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VotumPrime

At What Part of The Game Do You Think The Majority of NEW Players Quit The Game?

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Probably around the time when you need to use mods properly to progress. 

How long does it take to get to jupiter? 

 

Though I can only guess it's this point and you would be about MR 3 ish. With 2 frames in the foundry. 

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If I look back at when I started, the low amount of Warframe slots was definitely a bottleneck. I didn't know how easy farming plat is. I suspect most newbies don't know that either.

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It's probably for the best that the scatterbrained players leave and stick to other games TBH.

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7 hours ago, peterc3 said:

Minigames count as core Warframe experiences?

You think someone really into the FGC is going to pick up Warframe because it has a minigame?

Well no...but maybe.
Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition.

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8 hours ago, VotumPrime said:

That might be a good thing but it's kind of effort in the wrong places.

And I fully agree.

Edited by AlphaPHENIX

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The market. That's where I originally quit, and thats where all the new players I've brought into the game, or tried bringing into the game, have at least considered quitting. 

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My friend quit when they realize there's no auction house to put stuff he want to sell. already told him that it's trivial matter and still can use wf.market or chat, but i guess it not really suit his taste.

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I'd say one of three places depending on the player, of the ones that aren't going to stick around awhile.

First group stops after the first quest or so when they realize the story will take some digging to get into or the playstyle of the game just isn't for them.

Second group stops the first time they meet an enemy that they simply cannot beat with what the game has given them so far, right now it would be the nightwave crew probably which can show up in most any mission and just curbstomp them. Previously it was the first time you met the stalker and said to hell with this. 

Third group is likely when they burned through the starter plat and filled up their slots and realize they have none of the weapons anyone says are needed and don't want to drop a bunch of money into a free to play game just to collect all the things.

 

The only way to fix the first would be a lot more quests added so the whole game is quest oriented. You probably can't keep this group. The second group I cannot think of how to help, some players will always quit when the challenge seems too hard, though I might consider a higher mr limit maybe before things like stalker or nightwave zealots appear. The third group can't be helped, some people just play free to play games to get all the free out of them possible and then move on. You might keep them if you had a way to store built weapons and warframes for later retrieval, but would likely take a large chunk out of the profit for the game when people like me stop buying plat for more slots to get all the things.


That being said a better overall tutorial of key game elements like modding would be very helpful for player retention as well, I had no issue when starting of hitting up the wiki to figure things out, but not all players will do so.

Edited by Liltha
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If I have to say, it's the part where you need to understand how the game work...

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6 hours ago, Aazhyd said:

If I look back at when I started, the low amount of Warframe slots was definitely a bottleneck. I didn't know how easy farming plat is. I suspect most newbies don't know that either.

Slots in general can also be a problem that makes the game seem a bit heavy on the "PAY US MONEY" front.

Nightwave having slots in the rewards helps a bit, but the base number of frame slots feels like "Starter frame +1" might not be enough.

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I'd have quit early on because of the lack of slots. For months, I couldn't bring out any of the frames I had built (foundry build times don't matter if you can't claim the results at the end anyway.)

But I got a free give-away of 100plat, here on the forums, that allowed me to buy frame slots. Weapons were always considered fodder as I went, so I just cycled them out as I mastered them, only really keeping the Orthos.

Without that infusion of plat, I'd have end up quitting. The lack of an auction house is a big downside here. (I have bought and sold using the market site, but I find it entirely unprofessional and the only reason I used it was because it provided me the game's premium currency.)

P.S. I have bought Renown packs since, so I have gotten more plat... but early on, that was the biggest turn-off for me. That, and the arsenal/market shows everything sold by plat prices, instead of blueprints... if I hadn't watched youtube videos explaining how that all worked, I'd have been gone much sooner.

I also got my friend to play (who never would have otherwise), and he's bought plat packs and prime access, and renown packs... etc... just saying...

DE would have been better off giving me slots to actually use the stuff I was collecting, rather than bottlenecking.... strangling me for money at the start. DE didn't keep me here, kind people giving away plat did.

Edited by (PS4)AyinDygra
added stuff after ps
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11 hours ago, FlyingDice said:

Those are the two things I see cited most consistently by people who describe themselves as having tried WF, quit, and came back years later to try again. The first is obviously a frustration/ expectation of P2W kneejerk reaction, the latter is a perceived undocumented over-complexity reaction (similar to how people quit Path of Exile after seeing the passive tree). Both are pretty understandable even if you're not the sort of person that reacts to those things in that way, IMO.

The third I'd lay as the "okay I just ignored advice from people who know better and powered through all the content I could reach in a couple months, now I'm totally bored and burned out" type.

Ah yes this is definitely one of them. If you can think of anymore please come back and post it here.

11 hours ago, TheRealShade said:

Probably when they look in the marketplace and don't notice the BLUEPRINT button.

Absolutely. They always think it's pay to win for that reason.

10 hours ago, 0_The_F00l said:

Probably around the time when you need to use mods properly to progress. 

How long does it take to get to jupiter? 

 

Though I can only guess it's this point and you would be about MR 3 ish. With 2 frames in the foundry. 

I'm thinking we should probably do something huge with the conflict on Mars between the Grineer and the Corpus. There is an ancient Orokin City ruins there you know and it has an underground system of tunnels.

9 hours ago, CephalonTachyon said:

Personally for me, most I've seen quit at somewhere before Jupiter and after Venus.

 

I'm seeing that same pattern too. They arrive at Fortuna or at Cetus and they do the open world thing for a while and then they don't know what to do after. I also think a lot of them get put off by the lack of animation from other Warframes and players. Since the Cetus chat is often quiet and the region chat is too noisy. They have no real way of seeking help or information from players.

9 hours ago, Aazhyd said:

If I look back at when I started, the low amount of Warframe slots was definitely a bottleneck. I didn't know how easy farming plat is. I suspect most newbies don't know that either.

Absolutely. They should increase the amount of base Warframe slots to at least 4.

9 hours ago, Campaigner said:

It's probably for the best that the scatterbrained players leave and stick to other games TBH.

Don't be like that. In order for the game to grow and stay alive for many years to come we gotta try attracting all sorts of playerbases that we can but also keep them focused on clearing the game.

6 hours ago, Cloverskull said:

The market. That's where I originally quit, and thats where all the new players I've brought into the game, or tried bringing into the game, have at least considered quitting. 

This is a new one and I think I have a good idea as to why.

6 hours ago, Akahito_San said:

My friend quit when they realize there's no auction house to put stuff he want to sell. already told him that it's trivial matter and still can use wf.market or chat, but i guess it not really suit his taste.

I remember vaguely about the reason why they don't put up an auction house, they stated something about it being bad for the economy and how it would skyrocket prices resulting in inflation and something about how the current trade chat discourages that. I'm honestly not too familiar with this issue.

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3 hours ago, Liltha said:

I'd say one of three places depending on the player, of the ones that aren't going to stick around awhile.

First group stops after the first quest or so when they realize the story will take some digging to get into or the playstyle of the game just isn't for them.

Second group stops the first time they meet an enemy that they simply cannot beat with what the game has given them so far, right now it would be the nightwave crew probably which can show up in most any mission and just curbstomp them. Previously it was the first time you met the stalker and said to hell with this. 

Third group is likely when they burned through the starter plat and filled up their slots and realize they have none of the weapons anyone says are needed and don't want to drop a bunch of money into a free to play game just to collect all the things.

 

The only way to fix the first would be a lot more quests added so the whole game is quest oriented. You probably can't keep this group. The second group I cannot think of how to help, some players will always quit when the challenge seems too hard, though I might consider a higher mr limit maybe before things like stalker or nightwave zealots appear. The third group can't be helped, some people just play free to play games to get all the free out of them possible and then move on. You might keep them if you had a way to store built weapons and warframes for later retrieval, but would likely take a large chunk out of the profit for the game when people like me stop buying plat for more slots to get all the things.


That being said a better overall tutorial of key game elements like modding would be very helpful for player retention as well, I had no issue when starting of hitting up the wiki to figure things out, but not all players will do so.

Thank you for sharing such detailed feedback! I always wanted Warframe to have a campaign mode. We really do need some sort of connected and engaging story line like the campaign mode for Destiny 2 and the Halo series to get people through the star chart. I also feel like the junctions do more harm than good as it somewhat confuses and discourages players from progressing.

 

2 hours ago, (PS4)AyinDygra said:

I'd have quit early on because of the lack of slots. For months, I couldn't bring out any of the frames I had built (foundry build times don't matter if you can't claim the results at the end anyway.)

But I got a free give-away of 100plat, here on the forums, that allowed me to buy frame slots. Weapons were always considered fodder as I went, so I just cycled them out as I mastered them, only really keeping the Orthos.

Without that infusion of plat, I'd have end up quitting. The lack of an auction house is a big downside here. (I have bought and sold using the market site, but I find it entirely unprofessional and the only reason I used it was because it provided me the game's premium currency.)

P.S. I have bought Renown packs since, so I have gotten more plat... but early on, that was the biggest turn-off for me. That, and the arsenal/market shows everything sold by plat prices, instead of blueprints... if I hadn't watched youtube videos explaining how that all worked, I'd have been gone much sooner.

I also got my friend to play (who never would have otherwise), and he's bought plat packs and prime access, and renown packs... etc... just saying...

DE would have been better off giving me slots to actually use the stuff I was collecting, rather than bottlenecking.... strangling me for money at the start. DE didn't keep me here, kind people giving away plat did.

Yep this is definitely another reoccurring issue and they thought that Nightwave with its free slots would remedy this but it hasn't since new players don't concern themselves with Nightwave at all. 

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vor 12 Stunden schrieb TheRealShade:

Probably when they look in the marketplace and don't notice the BLUEPRINT button.

If you just scroll the weapon list, you will never know which ones can be build. Unless you keep attention to the checkbox at the very edge of the screen. Even if that box is marked, there is NO INDICATOR this weapon is "free". should add a colored corner to each BP avail weapon. Tooltip should say "Weapon can be build in the foundry" or "This weapon is available as BP or Platinum enhanced"

Corners: 

  • Bronze: BP only
  • Silver: BP and Plat (with Potato and Slot)
  • Gold: Plat only, because BP is hidden away in a gamemode.
  • Red: This Weapon is MR locked. (Bronze Weapons only)

 

edit: Concerning the slots, either they need an overhaul or have to be gone or at least be more generous.

Edited by NoSpax
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I try to help newbs and the one of more frequent thing that makes them quickly go ‘not logged for 30 days’ yet not talked about is....

 

Open Worlds.

 

Yeah, Plains of Eidolon and Orb Vallis.

 

 

Don’t get me wrong, there are tons of things to do and many of them are enjoyable..... if your MR is above two digits and your progression with Daily Standing is enjoyable and you can actually do what is offered there.

 

The problem is, since they are introduced early on and looks so busy, also while being familiar to many ‘gamer’ ppl who like open world solo games or MMO with huge fields, they constantly bash themselves into getting more from Open Worlds.

 

 

However, most things in Open world is used only for stuff that part only (fish, mine, conservation etc) and a good chunk of it is locked behind Operator and Amp (Which is much later into story), they feel frustrated that they aren’t getting much better.

 

That with meager Daily Standing they can achieve which would make them weeks if not months to reach higher ranks, often annoys them to the point of quitting.

 

I strongly believe that those Open Worlds , at least getting above Rank 2 or 3 with locals, should be locked until they can progress the Star Chart & Story Quests.

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7 hours ago, Cloverskull said:

The market. That's where I originally quit, and thats where all the new players I've brought into the game, or tried bringing into the game, have at least considered quitting. 

 

1 hour ago, VotumPrime said:

This is a new one and I think I have a good idea as to why.

When I first started playing in like 2014 I opened the market and saw that everything had a platinum cost. I thought the game was basically a mobile game where you can only advance with real money and quit. I returned in 2018 and I'm glad I got shown the ropes by some more  experienced players that time around and stuck to the game. I've since had the same experience of "so the game is P2W/mobile game" with pretty much everyone I've introduced to the game.

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I went on a brief quit after I'd spent my starter plat on a decoration, and a palette. I think explaining what platinum is, and how you can earn it would help the new player experience. Another problem I ran into early on, was modding and abilities; I had no idea what mods were for, and I believed abilities could only be used once every mission, since the game didn't really explain anything about efficiency or energy. A MR3 guy I was helping out a few months back, stopped logging in after Jupiter (I suspect he believed the game was pay2win, especially since he had bought a few warframes and cosmetics). My friends list is full of new players whom I had helped out, or taxied around, but never returned to the game.

I think another thing they could do, is make a practice area that is accessible through your orbiter, since most new players don't know about simulacrum, or even Simaris.

Like what others have said, giving the tutorial a more in-depth explanation on the game's basic mechanics could greatly improve player retention.

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experiencing multiple speedrun teams that rush to extraction and kill everything asap. This alone is a recurring complaint I get and see whenever my favorite sites or I promote warframe and the people in the commets mostly blame that. The grind is next.

Edited by Deshiel
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11 hours ago, Aazhyd said:

If I look back at when I started, the low amount of Warframe slots was definitely a bottleneck. I didn't know how easy farming plat is. I suspect most newbies don't know that either.

When I started playing... It took me a month to realize there was a trading system... would have been better if there was a basic quest relevant in trading for starters.

 

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According to Steam most people quit before even 10 hrs in.  Only ~26% keep on playing.

orxgXu5.png

Most new players simply get lost and dont know what to do after the intro quest. Obfuscation and RNG-dependent progress put them off. They see that crafting needs materials from god-knows where from locked planets... get killed while they do no damage to lvl20s ...mods... where?  what?  Game does terrible job at teaching anything, its still almost unplayable without guidance or wiki.

Then there are genuine nonsense roadblocks like 'find cephalon fragments' - the mandatory task right before you even get radar mods. Its like DE intentionally scares people away.

I had made a new account just to see how 'new player experience' has improved and having 3000hrs on main and knowing almost everything its still wasn't a smooth ride, I still had to check wiki for the best drop location of nescessary mods and materials and STILL I couldn't get Serration to drop even knowing where to farm it  and finished most of the starchart with  'broken' one (intentionally restrained from trading p2w) before the RNG smiled upon me. Most people dont look things up and dont have the patience, they give up and move to other games.

Edited by Monolake
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30 minutes ago, Deshiel said:

experiencing multiple speedrun teams that rush to extraction and kill everything asap. This alone is a recurring complaint I get and see whenever my favorite sites or I promote warframe and the people in the commets mostly blame that. The grind is next.

Yeah mixing new players and vets who faceroll everything leaving noobs in the dust feeling useless with nothing to do certainly kills the experience for them.

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20 hours ago, VotumPrime said:

State what part of the game you think it is and why do you think they quit at that part and what DE should do to remedy it so that things stay interesting and keep these new players from leaving forever. This can be moved to feedback later.

After the first few missions they see someone with Maiming Strike. 

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9 minutes ago, Monolake said:

According to Steam most people quit before even 10 hrs in.  Only ~26% keep on playing.

orxgXu5.png

Most new players simply get lost and dont know what to do after the intro quest. Obfuscation and RNG-dependent progress put them off. They see that crafting needs materials from god-knows where from locked planets... get killed while they do no damage to lvl20s ...mods... where?  what?  Game does terrible job at teaching anything, its still almost unplayable without guidance or wiki.

Then there are genuine nonsense roadblocks like 'find cephalon fragments' - the mandatory task right before you even get radar mods. Its like DE intentionally scares people away.

I had made a new account just to see how 'new player experience' has improved and having 3000hrs on main and knowing almost everything its still wasn't a smooth ride, I still had to check wiki for the best nescessary mods and materials drop location and STILL I couldn't get Serration to drop even knowing where yo farm it  and finished most of the starchart with  'broken' one (intentionally restrained from trading p2w) before the RNG smiled upon me. Most people dont look things up and dont have the patience, they give up and move to other games.

I've been thinking about this, and tbh I'm not sure if this is the right way to look at it anymore.

The thing is, it doesn't take into consideration if Warframe is the kind of game that the person is into.

Since it's f2p, there's zero investment to download and install it. I wouldn't be surprised if lots of people install it and just don't like what it is. On those cases, it's not necessarily the games fault, but rather it's just not the right game for that person.

If the numbers were restricted to the universe of players that actually are into PvE grindy games and looter shooters, that would make a lot more sense IMO. I don't think it's possible to restrict to that universe, but would be very curious to see that if it was possible. Maybe there's an achievement/trophy that could serve as a metric to split the user base and weed out the players for whom Warframe isn't their cup of tea.

Edited by Vit0Corleone
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