Actual Auction house is what we need

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

7 minutes ago, Toppien said:

but you don't even consider new players demand is not static in this case, it refreshes itself overtime, by new players and old players that don't have the new items and are coming back

I did. Read it again. 

7 minutes ago, Toppien said:

demand in this case is not finite, how do you think DE has been afloat for 7 years?

By constantly and consistently adding new things to the mix. By temporarily reducing supply of older things. 

9 minutes ago, Toppien said:

now in the case of the tax, why not making it reactive to how many players are active on the market at the time? too many players? the tax is higher, not many players, the tax drops, that way you keep the quantity of sellers in check, but you don't suffocate them either

Because the proposed tax is a weak attempt to fix a proposed system that broken from in advance. If the system is bad, don't make the change just for the sake of making a change. 

[(PSN)segulibanez65]

Even as someone that has made a killing off of trade chat, I want a real player market.  So sick of the trade bs... waiting around for people, people trying to low-ball after already agreeing on prices, "pmo" trollers, having to just sit in your orbiter and wait (unless you want to be "that guy" that doesn't respond for 1/2hr while finishing a mission.  So even though I have 10's of thousands worth of items to sell, I haven't gone "online in-game" on .market for months.  

Oh, then you get the weirdo's that won't leave you alone afterward, spamming messages to your discord/steam/psn.  

I want an auction house.  I don't care if I lose 4/5 of the value on the goods I currently have.  I'll take convenience over more plat any day

[Drachnyn]

I dont think a fully automated auction house is a good idea because we never know when DE could buff a mod or a weapon, or some convoluted mission makes one mod suddenly relevant again. This could lead to some really bad experiences when someone loses out on plat just because they couldnt login and adjust all prices right after an update. What I think would work instead is something like warframe.market but ingame where you can just list items and being able to agree to trades from DMs without the need to head to the dojo.

[Avienas]

58 minutes ago, (PS4)segulibanez65 said:

Even as someone that has made a killing off of trade chat, I want a real player market.  So sick of the trade bs... waiting around for people, people trying to low-ball after already agreeing on prices, "pmo" trollers, having to just sit in your orbiter and wait (unless you want to be "that guy" that doesn't respond for 1/2hr while finishing a mission.  So even though I have 10's of thousands worth of items to sell, I haven't gone "online in-game" on .market for months.  

Same here mai tenno brother, just like how any `trading system` works in ANY game that involves player interaction which is basically ANY online game whether its the interaction of cooperation to get a common cause for loot by doing missions together or haggling with each other to settle for a value we both can like, Instead of being a bunch of cluck-wads who want to just run off instead of trying to talk with people such as asking for a better value on the item i wanna sell or they wanna do that for thar item or i want to ask for the price they request to get lowered. It honestly makes more sense to god damn HAGGLE with people, instead of just continuing to spam the freaking market and expect someone will eventually come along to give you a auto-buy price adhering to what you are selling and want for it or adhering to a value low enough that you want to pay for something.

If D.E. is clearly unable to create incentive for the SOCIAL EXPERIENCE as many particular people want to brag that trade chat is about, which honestly Was clearly something alot of other players disillusioned themselves as far as i can tell at this point, when clearly market chat is quite different then that rosy perspective on it being completely fine. Then you might as well get to doing your best Beerus Impression and just Hakai that crap out of existence. THEN move something else in its place that better serves the main purpose everyone was using it for or gets people to REALLY want to follow that social interaction alot more then what is currently going on.

Quote

Oh, then you get the weirdo's that won't leave you alone afterward, spamming messages to your discord/steam/psn.  

Funny how when i stay in market chat for more then 30 minutes i can get quite a few of those when i am trying to sell simple goods to simple WTBers and can run into quite a few people who suddenly say they meant `TRADE` and then continue to spam me items when i said: `no thanks, since you were saying WTB, i was under the impression you were going to pay in platinum, not items i clearly do not need when you can check my profile and i am currently the highest MR possible in the game at the moment.`

Quote

I want an auction house.  I don't care if I lose 4/5 of the value on the goods I currently have.  I'll take convenience over more plat any day

Speaking of that age old question: Me haps just had a fun brainstorm because someone brought up the idea of using: Ducats as a taxing currency or `Throw items in the void`, which is basically what ducat exchanging is So hope you dont mind me using this reply to listing this idea:

AS i mentioned in either a previous thread or earlier in this one, hard to keep track of them when a certain Guzzlord-Mantis keeps wanting to flood them all and make it hard to tell them apart, I mentioned Mobile games that use TREASURE TRADE type systems, especially for events where you would be able to get all sorts of loot, sometimes themed to the event itself, such as particular crafting resources and what not.

Now here`s my pitch: How about D.E. create a similar system where we can deposit mods (mainly gold ones), Prime Blue prints, Special blueprints/parts (like the Vandal/Wraith parts), Relics(Especially Relics) and heck maybe even Riven mods we do not want because we cannot sell it nor do we want to transmute it. Which could be used to get a currency to exchange goods that would reset monthly and have a limit on each exchange, But could easily contain ALL-IMPORTANT goods like warframe/weapon slots, like maybe 1 or even up to 3 each, alongside potatoes, forma and so on. TRY TO REMEMBER, that these exchanges would have a cap that does not reset, till the end of EACH MONTH, so people would have to wait till the next month to get goods if they clean out the stock rather fast.

 

Now why would i suggest such a thing?: Because slots, potatoes and forma are extremely important, this would create a nice sink for various `junk loot` that could likely create a nice sink for peoples inventories on excess items, plus maybe even create a market where people would buy and trade for large amounts of these `junk items` to get loads of these Treasure exchange points. Which of course might have infinite simple pick ups like Endo packets, random Ayatan statues and amber stars. Since the infinite stuff could definitely not be things like Kuva for obvious reasons and Credits would likely be another pick option, but would not be as viable as Endo would be.

But overall, this could likely indirectly affect market chat as how some people would say, `reduce` the over-saturation of goods and the various tid-bits i have pointed out on creating a nice more friendly system for people to make use of, instead of over-reliance on the toxic system we cal market chat for important things like Slots & Potatoes, which clearly would not amount to much of D.E.s profits, when things like Riven mods, Cosmetics, Prime packs and so on, would clearly have much more of an impact then small bits of `chump change` some people in market chat throw about much higher values with little care.

 

Anyway Here`s hoping ya`lll start trying to take to this idea and suggest other tweaks that could work, because this is my latest edition of indirect ways to improve market chat, thru affecting things that surround it, such as doing a good job at cleaning up excess items, because alot of people will want to burn it in the `treasure exchange currencies` instead of trying desperately to sell the items, that likely no one will want to pay a `fair price` for, while this `over saturation` exists.

Edited January 21, 2020 by Avienas

[Toppien]

1 hour ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

I did. Read it again. 

By constantly and consistently adding new things to the mix. By temporarily reducing supply of older things. 

Because the proposed tax is a weak attempt to fix a proposed system that broken from in advance. If the system is bad, don't make the change just for the sake of making a change. 

well in the end people are sick of the current system, that is why 3rd party markets exist, the only thing left to do is putting it inside the game, people already use the prices of the market, how is that a broken system, when such "broken" system is already a better alternative than what we already have in game?

and no my proposal is not to make a change for the sake of change, is just to make the change more appealing to the mediocrity of the people, but the change needs to happen, the actual system is not enough, if not the auction house then any other alternative that doesn't involve sitting a whole game session doing nothing like an idiot looking at chat, wasting my free time that i should use playing and relaxing instead of just reading over an over again how a bunch of uninteresting offers goes passing through the tedious chat box.

it is not enough, change needs to happen, doesn't matter if the change is good or bad, but if also things never move, never change, that's just asking to be eaten.

 

could also be that items put in the auction house are only available when the player is logged in, idk kinda like what we have on maroo's bazaar but without us sitting there with the hand on the air all the play session

Edited January 21, 2020 by Toppien

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

2 hours ago, Toppien said:

well in the end people are sick of the current system, that is why 3rd party markets exist, the only thing left to do is putting it inside the game, people already use the prices of the market, how is that a broken system, when such "broken" system is already a better alternative than what we already have in game?

Hint: Go do some research on what effect the creation of warframe.market had on the in game economy. 

And remember only a fraction of the players are on that site. And it does not permit offline or afk trading. 

Then figure out what scaling that up to all players, and offline/afk trading will do. 

2 hours ago, Toppien said:

and no my proposal is not to make a change for the sake of change, is just to make the change more appealing to the mediocrity of the people, but the change needs to happen,

And

2 hours ago, Toppien said:

it is not enough, change needs to happen, doesn't matter if the change is good or bad, but if also things never move, never change, that's just asking to be eaten.

Again, many people around the world want access to addictive drugs. Is giving it to them because "they want it" a good idea? 

Making bad changes is a bad idea. Don't do that. 

 

If you come up with a good idea, I'll back your proposal. But I will oppose ideas that aren't good, or are flat out bad. And auction houses are a frigging terrible idea. 

2 hours ago, Toppien said:

could also be that items put in the auction house are only available when the player is logged in, idk kinda like what we have on maroo's bazaar but without us sitting there with the hand on the air all the play session

Ok let me propose a simple litmus test. For any proposed change ask yourself "does this increase supply without increasing demand?" 

Any time the answer is "yes", just hit delete. 

Edited January 21, 2020 by (PS4)guzmantt1977
Minor adjustments

[(PSN)sweatshawp]

You want an offline trading function not an auction house cause that would drastically inflate prices

[CoefficientOfCool]

bro you are trying to solve the wrong problem. solve this one - why would de ever change the  current system? surely they must profit from the chaos that is trade chat. I would also imagine its nice to have a completely separate entity handle your market on their "3rD-PaRtY" website. I dont know how it works but I'd be interested to know whether it would be easier / harder or not change in difficulty to do chargebacks on cc's to get rid of bad plat if DE were in complete control of the market and it was in-game accessible... 

anyway, come up with a solution that will not hurt DE's bottomline as well as solve the issues you are currently facing and *shrugs* I dunno, maybe? it could happen?

Edited January 21, 2020 by CoefficientOfCool
engrish hurd

[Mest_Gryder]

vor 9 Stunden schrieb (PS4)guzmantt1977:

Hint: Go do some research on what effect the creation of warframe.market had on the in game economy. 

And remember only a fraction of the players are on that site. And it does not permit offline or afk trading. 

Then figure out what scaling that up to all players, and offline/afk trading will do. 

 

Again, many people around the world want access to addictive drugs. Is giving it to them because "they want it" a good idea? 

Making bad changes is a bad idea. Don't do that. 

 

If you come up with a good idea, I'll back your proposal. But I will oppose ideas that aren't good, or are flat out bad. And auction houses are a frigging terrible idea. 

Ok let me propose a simple litmus test. For any proposed change ask yourself "does this increase supply without increasing demand?" 

Any time the answer is "yes", just hit delete. 

We did not say in one word, that we support trading while offline. But despite that fact, that is already very similar to the warframe.market.
The idea is to make trading a less messy place ingame and filters are obviously not fixing it. When every player spams their offers at the same time - and that also counts for recruiting - then we have people who suddenly click on another player, because the chat bounce quick and fast, regradless of a filter. Have you ever seen a twitch stream? That is how it looks like on an english trade or recruit chat.

What is that nonsense comparison with your drugs, boy? I see you know nothing about drugs tho, but I do not want to discuss it here.
Please remain quiet when you think about comparing something like that.
Your only argument is changes are bad. The argument should be, don't touch a running system, but the system is windows XP. It is Outdated! Obsolete!
Specially with such a high player base.

Your next argument is, that you as individual will lose your profit, because you are in that delusional believe, that demand stays constant or that there is not already a tendency of overdflowing supply. Do you even trade, that you can't see the tendency or the problems that trading on daily basis comes with? Even more surprised I am, that PS4 player for who trading must be even more tideous without keyboard, are defending a lost argument, without any suggestion, except only to put denial.
You do not care about the game, but only about your own profit.

We could simply advertise warframe.market to everyone, lets see how long your beloved profit will remain.

They don't use it because it is easy over night profit. It is less messy and you do not need to spam the heck out of the trade channel and still you have your daily limits and need to be there in person for trade. And only people who are online will receive the message for trade, because most people want instant trades and not wait for the cheapest offline gamer.

So what is your aguement again? Please process your own defect and think again. Because everyone can say no, only to defend their personal benefit. I am open for every suggestion and idea everyone has. But saying no, is no suggestion. Saying no, is no explination and saying no just because of the sake to say no, is a no go.
Also we do not demand just changes for the sake of a change, we actually work out ideas.
So I count your "calling for changes just for the sake of changes" invalid AF.

People already said how to regulate and even fix the trading regulations. You did nothing, but complain and throw empty phrases.
Give your hope of a yet stable market to the void, because if I want to, I can change it just by spreading the word of 2 external trading websites, the rest will be done by mouth to mouth advertisement within the clans.

You know what is funny? Because how usntable the market currently is, I am surprised that you want to defend that broken market at all, specially as a console player.

Edited January 21, 2020 by Mest_Gryder

[Mest_Gryder]

vor 2 Stunden schrieb CoefficientOfCool:

bro you are trying to solve the wrong problem. solve this one - why would de ever change the  current system? surely they must profit from the chaos that is trade chat. I would also imagine its nice to have a completely separate entity handle your market on their "3rD-PaRtY" website. I dont know how it works but I'd be interested to know whether it would be easier / harder or not change in difficulty to do chargebacks on cc's to get rid of bad plat if DE were in complete control of the market and it was in-game accessible... 

anyway, come up with a solution that will not hurt DE's bottomline as well as solve the issues you are currently facing and *shrugs* I dunno, maybe? it could happen?

Actually trading on a 3rd party website is much easier than trade chat, therefor is the tendency just knowing of one of these websites, that more people use them and have an unfair advantage of those who did not know of them.
Also people who use trade bot/scripts in the official trade chat have an unfair advantage.
And because of these spammer, trade chat tend to be very messy.

I think to use ducats as a trading tax currency for a better and more tidy trading system very attractive, maybe that idea can be polished.
In the end when all items experience a deflation of the market "cheap prices",
will DE actually benefit from it, because the official market items they offer, will always remain the same prices. So it is more likely, that people use real money to support the game. The people who are "leeching" from those players who actually invest the game with their money, will have a harder time, but it is just a natural consequence that is about to occur already.

Edited January 21, 2020 by Mest_Gryder

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

2 minutes ago, Mest_Gryder said:

We did not say in one word, that we support trading while offline. But despite that fact, that is already very similar to the warframe.market.
The idea is to make trading a less messy place ingame and filters are obviously not fixing it. When every player spams their offers at the same time - and that also counts for recruiting - then we have people who suddenly click on another player, because the chat bounce quick and fast, regradless of a filter. Have you ever seen a twitch stream? That is how it looks like on an english trade or recruit chat.

1) scroll up. Directly after the post you quoted is one talking about offline trading. 

That's just the most recent example. 

If you are not good at setting effective filters, that's a "you problem". Try using a couple of positive filters for items instead of negative ones. 

7 minutes ago, Mest_Gryder said:

What is that nonsense comparison with your drugs, boy? I see you know nothing about drugs tho, but I do not want to discuss it here.
Please remain quiet when you think about comparing something like that.
Your only argument is changes are bad. The argument should be, don't touch a running system, but the system is windows XP. It is Outdated! Obsolete!
Specially with such a high player base.

It shows that giving people what they think they want is not always a good idea. When people are not smart enough to avoid requesting bad changes, they should not be given the things that will directly hurt them. 

And please learn to read. Changes can be good or bad. Good changes that are generally beneficial are fine. Bad changes which will harm the majority of players, are not. 

11 minutes ago, Mest_Gryder said:

Your next argument is, that you as individual will lose your profit, because you are in that delusional believe, that demand stays constant or that there is not already a tendency of overdflowing supply. Do you even trade, that you can't see the tendency or the problems that trading on daily basis comes with? Even more surprised I am that PS4 player for who trading must be even more tideous without keyboard, are defending a lost argument, without any suggestion, except only to put denial.
You do not care about the game, but only about your own profit.

Nope, but that's a very pretty strawman argument you're making.

I seldom sell things in this game and am more likely to give stuff away. I'm one of the people who will benefit from the proposed change because I have a surplus of plat because I choose to spend real money to support the game. Having prices crash would benefit me. I'd be able to buy everything I lack, for a pittance. 

But the proposed system will kill the economy, and f2p players will have a much much harder time. That's going to hurt the game. You're just too myopic to grasp what I've said. 

16 minutes ago, Mest_Gryder said:

We could simply advertise warframe.market to everyone, lets see how long your beloved profit will remain.

Again, take a good look at the effect warframe.market had when it was released. 

19 minutes ago, Mest_Gryder said:

They don't use it because it is easy over night profit. It is less messy and you do not need to spam the heck out of the trade channel and still you have your daily limits and need to be there in person for trade. And only people who are online will receive the message for trade, because most people want instant trades and not wait for the cheapest offline gamer.

And those limitations are the thread that we're currently dangling by. Several of the proposed systems would remove several of them. That's bad, mmmkay? 

22 minutes ago, Mest_Gryder said:

So what is your aguement again? Please process your own defect and think again. Because everyone can say no, only to defend their personal benefit. I am open for every suggestion and idea everyone has. But saying no, is no suggestion. Saying no, is no explination and saying no just because of the sake to say no, is a no go.
Also we do not demand just changes for the sake of a change, we actually work out ideas.
So I count your "calling for changes just for the sake of changes" invalid AF.

Having an open mind is grand, but you need to be careful that it's not too open because then you risk having your brain fall out. 

In your case, because you are like a child and cannot perceive the danger, you're throwing a tantrum because someone is trying to stop you from doing something that would end badly. It's relatively simple economic principles. Infinite supply and highly finite demand. If you rapidly increase supply that's going to cause a major problem. 

26 minutes ago, Mest_Gryder said:

People already said how to regulate and even fix the trading regulations. You did nothing, but complain and throw empty phrases.
Give your hope of a yet stable market to the void, because if I want to I can change it just by spreading the word of 2 external trading websites, the rest will be done by mouth to mouth advertisement within the clans.

Every single proposal to "fix" the problems that would be caused by the proposed changes has thus far failed to address the root of the problem. Each would still lead to a system that's worse than the current one. 

That means that the only option is to not make these bad changes. 

31 minutes ago, Mest_Gryder said:

You know what is funny? Because how usntable the market currently is, I am surprised that you want to defend that broken market at all, specially as a console player.

Imagine you had a broken arm, and someone came along with a suggestion to fix it by putting you to lie down on the road and let cars drive over you. When you say that isn't a good idea, people sugge laying down in a way that fewer cars might hit you. When you point out that having any cars hit you is still only going to make your situation worse, someone shouts "yeah but it's already broken so that's no problem lulz". 

I'm pretty sure that you would think that person is an idiot, and opt to not do what they are suggesting. 

Right. That's the situation we have here. Yes the system we have, has a problem. But the proposes changes would all make it worse. Supporting those changes is a terrible idea. 

 

[(PSN)segulibanez65]

11 hours ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

Again, many people around the world want access to addictive drugs. Is giving it to them because "they want it" a good idea? 

What the market wants, it gets.  Fighting it, just as is the case in the drug war, is a foolish, Sisyphean task.  I'm not going to say WF economy is even in the same same universe as the drug war and the evils it has unleashed on society: wars, both traditional and civilian (ie 40k murders in Mexico in 2019 alone just because the US has prohibition... and that figure is rising every year) preventable overdose deaths in the 10's if not 100's of thousands over the last couple decades, people in prison for crimes of consciousness, and the opiod epidemic (just look at Switzerland or Portugal and see how NOT prohibiting has affected their society)  That is not even getting into the lost corporate profits, jobs, and state/federal taxes that are ceded to the gangs and cartels by not regulating a few hundred billion dollar annual market.  Even after all this death and societal destruction, demand and use has never been higher.  You cannot fight nature and expect any positive results.

We see parallels in the WF economy, they are just frivolous and of no relative import in the grande scheme: third party sites already exist and benefit from DE not regulating their economy.  The riven mafia bs.  The selling of items for real-world money (sometimes pretty high amounts) on ebay, et al.  This doesn't exist with a proper in-game market, at least no where near the current scale. 

I fail to see how DE benefits at all from people selling Primed mods and Rivens on ebay for $20+  However, DE could "profit" by charging a plat tax on transactions, pulling some out of the market to their benefit.  Only people it would hurt would be the plat hoarders and riven cartels, and in that case, good riddance.

[AlfredDean]

On 2020-01-09 at 2:00 PM, anemo2 said:

revert ember

cease thy blabbering

 

 

to be real with you though, the old ember was a mindless, useless "press 4 to get dissapointed" frame at worst, and a sub par CC frame at best and now plays like a more-fun mag (imho) and nothing's worse than a boring frame where 1 button is the only way to play so how about no

[(PSN)AyinDygra]

The term "Auction House" misrepresents the intended mechanic: an asynchronous trade system that lets items be listed for buy-out prices, with an in-game searchable method to be found by buyers, and be transfered to buyers for that price, while the seller is busy playing or out working or at school.

Items could be listed with a Ducat Tax that would simultaneously become a supply-sink (prime parts would have to be traded in for ducats for this "auction house" to be used by people) and set a "minimum" value on trades, since it cost that person who listed the item something of value to them (Ducats., which means Prime Parts, which could have been traded for plat.) This gets around the issue of a "Plat Tax" while simultaneously being a Plat tax by proxy.

The number of items listed could be limited to 5 per day. (your normal limit of trades per day would still exist, but the "Auction House" could only be used for 5 of them, and then your item would no longer appear in people's searches, as the trade would not be available.)

All listed items for sale would have to be sold for their listed prices, which would eliminate the biggest issue with 3rd party listings... where you don't have to actually go through with a sale, manipulating the market without even owning the item that you've listed. No ghost listings will exist in an in-game "Auction House", which will create a realistic view of the actual market.

A price history with buyers/sellers listed, the date, and amount the sale went for, could be provided, giving people an idea of what an item is really worth, and if shady shenanigans are going on with people buying/selling in a group to manipulate prices. (with the limited number of daily trades within this system, it would require a large network of people, and to mask their intentional cross-trading to manipulate prices would be much harder to orchestrate. And they'd be wasting tons of Ducats and the plat those could translate into with buying Prime mods from Baro to sell later, or other such things.)

 

The people citing real-world economics issues of supply and demand don't really understand all the precautions that could be implemented into the system to curb the negative aspects that they foresee going into a wild downward spiral.

In any case, a more accessible method of trade in-game, without standing around doing nothing with your hand held over your head, would promote more fun gameplay, and less tedious stuff. Currently, people who don't trade have 0 value in anything they own. With such a system in place, even if it's only worth 1 plat, that's an infinite increase in value, and they'd suddenly be able to make *SOME* plat, rather than none, and stay totally free to play. It may take a lot more trades than the current system, because the current system is cumbersome and annoying and is only used by a fraction of the playerbase (creating false scarcity that benefits those who DO use the system, but only them... a beneficial contained loop that keeps out normal players.)

 

 

Edit: The "5" limit per day may have to be a little higher to match the trade slots, since I think they changed that to allow the trading of the full sets of certain things that needed all those slots. I don't recall exactly. The limitation stands, though, a low number that limits the impact of the "Auction House" so it's not opening up the floodgates of everybody's entire inventory that they choose to list. The limited number of slots also works as a "minimum value" for trades, since you'll only really want to sell what's really valuable, and not "waste" a slot on a 1 plat item. And it'll limit stupidly high asking prices, since an item that sits there taking up a slot isn't selling... and potentially limits your per day profits.

Edited January 21, 2020 by (PS4)AyinDygra

[(PSN)segulibanez65]

@(PS4)AyinDygra

I love it.  The daily limit seems perfectly reasonable, and while I personally wouldn't mind a straight-up plat tax, I love the ducat tax idea.  Achieves the same goal for DE while having better optics.  

Price floors and ceilings could be established to somewhat fix the market, and for the ultra-rare items that people believe have a higher value than the price ceiling, they can still trade in the old system.  I largely see an in-game market as a place to buy/sell the most commonly sought after items with ease.  CO/BR/QT etc... Primed/Corrupted mods.  Weapon/Frame sets or parts.  Veiled or mediocre-bad rivens.  Common-Rare arcanes.  Just the stuff that see's plenty of use that has a small value, but not enough value for people to actively engage in the current trade system.  I bet I have 25-30 rivens that are either for "bad" weapons or those I just don't use that have little value in the market.  I'm sure there are players out there that use Ankyros or Dual Heat Swords or Veldt that would gladly buy a riven for 5-10p, but I'm not going to spam trade chat for hours hoping someone comes along.  So instead they just sit there taking up space as I push closer and closer to the max riven capacity.  

 

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

2 hours ago, (PS4)segulibanez65 said:

We see parallels in the WF economy, they are just frivolous and of no relative import in the grande scheme: third party sites already exist and benefit from DE not regulating their economy.  The riven mafia bs.  The selling of items for real-world money (sometimes pretty high amounts) on ebay, et al.  This doesn't exist with a proper in-game market, at least no where near the current scale. 

I fail to see how DE benefits at all from people selling Primed mods and Rivens on ebay for $20+  However, DE could "profit" by charging a plat tax on transactions, pulling some out of the market to their benefit.  Only people it would hurt would be the plat hoarders and riven cartels, and in that case, good riddance.

Setting aside the fact that you seem to think that giving people access to harmful addictive drugs is a good idea, the real money trading system you described is actually a blatant violation of the TOS and is grounds for being banned. 

Interestingly just about the only items that would hold value under your proposed system are the good rivens. They're just about the only thing that we have where supply cannot exceed the potential demand any time soon, as each is unique. 

The people who would benefit most from your suggestion are exactly the type of "Riven Mafia"-bogeymen so many people seem to be so interested in. 

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

19 minutes ago, (PS4)segulibanez65 said:

I'm sure there are players out there that use Ankyros or Dual Heat Swords or Veldt that would gladly buy a riven for 5-10p, but I'm not going to spam trade chat for hours hoping someone comes along.

Have you tried "WTS junk rivens 10p each, multiple trades invited"? 

Pretty sure you can get them sold a lot faster than you think. 

[(PSN)segulibanez65]

35 minutes ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

Setting aside the fact that you seem to think that giving people access to harmful addictive drugs is a good idea, the real money trading system you described is actually a blatant violation of the TOS and is grounds for being banned. 

Interestingly just about the only items that would hold value under your proposed system are the good rivens. They're just about the only thing that we have where supply cannot exceed the potential demand any time soon, as each is unique. 

The people who would benefit most from your suggestion are exactly the type of "Riven Mafia"-bogeymen so many people seem to be so interested in. 

It DOES NOT MATTER! How do people not understand this... No matter what rules you set, people will always break them.  No matter how stringent, no matter the consequences.  There are death penalties in certain parts of the world for simple possession... yet there are still addicts in those jurisdictions.  If death does not deter a junky in (insert backwards here) do you really think a TOS is going to stop people from selling a video game item?

DE can set rules against selling accounts or selling in-game items off-site for cash, but it will ALWAYS occur.  The best you can do is provide for the market in such a way that the average person that does not wish to circumvent the system can have easy access.  Even then, you will still have problems.

The world (and its people) are much more complicated than black and white restrictions/labels can prescribe.  Almost everyone resides in the gray.

BTW, you're damned right I'm all for giving people legal, regulated access to any and all drugs.  I'm not a sadist, I'd rather see people get the help they need, not a hot-shot of fent from a dealer or a 12yr prison term for holding an inanimate substance.  Do a little reading on the government-sponsored Swiss heroin program; if it doesn't open your eyes, you're myopic.  Prohibition does exponentially more damage to society than abuse/addiction could ever dream of, and we have decades of data to prove it, as well as our failed alcohol prohibition that was an absolute DISASTER.  It only gave rise to the most violent criminal syndicate we'd ever seen in the Mafia... Where have I seen this before??? Sinaloa Cartel? Medellin Cartel? Taliban? MS-13? Bloods/Crips?  Sure it was just a coincidence they all rose to power and prominence following the war on drugs though...

[(PSN)sweatshawp]

43 minutes ago, (PS4)segulibanez65 said:

you're damned right I'm all for giving people legal, regulated access to any and all drugs.  I'm not a sadist, I'd rather see people get the help they need, not a hot-shot of fent from a dealer or a 12yr prison term for holding an inanimate substance.  Do a little reading on the government-sponsored Swiss heroin program; if it doesn't open your eyes, you're myopic.  Prohibition does exponentially more damage to society than abuse/addiction could ever dream of, and we have decades of data to prove it, as well as our failed alcohol prohibition that was an absolute DISASTER.  It only gave rise to the most violent criminal syndicate we'd ever seen in the Mafia... Where have I seen this before??? Sinaloa Cartel? Medellin Cartel? Taliban? MS-13? Bloods/Crips?  Sure it was just a coincidence they all rose to power and prominence following the war on drugs though..

You had us all until you went and said this..... 

You're trolling right?

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

51 minutes ago, (PS4)segulibanez65 said:

It DOES NOT MATTER! How do people not understand this... No matter what rules you set, people will always break them.  No matter how stringent, no matter the consequences.  There are death penalties in certain parts of the world for simple possession... yet there are still addicts in those jurisdictions.  If death does not deter a junky in (insert backwards here) do you really think a TOS is going to stop people from selling a video game item?

DE can set rules against selling accounts or selling in-game items off-site for cash, but it will ALWAYS occur.  The best you can do is provide for the market in such a way that the average person that does not wish to circumvent the system can have easy access.  Even then, you will still have problems.

Uh... But by that logic, that's not a valid reason to do what you are proposing, because it won't stop people from doing what you say is a bad thing, as your claim is that it will "ALWAYS occur". 

So..... 

[(PSN)sweatshawp]

4 minutes ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

Uh... But by that logic, that's not a valid reason to do what you are proposing, because it won't stop people from doing what you say is a bad thing, as your claim is that it will "ALWAYS occur". 

So..... 

Guys as fellow ps4 players can we all come together in unity to laugh at Xbox users?

[(XBOX)Red Dough Boy]

1 hour ago, (PS4)sweatshawp said:

Guys as fellow ps4 players can we all come together in unity to laugh at Xbox users?

Leave the class warfare to Fallout 76. 

[(PSN)sweatshawp]

5 minutes ago, (XB1)Red Dough Boy said:

Leave the class warfare to Fallout 76. 

I'd prefer black dessert warfare at least the combat will look flashy

[(XBOX)Red Dough Boy]

28 minutes ago, (PS4)sweatshawp said:

I'd prefer black dessert warfare at least the combat will look flashy

I'd take Wahammer 40k warfare personally, brutality and scale is always awesome. 

[Tinklzs]

On 2020-01-10 at 1:58 AM, -AxHx-Vile said:

"I want to sell stuff for high prices so please lock the price in an ingame auction house"

Hell no. Enjoy the free market.

And for some people complaining about staring at trade chat, use https://warframe.market/
"But the prices there are too low" it's called market saturation.

And if they think the market saturation is bad now, it would be x10 worse if we had an AH. Players just don't understand that principle, and I hope DE never caves and adds one. Because then trading will be even worse.