Revenant Themed Warframe "Vlad" Feedback and Discussion

[SirRocetti]

So id like to share my ideas when I saw Vlad on stream. So ill leave here my 2 cents.

Vlad is Allucard?

Maybe its just me and my life experience with Castlevania, but I felt like the fog ability had some inspiration from ps1 Castlevania where Allucard turned into a fog and crossed iron bars. And as a huge fan of the series I was "oh lord! I need this Guy!", but after the OMG secs a feeling hitted hard on me:

Eidolons and Sentients are not vampires.. and this character design is not even ressembling a lord of shadows to give it a heavy vampire name like Vlad.

So my Idea is: se could get 2 New warframes from this. Gradalyst, the eidolon one that was presented in this devstream and Vlad, the one whos powers are inspired by Vampires.

Gradalyst should be more focused on reproducing the eidolons powers. His Shields should be a great thing and maybe have a passive that explodes when depleted causing some effect in the range (affected by strech). He should have a summon skill like the eidolons and a ground stomp or any other eidolon ability. Maybe a unique system could be implemented into its 4 where its a different skill based on the eidolons standout behaviors that can be aquired by equip different arcanes (they would give the natural bonus + change the skill). And his parts obviously come from eidolon hunts or/and bounties. Anyway.. make him a eidolon beast.

Vlad i think could match better a orokin tower (now the void) tileset since i could imagine a vampire getting out of that fancy coffin-like containers we open. His design could be more lordish and corrupted at the same time (void corruption). The skillset presented is a little useless having in mind what warframes we already have (i know its fun to use different frames to break the routine but ar the end we always trust one frame for the sorties and other high level content) so we could come up with a better set for him. Ill stay with the CC concept and think over its skillset from that base, but he could be a damage type.

Could be something like: His passive is lifesteal on mel attacks. His 1 should be a dash through enemies with additional lifesteal or energy steal or stagger them by making their minds blank. The 2 should be a buff that he steal power from an enemy. Its like he aim at the enemy he wants and suck up from (damage bonus, armor bonus, Max health bonus,etc) and the buff apply for everyone in range (affinity or other range), during the buff duration the enemy will have a debuff on the stat extracted (the buff don't cancel on enemy death). Hes 3 should stay the fog morph but could be less of a pure smoke design and go for something like normal moving but with a cursed smoky look (use the New ludicrous particle systems to create a silhouette of him and add a aura that have range affected by strech!!) It could be used more as a mobility/ imunity than for anything, but the Idea of passing through enemies and cursing their minds turning them your puppets is really vampiric awesome (yeah im a vampire the masquerade fan). What was presented with the curse spread was a little "meh" since It wasnt a fast cc, but putting normal mevement in this fog morph and an foggy aura would turn It faster to jump through the hordes of enemies (this skill could be his 4 maybe). And for a 4 skill i think It can go with an buff where It suck up all cursed enemies and get their Power to him for a duration. So its like he becomes a little god while in this state with all that buffed stats. This is good for the scaling enemies but surely would be too much overpower so we should put a cap based on ability stenght (more Power = less duration). And his parts could be a second round on the creepy side of this universe. Harrows Quest was pretty creepy and an awesome break from the natural atmosphere in Warframe. So you guys know what to do.

Those are random ideas i came up right now but I think they are nice and wont let Vlad be like his vampire sister (Trinity is a vampire!) and would find some utility for endgame (not being Just another Warframe that you use anytime you get bored.. yeah zephir im looking at you). And the Gradalyst would be a powerful addition with that eidolon almighty strenght.

Its a lot of text, but what you guys think? Its just me that feels like Vlads skills do not match his body and story?

[(PSN)GrahamMasterJ]

I think his 4 should do damage and if he kills the enemies , they explode  spreading the affliction kind of like saryn in a way.  He could behave like a blood necromancer's corpse explosion or blood Nova except instead of blood it is void energy that he feeds off of. 

 

So 1 2 and 3 are used for set up and 4 is the pay off. You deal more damage the higher the affliction and if you kill they explode. Otherwise you just spread. This way you can try to chain the fodder to explode around a priority target. 

[Zomsan]

These are setients and their abilities 

 

Battalysts are Sentient combat drones. Capable of firing explosive projectiles and unleashing large clusters of omnidirectional lasers, Battalysts specialize in ranged combat.

Conculysts are Sentient  combat drones specialized for melee combat, capable of performing agile, heavy strikes, and forming an offensive whirlwind with their baton-arms alone.

Vomvalysts are spectral Sentient creatures found roaming in the Plains of Eidolon at night. They possess 2 forms: a default physical form and a ghostly energy form to which they switch when they have taken too much damage.

The Gantulyst is an enormous spectral Sentient  creature that can be summoned on the Plains of Eidolon at night. Much larger than the more common Teralyst Eidolon, it has replaced its right arm with an elongated boulder, and its massive weight creates shockwaves with every step.

The Hydrolyst is a titanic spectral Sentient  creature. This mythical Eidolon is a rare sight on the Plains of Eidolon at night, appearing only when it is ritualistically summoned. It is large enough to wield the landing strut of an ancient spacecraft as a weapon, and its arcane energies create localized storm systems wherever it surfaces.

So.. not a single Sentient or Eidolon has the ability to make someone go to bed right?

[seprent]

They are already putting his kit thought changes and the ult is being scraped for something involving lasers according to rebs twitter 

35 minutes ago, Zomsan said:

snip

 

[EchoesOfRain]

Honestly, I think Vlad's 1 should be merged with his 2.

On the first cast, Vlad builds up some stacks onto his Sentient Pact. If an enemy attacks him, the attack is nullified and the enemy immediately turns into a mindless drone, costing one stack. If Vlad has available stacks, he can also use one to cast onto an enemy to turn them into a drone himself. Once Sentient Pact runs out of stacks, all mindless drones go into Final Affliction, where they attack other enemies and spread the affliction and explode on death. While Sentient Pact is active, Vlad can also hold to cast the skill to deplete his stacks at no energy cost.

I really like Sentient Pact, it looks like a somewhat unique form of CC and damage mitigation. My issue is how his 1 looks like it's slow to cast on several enemies, and how the synergy with the 2 is awfully forced. Merge the two skills into a single ability, allow the enemies to become afflicted more naturally, and make room for another more interesting skill (hopefully one a bit more eidolon themed).

 

Ability replacement suggestion: Activate to begin draining Vlad's energy over time. Deactivating will turn the drained energy into a large explosion of magnetic energy. The more energy drained, the more damage the skill outputs. This would still fit into a sort of Vampire theme too. Vlad drains all of his energy, then sacrifices his minions ("drinking their blood") to replenish said energy. He'd kinda become a bit of an energy vampire rather than a health vampire, while upholding the Eidolon theme a bit stronger.

Edited June 4, 2018 by EchoesOfRain

[hellodownthere]

22 minutes ago, seprent said:

snip

so much for the revenant vampire frame now its becoming more of an eidolon frame. Lasers ? probably going to be the 360° laser fire, if not something close to that

[Klokwerkaos]

There are tons of threads on this already.

Vlad is not a final name choice, it's a place holder.

The devs decide what the lore is, so if they say vampires then it's vampires.

It is my belief that the design of the original sketch was more influenced  by eidolon and sentient stuff than what we saw on the dev stream.

Vlad has more in common aesthetically with raziel than alucard, the stuff you describe as similar is sincerely generic vampire stuff being that castlevania is simply generic vampire tropes.

 

[seprent]

7 minutes ago, hellodownthere said:

so much for the revenant vampire frame now its becoming more of an eidolon frame. Lasers ? probably going to be the 360° laser fire, if not something close to that

Vampire was only one of the inspirations personally i think the eidolons are cool i always liked the sentient well design in lack of a better word

[Zomsan]

I hope his passive is damage resistance or something.

[Elanair]

Drugar an anagram of the word draugr  - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draugr

Welkar an anagram of the word walker. (Walking dead anyone?)

Vrega an anagram of the word grave.

 

 

[SneakyErvin]

15 hours ago, Vlada91 said:

Is better for you 2 bee some random soldier or a King? Same here with some random vampire or famous dark lord... Vlad whose first vampire,and when you hear that name you know that he is someone that is very badass and not some random vampire that is not that powerful like him. Because he is not the first he is just random vampire and thats all....

Actually, the Draugr of the north were a couple of hundred years earlier than Vlad, same as many other vamp like creatures. There were also well known ones in the sagas. 

Vlad may be the most known "vampire" but he was far from the first. The lore of vampires goes back to ancient greece and even further.

Also, the frame really doesnt look vampy or Vlad-like.

[Einhandr]

I knew that new frame looked familiar... this is metal AF.
Rings of Warframe confirmed.

[Vlada91]

1 hour ago, SneakyErvin said:

Actually, the Draugr of the north were a couple of hundred years earlier than Vlad, same as many other vamp like creatures. There were also well known ones in the sagas. 

Vlad may be the most known "vampire" but he was far from the first. The lore of vampires goes back to ancient greece and even further.

Also, the frame really doesnt look vampy or Vlad-like.

Draugr from skyrim?? 😁 and your Draugr dude he is just similar 2 a Vampire but he is not a really a Vampire.... Did you know that Dracula whose a Serb. And The word vampire is the only thing of Serbian origin that has become common to all the world's languages. 

Edited June 4, 2018 by Vlada91

[DeMonkey]

16 hours ago, Kaotyke said:

It does actually: War and Broken War. Sentient material that we can channel void energy when using Channeling. It doesnt explode or corrode.

Void is poison Sentients: sterilize them, resets their adaptation and likely kills their mind. Warframes with Sentient parts? They will never adapt and since the parts are already dead...

There is nothing saying that if the two combine they will have a chain reaction.

Isn't this already obvious due to AMPs?

Surely War and Broken War don't even come into it, by breaking down Wisps we make AMPs out of Sentient Parts, channel void energy directly into it and nothing explodes.

I don't understand why people struggle to understand this, and subsequently why you're having to explain it. We've known since October that Sentient parts don't react to void energy in an explosive manner, they appear to be able to shape it.

[(PSN)SlyFox5679]

I have a feeling Vlad will come to the game whenever and then everyone will have it and get played and then disappear because its abilities may not work at high lvl play like other frames and people will go back to what they know is reliable and works at high lvl's. 

Remember the last time DE took an idea from a popular character and made it into a frame ? looking at you wukong and that didn't come out as expected and do people really see anyone playing wukong anymore ? not really. 

I really think making a frame from a storybook character is a bad idea at this point and should try a different route when trying to think up a new frame. so lets see next logical step after a vampire is probably a werewolf frame and so help me god if that doesn't turn into an actual werewolf i may lose my faith in DE's creative powers that be.

I find frames that don't have some form of AOE 4th ability to be lacking because in high level content being able to kill large groups of enemies or crowd control them in some way is usually the way i'd go and speaking of abilities vlad turning into mist sounds like wukongs cloudwalker ability and could be just as useless except for the affect it can do to enemies and the whole kid for vlad sounds like it should be used on Nyx instead but i could be the minority here.

[(PSN)TheRealTommo]

Would be cool if he could build up resistances to status effects, like the Sentients do? Maybe reflect this back on enemies.

Edited June 4, 2018 by (PS4)TheRealTommo

[Khlamydia]

*post contains minor vague story spoilers, you have been warned*

If you want to do some interesting stuff with Vlad and keep fast paced interesting gameplay that doesn't just steal other frames kits:

1. Rather then copy the marking mechanic directly off Ash so that Vlad can pretend he is secretly Nyx, Instead why not have this affliction mechanic be duration based instead. Have it marks anything that attacks the player instead of a stun mechanic or a manual stop and smell the roses system, and balance it with having a cap of "spawn" so you don't have a train of 50 of these guys swarming around your foes. Skip the invulnerable status entirely where they following you around, and just turn them into mines that auto explode on enemies upon reaching melee range who are not already marked, and then they follow within a certain radius of you walking away from them and look for enemies to explode on of instead of fighting with their weapons which lets be fair wont do any real significant damage in the first place due to scaling. This way both the player, the players allies, and the enemy all get to keep attacking both afflicted and non-afflicted and setting them off early if they want to, and you also get active gameplay with an interesting mechanic, that doesn't slow the mission down in order to play lets manually mark these guys one at a time (IE hold on everyone, i gotta activate my ability, so please stop moving through rooms and killing for a minute so i can manually click on 8 of these guys one at a time... said nobody ever)

2. A "charge" based stun mechanic sounds like a huge energy drain on our limited resources and one that just wont get used if its as expensive as it sounds. Something that might be more interesting is if stun could be far better replaced by augmenting any existing and newly created walking mines to do more damage, maybe cause additional status effects, set off stuns when they explode, give them a speed boost to seek out targets faster, or plenty of other things for whatever the duration it lasts for. By going duration based it allows you you make use of preexisting afflicted and also buff newly created afflicted that you gain after you hit the button. Or you could go an entirely different direction and have the button drain the health / energy / or overshields directly out of nearby enemies in a radius like a "vampire".

3. This really just completely outshines Wukongs cloud in every possible way. Regardless, The visuals of it look good, but perhaps it should have a major speed increase so people want to use it instead of bullet jumping everywhere at mach 10. Or instead of a speed increase what if it was a ethereal dash the direction you are facing with the affliction radius based on Range, and it afflicted everything along the path in a radius that you dashed through almost like a cool spectral teleport that picks up additional afflicted that aren't shooting directly at you.

4. Rather then a group sleep mechanic which is really just equinox, is what if your 4 ability let you possess an enemy with your essence similar to *spoiler* that one time we did the thing in that quest *spoiler*. If you could possess enemy factions you could open up all sorts of interesting play options if the enemy's didn't attack you until you provoked them by shooting your gun at them first, you could sneak into security checkpoint walls that magnetize or set off alerts for bypassing alarms, ignore that big nullifier bubble, go and complete hacking at terminals or give guard reinforcements the all clear by shutting off alarms at panels. You could turn the tides on your enemies physically too letting the player move and shoot as the target taking the brunt of high level eximus swarming the player and making them fight each other via possession.

Note to DE: I try to only make suggestions that the code already seems to exist for, for the most part. I wouldn't suggest bigger overhauls this late into production if these code segments I'm recommending didn't already exist on other parts of the game that could be adapted for Vlad fairly easily here. If the community in general was included for feedback much earlier in the design process before you have anything to show us we could really help you out in suggestions and ideas before a lot of work is put into abilities that just end up needing to change after release like Khora. Just a thought, if you tell us about a frame concept early, and ask for input on what its kit could include, you could get a bunch of free great suggestions before its already too late to implement or change the kit DE. You'd end up with more well rounded frames that feel polished and don't have people scratching their heads asking why did you do that? You have a great resource here in the community, and we really do want to help, so let us.

Edited June 4, 2018 by Khlamydia
Note to DE

[SneakyErvin]

40 minutes ago, Vlada91 said:

Draugr from skyrim?? 😁 and your Draugr dude he is just similar 2 a Vampire but he is not a really a Vampire.... Did you know that Dracula whose a Serb. And The word vampire is the only thing of Serbian origin that has become common to all the world's languages. 

I'm not sure if you are joking or if you honestly have no clue what a Draugr is is actual lore and myths.

Also Dracula wasnt a serb, he was born in central romania (Sighisoara Transylvania). He then became the Lord of Wallachia, a region in the southern parts of romania, bordering more towards bulgaria than serbia.

The word vampire is also not 100% of serbian origin. It is simply eastern european slavic. Serbia was one of the first places that westerners and central europeans encountered the words, but no one is sure where it actually comes from. The idea of the creature, no matter the name, is far older and has appeared in many cultures under different names, same as the "were" creatures.

None of this really matters though because the vampiric feel of the frame is next to none.

Edited June 4, 2018 by SneakyErvin

[Vlada91]

47 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

I'm not sure if you are joking or if you honestly have no clue what a Draugr is is actual lore and myths.

Also Dracula wasnt a serb, he was born in central romania (Sighisoara Transylvania). He then became the Lord of Wallachia, a region in the southern parts of romania, bordering more towards bulgaria than serbia.

The word vampire is also not 100% of serbian origin. It is simply eastern european slavic. Serbia was one of the first places that westerners and central europeans encountered the words, but no one is sure where it actually comes from. The idea of the creature, no matter the name, is far older and has appeared in many cultures under different names, same as the "were" creatures.

None of this really matters though because the vampiric feel of the frame is next to none.

Vlad Tepes was a hundred per cent Serb. But not just him. Most of today's Romanians native Serbs. Many do not know that until the 19th century, they speak Serbian language and Serbia  letter. Sorry for bad English im from Serbia 😏 and Vlad whose member of the Order of the Knights Dragon... Dracul in Romania is Dragon 😛

Edited June 4, 2018 by Vlada91

[Harbinger81]

I think a great name would be, Acceber

 

Which is Rebecca backwards, if you didn't notice. Just my 2 credits worth... Thanks Rebecca for making this game better and better.

[SneakyErvin]

1 hour ago, Vlada91 said:

Vlad Tepes was a hundred per cent Serb. But not just him. Most of today's Romanians native Serbs. Many do not know that until the 19th century, they speak Serbian language and Serbia  letter. Sorry for bad English im from Serbia 😏 and Vlad whose member of the Order of the Knights Dragon... Dracul in Romania is Dragon 😛

You are thinking of Slavic, that is a whole different thing. Serbian is part of the indo-eauropean slavic language. The cyrillic alphabet originated in ancient bulgaria, long before there was a serbia. It in turn comes from old greek scripts, which in turn come from scripts even further back, like egyptian hieroglyphs.

Vlad Tepes was very much not a serb, he was a romanian, both however being part of the indo-european slavic people. Just as I'm swedish and not a dane, finn or norwegian even though I'm scandinavian.

[(PSN)Syalin_]

so devs I was watching a review a youtuber named IFlinn did for the devstream you guys showed of the new frame vlad. He said you guys were going to listen to community feedback for the frame so I thought I would give my thoughts.

1. I like frames who have at least three or more abilities that can combo together. I like the set up it takes to get everything flowing so that's a plus 1 for me.

2. for his second ability, I like the idea of stunning enemies when they hit you, this is a nice bit of cc and units will not be able to constantly bombard you with constant shots and melee attacks so this is nice. But, I don't like how it does the same thing his first ability does by marking enemies for free, what is the point in his first ability if his second does the same thing for free.

3. his abilities seem great and I think they would be very fun. But theres one big problem I have with the end of your set up. so if I herd right what you would do is mark enemies with your first, and the same with your second for whatever reason you would use both, then you use your three to have them fallow you. then you place them to sleep with your 4 to set up I mine field of some sort and you shoot the enemies to make them blow up. all of that sounds great but all I see is that what revenent can do in 4 abilities, nova can do in 1.

so anyways that's what I think of the new frame. overall, he seems great and I think he would be a lot of fun, but I don't think he will be a very practicle frame to nova users.

sorry if I misinterpreted any information on the abilities and how they work, this is just my feedback based on what I understand.

hold on I never posted this here, I made my own topic in the feedback section. how did it get here

Edited June 4, 2018 by (PS4)Syalin_

[Urlan]

19 hours ago, Elanair said:

Ah yes, now I remember the lore fragments regarding Gara, the Unum the particular eidelon on the plains. I'm beginning to understand now why they associated it with vampirism and undeath since, as you pointed out, it appears to have it's 'weakness' regarding the light but other than that? Not much else as far as I noticed. I understand if he has their weakness, that makes sense as you pointed out, but the current power kit like sleep, afflictions and mind-controls don't seem to make much sense as far as I can see.

I'l also have to point out what you mentioned about Vlad being based on Eidelons that weren't shattered by Gara or the Unum, eidelons that just arrived from the Tau system at the beginning of the war, I suspect you are correct that he's most definitely based on those eidelons that just arrived from the Tau system and weren't damaged or shattered. It's the only thing that would make sense from a lore perspective, but I can see it very plausible for Vlad to have the same or similar powers to the current shattered eidelons mostly because we have no confirmation or negation that their powers have changed much, or at all, since getting shattered. So from a lore perspective and depending on what DE confirms, the powers of the eidelosn that just arrived from the Tau systems and the power of the current 'shattered' eidelons might be very similar or even the same. Or maybe not! It can go either ways until we have some confirmation, but the possibilities are there depending on what DE decides to choose for the lore.

I also want to point out that we also have 3 eidelon variants and as we noticed, most of their powers are similar as well so it's very likely that most eidelons had a similar set of powers with certain alterations. A bit of speculation, I know but it opens up the possibility from a lore perspective. Unless DE confirms it that the shattering altered not only their appearance (to some extent, like the missing arm) but their powers to such an extent that they are unrecognizable from their pre-shattering then Vlad can still have similar abilities as the current eidelon from a lore perspective. Which I'm honestly hoping will be the case since I really don't feel like his current powers fit him.

 

 

Yes, the vampire theme powers seem to be pulling more from the western vampire themes of Nyx's mind control and confusion kit than Eidolons, DE Steve was suggesting the warframe get more Eidolon themed moves, like the lasers. The Sentient that became the Eidolons (shattered remenants, or phantasms) are constantly leaking energy this is something that is in tune visually with the Eidolon Warframe. This making of the Eidolons didn't happen though until after the Massacre of the Oroking Elite after what is called the Old War was pretty much considered concluded. The Sentient that would become the Eidolons bee-lined Er or Earth as we call it to destroy Orokin Towers like the Unum that were scattered about Earth's surface protected by communities. We have another flying Unum Meat head variant coming down the tubes that is probably around the size of the Hydrolyst that supposedly will offer different moves and fighting styles. Unfortunately, considering the Eidolon shards are replacing their parts with trees, rocks, and whatever; outside lasers from ship sized cannons, we can only go back those Codex entries as to the original's fighting style. If you look around the Plains, you can see the shattered physical parts of the main Sentient that became the Eidolon Shards and at least from those huge parts, its appearance is more in line with what we have seen of Hunhow rather than the Eidolons so far.

[WolvenEdge]

20 hours ago, Kaotyke said:

It does actually: War and Broken War. Sentient material that we can channel void energy when using Channeling. It doesnt explode or corrode.

Void is poison Sentients: sterilize them, resets their adaptation and likely kills their mind. Warframes with Sentient parts? They will never adapt and since the parts are already dead...

There is nothing saying that if the two combine they will have a chain reaction.

Sorry, but no.

War and Broken War are actually covered by our dear Hunhow; "Natah, you trust this Orokin blood, who would chisel weapons from our bones?"

I also mentioned this before; the majority of a sentient lifeform is corroded or destroyed by Void energy, such as the Sentient battalysts and conculysts that Hunhow sends after you in the towers, during Octavia's Anthem.

All that is left is lifeless bone, inert, but still powerful in its own right. We're talking about a warframe here that is part, or influenced by, living sentient energy and parts; these would corrode and/or react badly to Void energy the instant the Warframe was activated again, leaving a likely non-functional warframe full of sentient bone shards.

Have fun with that.

[Kaotyke]

11 minutes ago, WolvenEdge said:

Sorry, but no.

War and Broken War are actually covered by our dear Hunhow; "Natah, you trust this Orokin blood, who would chisel weapons from our bones?"

I also mentioned this before; the majority of a sentient lifeform is corroded or destroyed by Void energy, such as the Sentient battalysts and conculysts that Hunhow sends after you in the towers, during Octavia's Anthem.

All that is left is lifeless bone, inert, but still powerful in its own right. We're talking about a warframe here that is part, or influenced by, living sentient energy and parts; these would corrode and/or react badly to Void energy the instant the Warframe was activated again, leaving a likely non-functional warframe full of sentient bone shards.

Have fun with that.

Bones are living materials, yes. But having them as conduits integrated in the Warframe is not out of the realm of possibility, like the Amps as @DeMonkey mentioned.

They dont NEED to be alive to do what we want.