, for those who might not need Endo? One with the Endo rewards table, one with void relics table, and one with a rare resources table (nitain, mutagens, detonite, fieldron, argon - those sorts of things). Just a thought!

[Cubewano]

3 hours ago, Solarsyphon said:

Short answer is I wasn't thinking an invis nullifier  but just an enemy that can see invis. Something like the orbital strike drones from the vay hek fight except they would see invisible warframes. 

And how does that factor into all the other survivability skills other frames have? Will there be a unit that can ignore dr skills? Units that can fire through bubbles/walls? Iron Skin negation units? How is the bonus for all other frames handled so everyone still remains on equal terms? 

[Renzo]

Another complaint incoming. I just finished a LUA survival mission in public, where the enemy spawnrate was actually worse than what it is when doing solo survival missions. Not that much of a fun running around trying to find enemies just to find 1 or 2 after searching 10-15 seconds...

[Gabbynaru]

...Okay, here's my feedback for Arbies:

1. I'm fine with Arbies being one mission type per hour, what I truly despise is the fact that I had to wait a whole bloody day to see my first survival mission. I don't like defense, and I saw them pop up 3 times consecutively. My suggestion is to have all mission types available, but if you pick and finish one, you can't pick any of the other until the next refresh. It's incredibly annoying to not only wait, praying to RNG for a mission is downright insulting. Heck you can't even plan to do a mission at a certain time cause you don't know if that mission will even pop up. So, this stupid limitation really has to go.

2. The game mode is not NOT rewarding at all. And, no, I'm not talking about the drop tables. I'm fine with those. At least I'm not getting sh***y rivens or, clem forbid, focus lenses. I'm fine with endo, and statues, I need that. What I'm not fine with is waiting 10 minutes for a single bloody mod or a meager amount of endo. It's a waste of time. Suggestion: Halve the rewards/drop rates, put them every 5 minutes, make the rotations AABBCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCC~

3. Fix the solo spawns! Seriously, a level 60+ mission shouldn't have spawns equal to a level 5 mission.

4. One shot kills are bullS#&$ and cheap. We knew that. We knew the game had that problem. This mode exemplifies that at its worst. Suggestion: Shield gate with a ~1 sec invulnerability after the shield's been instadrained.

5. Why is it that only the boring endless missions get this mode? Where's my spy, my exterminations, my captures? You know, the fun modes?

6. The new drones being unaffected by powers is kinda bullS#&$. What's the point of playing Warframe then when the fun part of the game, the powers, might well not be there? I might as well go play Call of Duty, it's basically the same game at that point.

[EinheriarJudith]

DE you made the lethal alerts so much fun to play. why did you fall short with onslaught? id like to see the ice planet maps removed, spawn has not been fixed on it. was playing defense and had ice planet and it took longer to reach wave 10 because of broken spawn then it did on ceres or uranus defense. please fix the spawn.

Edited October 13, 2018 by EinheriarJudith

[EinheriarJudith]

40 minutes ago, Tyreaus said:

Not sure if already suggested but maybe we could have 3 arbitrations running per hour, for those who might not need Endo? One with the Endo rewards table, one with void relics table, and one with a rare resources table (nitain, mutagens, detonite, fieldron, argon - those sorts of things). Just a thought!

no thanks. the rewards for lethal alerts are quite fine.endo is one of the few resources that cannot be boosted by a resource booster as far as i know. but i will agree they need to actually put up 1 of each endless mode.

Edited October 13, 2018 by EinheriarJudith

[EinheriarJudith]

1 hour ago, atejas said:

This is mostly because of pathfinding issues that have been around for years. DE needs to either fix them, reduce the round counter for defense, or set defense arbitrations in smaller maps like Hydron. Taking more than 30 minutes to do one ABC rotation is unacceptable.

my god this! hydron, corpus ship, eris (as seen on akkad),

[Messkoo]

My feedback :

- too much (and only) endo rewards (endo and ayatan). There is no point of doing it when i will have all mods. It's mission like that we want for a better way of farming kuva.

- No Bleed out, it's a good and bad things. It needs to have a tankiest build if you don't want to camp, but reduce team interaction. and for me team play is more interesting. Replace revive by bleedout state ? (4 revive = 4 time we can be save by our allies)

- Def are still boring and take too much time to have rewards.

 

[EinheriarJudith]

1 minute ago, Messkoo said:

My feedback :

- too much (and only) endo rewards (endo and ayatan). There is no point of doing it when i will have all mods. It's mission like that we want for a better way of farming kuva.

- No Bleed out, it's a good and bad things. It needs to have a tankiest build if you don't want to camp, but reduce team interaction. and for me team play is more interesting. Replace revive by bleedout state ? (4 revive = 4 time we can be save by our allies)

- Def are still boring and take too much time to have rewards.

 

the point is to have a higher start point to do endless. i dont know about you but i loath playing low lvl missions and waiting for them to ramp up. my gear is at the point where starting at 60 is a breath of fresh air. i like many others have loads of primed mods to max out so easy endo is a plus.

missions have been needing to be failable for a long time. one life to live is a good change.

agreed on the defense part.

[MartinVole]

The slower reward interval coupled with getting mostly endo/ayatans seems more a punishment than rewarding, especially to veterans, which I assume this is aimed at. NPC defense is more a mess than a fun challenge, given the NPC will just run wherever and behave in an erratic manner. As it stands it feels more like a "time grind" than a "fun time" since it quickly feels... sluggish, rather than intense. If that makes sense. I'd gladly nerf the endo rewards for more intense enemy rate and reward rate. Or, well, pad the time with something interesting, like minibosses, that have a chance to drop the mods.

[ArkThanatos]

Elite alerts... 
ok so the Idea is kinda cool. i like the Game mod mostly. 1 life thats it, very cool..

now im sure some people are NOT going to be happy with what i have to say here.
i do love this game. i want to see things improve. somethings in this game are buggy, alot of things need updates. 
the AI on these new drones is terrible, im Not a fan of the mechanics.
 

they get stuck in ceilings, or low hanging air.. they will randomly dart about making them a pain in the $&*^ to shoot.
they can group up an overlap protect things. when they do this an get stuck. its GG you cant hit them because there are 20 mobs in a corpus hallway, stuck. with 4 drones above them...stuck. 5 offsprays as well, a nully and Techs galory and your Life or Lifesupport run out.

these drones are pretty damn trash.

personally i think they should have a Max of 5 mobs protected at one time. that way if the continue to get stuck you can thin out the heard a bit, this reduces the mobs being stuck so much. 
make them a little more visible (not everyone here has 20-20 eye sight), and for god sake Please fix offsprays\drone getting stuck on low hanging objects. 

the fact these guys are Ancients and nullifers stuck in 1/2 size attack drone thats stuck in a roof that causes the mobs to get stuck... not cool. this is really a BAD executions on a decent idea.
the max these guys should be able to do is 5 mobs Each. they get stuck you can thin out the herd. 

we already have absolutely cucked life support...you can't get life support once these guys either somehow end up hip height in the crowd, hide behind 7 offsprays. have 3 of their buddies show up, or again... get stuck in the roof.

fix AI. reduce how many mobs can be protected, improve visability.... when everything is red an there are so many shield charge lines about with shield offsprays and these guys and a nullifier you aren't going to see it... specially when it drops into the crowd. 

its a good idea that was poorly executed