Dax Combat outside of New War

[(PSN)CUInc]

Basically the Teshin segment of the new war, but you can play as a Dax during normal gameplay. What do you guys think?

[Chewarette]

That it was extremely situational and would have limited applications in the rest of the game, plus it would become boring extremely quickly.

Let's learn from Kahl's disaster. Just because a portion of a quest is cool in-context doesn't mean it has to be implemented everywhere.

[quxier]

29 minutes ago, Chewarette said:

Let's learn from Kahl's disaster. Just because a portion of a quest is cool in-context doesn't mean it has to be implemented everywhere.

Duviri/Drifter's combat is pretty nice... without horses. If they were even expand Duviri then this would be nice place to put into.

[Genitive]

I'll pass. We already have Kahl and Duviri. The latter is pretty good and I can see it being expanded by adding more islands, but I don't think we need another Kahl-like segment.

[(PSN)Sentiel]

I found it very boring already during The New War. Teshin's segment was unnecessarily long and repetitive.

I would not want to do that again even if DE would make improvements to it. Also, I'm one of the 'I play Warframe to play as Warframe' people. No Kahl, Teshin, Vaso, Drifter, and Arthur for me please. 

[(PSN)MYKK678]

3 hours ago, (PSN)CUInc said:

Basically the Teshin segment of the new war, but you can play as a Dax during normal gameplay. What do you guys think?

We'd need a mix.

We can't just have Dax Combat because most of the Dax are dead. We only know of 2 being alive.

Previously I had pitched an idea of an Optional Quest that would allow you to change your Drifter into a new type of Dax Soldier. The whole idea of it is that Teshin is looking to redeem the name Dax, as in his solitude in Duviri's Cave he's had time to look back on things, and he realises he and his colleagues were nothing but slaves and puppets to the Orokin. And so he trains the Drifter to become a brand new "breed" of Dax, no enslavement, no kuva, just a code of honour.

The idea was to be a mix of Duviri Combat and Teshin New War Combat. Most of the controls similar to Duviri, but instead of Duviris "powers" (you wouldn't be calling a horse in a grineer ship) you instead could switch between 3 Stances with your chosen weapon. Similar to the system Teshin used to switch his swords between 3 Elements. As an example, if your chosen weapon was the Nikana, you'd switch between Blind Justice/Decisive Judgement/Tranquil Cleave, each with their own pros and cons. The Orvius Grapple Hook from New War would become an Orvius Teleport, like how Wisp can Teleport to where her Wil-O-Wisp is, and be The Dax's 4th Power.

Mods would be based on the Duviri Decrees. Some wouldn't be viable or would need their stats reduced to stop them from being OP.

This would all have an effect on your Warframe too though. You'd still enter missions with a Warframe, but for balance reasons the Warframe itself would have an innate penalty. The Dax doesn't have as strong of a Void Connection to the frames, and uses the Lotus' Grasp (hand) to perform Transference. This isn't even close to a final figure, it's just an example figure, but the Warframe would have all ability stats reduced by 30% (ish). This way you can choose between your Operator and Warframe, retaining the gameplay we currently have, and the Dax and Warframe, a 50/50 Combat style between both but penalised in order to not make the Operator automatically obsolete.

Eventually down the line there could be expansions to this too, like the option for you to train your AI Railjack Crew to also become Dax and join you in boarding other vessels as a team of Dax Soldiers.

[Berzerkules]

No thank you. 

If I wanted different type of combat I'd go play a different game. 

When I play warframe I want warframe. Not Khal, not Duviri not Dax not rail jack.

[Corvid]

25 minutes ago, Berzerkules said:

When I play warframe I want warframe. Not Khal, not Duviri not Dax not rail jack.

All of which are part of Warframe. The simple truth is that a core part of this game's identity is that it is a gameplay combo platter, and it has been so for nearly as long as the game has been playable.

In fact, the current iteration of Archwing's control setup (minus Universal Blink) is actually older than the so-called "core gameplay", because while it did go through a few iterations, the most recent changes effectively reverted it back to its initial state.

[(PSN)Unstar]

There are a lot of reasons that I like Warframe: the movement, the customization, playing with my fellow Tenno.  I don't always need to be my Warframe, but if DE wants me to play as something other than my Warframe it needs to be really fun.

The Teshin gameplay during The New War didn't come close to clearing that bar for me.  I found it mediocre and tolerable in the context of the story they were telling.  I would not want to experience it again.

For what it's worth, I liked Kahl's New War gameplay much better because it told a better story and had a distinct cluddy feel.  But then they brought it back into its own game mode and it immediately became stale because Kahl lacks fun movement, lacks meaningful customization, and you play as him all alone.  I hope DE learns from that.

[(PSN)robotwars7]

given how people feel about Kahl's missions, I'm going to say... no thanks.

10 hours ago, (PSN)Sentiel said:

I would not want to do that again even if DE would make improvements to it. Also, I'm one of the 'I play Warframe to play as Warframe' people. No Kahl, Teshin, Vaso, Drifter, and Arthur for me please. 

Kahl, Teshin, Veso and Drifter I get, but.. Arthur? bro, Arthur moves EXACTLY like a warframe does, he has all parkour moves in the Whispers in The Walls quest where you play his sequence, that we also saw in full at the last TennoCon. he *is* a warframe, just not "fully". playing as him is no different than Excalibur.

[Merkranire]

Er. Not sure why we can’t do that already…? What would be different?

Right now I’m doing a bunch of leveling of melee and going pure melee; feels pretty similar, though with a Warframe and its intrinsic ability kit and movement and access to customisation and range of missions (I’m quite enjoying it)

Edited June 7 by Merkranire

[AzureTerra]

Outside of Duviri anytime we are forced to not use our warframes sucks badly

[Pakaku]

You can already sort of get the experience by playing Valkyr. All that's missing is the Orvius ripline (a way to ripline in the open air would be a great buff) and a way to change her melee's element on the fly (which was only ever necessary because of the elemental Sentient "puzzle combat")

Edited June 7 by Pakaku

[Berzerkules]

10 hours ago, Corvid said:

All of which are part of Warframe. The simple truth is that a core part of this game's identity is that it is a gameplay combo platter, and it has been so for nearly as long as the game has been playable.

In fact, the current iteration of Archwing's control setup (minus Universal Blink) is actually older than the so-called "core gameplay", because while it did go through a few iterations, the most recent changes effectively reverted it back to its initial state.

When I started warframe it felt unique, I had never played anything like it. The mobility system is completely different that anything else out there and i was immediately hooked. Then I get into customizing builds for frames and weapons and again it's completely unique, one of a kind. Warframe stands out because it is different.

Then there is Khal. If that was a stand alone game I wouldn't play it. Duviri isn't unique, there are other games that play like that which are better. Railjack as a flying through space blowing stuff up game is terrible. There are way better options out there if that's what you're looking for. 

All that other stuff just doesn't have that something else that feels special to me. It's an indescribabe blandness, a solid meh.

[Merkranire]

🤔 I guess I could see it as if you’re playing a mission as the Dax, where it’s like a different Warframe with its set of limitations that can be tailored to the mission a little more, and maybe it can have its own set of weapons but with the mod system available to customise how they perform…?

Wouldn’t mind a mission with an objective and some scripted sequences, kind of like Kahl. I like the idea behind Kahl and his mission design, but I missed the ability to customise our gameplay within the constraints of using a singular character and set of gear (and honestly I feel like the gameplay was a bit too easy with no control over it)

[Caerith]

I wouldn't mind if we could equip something like a "movement stance" to our Operator to give them Dax or Drifter controls* as an option. 

* and a sword.

[(PSN)Sentiel]

5 hours ago, (PSN)robotwars7 said:

given how people feel about Kahl's missions, I'm going to say... no thanks.

Kahl, Teshin, Veso and Drifter I get, but.. Arthur? bro, Arthur moves EXACTLY like a warframe does, he has all parkour moves in the Whispers in The Walls quest where you play his sequence, that we also saw in full at the last TennoCon. he *is* a warframe, just not "fully". playing as him is no different than Excalibur.

I don't care about movement and never mentioned it.

While Arthur is technically a Warframe, he's not my Warframe, at least not in the short teaser we got. So unless I can use my mods on him and equip him with my weapons, he falls exactly with the rest of the characters I mentioned.

I want to use my Arsenal which I gathered, upgraded, customised, and perfected over the countless hours I spend in Warframe. That's what playing Warframe means to me. Any content that denies me access to it can #*!% right off.

[Corvid]

7 hours ago, Berzerkules said:

The mobility system is completely different that anything else out there and i was immediately hooked.

If you started playing when the current mobility system was implemented, then there was already at least one other gameplay style in the game at that time.

You may not like those alternate gameplay styles, and that's fine. What I dispute is the notion that they "aren't Warframe". As far as I'm concerned, anything that is in Warframe is Warframe.

[Venus-Venera]

Am 6.6.2024 um 11:54 schrieb (PSN)CUInc:

Basically the Teshin segment of the new war, but you can play as a Dax during normal gameplay. What do you guys think?

I don't see any advantages. Because in a short adventure it would be very interesting. But this is about a fast action game with kill-for-loot motivation. And anything that takes too long is just boring.

And don't forget that the players have to do it daily, weekly or even for months. Because they'll quickly get stony-faced and ask themselves what it's all about.

As long as it rarely happens, then it's OK in my opinion. But that's already the case... in duriri exp or lone story at least.

[Merkranire]

The more I think about it, the more I would like missions reminiscent of Destiny’s Strikes; I happily did those on repeat until they were too easy, and they didn’t even have the breadth of options and ways to customise the experience that Warframe does, so inserting more linear missions with bits of story into Warframe would be appreciated

[OniDax]

On 2024-06-06 at 6:32 AM, quxier said:

Duviri/Drifter's combat is pretty nice... without horses. If they were even expand Duviri then this would be nice place to put into.

Drifter combat isn't good either in my opinion. It's a very limited version of Warframe melee gameplay, and it certainly pales in comparison with better melee-focused games on the market. It would be cool to play as a Dax, but with Warframe's gameplay (aka give the Dax four abilities, full Warframe movement, and access to the Warframe weapons).

Edited June 7 by OniDax

[KRYPTR0N]

If you wanna play as teshin so bad. why not just ask for a teshin/drifter skin for over your warframe. Because believe me. Limitng your capabilities in the main game is gonna get very old, very fast. Now someone might argue that they dont like the idea of seeing drifter do warframe stuff, which i get. To fix that, just make the skin client side 🤷‍♂️

[_Eclips3_]

Nothing wrong with having the choice. No idea why nobody likes having options, although I'm not surprised considering the entire game revolves around playing 1 single mission 10-20 times to get a reward (I have ~30 more runs of the highest tier bounty to max out cavia standing if I want to minimise the amount of times I have to repeat bounties, HOW IS THIS CONSIDERED FUN???). Obviously choice isn't very big in this community.

 

So what if the Dax mode is dead? Some players might like it. Another idea is to allow us to play as the dax in Duviri or something.

Edited June 14 by _Eclips3_

[quxier]

On 2024-06-07 at 8:08 PM, OniDax said:

On 2024-06-06 at 12:32 PM, quxier said:

Duviri/Drifter's combat is pretty nice... without horses. If they were even expand Duviri then this would be nice place to put into.

Drifter combat isn't good either in my opinion. It's a very limited version of Warframe melee gameplay

That limitation is what makes it good. If you add frame combat then can basically hold melee and everything would die. There has to be action-reaction things.

[0_The_F00l]

i may have enjoyed it , if it actually had variety.

I enjoyed Kahl in the beginning too , but playing the same 3 missions repeatedly? got old in a matter of weeks.

So if there is actually mission variety (on par with the core warframe missions) it may be worth exploring.