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Garuda is weak or is just me?


Azrra
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I feel like Garuda is weak talking about resistance, she is a long run frame but she can't stand high level enemies like other frames, her 1 push you to jump mid fight but you are probably going to die, the shield is not that good, it only blocks the front damage and if you are jumping mid fight you are probably ending between enemies.
I think a good buff would be giving her a 360º shield, what do you guys think? 
it feels so bad using her 1 and go melee to die, it's better to just jump, get it and go back, her 2 don't heal enough to maintain you alive 😕
Also I find her 4 too slow but it can be fixed with natural talent.

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Tis a good day to see someone complain about a thing being underpowered while someone else complains it's over powered just minutes apart.

Playstyle, mob type, general situation awareness and understanding, secondary supplements, there's a lot of factors into what makes someone feel or actually be overpowered vs. not.

Right now Garuda hasn't been out for like, what, a week? People who aren't buying her couldn't of possible built her between the reputation reqs and build times? Let's give the community some time to figure out some good builds, other frame synergies, weapon synergies and the like and then we can start worrying about the nerf hammer, buff bat and the Tweak Tweezers.

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Garuda is far from weak, but I think most can concede to the notion that her one ability is a bit poorly thought-out though and can lead people to putting her in situations she isn't best tailored for. Her primary defensive tool that really only functions well from a distance forcing you into melee range upon activation is certainly an awkward design choice. 

You have to be very mindful of when you use her lunge, and otherwise keep mobile until a good opportunity to recast it comes up, try not to blindly fling yourself at any clump of enemies you see however because that's just a death trap waiting to be cast. 

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She doesn't live up to her full damage dealing potential of discount Saryn with heals. Her 1 is not that reliable for consistent damage, since it requires quite the buildup and also drains energy unlike anything else in the game. Her 2 with some strength and range is godly, 3 is meh, 4 is the best damage buff you could ask for, coupled with a stun and a minor bleed. She is technically a caster/support pure and simple and a good one.

Having said that, you'd think that an inbuilt melee weapon and strong comparisons to Valkyr would ring some bells to people, but I'm amazed by the lack of common sense that's been going around on the forums, with people claiming she's a glass cannon or synonyms.

What about a more melee oriented build?

With Steel Charge, Power Drift, Adaptation, Gladiator Resolve, Gladiator Aegis, Flow, Umbral modsand Hunter Adrenaline, mine has over 1k armor, 1200 hp and 180% Strenght and infinite energy, along with Guardian and Grace and a Kavaat with Hunter Recovery and Pack leader it's pure and simple overkill on the tanking department, I had forgotten her 2 even exists. It's a glorious kangaroo build in which you spam 1 and melee.

Her 1 perfectly suits that playstyle, 100% of the time your targets can't damage you and should you feel like it you have a nuke if you charge it. Her 2 is used once per mission tops or to help allies, her 3 if I feel like I want more damage and her 4 on enemies who would live longer than 3 seconds vs the hybrid build CO+BR talons (almost none) or you have a map wide nuker in the team, which you want to enable.

With this build she keeps roughly 50% of her support potential, but she's a Valkyr with better mobility and an occasional nuke.

 

Edited by Ver1dian
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Yes she is weak. Her 4 is the only reason to use her over other frames, but it casts slow and requires additional follow-up damage. Other frames would've killed the enemies way before that happens. If her 4 casts much faster than it does now, then she might be decent. 

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vor 6 Stunden schrieb LarryYourWaiter:

Ha!  The thread below yours is claiming she’s game-breakingly overpowered! 

She is not game-breaking overpowered.
For standard content including Sorties and Elite Onslaught 1-8 other Warframes are faster and more efficient.

 

vor 4 Minuten schrieb 420-chan:

Yes she is weak. Her 4 is the only reason to use her over other frames, but it casts slow and requires additional follow-up damage. Other frames would've killed the enemies way before that happens. If her 4 casts much faster than it does now, then she might be decent. 

I wouldn't call her weak, exactly. She's an excellent point defense support with a mix of very strong offense/defense skills. I agree, that the charge on 4 has to go though. The skill is limited enough already with the 180° attack cone and the fixed max range (range mods don't work with it).

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She is weak because the synergy between her abilities is all over the place. She places herself in so much danger but her 1 and 2  and her 4 charging time forces you to use a camping playstyle but her skills are not even efficient at doing that. What she needs is Blood armor which would give you damage reduction while retaining the damage absorption of her shield that will help her to jump from one enemy to another and deploy some altars to help her team without Being one shotted in the air. Her 4 needs faster charging time so you don't need to be glued to one spot just  for a debuffing ability. And make her 3 scale with power duration or power strenght because as it is right now it makes completely no sense that it scales with efficiency.

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she isnt weak, shes just clunky and, imo, unfinished. 

People say that her 4 - 1 combo is broken and overpowered, but they only say that because they instakilled a lvl 160 corrupted bombard in the simulacrum. In practice actually pulling off that combo takes forever. Like congrats you can nuke a small room, but it took you 30 seconds of charging your blood ball then another 3 seconds of standing still making you super vulnerable, and then you nuke a small room.

the only ability's that actually do anything in actual game play is her 2 and 3.

If they want to make her super usable and useful in regular game play they need to make her shield scale with range so it wraps around her more, make charging her blood ball faster so it doesn't take 300 years to get good damage using only her 1, her blood alter needs a range buff, even if it means less hp/s, and her ult needs to charge faster so you don't sit there like a sitting duck until its done charging, and her ult needs to start at a energy cost of 50 and then grow to 100 energy the more you charge it, that way you don't feel like you're wasting energy if you don't charge the ability all the way.

 

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10 minutes ago, Toran said:

She is not game-breaking overpowered.
For standard content including Sorties and Elite Onslaught 1-8 other Warframes are faster and more efficient.

 

I wouldn't call her weak, exactly. She's an excellent point defense support with a mix of very strong offense/defense skills. I agree, that the charge on 4 has to go though. The skill is limited enough already with the 180° attack cone and the fixed max range (range mods don't work with it).

I don't believe in the "support" thing since everyone should already have Magus Elevate or something else that heals to sustain themselves. Abilities that do nothing other than healing are completely redundant in Warframe. I would compare Garuda's 2 to Trinity's 1 since both make the enemies unkillable/tougher and provide nothing other than healing. At least you can still kill Trinity's heal pylons, but Garuda's are invincible and just stay there to interfere with mob spawns and defense waves until Garuda remembers to deactivate it. 

To me Garuda is basically a budget Rhino. Her 4 serves as a team damage buff like Rhino Roar, but it's slow and inconsistent. Her 3 is a way to activate her passive to buff her damage, like Rhino Roar but weaker. Her 1 is basically a budget Iron Skin that offers some survivability, but not nearly as reliable as Iron Skin. If Garuda wants to have good uptime of her 4 debuff on all enemies, she needs to be spamming 4 and doing little else. But why not just play Rhino and Roar and be done with it then? The only thing Garuda has that Rhino doesn't is... a 6 meter range heal pylon? Garuda's 4 does have good synergy with Equinox Maim though, I'll give her that. 

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2 hours ago, Ver1dian said:

With Steel Charge, Power Drift, Adaptation, Gladiator Resolve, Gladiator Aegis, Flow, Umbral modsand Hunter Adrenaline, mine has over 1k armor, 1200 hp and 180% Strenght and infinite energy, along with Guardian and Grace and a Kavaat with Hunter Recovery and Pack leader it's pure and simple overkill on the tanking department, I had forgotten her 2 even exists. It's a glorious kangaroo build in which you spam 1 and melee.

First of all steel charge is a terrible aura mod are you only use it for extra points?

Second dont take this as an offense but your build can make pretty much all frames durable. I can apply this set to my mag and call her a melee frame too.

Garuda has a weaker but aimable variant of volts shield, a decent healing ability what was not designed for a melee frame, literal suicide and finally a damage support skill what is slow to cast even with natural talent.

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1 hour ago, 420-chan said:

I would compare Garuda's 2 to Trinity's 1 since both make the enemies unkillable/tougher and provide nothing other than healing. At least you can still kill Trinity's heal pylons, but Garuda's are invincible and just stay there to interfere with mob spawns and defense waves until Garuda remembers to deactivate it. 

Enemies take full damage while in Garuda's 2 once it goes down, still requires the timer to run out/her to remove it, but you can make them die as soon as that happens.

1 hour ago, 420-chan said:

I don't believe in the "support" thing since everyone should already have Magus Elevate or something else that heals to sustain themselves. Abilities that do nothing other than healing are completely redundant in Warframe.

I don't think this is fair. I don't use Life Strike and I don't rely on my Charger for health on Garuda because she can heal, therefore I have an open mod slot in my melee or pet. A frame doing something that something else can do means that you don't need that something else. You have room for a different arcane/mod, or you don't have to waste a pizza, etc. 

Look at the Dread, it's a silent bow. That doesn't make the mod that silences your weapon redundant, you can use it on different weapons. The mod doesn't make the Dread redundant, you have an open slot to use for something other than that mod.

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Garuda is what she was built to be - a very high risk Glass Cannon style character that relies on extreme DPS and a team built around her to keep her alive. If not, she runs a very high risk of getting killed.

Not everything has to be easy to play, even if it is nice if that's the case.

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48 minutes ago, Fallen_Echo said:

First of all steel charge is a terrible aura mod are you only use it for extra points?

Second dont take this as an offense but your build can make pretty much all frames durable. I can apply this set to my mag and call her a melee frame too.

Garuda has a weaker but aimable variant of volts shield, a decent healing ability what was not designed for a melee frame, literal suicide and finally a damage support skill what is slow to cast even with natural talent.

I was going to get into detail, but I realised you and a lot of people just lack imagination and view her as only a caster. She has a wow's death knight feel, half caster half melee, better at what you decide.

If this build outlasts and outdamages mr26 umbras/rhinos..etc. then I cant say she's lacking.

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1 hour ago, CoolDudeMcCool said:

Enemies take full damage while in Garuda's 2 once it goes down, still requires the timer to run out/her to remove it, but you can make them die as soon as that happens.

I don't think this is fair. I don't use Life Strike and I don't rely on my Charger for health on Garuda because she can heal, therefore I have an open mod slot in my melee or pet. A frame doing something that something else can do means that you don't need that something else. You have room for a different arcane/mod, or you don't have to waste a pizza, etc. 

Look at the Dread, it's a silent bow. That doesn't make the mod that silences your weapon redundant, you can use it on different weapons. The mod doesn't make the Dread redundant, you have an open slot to use for something other than that mod.

Like I said, Magus Elevate. It doesn't take any precious slots; it's simply a heal on demand ability for every single frame after you get it. There's no reason why anyone shouldn't have that, unless they simply can't get it. I guess Garuda's 2 isnt absolutely useless if you want to help newbies along? At least Oberon Trinity or Harrow doesn't require you you to be inside a bloody 6m radius circle to heal you. 

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1 hour ago, 420-chan said:

Like I said, Magus Elevate. It doesn't take any precious slots; it's simply a heal on demand ability for every single frame after you get it. There's no reason why anyone shouldn't have that, unless they simply can't get it. I guess Garuda's 2 isnt absolutely useless if you want to help newbies along? At least Oberon Trinity or Harrow doesn't require you you to be inside a bloody 6m radius circle to heal you. 

I don't have it, don't feel like getting it, and even if I did have it, I would be able to replace it with something else.

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Pretty much third weakest warframe ingame,yes can kill 140 lvl heavy gunner in one shot,but to do that one shot takes too long meanwhile i meme strike those gunners in 1/10 of time.
Can not even stay alive as long as limbo can,useless trashframe mastery fodder

Spoiler

(now that i say this i can keep using my OP garuda without nerf hue hue)

 

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1 hour ago, CoolDudeMcCool said:

I don't have it, don't feel like getting it, and even if I did have it, I would be able to replace it with something else.

Not really. The other operator arcanes are useful for Eidolon hunts only so there's no reason not to equip Magus Elevate unless you're a beginner and can't get it. Garuda's 2 is a decent skill for beginners but that's it. 

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3 hours ago, 420-chan said:

Not really. The other operator arcanes are useful for Eidolon hunts only so there's no reason not to equip Magus Elevate unless you're a beginner and can't get it. Garuda's 2 is a decent skill for beginners but that's it. 

Then that means it's a problem with Operator arcanes, not Garuda. There should be more of them that are worth using, so you have to decide between Magus Elevate and something else - except when you use Garuda, for example.

Also, a frame should be made to be self-sufficient. DE shouldn't make frames that rely on Magus Elevate, or energy pizzas, or anything like that, because people who don't have them will think the frame is incomplete and just garbage to play. Frames should be good on their own(or their base stats should be decent enough to mod around in some way, I don't expect unmodded frames to work at high levels). Maybe a frame only works best with these things, but they should not be designed with those things in mind.

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