Chroma changes?

[Neloc]

I wanted to start a discussion on possible chroma changes.

First some background I have been playing warframe since before chroma was released. Before chroma I mainly had played Rhino for the survivability. I switched to chroma based on his design and at the time he was similar to Rhino, aka had a good defense ability and a damaging boosting ability. Chroma back then became my most played warframe for a time, but eventually I switched to other warframes and other games. 

I never really played chroma during his hay days of eidelon hunting because I never really did that content much. I recently came back to chroma and found him more or less the same since I last played him, with only slight qol changes in his 1 and 3. 

Now I put this background up so people know that I am not a 500 hour chroma main and I am just wanting to start a discussion about possible changes to make chroma more interesting or less clunky to play.

I now wanna talk about some of my slight annoyances I have had coming back to chroma after many years of playing different warframes.

1: I would like to go the ability I have the most grief with first, which is his 3. I like what the ability does however I feel like there are a lot of unnecessary restrictions on it. For one it is only a weapon buff (except for chroma's abilities), two it's additive damage instead of multiplicative (which a lot of arcanes do now without having to take damage), third you have to take damage just to get the buffs, and finally is the fact that it is a buff you have to remember to constantly recast.

So most of these I can overlook if some of the others were addressed. For instance if this became a toggleable ability I feel like it would alleviate some of the issues. There are so many things that can shut off your abilities, anything from a myriad of enemies to accidentally falling off the map. Now I am going to make a lot of comparisons to other damage buffs like roar. Both roar and vex can be turned off the same ways, however you can recast vex before it finishes but you have to wait for roar to run out. Vex can reach a higher percentage but the damage is comparable to roar if you take into account that roar can also benefit faction mods.

Now my point roar is at full strength everytime you press the button no setup necessary. Now compare this to vex armor that has to be charged up each time and you can see the problem. Now if vex was togglable you wouldn't have to worry about losing it just because you missed the timing to press 3 again. Because loosing your buff on chroma is a lot more punishing than probably any other ability that you need to constantly refresh since you have to loose a massive amount of armor you were using for survivability and then build it back up by taking damage right after losing a massive amount of armor.

This is just one option to fixing this ability,  others might be just make it max out when you press it without having to take damage.

 

2: I feel like chroma's 2 and 3 could be combined into one ability. They have basically the same cooldown and I cannot think of a situation where you would have one on and not the other. This creates the monotony of having to press buttons for just upkeep. Let's compare this to other warframes that have to constantly press buttons. Such as Gauss or Lavos both are constantly pressing buttons but the feeling of pressing 1 on gauss and sprinting at high speeds or pressing 3 on lavos and sending out a alchemical probe that creates a ton of universal orbs to help your team. Both feel and are visually more satisfying than chroma doing a little shake on two separate abilities just to maintain buffs.

So as I stated before I think these abilities should be combined. And if the previous change of changing the three to togglable was adopted then I believe whenever you cycle through his one the elemental buff would change without recasting 3 to avoid resetting your buffs.

 

3: Now my previous point brings up a new problem "If we combine his 2 and his 3 what would fill the gap?" This is some of my most drastic changes and are well out of just a touch up and more of a full rework. If all the previous suggestions were adopted then I purpose we move his current 1 to his 2 and make it more of a cone than a line when he breaths fire and it is no longer a constant stream but creates a cone like Frost's ice wave (but probably not as big) and it would leave an elemental after effect on the ground in said cone afflicting statuses. Possibly even allowing for elements to be combined, for instance if he breathed a toxin cone then a fire cone it would create a gas cloud in the cone area.

This leads to his new 1 which I think should be a claw swipe that inflicts slash. It would need to be short range and it's damage would scale with ability strength and vex armor buff. 

Finally to bring it all together a change to his 4. Instead of effigy it becomes Aspect of the Dragon. This leans back on chroma's buffing nature with a self buff. Upon activation Chroma's effigy flies just above him and buffs all his other abilities by adding range, efficiency, and strength while also keeping its passive to earn more credits and its active to periodically scream and stagger enemies. This of course would be a timed buff since we are assuming his 3 is toggled now.

 

Again this post is just to start a discussion and I would like long time chroma players to chime in and let me know what they think. I hope I did a good job of explaining and of keeping the essence of chroma. As much as I would like to see all of these changes I think just a few of them could go a long way to making chroma more interactive to play and less of just a timer watching simulator. Please let me know your thoughts or if there was something I missed. 

Edited January 25 by Neloc

[(PSN)robotwars7]

IMO his 2 and 3 are OK, it's his 1 and 4 that desperately need buffing.

- Spectral Scream should be converted to the damage calculations used by beam weapons after they were reworked, instead of the current status-per-second setup. even without tweaking the base damage of the ability this would result in an immense sustained DPS increase because it would be applying several times per second. the visuals should also reflect this, with it appearing as a true concentrated jet of flame with a noticeable AoE at the impact point of the stream. look up basically any image of a fantasy dragon breathing fire and you'll see what I mean.

- Effigy should act like an exalted sentinel, with independent flight and attack patterns, and significantly reduced energy consumption or a set duration and cost. damage should be buffed and being able to apply Vex Armor, elemental ward to allies independently would also be kind of neat IMO.

[Neloc]

14 minutes ago, (PSN)robotwars7 said:

IMO his 2 and 3 are OK, it's his 1 and 4 that desperately need buffing.

- Spectral Scream should be converted to the damage calculations used by beam weapons after they were reworked, instead of the current status-per-second setup. even without tweaking the base damage of the ability this would result in an immense sustained DPS increase because it would be applying several times per second. the visuals should also reflect this, with it appearing as a true concentrated jet of flame with a noticeable AoE at the impact point of the stream. look up basically any image of a fantasy dragon breathing fire and you'll see what I mean.

- Effigy should act like an exalted sentinel, with independent flight and attack patterns, and significantly reduced energy consumption or a set duration and cost. damage should be buffed and being able to apply Vex Armor, elemental ward to allies independently would also be kind of neat IMO.

The exalted sentinel idea is kinda a cool idea. I wonder if it could also be like a venari kind of thing where you could have it follow, defend, or attack. And like you said you could send it to allies and they could be another affinity bubble spreading his 2 and 3.

[trst]

Personally I feel like a lot of his issues would be resolved if his status chance wasn't awful and un-moddable. Since we've received multiple mods/mechanics that benefit from status effects and multiple have been reworked.

Scream would be a lot better if he could apply multiple stacks per second thus you'd only need to have it cast for a second or two and get the DOT/Armor stripping/Crit buff on a crowd of enemies instead of his fixed 1 proc/s. Or Effigy being able to apply those effects to an entire room instead of being a turret that doesn't do much but mediocre damage and unimpactful CC.

 

As for the things brought up here, Vex Armor would be pretty broken if it was a toggle considering how much armor and damage it grants. It's also not really fair to compare it to Roar when that's the only damage buff that applies like Faction mods.

While Elemental Ward would make more sense as a toggle but then consider that having a toggle means Chroma no longer benefits from energy regen with it active.

[Bahamutr13]

For for Effigy, exalted sentinel looks cool. But, I feel it needs to do more than just be that.
Lets treat Effigy more like Chroma's Stand and give elements more of a role to what effigy can do.

This is just a rough example

Effigy:

• No lag time when casting and is faster to cast
• Heat:
  • On Initial cast: Effigy charges forward like a meteor crashing at aim point and dealing fire damage.
  • While Active: Effigy will keep following nearest player after reaching aim point.
• Cold:
  • On Initial cast: Effigy roars and creates a blizzard which freezes enemies in a area
  • While Active: Effigy will be stationary.
• Electric:
  • On Initial cast: Effigy becomes lightning for a short duration and zaps through each possible target in a radius .
  • While Active: Effigy will keep moving randomly around in a 30m radius around you; prefers staying higher from the ground. 
• Toxin:
  • On Initial cast: Effigy splashes forward a toxin wave.
  • While Active: Effigy will keep looking for loot and enemies to kill; Effigy picks up loot for you.

 

Edited January 26 by Bahamutr13

[(PSN)GEN-Son_17]

4 hours ago, (PSN)robotwars7 said:

IMO his 2 and 3 are OK, it's his 1 and 4 that desperately need buffing.

- Spectral Scream should be converted to the damage calculations used by beam weapons after they were reworked, instead of the current status-per-second setup. even without tweaking the base damage of the ability this would result in an immense sustained DPS increase because it would be applying several times per second. the visuals should also reflect this, with it appearing as a true concentrated jet of flame with a noticeable AoE at the impact point of the stream. look up basically any image of a fantasy dragon breathing fire and you'll see what I mean.

- Effigy should act like an exalted sentinel, with independent flight and attack patterns, and significantly reduced energy consumption or a set duration and cost. damage should be buffed and being able to apply Vex Armor, elemental ward to allies independently would also be kind of neat IMO.

Love these ideas! The beam weapon reference is especially cool and would fit perfectly to Chroma's setup.

The sentinel effigy idea has been on my mind for a long time! Combined with the improved 1 ability, effigy could be a really powerful ability that falls in line with other high offense oriented frames. 

[(PSN)Sentiel]

I love the Spectral Scream and Effigy suggestions by @(PSN)robotwars7

Except that I would prefer to be able to command Effigy. The idea of it roaming around is great but if it can also provide buffs, I'd like to be able to tell it to hold position.

As for the rest of Chroma's kit. I'd like for Vex Armor to get a HUD icon showing the current buffs and duration, similar to what Citrine has for example. It would make it easier to monitor the ability so it doesn't turn off.

Also, I'd like for Elemental Ward to be the ability that changes Chroma's element and also for it to be recastable. Abilities with set duration are outdated and user unfriendly.

[Xzorn]

Chroma never really had a hay day for Eidolon hunting. His Vex armor was nerf'd from Multiplicative to Additive then called a bug before hand.
There was actually a bug added during that period which made the buff double dip on weapons with combination elements as bade damage.
ie Staticor and Dark Split Swords gained double his Vex Damage.

• They tried to give him group value but the radius of his buff is too small. This paired with Chroma's need to use Blind Rage now in order to make the additive changes a reasonable damage buff. He is also forced into heavy Duration investment for both sanity and energy economy reason making that change pointless.
• IMO Effigy is just a dead skill concept. The skill would have to do some massive CC or AoE. It's one of those situations where just shooting is better.
• Chroma's need to invest heavily in Duration is partially what kills his Spectral Scream outside it's bad damage.

He's kinda not worth playing without 300%+ Power and that's not a thing for most frames. No matter how cool a skill rework idea is, he has a numerical problems that need to be fixed or it's probably going to fall short. Chroma without Narrow Minded and Blind Rage feels pretty bad to play. Plenty of frames like Gara, Trinity, Baruuk, Mesa and similar get 90%+ DR for 130-150% Power. Even with 340% Power my Chroma only has more eHP than these others because I also run QT on him.

Changing these numerical problems along with making Chroma want Ability Range is the first step.
Effigy being an alternate source of Chroma's buffs would be decent if he could afford the ability range.

[(XBOX)ECCHO SIERRA]

8 hours ago, (PSN)robotwars7 said:

IMO his 2 and 3 are OK, it's his 1 and 4 that desperately need buffing.

- Spectral Scream should be converted to the damage calculations used by beam weapons after they were reworked, instead of the current status-per-second setup. even without tweaking the base damage of the ability this would result in an immense sustained DPS increase because it would be applying several times per second. the visuals should also reflect this, with it appearing as a true concentrated jet of flame with a noticeable AoE at the impact point of the stream. look up basically any image of a fantasy dragon breathing fire and you'll see what I mean.

- Effigy should act like an exalted sentinel, with independent flight and attack patterns, and significantly reduced energy consumption or a set duration and cost. damage should be buffed and being able to apply Vex Armor, elemental ward to allies independently would also be kind of neat IMO.

I think his 1 should be scrapped entirely.

Im not saying what youre suggesting is a bad idea, but i dont think its enough and i dont see it scaling very well. 

His 4 being an "exalted sentinel" is an interesting concept. Right now its just bad.

His damage buff i wish theyd look at too, between arcanes and galvanized shot (and equivalents) "+900% serration damage" isnt that great. 

[TARINunit9]

I just want Spectral Scream to be replaced with the hit-boxes of the Nepheri. We can balance (or not) the damage later, just give me real dragon breath and not just that weak mist you exhale on a cold morning

[Neloc]

12 hours ago, trst said:

Personally I feel like a lot of his issues would be resolved if his status chance wasn't awful and un-moddable. Since we've received multiple mods/mechanics that benefit from status effects and multiple have been reworked.

Scream would be a lot better if he could apply multiple stacks per second thus you'd only need to have it cast for a second or two and get the DOT/Armor stripping/Crit buff on a crowd of enemies instead of his fixed 1 proc/s. Or Effigy being able to apply those effects to an entire room instead of being a turret that doesn't do much but mediocre damage and unimpactful CC.

 

As for the things brought up here, Vex Armor would be pretty broken if it was a toggle considering how much armor and damage it grants. It's also not really fair to compare it to Roar when that's the only damage buff that applies like Faction mods.

While Elemental Ward would make more sense as a toggle but then consider that having a toggle means Chroma no longer benefits from energy regen with it active.

I agree with the status procs itt would help if they were applied faster or if effigy could place down room wide procs.

However I do not agree that vex would be broken considering you have frames like revenant that can be both immortal and one shot most enemies in the game. Also there are plenty of powers that make you basically immortal and armor has diminishing returns. Honestly I am trying to get past the feeling of going from fully stacked chroma to nothing in an instance. A comparison I can think of is imagine playing nidus losing your 100 virulence stacks because a timer ran out? It would be a pretty terrible feeling, this is the feeling I am trying to alleviate by making vex armor a toggle

[Neloc]

12 hours ago, Bahamutr13 said:

For for Effigy, exalted sentinel looks cool. But, I feel it needs to do more than just be that.
Lets treat Effigy more like Chroma's Stand and give elements more of a role to what effigy can do.

This is just a rough example

Effigy:

• No lag time when casting and is faster to cast
• Heat:
  • On Initial cast: Effigy charges forward like a meteor crashing at aim point and dealing fire damage.
  • While Active: Effigy will keep following nearest player after reaching aim point.
• Cold:
  • On Initial cast: Effigy roars and creates a blizzard which freezes enemies in a area
  • While Active: Effigy will be stationary.
• Electric:
  • On Initial cast: Effigy becomes lightning for a short duration and zaps through each possible target in a radius .
  • While Active: Effigy will keep moving randomly around in a 30m radius around you; prefers staying higher from the ground. 
• Toxin:
  • On Initial cast: Effigy splashes forward a toxin wave.
  • While Active: Effigy will keep looking for loot and enemies to kill; Effigy picks up loot for you.

 

Wow I like all of these! This is a super cool idea I hope DE sees some of these and gets inspired. 

[Ocerkin]

On 2024-01-25 at 2:44 PM, Neloc said:

I wanted to start a discussion on possible chroma changes.

First some background I have been playing warframe since before chroma was released. Before chroma I mainly had played Rhino for the survivability. I switched to chroma based on his design and at the time he was similar to Rhino, aka had a good defense ability and a damaging boosting ability. Chroma back then became my most played warframe for a time, but eventually I switched to other warframes and other games. 

I never really played chroma during his hay days of eidelon hunting because I never really did that content much. I recently came back to chroma and found him more or less the same since I last played him, with only slight qol changes in his 1 and 3. 

Now I put this background up so people know that I am not a 500 hour chroma main and I am just wanting to start a discussion about possible changes to make chroma more interesting or less clunky to play.

I now wanna talk about some of my slight annoyances I have had coming back to chroma after many years of playing different warframes.

1: I would like to go the ability I have the most grief with first, which is his 3. I like what the ability does however I feel like there are a lot of unnecessary restrictions on it. For one it is only a weapon buff (except for chroma's abilities), two it's additive damage instead of multiplicative (which a lot of arcanes do now without having to take damage), third you have to take damage just to get the buffs, and finally is the fact that it is a buff you have to remember to constantly recast.

So most of these I can overlook if some of the others were addressed. For instance if this became a toggleable ability I feel like it would alleviate some of the issues. There are so many things that can shut off your abilities, anything from a myriad of enemies to accidentally falling off the map. Now I am going to make a lot of comparisons to other damage buffs like roar. Both roar and vex can be turned off the same ways, however you can recast vex before it finishes but you have to wait for roar to run out. Vex can reach a higher percentage but the damage is comparable to roar if you take into account that roar can also benefit faction mods.

Now my point roar is at full strength everytime you press the button no setup necessary. Now compare this to vex armor that has to be charged up each time and you can see the problem. Now if vex was togglable you wouldn't have to worry about losing it just because you missed the timing to press 3 again. Because loosing your buff on chroma is a lot more punishing than probably any other ability that you need to constantly refresh since you have to loose a massive amount of armor you were using for survivability and then build it back up by taking damage right after losing a massive amount of armor.

This is just one option to fixing this ability,  others might be just make it max out when you press it without having to take damage.

 

2: I feel like chroma's 2 and 3 could be combined into one ability. They have basically the same cooldown and I cannot think of a situation where you would have one on and not the other. This creates the monotony of having to press buttons for just upkeep. Let's compare this to other warframes that have to constantly press buttons. Such as Gauss or Lavos both are constantly pressing buttons but the feeling of pressing 1 on gauss and sprinting at high speeds or pressing 3 on lavos and sending out a alchemical probe that creates a ton of universal orbs to help your team. Both feel and are visually more satisfying than chroma doing a little shake on two separate abilities just to maintain buffs.

So as I stated before I think these abilities should be combined. And if the previous change of changing the three to togglable was adopted then I believe whenever you cycle through his one the elemental buff would change without recasting 3 to avoid resetting your buffs.

 

3: Now my previous point brings up a new problem "If we combine his 2 and his 3 what would fill the gap?" This is some of my most drastic changes and are well out of just a touch up and more of a full rework. If all the previous suggestions were adopted then I purpose we move his current 1 to his 2 and make it more of a cone than a line when he breaths fire and it is no longer a constant stream but creates a cone like Frost's ice wave (but probably not as big) and it would leave an elemental after effect on the ground in said cone afflicting statuses. Possibly even allowing for elements to be combined, for instance if he breathed a toxin cone then a fire cone it would create a gas cloud in the cone area.

This leads to his new 1 which I think should be a claw swipe that inflicts slash. It would need to be short range and it's damage would scale with ability strength and vex armor buff. 

Finally to bring it all together a change to his 4. Instead of effigy it becomes Aspect of the Dragon. This leans back on chroma's buffing nature with a self buff. Upon activation Chroma's effigy flies just above him and buffs all his other abilities by adding range, efficiency, and strength while also keeping its passive to earn more credits and its active to periodically scream and stagger enemies. This of course would be a timed buff since we are assuming his 3 is toggled now.

 

Again this post is just to start a discussion and I would like long time chroma players to chime in and let me know what they think. I hope I did a good job of explaining and of keeping the essence of chroma. As much as I would like to see all of these changes I think just a few of them could go a long way to making chroma more interactive to play and less of just a timer watching simulator. Please let me know your thoughts or if there was something I missed. 

im gonna add one thing, you said swap his 1 to his 2, id be okay with this under one condition, you switch it so like your proposed 4 his effigy hovers off him and does the breath attack while you can still use your weapons, because there is no reason to use the breath weapon over using your weapons, instead make it so its in addition to your firing your weapons

[Kronxito]

Idea for 1: dragon breath to do like Frost’s 2nd skill but leaving flames on the ground for some time (tied to duration)

Changing color and doing another breath could combine the elements and proc the corresponding status. 

 

 

[(PSN)GEN-Son_17]

34 minutes ago, Kronxito said:

Idea for 1: dragon breath to do like Frost’s 2nd skill but leaving flames on the ground for some time (tied to duration)

Changing color and doing another breath could combine the elements and proc the corresponding status. 

 

 

Nice synergy components here. Have it as a burst attack instead of being prolonged. To make it fair, I would remove cold from his arsenal and replace it with corrosive. Then I would buff/modify Frost's ice wave as a way to keep the two abilities completely separate. 

[DrivaMain]

I'll leave this very well-made rework concept here. This person went out of his way to create concept art demonstrating the new set of abilities. 

 

When Chroma Prime was released back in 2018, there was a huge mega thread with THOUSANDS of replies demanding DE for a complete thorough rework. Unfortunately, DE continues in their silence.  What we got back in 2020 is just minor tweaks that only address one issue (elemental cycling) while leaving the rest.

 

You can somewhat make Chroma shine in anything except a walking weapon platform in its current state today but requires expensive investments because Chroma demands A LOT of STR and energy.  You need at least 400% STR to make cold and electric ward's status chance to be 100%

[Monolake]

Quote

combine 2 and 3

Cant do that, other than being toggle-on buffs that you want to constantly have on, they are completely different abilities and Ele Ward is a helminth skill, so they cant be merged. Ele Ward is really the only interesting Chroma skill that can be played with for some creative builds - on other frames better than on Chroma.

Other than that hes just a walking Serration and a PT credit booster. He desperately needs a buff/change, but DE wont bother with him cause he still sees consistent if below average use due to PT farming, there are plenty other frames that need help before him.

(Its also worth noting that while other frames were getting buffs, Chroma only got colossal nerfs cause his power was 'unintended' result of DEs inept scripting multiplying all the elements with eachother and also working with some other buffs - all that got killed off)

Edited February 4 by Monolake

[Kronxito]

7 hours ago, Monolake said:

Cant do that, other than being toggle-on buffs that you want to constantly have on, they are completely different abilities and Ele Ward is a helminth skill, so they cant be merged. Ele Ward is really the only interesting Chroma skill that can be played with for some creative builds - on other frames better than on Chroma.

Other than that hes just a walking Serration and a PT credit booster. He desperately needs a buff/change, but DE wont bother with him cause he still sees consistent if below average use due to PT farming, there are plenty other frames that need help before him.

(Its also worth noting that while other frames were getting buffs, Chroma only got colossal nerfs cause his power was 'unintended' result of DEs inept scripting multiplying all the elements with eachother and also working with some other buffs - all that got killed off)

Chroma works very well. Only the 1 and 4 need rework. Thats all. 

Chroma is a beast on any content and it can kill any boss. Any. Boss. He is my go to for everything solo but excavation. Im talking about steelpath, sorties, archon, netracells, etc.

His 2 and 3 are just ok now. 

Edited February 4 by Kronxito

[Nerthiril]

On 2024-02-04 at 7:49 AM, Kronxito said:

Chroma works very well. Only the 1 and 4 need rework. Thats all. 

Chroma is a beast on any content and it can kill any boss. Any. Boss. He is my go to for everything solo but excavation. Im talking about steelpath, sorties, archon, netracells, etc.

His 2 and 3 are just ok now. 

That is kind of the issue with chroma and why it may be hard to see why they need a rework. They can kill any boss and sometimes are a beast at doing so. But Warframe is meant to build up that space power fantasy. You would be hard pressed to find frames that just cannot do end game activities no matter how hard you mod them or bring over powered weapons. Which is another part of bias towards chroma being good. Vex armor boosts gun damage. If your gun is good you can easily solo anything with chroma but that doesn’t mean the frame is good. Just your gun. Vex armor basically at the moment just frees up a mod slot for something other than serration allowing you to squeeze a bit more damage out from a gun. Chroma isn’t bad in my view by any stretch of the word but is definitely a horrible victim of power creep. Most you can say is he is a Jack of all trades master of none gunframe. Want tankyness. Rhino and Hydren. Gun Dps: Volt, Equinox, Rhino, or mirage. Ability Dps: Any and all caster frames. Support? (For the few who don’t run selfish chroma). Wisp or Citrine. His only real benefit is he can do everything decently. So he “Works well” in that sense of he can do end game missions (which every frame should be able to do and is why inaros is getting a rework).

All in all, chroma is just an outdated frame that is a relic of a lost time. (who I will keep using and refusing to give up on in hopes that one day they will see a proper rework)

[(PSN)Nykili]

Yeah our resident Dragonframe needs a little love I agree his 2nd and 3rd should combine and become a Toggle 2nd his 3rd should be the scream his effigy does and that when held also can swap elements BUT it affects the effigy's elemental attacks and the scream (procs a stack of that element to surrounding enemies) while the 1st's elemental swap affects the new buff and 1st elemental damage.

Edited February 11 by (PSN)Nykili

[(XBOX)Graysmog]

On 2024-01-25 at 4:55 PM, trst said:

Personally I feel like a lot of his issues would be resolved if his status chance wasn't awful and un-moddable. Since we've received multiple mods/mechanics that benefit from status effects and multiple have been reworked.

Scream would be a lot better if he could apply multiple stacks per second thus you'd only need to have it cast for a second or two and get the DOT/Armor stripping/Crit buff on a crowd of enemies instead of his fixed 1 proc/s. Or Effigy being able to apply those effects to an entire room instead of being a turret that doesn't do much but mediocre damage and unimpactful CC.

 

As for the things brought up here, Vex Armor would be pretty broken if it was a toggle considering how much armor and damage it grants. It's also not really fair to compare it to Roar when that's the only damage buff that applies like Faction mods.

While Elemental Ward would make more sense as a toggle but then consider that having a toggle means Chroma no longer benefits from energy regen with it active.

Honestly that's just more incentive to give Chroma an actual worthwhile Passive, like one that gives him Energy through the whole Rage mod mechanic or making it so elemental kills give a flat amount.

I'm also personally hoping that DE just gives him a heal in some fashion, he's a tank who thrives off of constantly taking damage and he doesn't heal? It just seems counter-intuitive.

Chroma also just has some dumb mechanics, like having Effigy halve your armor on a tank frame or making it so you can't keep at least two Ward buffs between variants. He just feels so intentionally handicapped despite him really not being all that powerful outside of niche scenarios.

[Vector-Sigma]

 I don't think my opinion will matter here but I'll try anyway..

I'm a solo Chroma main..( I do have rare moments where I try to play with others) 7906 hours with 35.7% on Chroma and 21.8% and still going with Chroma Prime. I use to be a Rhino main, 8% on Rhino and 15.7% on Rhino Prime. I don't use Narrow Minded. I Have 3 Tau Crimson shards on Chroma Prime, one being duration. I'm not good at stats math and I never felt right at mods, so whenever someone asks for my build I just tell them to look it up or find one better. I had a hard time back when Warframe came out, even tho I can do Solo Conjunction Survival on Steel Path for up to an hour or more with Chroma Prime, I still don't feel like I'm considered good. I just play what I like and how I mod. I run with Gotva Prime, Laetum and Nepheri and main Vazarin for its healing (Madurai or Zenurik for some Zariman missions) /profile Killerworld#632 / Vector-Sigma#599 for proof (merged)

Issues with Chroma before my own input:

1. Chroma Prime with Primed Flow or Archon Flow, the stats screen shows 855 energy but when I have all the energy its 854, its just 1 point but still why tell me 855 (bug?) 

2. At times when activating Vex Armor (not recast) I have to spend a second of the timer for it to start accumlating. (maybe its just me)

--

My input:

1. Chroma is power hungry, all my Arcanes, Mods and Shards, 1351% damage and 1720% armor from Vex (841% and 1071% with only shards and non activating mods (like growing power or molt augmented)). There is no limit to how much Power I can put except mod space, duration, energy and timing it right. Some frames get actual damage reduction and take more hits at higher levels compared to my 1720% with Umbral Fiber maxed (using all Umbrals) and I lose too much health that I have to rely on Vazarin to heal me and/or use fire Elemental Ward as a psuedo heal (you regain health if you don't lose to much) and because I need alot of power to survive on my own, my energy from maxed Blind Rage is impacted a lot. Using Maxed out Arcane Energize and Tau Amber Shard with energy orb effectiveness I still have moments where its not enough especially with the burn rate from Effigy and recasting Vex and Elemental, the moment I have zen with all this is when there is a lot of Eximus and they are dropping energy orbs or I get the enegy regen from Zariman/Sanctum. I don't feel comfortable not having more power to keep Vex super useful, I'd like to use Augment of having Elemental Ward stay on allies when I go or using the Effigy augment to move my Effigy and get energy returns but I can't because I'll end up not dishing enough or taking enough, even Effigy dies too quick.

There is still enemies I have to worry about besides level, there's the spine attack from Phroid, Kela if sortie gives her a boost in damage, Narmer's "All as one" attack, can one shot me and/or its slash damage. If im not quick to heal with Vazarin or step out of the Warframe while the timer goes. Lastly, Ancient Disruptors because of my requirement of Blind Rage and how Ancient Disruptors get more powerful with others near it and depending on level they can zap my 854 energy to scraps. A single level 40 Ancient Disruptor lowers 854 to 794 and a single level Ancient Disruptor at 195, 854 to 250 energy. Vex armor being the most expensive 116.25, idk the math but thats what the stats screen says and testing against an Ancient Disruptor in Simulacrum.

----

2. Spectral Scream, I rarely use it and when I do it is for energy emergencies because of Archon Flow. Spectral Scream is too weak even with my Vex buffs, wish it didn't have a casting cost. I'd like to see it changed to Elden Ring dragons' styles, where the breath flows more and more and has DoT on the floor of where it trailed or something more flashy and fun, since this is sci-fi game could do more by adding some technology/energy/effigy style thing to it like a blast effect when hitting enemies. Other part of me wants to launch giant elemental orbs like Latron Incarnon or like a BFG 9000 from Doom (Classic or 2016/Eternal) or something a futuristic dragon would do.

---

3. Elemental Ward.. 

The reason I don't use Narrow minded is because I like using Electricity. I only use Fire and Toxin for tough moments and need Electricity for Hijack. Using narrow minded lowers the range of helping others with the ward and with Electricity's range, can zap a bit better range when I get the double power and range boost from Void relics. Removing/nerfing that power damage adds more range also sucks since Chroma is power intensified.

I'd like to be able to have more range and have benefits of overguard and/or overshield or If you have fire active, you are immune or reduction to that element or get health when attacked by that element or killing an enemy with element type? (like Paladin's elemental auras or rares that have elemental healing from Diablo 2 or Gauss's Kinetic plating styled)  Chroma does need more attacks tho.. Maybe something like Qorvex and Vauban but in a dragon's way? Orowyrm? 

---

4. Speed and Vex

The most important skill on Chroma and even with my stats, I can't do crazy defense missions unless I have a good AoE and being quick about it, so I end up using the Amalgam Serration and Amar's Anguish on exilus slot since Chroma is slow to me and can't pull off ESO so I have to use frost for defense and Saryn for ESO even tho I'd rather main as Chroma. Atleast, with the sprint speeds, double jump and parkour boost I can do Void Flood and Cascade easily.

I understand the wanting of toggle but without toggle I am able to rely on other sources and I can have hope for an energy orb to pop around and hit the energize when I have zero energy. At toggle, it'll deflate at 0 energy and I'll be even more at the mercy of Ancient Disruptors unless they change something else with Vex. I'd rather it be more like Gyre's Cathode Grace, where killing enemies extends the duration and there are moments especially the no revive missions where I want Vex to stay up and not die easily just because I forgot to recast or didn't use it because I'm building up Molt Augmented. Vex armor is expensive and recasting drains so much with Effigy around too, 9.12 per sec with my setup.

All my mods are centered at Vex  and I dislike that. Sometimes I wish I could use Archon Range or the rage mods or an augment or something but not enough space on Warframes. 

I'd like to see a better UI on it, how do I know if my stats are even good? Yea big numbers sounds nice but what does my weapon damage look with 1351% vs Laetum's 50% chance to do 2000% Damage kinda thing.

I'd like where I don't need to supply so much power strength and get better or same benefits. Also, I want where when I cast Vex without Molt Aug at 250 and without other activations, that when I recast, I can make damage and armor go higher when I do have my activations and molt at 250. I always have to let my Vex turn off, re-do my dance of activations, growing power, power drain, molt augmeneted, Energy Conversion and then take damage so I can get to my 1351% damage.. if I miss one of those I'm stuck and have to re do my tango.

I know there is Pax Bolt and Exodia Brave but I like what I'm using but enegy costs are high enough.

The only thing I can think of to changing Vex is do something like a rage/stress meter but Chroma keeps growing in both categories, power strength allows you to handle more and accumulate quicker percentages before Chroma can't handle the stress which you then use Spectral Scream with synergy of stress and vex to lower stress and do a cool breath attack? (Thinking of Super Saiyans [Dragon Ball Z] or like Ember but I don't like Ember's penalties) might be OP sounding but at same time on circuit SP getting hit by enemies at round 6+ hurts and my current states don't help at super high level enemies.

---

5. Range..

Range seems so.. pointless if you aren't into electricity. Effigy doesn't seem to benefit from it and you'd think it would so that it can stun at furthur distances or have a more spread out attack. Elemental Ward doesn't benefit fire ring, would like it more so infested or melee types get hit before hitting me or when I run near storages its not 4m to hit with the fire ring.

Would like to see range incorporated more if they do something about the power creep thing.

----

6. Effigy

Its cool but its slow and doesn't deal much. I am using Archon Continuity for the Corrosion. Luckily Archon Flow works with it but it doesn't kill as fast with that breath and the 4 seconds interval of switching with stunning and spraying. I wish it did more than just spray. Doesn't help much on defense and Soloing Mirror defense is hard, I have to use Effigy and Nidus specter to help out. Sometimes I wish it was like the Jackal, shooting grenades and doing large swirling beams. Other times, I think of this game called Chaos Legion where Chroma's effigy looks like Perfect Thanatos, the being swirls like a football and strikes heavily at enemies knocking them down on the floor and its other attack is where it slows down time and launches a barrage of homing energy missiles. I even thought at one point why not ride the effigy like a kaithe and it has its attacks.. lol. All I can think of is one again some more attacks wise, remove the debuff or maybe help with stressor idea, improve time of stun and breath attack. Maybe an enemy puller function?  Some sort of grand AoE attack like Dragonlord Placidusax (elden ring) or be more effective like Hydroid's tentacle swarm. 

I do think its a good idea that effigy reacts different with each elemental or has more energy/tech looking attacks and synergy stuff. 

I've also wondered if maybe its something like Equinox, where once you summon effigy you are given another 3 abilities to use. 

Wish the energy drain and cost to cast was lower or is another duration thing. Needs more survivability. Shouldn't have an issue with Guardians. Too weak against Eximus units.

--

7. silly idea

Since Chroma is seen as a dragon and has the credit drop with effigy, why not have some sort of hoarder perk. Credits adds to this, getting resources adds another thing, mods, etcera. Get rare mod drops gives efficiency or something but I feel this idea would be crap since there is other issues and how would that add more to effigy's deficiency. 

---

 

summary..

Chroma demands power like fry demands 100 coffee in that Futurama episode. Synergies or make Chroma the frame that exalts in power strength, like Hildryn with shields. Would like to see spectral scream turned into either an elden ring's dragon's type breath or elemental orbs like Latron's Incarnon. Timer on elemental ward should have an increase as well as its range on all elements and maybe be something like Qorvex and vauban or offers elemental resist/absorbing to heal, like fire eximus doing fire but Chroma has fire so absorbs and heals team and perhaps included with affinity range. Vex armor, be like Cathode's grace, kill to gain time and allow where activation mods can still boost vex when recast when missed before or turn the ability into a stress meter and the only limit is how much chroma can take so a balance of making chroma chill out and go back in, using spectral at a high stress makes it really powerful, (projectile?) no limits or increased limit of how much damage and armor gained? I would imagine when enemies hit to hard the stress is always too high. Power strength to have a higher threshold and gains or efficency idk.. thought of super saiyans or games where you're in critcal and do very high damage but in warframe's critcal it'd be like meter like Ember. Range mods should effect effigy range and elementals not just electricity or bring back power strength giving range. Effigy, attacks more, hits more woth knockdowns, flys more, or does more AoE attacks or given abilities like using a kaithe or equinox or khora. Not good at defense missions compared to other frames. Drains to much. Lower cost and drain. Be able to hurt eximus better. Lastly, silly idea since Dragons are hoarders of treasure, why not get benefits from loot you pick up in a mission? Credits for more vex/elemental time? Anyway, thanks for reading, tried my best and I once again feel I'm a failure here lol but that's my problem, Idk what else to say or add without it sounding too OP or just another Augment. Want to use more than just Power Strength as a solo player but yea.. GL HF!

 

 

 

Edited February 18 by Vector-Sigma

[Nerthiril]

On 2024-02-18 at 4:29 PM, Vector-Sigma said:

 I don't think my opinion will matter here but I'll try anyway..

I'm a solo Chroma main..( I do have rare moments where I try to play with others) 7906 hours with 35.7% on Chroma and 21.8% and still going with Chroma Prime. I use to be a Rhino main, 8% on Rhino and 15.7% on Rhino Prime. I don't use Narrow Minded. I Have 3 Tau Crimson shards on Chroma Prime, one being duration. I'm not good at stats math and I never felt right at mods, so whenever someone asks for my build I just tell them to look it up or find one better. I had a hard time back when Warframe came out, even tho I can do Solo Conjunction Survival on Steel Path for up to an hour or more with Chroma Prime, I still don't feel like I'm considered good. I just play what I like and how I mod. I run with Gotva Prime, Laetum and Nepheri and main Vazarin for its healing (Madurai or Zenurik for some Zariman missions) /profile Killerworld#632 / Vector-Sigma#599 for proof (merged)

Issues with Chroma before my own input:

1. Chroma Prime with Primed Flow or Archon Flow, the stats screen shows 855 energy but when I have all the energy its 854, its just 1 point but still why tell me 855 (bug?) 

2. At times when activating Vex Armor (not recast) I have to spend a second of the timer for it to start accumlating. (maybe its just me)

--

My input:

1. Chroma is power hungry, all my Arcanes, Mods and Shards, 1351% damage and 1720% armor from Vex (841% and 1071% with only shards and non activating mods (like growing power or molt augmented)). There is no limit to how much Power I can put except mod space, duration, energy and timing it right. Some frames get actual damage reduction and take more hits at higher levels compared to my 1720% with Umbral Fiber maxed (using all Umbrals) and I lose too much health that I have to rely on Vazarin to heal me and/or use fire Elemental Ward as a psuedo heal (you regain health if you don't lose to much) and because I need alot of power to survive on my own, my energy from maxed Blind Rage is impacted a lot. Using Maxed out Arcane Energize and Tau Amber Shard with energy orb effectiveness I still have moments where its not enough especially with the burn rate from Effigy and recasting Vex and Elemental, the moment I have zen with all this is when there is a lot of Eximus and they are dropping energy orbs or I get the enegy regen from Zariman/Sanctum. I don't feel comfortable not having more power to keep Vex super useful, I'd like to use Augment of having Elemental Ward stay on allies when I go or using the Effigy augment to move my Effigy and get energy returns but I can't because I'll end up not dishing enough or taking enough, even Effigy dies too quick.

There is still enemies I have to worry about besides level, there's the spine attack from Phroid, Kela if sortie gives her a boost in damage, Narmer's "All as one" attack, can one shot me and/or its slash damage. If im not quick to heal with Vazarin or step out of the Warframe while the timer goes. Lastly, Ancient Disruptors because of my requirement of Blind Rage and how Ancient Disruptors get more powerful with others near it and depending on level they can zap my 854 energy to scraps. A single level 40 Ancient Disruptor lowers 854 to 794 and a single level Ancient Disruptor at 195, 854 to 250 energy. Vex armor being the most expensive 116.25, idk the math but thats what the stats screen says and testing against an Ancient Disruptor in Simulacrum.

----

2. Spectral Scream, I rarely use it and when I do it is for energy emergencies because of Archon Flow. Spectral Scream is too weak even with my Vex buffs, wish it didn't have a casting cost. I'd like to see it changed to Elden Ring dragons' styles, where the breath flows more and more and has DoT on the floor of where it trailed or something more flashy and fun, since this is sci-fi game could do more by adding some technology/energy/effigy style thing to it like a blast effect when hitting enemies. Other part of me wants to launch giant elemental orbs like Latron Incarnon or like a BFG 9000 from Doom (Classic or 2016/Eternal) or something a futuristic dragon would do.

---

3. Elemental Ward.. 

The reason I don't use Narrow minded is because I like using Electricity. I only use Fire and Toxin for tough moments and need Electricity for Hijack. Using narrow minded lowers the range of helping others with the ward and with Electricity's range, can zap a bit better range when I get the double power and range boost from Void relics. Removing/nerfing that power damage adds more range also sucks since Chroma is power intensified.

I'd like to be able to have more range and have benefits of overguard and/or overshield or If you have fire active, you are immune or reduction to that element or get health when attacked by that element or killing an enemy with element type? (like Paladin's elemental auras or rares that have elemental healing from Diablo 2 or Gauss's Kinetic plating styled)  Chroma does need more attacks tho.. Maybe something like Qorvex and Vauban but in a dragon's way? Orowyrm? 

---

4. Speed and Vex

The most important skill on Chroma and even with my stats, I can't do crazy defense missions unless I have a good AoE and being quick about it, so I end up using the Amalgam Serration and Amar's Anguish on exilus slot since Chroma is slow to me and can't pull off ESO so I have to use frost for defense and Saryn for ESO even tho I'd rather main as Chroma. Atleast, with the sprint speeds, double jump and parkour boost I can do Void Flood and Cascade easily.

I understand the wanting of toggle but without toggle I am able to rely on other sources and I can have hope for an energy orb to pop around and hit the energize when I have zero energy. At toggle, it'll deflate at 0 energy and I'll be even more at the mercy of Ancient Disruptors unless they change something else with Vex. I'd rather it be more like Gyre's Cathode Grace, where killing enemies extends the duration and there are moments especially the no revive missions where I want Vex to stay up and not die easily just because I forgot to recast or didn't use it because I'm building up Molt Augmented. Vex armor is expensive and recasting drains so much with Effigy around too, 9.12 per sec with my setup.

All my mods are centered at Vex  and I dislike that. Sometimes I wish I could use Archon Range or the rage mods or an augment or something but not enough space on Warframes. 

I'd like to see a better UI on it, how do I know if my stats are even good? Yea big numbers sounds nice but what does my weapon damage look with 1351% vs Laetum's 50% chance to do 2000% Damage kinda thing.

I'd like where I don't need to supply so much power strength and get better or same benefits. Also, I want where when I cast Vex without Molt Aug at 250 and without other activations, that when I recast, I can make damage and armor go higher when I do have my activations and molt at 250. I always have to let my Vex turn off, re-do my dance of activations, growing power, power drain, molt augmeneted, Energy Conversion and then take damage so I can get to my 1351% damage.. if I miss one of those I'm stuck and have to re do my tango.

I know there is Pax Bolt and Exodia Brave but I like what I'm using but enegy costs are high enough.

The only thing I can think of to changing Vex is do something like a rage/stress meter but Chroma keeps growing in both categories, power strength allows you to handle more and accumulate quicker percentages before Chroma can't handle the stress which you then use Spectral Scream with synergy of stress and vex to lower stress and do a cool breath attack? (Thinking of Super Saiyans [Dragon Ball Z] or like Ember but I don't like Ember's penalties) might be OP sounding but at same time on circuit SP getting hit by enemies at round 6+ hurts and my current states don't help at super high level enemies.

---

5. Range..

Range seems so.. pointless if you aren't into electricity. Effigy doesn't seem to benefit from it and you'd think it would so that it can stun at furthur distances or have a more spread out attack. Elemental Ward doesn't benefit fire ring, would like it more so infested or melee types get hit before hitting me or when I run near storages its not 4m to hit with the fire ring.

Would like to see range incorporated more if they do something about the power creep thing.

----

6. Effigy

Its cool but its slow and doesn't deal much. I am using Archon Continuity for the Corrosion. Luckily Archon Flow works with it but it doesn't kill as fast with that breath and the 4 seconds interval of switching with stunning and spraying. I wish it did more than just spray. Doesn't help much on defense and Soloing Mirror defense is hard, I have to use Effigy and Nidus specter to help out. Sometimes I wish it was like the Jackal, shooting grenades and doing large swirling beams. Other times, I think of this game called Chaos Legion where Chroma's effigy looks like Perfect Thanatos, the being swirls like a football and strikes heavily at enemies knocking them down on the floor and its other attack is where it slows down time and launches a barrage of homing energy missiles. I even thought at one point why not ride the effigy like a kaithe and it has its attacks.. lol. All I can think of is one again some more attacks wise, remove the debuff or maybe help with stressor idea, improve time of stun and breath attack. Maybe an enemy puller function?  Some sort of grand AoE attack like Dragonlord Placidusax (elden ring) or be more effective like Hydroid's tentacle swarm. 

I do think its a good idea that effigy reacts different with each elemental or has more energy/tech looking attacks and synergy stuff. 

I've also wondered if maybe its something like Equinox, where once you summon effigy you are given another 3 abilities to use. 

Wish the energy drain and cost to cast was lower or is another duration thing. Needs more survivability. Shouldn't have an issue with Guardians. Too weak against Eximus units.

--

7. silly idea

Since Chroma is seen as a dragon and has the credit drop with effigy, why not have some sort of hoarder perk. Credits adds to this, getting resources adds another thing, mods, etcera. Get rare mod drops gives efficiency or something but I feel this idea would be crap since there is other issues and how would that add more to effigy's deficiency. 

---

 

summary..

Chroma demands power like fry demands 100 coffee in that Futurama episode. Synergies or make Chroma the frame that exalts in power strength, like Hildryn with shields. Would like to see spectral scream turned into either an elden ring's dragon's type breath or elemental orbs like Latron's Incarnon. Timer on elemental ward should have an increase as well as its range on all elements and maybe be something like Qorvex and vauban or offers elemental resist/absorbing to heal, like fire eximus doing fire but Chroma has fire so absorbs and heals team and perhaps included with affinity range. Vex armor, be like Cathode's grace, kill to gain time and allow where activation mods can still boost vex when recast when missed before or turn the ability into a stress meter and the only limit is how much chroma can take so a balance of making chroma chill out and go back in, using spectral at a high stress makes it really powerful, (projectile?) no limits or increased limit of how much damage and armor gained? I would imagine when enemies hit to hard the stress is always too high. Power strength to have a higher threshold and gains or efficency idk.. thought of super saiyans or games where you're in critcal and do very high damage but in warframe's critcal it'd be like meter like Ember. Range mods should effect effigy range and elementals not just electricity or bring back power strength giving range. Effigy, attacks more, hits more woth knockdowns, flys more, or does more AoE attacks or given abilities like using a kaithe or equinox or khora. Not good at defense missions compared to other frames. Drains to much. Lower cost and drain. Be able to hurt eximus better. Lastly, silly idea since Dragons are hoarders of treasure, why not get benefits from loot you pick up in a mission? Credits for more vex/elemental time? Anyway, thanks for reading, tried my best and I once again feel I'm a failure here lol but that's my problem, Idk what else to say or add without it sounding too OP or just another Augment. Want to use more than just Power Strength as a solo player but yea.. GL HF!

 

 

 

Just adding onto this about there is apparently going to be a mirage change. Eclipse is going to be toggle and the damage boost is apparently going to be additive 350%. Which is better than chroma’s 275% and doesn’t require build up. Chroma apparently is going to get an augment to make it so they take damage to health whenever an ally takes damage, they heal whenever an ally kills an enemy, and gain 1s of gex armor duration per kill. But the main kick in the teeth is the mirage 350% damage. It gets that instantly without build up. And is better. Only thing chroma has is that VA is aoe but in order to keep up with energy costs of Blind rage narrow minded is very beneficial which ruins the only benefit it has over eclipse. So idk what DE is thinking, augment is a good start but they seem pretty intent on making chroma just a credit farm frame for PT