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So if you had to pick a warframe that really needs a rework or buff, Who would it be?


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Chroma needs to go from Masochist Lizard to Actual Dragon ASAP.

Hydroid needs a more cohesive kit overall, concept is fine, execution is clunky, his 1 and 2 in particular feel...underwhelming.

Inaros is as boring as a bag of sand, which while not surprising, isn't good either.

Those are my top 3, but a few others need things like different passives (Rhino/Frost) or some minor changes (Give Loki a real 3rd ability and just make Decoy trigger Switch Teleport as a hold-cast).

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tl;dr; Remove Grendel from the game. Make Frost and Hydroid on par with Khora. Modernize/Spice up Zephyr. Make speed for warframes interact with parkour velocity as well.

I think that Grendel should be removed from the game, the initial design is bad and the implementation is even worst. It would probably be funnier making a new frame than salvaging this piece of garbage.

On a general note, I hope for more ways of interacting with parkour velocity. It is imho a backlog of parkour 2.0 that some frames had sprint boosts that did not got translated, sadly frames added more recently have the same flaws with for example Gauss getting very often slower than people bullet jumping properly with a parkour mod ^^.

On a general note 2, imho brief respite should get tweaked due to its interaction with shield gating. You end up with frames with BnBs(bnbs are spells that get spammed in combat) using arcane energize to spam even more while becoming even more immortal...

Khora's mechanics outweight game scalling wich is not healthy, also general note 2 馃檪

Zephyr should be tweaked or at least "spiced up", the frame is in 0 meta comp, is not what you'd play solo and is too complicated for newer players as well. On paper and in reality this is a functioning warframe, she still just doesn't fit anywhere.

Hydroid has stats that was relevant at its release, it has 0 incidental side-effects or extra scalling to work with so it greatly sux. I think that his numbers should be reworked, but in particular his tentacles should scale very differently and maybe have few customisations through augments or other means like having specialised tentacles would be fun.

Frost has imho always suffered from having his nukes(3 of his 4 spells) scalling poorly, but on top of it his bubble is not needed anymore, people bring limbo or something else to defend objectives nowadays. 馃檪

Il y a 4 heures, Aldain a dit聽:

Chroma needs to go from Masochist Lizard to Actual Dragon ASAP.

Chroma is fine, he has even niches in Steel Path... I used him twice and it was pretty good. The frame is pretty good when it is good.

Edited by Galuf
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vor 45 Minuten schrieb Galuf:

Chroma is fine, he has even niches in Steel Path... I used him twice and it was pretty good. The frame is pretty good when it is good.

Saying Chroma is fine, because he is very good at someting is like saying that old Vauban was fine, because he was excellent at CC. And unlike Chroma was Vauban the best at what he does...

Btw. same problem with Ash, Loki, Frost,...

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il y a 17 minutes, ES-Flinter a dit聽:

Saying Chroma is fine, because he is very good at someting is like saying that old Vauban was fine, because he was excellent at CC. And unlike Chroma was Vauban the best at what he does...

Btw. same problem with Ash, Loki, Frost,...

Vauban with his rework is now funnier in the regular star chart, but for high end stuff you bring Khora and if you rush 5 waves or something Octavia may be bettter :). He is actually at its historical worst since last patch imho.

Ash, Loki and Frost are the best has absolutely nothing. There isn't one situation in the game where I'm like "oh boy I should have taken ash...", and it is definitely true for the 2 others as well except maybe Loki saving a bit of time in very vanilla spy missions (Lua ones and beyond have been designed against him openly).

Chroma is the only frame that translates damage absorbed into weapon damage. Pretty good on any boss that is immune to statuses or abilities in general. He is definitely good in steel path as well. Probably the best frame to bring against ambulas boss and sargas rusk at least.

Also the fact that he allows different moddings is pretty neat and refreshing. You don't need serration with Chroma.

Edited by Galuf
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vor 24 Minuten schrieb Galuf:

Ash, Loki and Frost are the best has absolutely nothing. There isn't one situation in the game where I'm like "oh boy I should have taken ash...", and it is definitely true for the 2 others as well except maybe Loki saving a bit of time in very vanilla spy missions (Lua ones and beyond have been designed against him openly).

Chroma is the only frame that translates damage absorbed into weapon damage. Pretty good on any boss that is immune to statuses or abilities in general. He is definitely good in steel path as well. Probably the best frame to bring against ambulas boss and sargas rusk at least.

Also the fact that he allows different moddings is pretty neat and refreshing. You don't need serration with Chroma.

The part with being at best at something was only about Vauban. Ash& Co have the same problem like Chroma. They just work, because of current Meta.

Chroma and Loki have both only two useful abilities (decoy and switch teleport are to situational). Frost has a stupid passive and with the right one he could easily do more than he actually does. And Ash is the master of small, but many problems. (Shuriken needs an augment to be become useful. Smokebomb is the by far weakest invisibility ability. Teleport is just broken. I don't need to count the problems of bs.)

Sure all of them are聽good compared to frames like Hydroid/ Grendel, but all of them are also聽 bad compared to farmes like Gauss, Nidus, Saryn, Rhino, Vauban, Octavia (,?Nezha?).

Edited by ES-Flinter
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il y a 14 minutes, ES-Flinter a dit聽:

The part with being at best at something was only about Vauban. Ash& Co have the same problem like Chroma. They just work, because of current Meta.

Chroma and Loki have both only two useful abilities (decoy and switch teleport are to situational). Frost has a stupid passive and with the right one he could easily do more than he actually does. And Ash is the master of small, but many problems. (Shuriken needs an augment to be become useful. Smokebomb is the by far weakest invisibility ability. Teleport is just broken. I don't need to count the problems of bs.)

Sure all of them are聽good compared to frames like Hydroid/ Grendel, but all of them are also聽 bad compared to farmes like Gauss, Nidus, Saryn, Rhino, Vauban, Octavia (,?Nezha?).

I don't know really. You can definitely use Effigy. The issue with it is that the underlying mechanic of getting credit is now useless but at its release I was often picking him in certain missions just to use effigy, atm it is good on profit taker and that's it ^^. The build for effigy are different than the meta and the effigy itself doesn't scale that well either. Maybe giving other macro benefits to effigy would be a nice fix, and actually yes his breath would benefit from a rebalance :D.

You opinion about loki's spells is very subjective. TPing to a decoy is pretty fun and it may save time. It is a bit sad that nova does kind of similar with her gates while having a more engaging skillset on the side.

You can't really compare frames to each others in terms of overall power, you can just compare similar ability effects and extrapolate on what you gain picking one instead of another; you have different loadouts for a reason. I pick Chroma in certain situations and when I read the score screen at the end of the mission I see the results on the score screen and it generally feels good anyway because I don't die and I dish out at the same time.

Edited by Galuf
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1 hour ago, Galuf said:

Hydroid has stats that was relevant at its release, it has 0 incidental side-effects or extra scalling to work with so it greatly sux. I think that his numbers should be reworked, but in particular his tentacles should scale very differently and maybe have few customisations through augments or other means like having specialised tentacles would be fun.

I remember way back before Parkour 2.0 when stamina was a stat, Hydroid had really high stamina.聽

When stamina was removed, most stamina related mods or what have you were replaced with something, or I think in some cases you got fusion cores if the mod was removed from the game (don't think it was endo back then).聽

But if I recall correctly, despite having one of the highest stamina stats as one of his stat selling points, Hydroid got nothing in return to boost him. He has been in need of a stat boost and a whole stat review for a looooong time.聽聽

Edited by Tesseract7777
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Its weird how many people say hydroid and i said hydroid also few months ago...and i never even used much other than mastery with his normal variant a year ago.

Well even before khora people used hydroid only for tentacles and you have to put them in specific spots as well as not killing the enemies too fast so his dumb drunk tentacles will get them,kinda awkward tbh.

His 1 and 2 do impact damage which is the worst damage type,his 3 idk dmg wise becuase i never potatoed hydroid but mobillity wise its just tooo goddamn slooooow i had聽to spam 2 to even move quick and spent my energy.

His tentacles struggle to kill even garbage enemies,not sure if you can even make them kill anything that is level 50 or 40 even.

id thought i was just mistaken and people could do something with his 1 and 3 with some augments and forma,guess not.

He is probably the worst frame so far rn.

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vor 51 Minuten schrieb Galuf:

You opinion about loki's spells is very subjective. TPing to a decoy is pretty fun and it may save time. It is a bit sad that nova does kind of similar with her gates while having a more engaging skillset on the side.

Probably yes. As an Ash main it's my destiny to dislike Loki. A聽Loki main wouldn't think different about Ash. 馃槀馃ぃ馃槀

But I think you get what I mean. It's not that they are trash. It's just the problem that they have the luck to work in current times.

Edited by ES-Flinter
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Inaros.

But I want to allow his health meme to still exist.

He was meant to be an "Egyptian Vampire" or something, however his vampire powers which were meant to help a team, doesn't really work in practice.

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Nekros needs a rework.聽

He聽is super boring ability wise (keep his聽3, make his 2 make stuff come TO him,聽 redisign 1 and 4)聽.聽 聽He was built around despoil+health conversion聽and his 4th for his survival.聽 聽The augment and health conversion mod eat up 2 of his slots before you even get started.聽 His 4 is a huge visual cluster $#^& for yourself and everyone else.聽 聽And thats all his starting position.聽 聽Make his 3 run off health from the start.聽 Make his passive act like health conversion from the start.聽 Boom we instantly get back 2 slots.聽 聽This would make it easier to run umbra mods.聽 聽His 1 and 4 should be more offensive.聽聽

His desocration/despoil needs to happen ALOT faster.聽 When im playing Nekros and slaughtering my way through enemies with melee the corpses dont get converted until they are behind me which is sometimes to later to be picked up even with vacuum.聽 So you either waste time back tracking or intentionally go slow (which is not how the game is played).聽 As soon as you murder stuff they should be converted.聽 Now people are going to say you should be chopping up bodies for more chances at loot but who does that except when you going after some incredibly stupid rare drop mod ?聽 聽 But this is another huge frustration with playing Nekros.

I cant help but be jelly of Khora with her 60+% drop rate and hydroid with his 100%.聽 聽Its all a matter of duration/range/channeled and Nekros does have advantages.聽 Mobile huge AoE looting...聽 But.... would always be nice for better %.聽 聽I think if Strength affected loot% chance it would change up builds..... Mine is like 34% strength right now or something lol.聽 聽 This would play into umbra mods and more offensive kit also.聽 聽 I think Khora should get bumped to 100% and Nekros should get capped with strength bonus at 75% loot chance.聽 Poor atlas I dont know... 50-75% since he is mobile??聽

I put sooooo many hours into Nekros.. he is still my #1 most used frame even though im trying to take him down.聽 聽I havent used him alot in years...聽 I miss him but I know he isnt very fun to play.聽聽

-----------------------------

Harrow has some interesting mechanics but he is like paper.聽 I thought his 3 augment gave him damage reduction but its only while he is swinging his incense which is next to worthless.聽 聽If he got damage reduction for the DURATION of his 3 that would be a nice game changer for Harrow I think.聽聽

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Nyx. Mostly because I loved her back when I was single-digit MR and want her to matter.

Her first ability doesn't matter. One Eximus aura goes from their side to your side? And might have damage upped by 500% if you spend a mod on it? Wow, I'd definitely notice that. But at least it's thematic.聽 If we could tack on Revenant's聽 spreading thrall ability it'd be marvelous.

The second can be handy.聽 Removing exactly 99% (or all, if you prefer) of an enemy's armor with a button press is neat. I guess I wouldn't change it.

Chaos is fun.聽 I can reproduce it for 0 energy/no cast time with about three dozen of my weapons; except that'll do damage. Also make them do more damage against each other, for what it's worth.聽

Absorb with augment's fine as long as you don't have any allies.聽 If you do, though, a stray bullet will drain your energy & turn it off. Making you immune to ally damage would go a long way towards making it better.

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Loki has a boring kit, but I wouldn't suggest a major rework, he has a solid function, easy access to stealth with higher mobility than his competitors. He's the go to choice for Grineer Spy missions. His switch has unique uses, his decoy is needed for his switch, and his disarm isn't useless, as evident in a harder mode where enemies actually threaten allies.聽

They could come up with some improvements for his clone so it has some durability, and maybe uses your equipment to actually deal damage for a moment. But his only other flaw is that聽taking narrow minded for best invisibility duration pretty much cancels his disarm.

Banshee is very effective at two diametrically different things, her augmented sound quake is great at regular interceptions聽to keep foes off the panel, and clear tiles of trash mobs, and it shouldn't scale because it's a mindless button mash. Her other abilities allow her to jeopardize tons of enemies. The real problem is that her build kind of emphasizes one or the other, if her quake build scaled universally like her 2and and 3re ability, players wouldn't mind switching abilities for the situation.

Unfortunately with the converse builds and the聽load out limitations, players pick one and don't have tactical options. Which is bad design. All she really needs is a quake that primarily scales with duration. Maybe an edge function, like sound abilities ignoring shields or armor would help too, it would just make her equally effective against all factions instead of just unarmored targets.聽

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Inaros, Nekros, and Chroma. No major rework for anything, but some tweaking would be nice.

Inaros is a good frame but boring;聽his 2 and 3 are absolute trash as abilities. They need to either be replaced or overhauled.

Nekro's 1 is garbage, since his 2 does the same job in terms of聽CC. Only problem is that his 2 is contradictory in nature: armor stripping but now your enemies are scattered all over the place. Augments can solve both, but that's just wasting mod slots.

Chroma's another good frame, but his 1 and 4 are terrible. His 4 in particular works against himself with the聽armor reduction, kinda defeating the purpose of his 3. How does having an ultimate be a debuff make any sense? If you want a sentry to fight by your side, you might as well make a specter.

Edited by R.O.G.U.E.
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Just to mention he does not need聽a rework just a revisit but Ash needs one.

The 1st ability is only good with its augment. Augments should be used as an option and not coz the ability on its own is bad, the 2nd ability could benefit by having better cc and even through ppl say that his invisible is too short I have no issue with it, the 3rd ability has potential to be so much better just of the concept of teleportation alone and the 4th ability is terrible when it comes to activation speed, it`s too slow and other ppl can take your kills (even in low levels) and even more things that make it bad.

Overall Ash is a contradiction to what DE wants ppl to do in this game.... PLAY AS A TEAM, that's why he needs to be looked at again.

Here is a post showing his issues and the ways to fix them.


Since you mentioned Banshee I have some ideas to improve her, tell me what you think.

Spoiler

NEW Passive: Depending on the level of noise in the environment will determine the weapons and abilities performance.

路聽聽聽聽聽聽 There is a sound indicator showing the volume level of noise.

路聽聽聽聽聽聽 If there is no sound, weapons will be silenced.

路聽聽聽聽聽聽 If there is noise in the environment, her ability strength will increase based on the level of noise.

路聽聽聽聽聽聽 Sounds that Banshee makes does not add to the volume gauge.

1st ability:

路聽聽聽聽聽聽 Enemies hit will receive a 30% slower knockdown recovery.

路聽聽聽聽聽聽 Enemies that hit a hard surface will take more damage.

路聽聽聽聽聽聽 It can reflect projectile weapons back at enemies.

路聽聽聽聽聽聽 Can be used on the move.

路聽聽聽聽聽聽 Can break breakable objects.

2nd ability:

路聽聽聽聽聽聽 Can be used on the move.

路聽聽聽聽聽聽 (Synergy) Enemies affected take increase damage from her 1st and 4th ability.

3rd ability:

路聽聽聽聽聽聽 Enemies will notice you within a 10m of their vision.

路聽聽聽聽聽聽 Enemies will have a slower reaction time when noticing you (if you stand in front of them it will take them 3 seconds until they react to your presents)

路聽聽聽聽聽聽 If you hold the ability, you can control how far the ability reaches based on how much range it has.

路聽聽聽聽聽聽 Show the radius of the ability.

路聽聽聽聽聽聽 Put an indicator above enemies鈥 head to show how quickly they will be alerted by seeing you. (like stealth games)

路聽聽聽聽聽聽 If enemies are alerted, casting this ability will revert them back to being un-alerted however they will still be alerted if the alarms are on or if you are in their sights.

路聽聽聽聽聽聽 Can be used on the move.

路聽聽聽聽聽聽 Remove muffled sound.

路聽聽聽聽聽聽 (Synergy) If you use after casting the 2nd ability, you can see enemies through walls. It will also give you 4.0 punch-through on weapons. (can be increased by strength mods)

4th Ability:

路聽聽聽聽聽聽 Enemies will be suspended in the air.

路聽聽聽聽聽聽 After being cast, you can now move around while active.

路聽聽聽聽聽聽 It drains 6 energy a second.

路聽聽聽聽聽聽 After deactivation, enemies will have their damage reduced by 80%.

路聽聽聽聽聽聽 Can break breakable objects.

路聽聽聽聽聽聽 (Synergy) because this makes continues noise, the volume gauge will be at its highest as long as the ability is active.

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Hydroid 100%. He absolutely sucks, plain and simple. Really cool water elemental theme, really poor execution.

Tempest Barrage聽absolutely sucks and even the Corrosive Barrage augment can't save it anymore, since the Damage 3.0 update made corrosive next to useless. It's also RNG based, which means that there is never a 100% guarantee that you'll hit an enemy.聽

Tidal Surge is simply Excalibur's old Slash Dash and is just as useless.

Undertow removes 99.9% of the games fun and slows the gameplay to a whiplash-inducing halt. This is Hydroid's main way of dealing any sort of damage and it absolutely sucks, since you have to wait for like two minutes to kill a lvl 50 enemy. The amount of time it takes to kill anything above that is just too long to count.聽

Tentacle Swarm is just as useless and unpredictable today as it was when it first released. It becomes even more apparent how useless the ability is when its used in the open world maps and even the newer Corpus tilesets, which are very spacious. As with Barrage, its also very RNG based and the only time you will ever be 100% guaranteed to hit an enemy is during the initial casting. After that, you might as well just sit there and hope聽to the Gods that the enemy AI will聽walk into the ability.

Also, for some reason somebody thought it would be a good idea to at charge mechanics to his 1st and 4th, which only further exacerbated the issues with them.聽

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