Ember rework soon™?

[Kaminarion]

I hope it has been noticed how players do not really play Ember post-nerf.

Can we expect a boost/ rework or are we all going to regret owning that good looking Ember Prime but never use her.. 😞

Her Fireball could use a bigger radius, her Fire Blast should be burst dmg instead of that tiny circle. And I guess her World on Fire could be turned into a buff instead of a toggle.

Edited June 26, 2018 by Kaminarion

[Prof.549]

8 minutes ago, Kaminarion said:

players do not really play Ember post-nerf.

Another one of those threads...

 

9 minutes ago, Kaminarion said:

are we all going to regret owning that good looking Ember Prime but never use her.

Speak for yourself ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Kaminarion]

Have you tried using Ember in Sortie/ Kuva flood levels of difficulty? She used to be real good cc with the range and Quake but now she just dies fast.

[Urlan]

Didn't she relatively recently get her last 'rework'/nerf?

[Dhrekr]

19 minutes ago, Kaminarion said:

Can we expect a boost/ rework or are we all going to regret owning that good looking Ember Prime but never use her.. 😞

I don't regret the reworks. The rework is fantastic. I hated those two-neuron hacks who used a minmaxed Ember to do a level 10 Alert and, if this rework has freed us from them, so much the better.

And I keep using Ember no matter what. Is she the strongest? Arguably not. Does she ruin every public game she's in? Fortunately not.

[Zyrgi]

"No." to everything.

[Prof.549]

21 minutes ago, Kaminarion said:

Have you tried using Ember in Sortie/ Kuva flood levels of difficulty?

Have you considered that it's not what she was implied to do? Have you tried Titania in there for example? 

Not every frame should be a high-lvl killers. And Ember never was such.

[Kaminarion]

2 minutes ago, Prof.549 said:

Have you considered that it's not what she was implied to do? Have you tried Titania in there for example? 

Not every frame should be a high-lvl killers. And Ember never was such.

Nop am too lazy to finish her quest.

Also who cares about low lvl content. You can do that with anything.

Saryn became God tier when she could outdo ember in 2017 while one got buffed and the other nerfed... 

[BiancaRoughfin]

29 minutes ago, Kaminarion said:

Have you tried using Ember in Sortie/ Kuva flood levels of difficulty? She used to be real good cc with the range and Quake but now she just dies fast.

I dont remember depending on Warframe abilities for me to kill. Nothing pops a head better than a good Corinth shot or corrodes grupes of enemies than a well placed shot with the Staticor.

Also, mind you the problem isnt on Ember her self, its on the Heat Element which is crap. How about we wait for Damage 3.0 to come out and see how she will perform with the possible changes to heat then we can say if she needs a buff or not.

[(PSN)Yetchii]

I don't use Ember, so I'm not sure if this is right.. so go ahead and correct me if I'm wrong about this:

Before: Press 1 button > Run > Things die.

After: Press 1 button > Run > Things die but range decreases over time > Toggle the ability Off/On to reset the range and continue doing the same thing as before > It's too much effort now so the frame is dead.

Isn't the reason Ember isn't used much now because of the same reason Ash isn't used as much now compared to before he got his rework? Because it's not a press once and forget thing now?

[UseNet]

Ah yes, Ember. Master of the early starchart planets, destroyer of unarmored targets. kek.

Not sure what you're expecting from an ember rework, fire damage wont ever stand up to sortie level enemies etc. Not because ember sucks mind you, but because fire damage does nothing at those levels of scaling.

[RealPandemonium]

3 hours ago, Kaminarion said:

Have you tried using Ember in Sortie/ Kuva flood levels of difficulty? She used to be real good cc with the range and Quake but now she just dies fast.

Firequake was always questionable at best if not outright bad.  I level my weapons in Sorties using Ember with no problems.  Her best CC has always been Accelerant; Firequake is a meme-y distraction from that.  

3 hours ago, Prof.549 said:

Have you considered that it's not what she was implied to do? Have you tried Titania in there for example? 

Not every frame should be a high-lvl killers. And Ember never was such.

Ember kills high level enemies just fine with Accelerant's massive damage bonus.

3 hours ago, BiancaRoughfin said:

I dont remember depending on Warframe abilities for me to kill. Nothing pops a head better than a good Corinth shot or corrodes grupes of enemies than a well placed shot with the Staticor.

Also, mind you the problem isnt on Ember her self, its on the Heat Element which is crap. How about we wait for Damage 3.0 to come out and see how she will perform with the possible changes to heat then we can say if she needs a buff or not.

 

2 hours ago, UseNet said:

Ah yes, Ember. Master of the early starchart planets, destroyer of unarmored targets. kek.

Not sure what you're expecting from an ember rework, fire damage wont ever stand up to sortie level enemies etc. Not because ember sucks mind you, but because fire damage does nothing at those levels of scaling.

What is bad about Heat damage?  Only penalized against Proto Shields, neutral or decent bonuses elsewhere, and has a hybrid damage/CC status effect that you can use to mount massive damage over time on tougher enemies if you understand how it works.  

[(XBOX)Knight Raime]

Doubtful.  While she's not at a place booty quake players enjoyed she's still quite powerful if you spec her with the right loadout with heat damage in mind.  Even capable of doing sortie level content.  You can argue that she could be reworked to be even better than she currently is.  And you'd be right.  But personally I think other frames are in more need of attention first.  I'd have rather they waited to do anything to ember/limbo until they got to sit down and actually do a proper once over.  but -shrug- what's done is done.

[BiancaRoughfin]

19 minutes ago, RealPandemonium said:

massive damage over time on tougher enemies

I am eager to see how its done then, enlighten me because i have yet to see Heat dealing Massive Damage Over Time considering the damage doesnt scale properly with its source and different from Slash and Toxic, it doesnt stack but instead refreshes its duration.

[RealPandemonium]

40 minutes ago, BiancaRoughfin said:

I am eager to see how its done then, enlighten me because i have yet to see Heat dealing Massive Damage Over Time considering the damage doesnt scale properly with its source and different from Slash and Toxic, it doesnt stack but instead refreshes its duration.

It's because it refreshes that you can land a powerful headshot status on an enemy and just refresh it indefinitely whatever source you like until they die.  This is why, with 200% power strength, the new Fireball can deal 83,000 damage on a direct hit, 166,000 on a headshot, and 316,000 on a charged headshot, all because the napalm effect continutes to reapply heat status.  

I'm not sure what you mean by "doesn't scale properly with its source."  Elaborate?

Edited June 27, 2018 by RealPandemonium

[(PSN)deathwolfclaw666]

4 hours ago, (PS4)Yetchii said:

I don't use Ember, so I'm not sure if this is right.. so go ahead and correct me if I'm wrong about this:

Before: Press 1 button > Run > Things die.

After: Press 1 button > Run > Things die but range decreases over time > Toggle the ability Off/On to reset the range and continue doing the same thing as before > It's too much effort now so the frame is dead.

Isn't the reason Ember isn't used much now because of the same reason Ash isn't used as much now compared to before he got his rework? Because it's not a press once and forget thing now?

I don't know about other people but using IO as an example for me.

Before: press 4th > run from left to right over and over > mix with 1st, 2nd and weapons fire as I go.

After: press 4th > go AFK by main door > drop boosters/operator regen > repeat.

With other missions you have to get closer but the enemies die alot faster.  

[Rankii]

At any decent level WoF is complete S#&$, and with the range nerf it loses the CC it at least had with Firequake. Unfortunately people will cry more often to nerf a frame than to buff another so now here we are: where the true meta is to drag down anything that outperforms you.

[(PSN)ForNoPurpose]

i have thought about this.. i feel a "OG resonating quake + Reworked Spores" treatment would work intrestingly on World of fire..

 

Range and damage no longer change based on time active.. they and energy cost increase based on enemies killed by or while affected by fire damage. 

 

Base damage is now 100

Base range is now 5m

Base energy cost is unchanged

 

While active, if a target dies due to fire damage or dies while under the effects of a fire proc

 

Damage is increased by 100 (no limit)

Range is increased by 1m (Hard limit of 25m)

Energy cost increases by 1 each second (no limit)

All bonuses are affected by 50% of current mod benefit values. IE: +99% power strength would increase bonus damage per stack to 149 rather than 199 and range bonus would only be 1.4m increase with Overextended.

 

Deactivation of the ability under any condition resets the bonuses.

now embers world on fire slowly grows like a forest fire. from a ember to a raging inferno that uses more fuel than can be infnitely sustained. infinite damage scaling is possible like Spores however the energy cost can grow too high given enough kills causing the fire to go out.

 

a example... a Ember has killed 50 enemies since activating world on fire and each contributed to its effect. no power mods are equipped.

damage is now 5000 per tick

range is now 25m

energy cost is now 55 energy per second.

 

this change makes WORLD ON FIRE like Spores in a different fashion. damage scaling is seemingly infinite, however going too high would result in your entire energy pool being depleted in less than a second and it would be realistically impossible to get to values too high. Range is shorter initially but can now grow. damage scaling can now potentially affect sortie level enemies with the use of Embers other abilities. a Hard Range cap unaffected by mods is needed but it would allow ember to scale to much higher content.

 

 

if you think this idea is overpowered, please consider the energy drain effect... as the stacks grow it would become harder and harder to maintain energy, thanks to the halfed effect of mods on the bonuses, even a 175% efficency would mean that 50 stacks would still drain over 30 energy per second

[ShortCat]

The problem is, DE doesn't know what to do with her at the moment.

The intent behind WoF's rework was to drive Ember from low level content rush and AFK-farming; a goal it did not reach, as you still can do the same stuff with slightly altered builds. She recieved a big hit in her survivability with the range loss, Fire proc from WoF would CC enemies long enough to kill them. Additianolly she suffered efficiency nerf, which is understandable considering WoF's previously low costs, but in the greater picture her kit becamoe worse and 1-dimensional: Accelerant spam. Fireblast right now is reskinned Accelerant: it is a weak CC with potential DMG buff; only costs more Energy, has LoS and requires you to stand still to recieve the buff (which is unimaginable in higher content). Fireblast still has its uses, but more often it is better to recast Accelerant. 

Ember's damaging abilities fall behind other DPS Frames so that she has to rely on weapon buffs from her (Flash)Accelerant, thus her playstyle feels similar to Sonar Banshe. Sadly, the later one is 10 times better in this role. Hell, even Nova is a better buffer with one #4 use.

To sum it up: Ember's #3 & #4 have an identity crisis, which reflects on her potential as a DPS Frame and she is performing better as a buffer, but cannot copete in this role with other Frames due to her clunky handling. It is funny that Ember performes best vs Corpus atm.

9 hours ago, RealPandemonium said:

It's because it refreshes that you can land a powerful headshot status on an enemy and just refresh it indefinitely whatever source you like until they die.  This is why, with 200% power strength, the new Fireball can deal 83,000 damage on a direct hit, 166,000 on a headshot, and 316,000 on a charged headshot, all because the napalm effect continutes to reapply heat status. 

Oh, come on! You cannot argue with paper DPS. And those critical headshots that repeatedly cause this massive Fire proc, how do you do them? Because I find it rather difficult to consistantly land those, when my enemies cover their heads in panic animation and wobble on the spot.

Edited June 27, 2018 by ShortCat

[LSG501]

The only thing that really needs changing at the moment is the firequake augment.  Change that to stop the range reduction at the cost of the double damage (could even half the damage) and she'd be back to being pretty close to the old firequake.

Will anything get done.... doubtful, we've been saying the rework wouldn't fix anything on lower levels and would nerf firequake since before the rework was even implemented... look what we got.

[(PSN)Ozymandias-13-]

I would like her 1 to have a faster charge time. And I'm still not a fan of WoF, but I never have been.

But Ember is still a good frame, and people do use her. They just don't use her to speed run 95% of the game anymore, which is a good thing.

I use her in Sorties and Elite Sanctuary Onslaught regularly, so she's effective in high level content. Just probably not the way you're playing her. The important thing to know to understand how to player is that WoF was always trash. You need to build more around Accelerant and make sure you have pure Heat damage on your weapons in addition to whatever else you have. She will wreak havoc on anything she encounters and you'll only need to use WoF in short bursts for clean up if things get rough.

[(PSN)CoolD2108]

vor 16 Stunden schrieb Kaminarion:

Have you tried using Ember in Sortie/ Kuva flood levels of difficulty? She used to be real good cc with the range and Quake but now she just dies fast.

Have you tried an energy tank build on her? Sortie 3 as much as tickles her.

[(PSN)LoisGordils]

17 hours ago, Prof.549 said:

Have you considered that it's not what she was implied to do? Have you tried Titania in there for example? 

Not every frame should be a high-lvl killers. And Ember never was such.

Your logic is flawed. DE stated that they intend to make ALL Warframes endgame.

[EinheriarJudith]

i love ember. though i would remove the charge time from fireball, turn fireblast into a target skill, change WoF to target AOE ground eruptions, and change her passive to "using skills puts ember on fire while on fire she emits a burning aura setting enemies on fire when they get near her and give her the effect of Flame Repellent". i have no issues killing high lvl armored targets with her since accelerant is op, and heat damage is psycho on her because of it. if people are so hell bent on saying heat damage is bad (which it is not) DE could give heat the characteristic of intensifying its damage the longer it remains in effect on targets.

again ember is in no need of a rework she can be made to be stronger than she already is but she is not weak in the slightest.

[Prof.549]

47 minutes ago, (PS4)LoisGordils said:

Your logic is flawed. DE stated that they intend to make ALL Warframes endgame.

"The road to hell is paved with good intentions"