Echoes of Duviri: Hotfix 33.6.4

[quxier]

6 hours ago, McRibbles said:

Knows what?

[Amolistic.]

3 hours ago, Limelight143 said:

Thanks! I was actually also looking forward to seeing changes made to that obnoxious "Garuda - Thermal Sunder" build that has been plaguing pub runs. 

You haven't see a bigger plague that is rhino thermal sunder yet. Roar scale abnormally with thermal sunder. This is even more gamebreaking in duviri SP.

And Imagine a garuda or a harrow with thermal sunder + roar. You will see hell everywhere. Even Wave 14+ ESO is not going to stop them.

Gauss nuke is great already? Put that roar on to gauss and gauss mains do be smiling hard when cashing in ten millions of blast dmg.

 

I do agree it does need changes. It is simply too broken, even more with roar, and even more in duviri.

 

Edited August 16, 2023 by Amolistic.

[The_Android]

And still the console is not pointing to the correct forum/article to actually see what the update does.  For 10 years you posted updates correctly, why is this being a challenge now?

[MobyTheDuck]

1 hour ago, Hexerin said:

Not sure what you're talking about with the stealth, but the multishot issue has pretty much killed the entire incarnon system for me. No point investing time and resources into something that doesn't even work correctly. On top of that, the requirement of specifically headshots is just obnoxious. I have no problems with the concept behind that, rewarding skill is absolutely based. However, they need to also gain charge from body/limb shots.

The obvious way to handle that is make body/limb shots grant 1 charge, while headshots grant like 3 or 5 charges. Increase the total charge capacity, but reduce the ammo per charge so that you still end up with the same (or close to same) total ammo in incarnon mode. This way nothing changes for those who get headshots, but those who don't/can't (accessibility for those with physical disabilities, anyone?) can also actually have proper fun with the system.

THOUSANDS OF YEARS AGO there was an update to the enemy AI system, one of them being that they would notice corpses more often and get alerted.

This caused a problem with multishot due how linear coding is.
You shoot at an unaware enemy using a gun with 2 multishot, the first shot damages the enemy, but doesn't kills it. Now, the enemy is in an "alert" state. The second bullet in the multishot hits the enemy, but since the enemy was considered "alert", your stealth multiplier is now lost.

Basically, after that update, the enemies can detect the moment between lines of code between the first and last bullet in a multishot.

[Hexerin]

2 minutes ago, MobyTheDuck said:

THOUSANDS OF YEARS AGO there was an update to the enemy AI system, one of them being that they would notice corpses more often and get alerted.

This caused a problem with multishot due how linear coding is.
You shoot at an unaware enemy using a gun with 2 multishot, the first shot damages the enemy, but doesn't kills it. Now, the enemy is in an "alert" state. The second bullet in the multishot hits the enemy, but since the enemy was considered "alert", your stealth multiplier is now lost.

Basically, after that update, the enemies can detect the moment between lines of code between the first and last bullet in a multishot.

Ah yea, that's not good. Easily understood how it happened, but should absolutely be fixed.

On a personal note, however, that is not an issue for me. Stealth multiplier is just an affinity boost, and I farm my affinity via SO.

[quxier]

50 minutes ago, KitMeHarder said:

7 hours ago, Tiltskillet said:

But why do you see the problem with it but are fine with Mesmer Skin and Mesmer Shield?

• 1) Coop-wise, Styanax's is much stronger. Revenant cast Mesmer Skin way less often than Styanax cast Final Stand (his bread-and-butter damage source). Add in overguard gate, and the other 3 players are waaay tankier.
  • It also means it's basically free to cast (aka not the main point of the ability).
• 2) Styanax's overguard can not be nullified by any source, unlike MS and its aug.

1) Players may not even use Final stand. Without augment it's more limiting than "giving".

2) Styanax' can be "nullified".... by damage source. 15k damage + 0.5 second and you go to HP. Mesmer skin have short immortality time on each hit.

[Tiltskillet]

1 hour ago, KitMeHarder said:

Styanax's overguard can not be nullified by any source, unlike MS and its aug.

That's definitely a good point.  And I feel like that might be a bug;  same with Kullervo Recompense.  Iron Skin, the Avalanche augment, and Rumbled all get nullified.

[Eclipse2024Qc]

Il y a 10 heures, [DE]Danielle a dit :

Corrupted Jackal Undercroft Assassination Changes: 

• The following changes have been made to address feedback that the fight feels a tad too challenging on the Steel Path. 
  • The Corrupted Jackal Asssassination mission will now appear at stage 4 and onwards in The Circuit to ensure players have had a chance to earn more Decrees before taking it on. 
  • Slightly reduced Jackal's health and the number of grenades Jackal fires in phases 1 & 2. 

You destroying my favorite game, last time I did to kill the corrupt Jackal and now, since update you destroy my enjoyment of playing my favorite game. I hate your idea. >:(

[Dioxety]

These changes are nice, I was hoping for some Soma Incarnon buffs as it's still really weak. No Synergy between Incarn form and regular due to losing the crit.

[Vryheid]

Making overguard stackable on Frost's augment is a fantastic change for him that singlehandedly turns Avalanche into one of the strongest support abilities in the game. Combined with the recent buffs to Overguard, Frost is damn near unkillable even in SP Circuit, as he can keep triggering his shield/overguard gates over and over while armor stripping and stunning enemies in a huge radius. He's even easier to use for team overguard spam than Styanax because he doesn't have to aim or even line of sight any enemies to trigger this over and over. Styanax's overguard augment depending on affinity range instead of ability range does mean it's easier to build around though, and Styanax's version tends to build up team overguard much more quickly, so I'd say they're about on par with each other in terms of effectiveness.

[Voltage]

9 hours ago, XHADgaming said:

That's not the point, the point is because of how challenging it is in both scenarios not how fast it is.

Ok, so improve your loadout and builds. People spent the last 7 years saying "don't balance around Rivens", and now we're asking to balance around Decrees?

[Slayer-.]

12 hours ago, VCen7 said:

Thanks for the Wisp prime fix :D

But there is still a problem with the prime model.

Don't get me wrong but, her posterior looks so shrunken :/

 

Don't worry, a Kardashian butt implant is in the mail. 

7 hours ago, Tiltskillet said:

That's definitely a good point.  And I feel like that might be a bug;  same with Kullervo Recompense.  Iron Skin, the Avalanche augment, and Rumbled all get nullified.

Yeah, tell me about it, fighting the Jackel in SP with Rhino.  

I was running around like a headless chook staying alive and helping to kill it in between losing iron skin and nearly dying in the first shot.

4 hours ago, Dioxety said:

These changes are nice, I was hoping for some Soma Incarnon buffs as it's still really weak. No Synergy between Incarn form and regular due to losing the crit.

The Soma/P was a big letdown for that gun for me, though I guess it does kill in carny mode not as fast as others but at the same time the non-carny mode is even better now at least.

 

Thank you DE for fixing the Spacekid camera rotation, wasn't nice trying to get back into the fight only to realise I've just void-dashed off a cliff. 

[BobberyPrime]

13 hours ago, Ace-Bounty-Hunter said:

Clearly you've never played Styanax. Using his 4 suspends him in midair and effectively makes him a sitting duck. You can't cast other abilities or dodge roll until he's done throwing his javelins. It doesn't take much for enemies to completely shred through his overguard, shields and his health in between casts, because he also needs to land on the ground to recast his 4.

Having a lot of overguard was at least a nice buffer. Now he's about as useless as a chocolate fireguard, 

> Useless

Coming from someone who's relatively well-versed in Styanax: This nerf may hinder him at level cap, but not much otherwise. I think a lot of people aren't acknowledging the part where the 15k cap scales with ability strength. With my currently ran build, my max cap is around 55k with Molt Augmented fully stacked. Sure, that can still get shredded after a certain point, but most people who don't do endurance will hardly be stopped by this nerf. 

Moreover,

9 hours ago, KitMeHarder said:

• Coop-wise, Styanax's is much stronger. Revenant cast Mesmer Skin way less often than Styanax cast Final Stand (his bread-and-butter damage source). Add in overguard gate, and the other 3 players are waaay tankier.
  • It also means it's basically free to cast (aka not the main point of the ability).
• After this hotfix, overguard provides more status/CC immunity than MS does.
• Styanax's overguard can not be nullified by any source, unlike MS and its aug.
• MS does worse in lower levels, but Styanax's does good in low and high levels thanks to overguard gate.
• Etc...

And MS also has some upsides, but at least as a support tool for 99% of the game, Styanax's way better (even for that 1%, constant overguard gate is pretty good).

Combine overguard gating with shield gating, and Styanax still crushes absolutely everything in his way. As long as his 4 is hitting an enemy, he will constantly overguard gate. He's going to be fine. The doomsday mentality in this thread thinking Styanax is dead need to consider all of this before screeching all hope is lost.

Edited August 16, 2023 by BobberyPrime

[Endymion0021]

I don't get all the crying about the overguard cap on Styanax, if you were able to hit millions of overguard, you did not realy need it in the first place.

With my current setup 400% strength with molt augmentet stacked, which stacks 240 overguard per hit with 63 spears per volley, if you hit most you get 15k - 25k overguard with some double hits, thats still 3 casts for hitting the cap (which 15k times 400% is 60k) and assuming not getting hit at all.

Most Steelpath missions without a major CC frame in the party I rarely got above 100K overguard in the firstplace, since it got used up and replaced at an equal pace.

Additionaly Rallypoint supplying everyone with (over)shields on kill and the constant stream of energy which you can multiply with nourish to absurd levels, you can't complain him being weaker than before he got the augment (or buggy release Styanax).

[Numerounius]

7 hours ago, Voltage said:

Ok, so improve your loadout and builds. People spent the last 7 years saying "don't balance around Rivens", and now we're asking to balance around Decrees?

Again, missing the point! This isn't about my own experiences about how fast or how easy I am going through the fight nor am I asking it to balanced around decrees.

I am quoting the patch note and explaining the hypocrisy behind changing one instance of the Jackal fight because it is quoted as being too challenging and prolonging the fight to ensure players have decrees before facing it yet it is still able to be fought with the same amount of decrees as before in another instance.

Edited August 16, 2023 by XHADgaming

[---Matiz753---]

It's bad option when you buff almost everything when game don't give any challange

[Cerikus]

20 hours ago, [DE]Danielle said:

Overguard granted by Frost’s Icy Avalanche Augment Mod now stacks on cast (up to 15k, which scales with Ability Strength) instead of keeping the highest value from the original or recast. 

Thank you!

[Inquizitor]

Fix the Eximus Bailiff codex entry.

[Leqesai]

19 hours ago, SngLol said:

Reverse the new Overguard cap. It really ruined all my Overguard builds. the cap is extremely low compared to what I could usually get and it would still deplete to zero from time to time. This new cap has me thinking of trashing all my builds focusing Overguard, because it's no longer useful. I'm going back to Revenant, at least I can trust that.

Lol

[Cyco_tK]

Chat box moving when loading into missions has STILL not been fixed, it's been 4 updates now and not even a single mention of this issue regardless of being posted on every update! Please fix this, it's so annoying!

[Doomelf]

20 hours ago, Ace-Bounty-Hunter said:

Clearly you've never played Styanax. Using his 4 suspends him in midair and effectively makes him a sitting duck. You can't cast other abilities or dodge roll until he's done throwing his javelins. It doesn't take much for enemies to completely shred through his overguard, shields and his health in between casts, because he also needs to land on the ground to recast his 4.

Having a lot of overguard was at least a nice buffer. Now he's about as useless as a chocolate fireguard, 

 

Final Stand limits his movement a lot, but can increase it with sprint speed bonuses such as those from Amalgam Serration and Praedos. Will be getting overguard from Intrepid Stand constantly so won't need Primed Sure Footed and can go with Rush for even more sprint speed. It's quite noticeable so won't be a sitting duck anymore. This also helps with survivability as the additional freedom while moving makes Styanax even harder to hit and enemies don't have good accuracy to begin with.

The most important factor to keeping Styanax alive and preserving his overguard is killing enemies fast. On a min-maxed Final Stand build will be using Holster Amp, Arcane Arachne and Vigorous Swap which affect the ability's base damage and are multiplicative to ability strength. At base steel path enemies will be dying instantly so Bleed procs won't even have time to shine.

For even more survivability have the option to use the uncharged shot of Epitaph before casting Final Stand for additional CC with forced Cold procs and Blast ones which reduce enemy accuracy even more. Since will be used as a primer, the Viral procs will contribute for even more damage as well. At base steel path is unnecessary, though helps against eximus and acolytes.

There are players who have reached and maintained over a million overguard in steel path before the Intrepid Stand change. How do you think that was possible if Styanax had issues preserving his overguard? And here we have people complaining they can't maintain the amount Intrepid Stand can reach after the change.

With overguard having a 0.5s invulnerability period when broken and another from the shield gate the only way Styanax can die is if the one playing him has skill or build issues. Even if are playing at high levels such as in the thousands where overguard will be breaking frequently still won't have survivability issues if are using Vazarin with its amazing Protective Sling and Guiardian Break nodes.

 

[iPathos]

16 hours ago, quxier said:

1) Players may not even use Final stand. Without augment it's more limiting than "giving".

2) Styanax' can be "nullified".... by damage source. 15k damage + 0.5 second and you go to HP. Mesmer skin have short immortality time on each hit.

Nullifiers remove Mesmer Skin, they do not remove overguard given by Intrepid Stand.

Players not using Final Stand is a choice, same as all abilities.

[iPathos]

Just to back up your claim above @Doomelf - this took all of five minutes within the simulacrum.

So managing similar numbers within actual missions is certainly something that was being done, with ease. 😁

[--N--]

On 2023-08-15 at 9:19 PM, [DE]Danielle said:

• Fixed controls for Komi, Recover the Paragrimm’s Tomes, and the security cameras in Break Narmer missions not working when using Steam input. 

The camera in Break Narmer (Sneaky Sabotage) does not work on the Steam Deck with the official layout. RS moves the camera, but A and B do nothing. Steam + R2 (to simulate a mouse click) doesn't work either, but Steam + L2 (right click) at least lets me exit it and abort instead of having to abort the game.

[quxier]

6 hours ago, iPathos said:

22 hours ago, quxier said:

1) Players may not even use Final stand. Without augment it's more limiting than "giving".

2) Styanax' can be "nullified".... by damage source. 15k damage + 0.5 second and you go to HP. Mesmer skin have short immortality time on each hit.

Nullifiers remove Mesmer Skin, they do not remove overguard given by Intrepid Stand.

 

 Yes, but at some point enemies will deal 15k damage so it's like Overguard has been "nulliefied" (removed in short time)

6 hours ago, iPathos said:

22 hours ago, quxier said:

1) Players may not even use Final stand. Without augment it's more limiting than "giving".

Players not using Final Stand is a choice, same as all abilities.

Yes, but there are less rewards to use Final stand, hence less usage.

ps. you can use multiple quotes

7 hours ago, Doomelf said:

There are players who have reached and maintained over a million overguard in steel path before the Intrepid Stand change. How do you think that was possible if Styanax had issues preserving his overguard? And here we have people complaining they can't maintain the amount Intrepid Stand can reach after the change.

What's weird about it? Certain setups lets you do "magic". For example base Sevagoth 1+2 do not great damage (not even considering SP). However you can:

- put few hundred of Strength and see Debuff having bigger change

- or put grouping enemies and spam 1+2 -> closer enemies the more damage they get, I've tested it pre SP Simulacrum and I could deal even with Corrupted heavies (not sure if it were 100 or 155).