Chroma needs a rework

[EinheriarJudith]

1 minute ago, maddragonmaster said:

well my issue is not evolving around going for 1+ hour runs. its more of his kit not having fluidity, and party trick level of effectiveness for the key "dragon"  qualities. which i feel is being weighted down by having his 4th ability as effigy. at least knock that ability down to 1st ability at least. and then rework spectral scream into a great 4th ability. and then bam a more engaging playstyle for chroma, rather then just press 2 and 3 over and over and kill stuff with weapons.

id rather they give effigy sentience and have him use spectre AI. im  not trying to say his kit doesn't have issues but his passive is far from the worst imo and is far more tanky than frames short of valkyr.  effigy draws pretty good aggro like any pet ally should. the trade offs for using it i think are a bit out of controll. you lose 50% armor, it has health meaning enemies can force deactivate, and it has a channel cost on top of an initial cast cost. Currently Effigy is to expensive.

[m0b1us1]

58 minutes ago, EinheriarJudith said:

are you defending broken mechanics? his calculation was broken so now you cant cope? give me a break. you arent chosing between 350 armor and 25% power STR. all of it adds up. DE doesnt balance the game around endurance so what are we talking about here? you having problems playing at lvls where game balance is broken? 2,327.5 is not a small amount of armor and the one issue that is even a problem is solved by using heat color to get bonus HP.

when the majority of warframes player base start doing 1hr - 3hr+ endless then we can talk about it. till then why talk about it now when the game is being balanced around 80 -100?

It seems you are unaware of the ACTUAL broken mechanics that was involved with vex buff. You see, the major problem came down to the damage portion. If you had a weapon with a dual ele stat like radiation, then the damage multiplier would be given multiple times (in this case it would be fire and electric). So this was the actual broken mechanic that made Chroma so powerful against eidolons.

You also don't seem to be aware how armor works in this game. You see, the more armor you have, the less effective it is. It comes out to every 300 armor you have, you gain 100% of your health pool. So if you have 500 health, and 300 armor, you have 1000 EHP, if you double your armor, its 1500 EHP. So the more armor you have, the more it takes to gain a noticeable difference. Also the less HP you have, the less valuable armor is. So while 2300 isn't small, the old calculation blew that out of the water and let old chroma reach insane levels of EHP. Now, you can reach, 30-40kish?, which is good, but when you consider than Inaros can get 30k EHP and complete status immunity while only using his 4 charge (which requires 0 energy to charge and has tons of ways to heal and every ability CCs) then Chroma is looking incredibly lack luster. Chroma in that case only has armor and damage.

Now is this broken? Absolutely NOT. If your entire identity is "tank damage, and throw it back", then being that tanky isn't shocking at all. It's akin to saying "vauban has great CC". When the frame's identity is nerfed, then the frame drastically suffers. Imagine if they took Vauban and they nerfed his 3 so that only 3 enemies at max rank, unmodded, can be affected by it at a time. It would be a horrible blow to Vauban since his greatest strength is his incredibly reliable CC. Now you have Chroma, who only has his armor buff and damage buff, who is only known for taking crazy amounts of damage while dealing high amounts, and both are nerfed. You end up with a fairly lack luster frame who can't stand out. Chroma isn't like Rhino who actually has 4 decent skills and can provide amazing CC while having reasonable builds that let his other loadouts fit whatever he wants. Chroma, due to his gates on his abilities, always had pretty strict builds. Now its even more restrictive as DE tried to shove Chroma's tank status into a support role where you can't range or eff without swallowing energy pizzas.

You should read the notes, even DE said that before eidolons, vex armor wasn't a problem and gave chroma a strong identity of being a strong solo-tank. However, then they also said that at it's simplest, DE did not want their eidolons one shotted. NO WHERE did it say DE had a problem with Chroma being an actual strong tank.

[Femuru]

1 hour ago, (PS4)LoisGordils said:

I stopped taking you seriously when I read this. Refrain from commenting any further. 

never lmfao xD

[maddragonmaster]

22 minutes ago, EinheriarJudith said:

id rather they give effigy sentience and have him use spectre AI. im  not trying to say his kit doesn't have issues but his passive is far from the worst imo and is far more tanky than frames short of valkyr.  effigy draws pretty good aggro like any pet ally should. the trade offs for using it i think are a bit out of controll. you lose 50% armor, it has health meaning enemies can force deactivate, and it has a channel cost on top of an initial cast cost. Currently Effigy is to expensive.

on problem i don't want to play back seat when playing a DRAGON themed frame. i do not want to watch a derpy sentient pelt run around and try to breath fire roar and explode. i want to be the thing setting things on fire and rampaging and zooming around. and problem with having a dam sentient pelt as a 4th ability is the fact that this game is about parkour  and having frames with massive aoe abilities and aoe weapons are running around blasting things dead with saide aoe weapons and abilities before that said sentient pelt can even be effective. heck nidus' 1st ability would still be more effective then his 4th even if they gave it sentience. 

Edited September 20, 2018 by maddragonmaster

[(PSN)big_eviljak]

7 hours ago, DeadlyCreation said:

duration effigy would be huge! yeah from a casual perpesctive thus sounds good but if you want to go as far as possible chroma went from one of the best to mediocre. 

the fix for his vex armor is good and understandable but now he is lacking in power. he is just okay in every aspect. he does nothing great (vex armor being the best about him and his 1 and 4 the worst).  i honestly thing that changing some little things could make his while ability kit work we better together than before.

eg weaken effigy overal but make it being buffed by vex armor and duration based. and voila you have a synergy with the ultimate.

elemental wards eöements needs some tweaks aswell but i have stated solutions more than enough allready.

I like that idea. An eg that gets the vex buff and duration would be great.

[Lior55]

29 minutes ago, m0b1us1 said:

It seems you are unaware of the ACTUAL broken mechanics that was involved with vex buff. You see, the major problem came down to the damage portion. If you had a weapon with a dual ele stat like radiation, then the damage multiplier would be given multiple times (in this case it would be fire and electric). So this was the actual broken mechanic that made Chroma so powerful against eidolons.

You also don't seem to be aware how armor works in this game. You see, the more armor you have, the less effective it is. It comes out to every 300 armor you have, you gain 100% of your health pool. So if you have 500 health, and 300 armor, you have 1000 EHP, if you double your armor, its 1500 EHP. So the more armor you have, the more it takes to gain a noticeable difference. Also the less HP you have, the less valuable armor is. So while 2300 isn't small, the old calculation blew that out of the water and let old chroma reach insane levels of EHP. Now, you can reach, 30-40kish?, which is good, but when you consider than Inaros can get 30k EHP and complete status immunity while only using his 4 charge (which requires 0 energy to charge and has tons of ways to heal and every ability CCs) then Chroma is looking incredibly lack luster. Chroma in that case only has armor and damage.

Now is this broken? Absolutely NOT. If your entire identity is "tank damage, and throw it back", then being that tanky isn't shocking at all. It's akin to saying "vauban has great CC". When the frame's identity is nerfed, then the frame drastically suffers. Imagine if they took Vauban and they nerfed his 3 so that only 3 enemies at max rank, unmodded, can be affected by it at a time. It would be a horrible blow to Vauban since his greatest strength is his incredibly reliable CC. Now you have Chroma, who only has his armor buff and damage buff, who is only known for taking crazy amounts of damage while dealing high amounts, and both are nerfed. You end up with a fairly lack luster frame who can't stand out. Chroma isn't like Rhino who actually has 4 decent skills and can provide amazing CC while having reasonable builds that let his other loadouts fit whatever he wants. Chroma, due to his gates on his abilities, always had pretty strict builds. Now its even more restrictive as DE tried to shove Chroma's tank status into a support role where you can't range or eff without swallowing energy pizzas.

You should read the notes, even DE said that before eidolons, vex armor wasn't a problem and gave chroma a strong identity of being a strong solo-tank. However, then they also said that at it's simplest, DE did not want their eidolons one shotted. NO WHERE did it say DE had a problem with Chroma being an actual strong tank.

Marry me. Thank you for laying out this knowledge and furthering our cause to getting Chroma to a great state. DE must hear us. I mean... that nerf hurt so much. Chroma is my favorite frame and he's less than meh right now. Nidus blows him out of the water when it comes to tank, CC, healing, damage; it's atrocious. To me, he's a buffing tank frame. He could easily get a sticky buff treatment and make his effigy a buffing/CC/damage sentry AFTER they buff his 3 back. Do you think that they should buff his HP as well because they only buffed his Armor and Energy for some reason. 😕

[(PSN)big_eviljak]

9 minutes ago, Lior55 said:

Marry me. Thank you for laying out this knowledge and furthering our cause to getting Chroma to a great state. DE must hear us. I mean... that nerf hurt so much. Chroma is my favorite frame and he's less than meh right now. Nidus blows him out of the water when it comes to tank, CC, healing, damage; it's atrocious. To me, he's a buffing tank frame. He could easily get a sticky buff treatment and make his effigy a buffing/CC/damage sentry AFTER they buff his 3 back. Do you think that they should buff his HP as well because they only buffed his Armor and Energy for some reason. 😕

Tbf... Nidus blows alot of frames out of the water. Nidus is almost perfect... If every frame was built as well as nidus we would need missions with lvl 400+ enemies juat to have a challenge.

[Me.KayOh]

They can.

 

But they won't. 

 

Most you'll get in response is a question from Steve and a sarcastic remark from Rebecca downplaying your points. 

 

:shrug:

[Doc.Delta10_o]

I would like to be able to change elements at a whim.

On a petty note: His elemental colors clash with my fashion frame.

[-ARKEYN-]

Hello everyone. This is my first topic in Warframe's Forum. Sorry for my broken English (Maybe)
Today i want to talk about Chroma and his abilites.
After the post on Twitter where DE they said about of this frame "Nothing planned at the moment.". I, as well as probably others were upset at this answer. Ok. Maybe we can wait...but at the moment his skill not that useless (It is Spectral Scream and Effigy and of course Toxic's buff second skill) his weak. Spectral scream now depends on Vex Armor...It's realy cool, but no increase in strength. Too weak. What about Toxic Chroma...That's horrible...Recharge rate and Weapon Change Rate...Agree, bad buff in the battle where need to maneuver (I'm talk about Running speed how new buff) 
Passive (It is more of a feature, like the Revenant's immunity of a magnet🙁) I suggest: From the chosen color of energy will depend on what elemental damage will be on the equipped weapons (or at second variant even resistance to this or that elemental damage which you have chosen ... just right)
1-skill: All the same, it's even more important to strengthen it. The fact that he can depend on the 3-skill is cool, but there is still no difference. Checked. ☹️
2-skill: Change only the "toxic buff," instead of the speed of reloading and the speed of changing weapons, change the attack speed and movement speed. Motivation will appear take Toxic Chroma
3-Skill: No comments. He is already so good, except that the armor can be added with a bit of sensitivity, with a multiplier of damage... The best buff is among the frames. 😊
4-skill: Here's the trumpet-business! ... Holds against up to 60LVL well, but next.... So there is no such damage after 50 lvl. Type has its own mind, so to speak. (May be stunned at a distance, or maybe at all it's to score a big Bolter). Better return at least a chance of drops credits ... I do not know why this feature was removed ...
I would like to see this kind of rework, but not how with the excalibur ... (1 skill was removed, replaced with another one.)😶

Edited September 21, 2018 by -ARKEYN-

[Obe-Ron-Kenobi]

2 hours ago, smooth.operator said:

I would like to be able to change elements at a whim.

On a petty note: His elemental colors clash with my fashion frame.

Preach on my guy, that passive HAS to go for Chroma to make an impact in the evolving state of Warframe (and I'd hate to have another forgotten stepchild situation like Nyx again). IMO, if DE is to make as brief of a "rework" as possible these things HAVE TO CHANGE:

1. Passive NEEDS to be replaced and the current functionality moved to an ability (element swap)
2. If Spectral Scream stays as a 1st ability it needs some polish
3. Vex armor needs to be balanced (NOT another nerf, but NOTt a return to form. m0b1us1 described the situation in one of the best lights I've seen in the comment above/below *see spoiler).  

In my opinion Chroma also severely needs patches to his Spectral Scream and Effigy, as well as Toxin and Electric functionality on Elemental Ward (which I went into extensive detail in my rework suggestion if you want to talk about specifcs there, don't wanna waste mores space here), but at this point it would just be polish. The above 3 reasons are in my opinion the most apparent problems that need solving, and if that's all that would get a fix I can't say I'd be satisfied, but I'd definitely consider the access a this point.

Spoiler

m0b1us1: It seems you are unaware of the ACTUAL broken mechanics that was involved with vex buff. You see, the major problem came down to the damage portion. If you had a weapon with a dual ele stat like radiation, then the damage multiplier would be given multiple times (in this case it would be fire and electric). So this was the actual broken mechanic that made Chroma so powerful against eidolons.

You also don't seem to be aware how armor works in this game. You see, the more armor you have, the less effective it is. It comes out to every 300 armor you have, you gain 100% of your health pool. So if you have 500 health, and 300 armor, you have 1000 EHP, if you double your armor, its 1500 EHP. So the more armor you have, the more it takes to gain a noticeable difference. Also the less HP you have, the less valuable armor is. So while 2300 isn't small, the old calculation blew that out of the water and let old chroma reach insane levels of EHP. Now, you can reach, 30-40kish?, which is good, but when you consider than Inaros can get 30k EHP and complete status immunity while only using his 4 charge (which requires 0 energy to charge and has tons of ways to heal and every ability CCs) then Chroma is looking incredibly lack luster. Chroma in that case only has armor and damage.

Now is this broken? Absolutely NOT. If your entire identity is "tank damage, and throw it back", then being that tanky isn't shocking at all. It's akin to saying "vauban has great CC". When the frame's identity is nerfed, then the frame drastically suffers. Imagine if they took Vauban and they nerfed his 3 so that only 3 enemies at max rank, unmodded, can be affected by it at a time. It would be a horrible blow to Vauban since his greatest strength is his incredibly reliable CC. Now you have Chroma, who only has his armor buff and damage buff, who is only known for taking crazy amounts of damage while dealing high amounts, and both are nerfed. You end up with a fairly lack luster frame who can't stand out. Chroma isn't like Rhino who actually has 4 decent skills and can provide amazing CC while having reasonable builds that let his other loadouts fit whatever he wants. Chroma, due to his gates on his abilities, always had pretty strict builds. Now its even more restrictive as DE tried to shove Chroma's tank status into a support role where you can't range or eff without swallowing energy pizzas.

You should read the notes, even DE said that before eidolons, vex armor wasn't a problem and gave chroma a strong identity of being a strong solo-tank. However, then they also said that at it's simplest, DE did not want their eidolons one shotted. NO WHERE did it say DE had a problem with Chroma being an actual strong tank.

 

Edited September 20, 2018 by Oni_Spartan4

[(PSN)chris1pat8twins]

I’ve done many tests with chroma. He is mainly used to bring the weapons back into the spotlight. In fact he was so OP that he could one shot a teralyst’s limb. So hydroid would probably take like 3. Obviously DE did not intend for the eidolons to be easy to take out. So now. Chroma has been somewhat balanced. At least with his third. His forth definitely needs a buff. And almost all warframes’ first abilities are “useless”. Third and forth abilities are usually the most used(and powerful). 

My only suggestion for his forth other than giving it a buff, is to make it do more than scream and breath elements. Like being able to claw nearby enemies and move a little. Basically follow chroma like a sentinel. And his augment mod basically turns chroma into the Effigy. Basically he sprouts the energy wings and takes flight and can shoot balls of elements instead of a typical stream. 

I could see him being able to change elements with his first ability if it is double tapped. Which would change his energy color to a basic, red, green, blue, white. DE would have to work on that. Or maybe chroma can switch Configs. Like if you create an ice config, fire, and lightning, he could switch between them. Armor and all. But that might be complicated. 

Chroma is a complicated warframe. But regardless, I’m ready for him to come out on the 25th. 

[DeadlyCreation]

vor 18 Minuten schrieb Oni_Spartan4:

Preach on my guy, that passive HAS to go for Chroma to make an impact in the evolving state of Warframe (and I'd hate to have another forgotten stepchild situation like Nyx again). IMO, if DE is to make as brief of a "rework" as possible these things HAVE TO CHANGE:

1. Passive NEEDS to be replaced and the current functionality moved to an ability (element swap)
2. If Spectral Scream stays as a 1st ability it needs some polish
3. Vex armor needs to be balanced (NOT another nerf, but NOTt a return to form. m0b1us1 described the situation in one of the best lights I've seen in the comment above/below *see spoiler).  

In my opinion Chroma also severely needs patches to his Spectral Scream and Effigy, as well as Toxin and Electric functionality on Elemental Ward (which I went into extensive detail in my rework suggestion if you want to talk about specifcs there, don't wanna waste mores space here), but at this point it would just be polish. The above 3 reasons are in my opinion the most apparent problems that need solving, and if that's all that would get a fix I can't say I'd be satisfied, but I'd definitely consider the access a this point.

  Unsichtbaren Inhalt anzeigen

m0b1us1: It seems you are unaware of the ACTUAL broken mechanics that was involved with vex buff. You see, the major problem came down to the damage portion. If you had a weapon with a dual ele stat like radiation, then the damage multiplier would be given multiple times (in this case it would be fire and electric). So this was the actual broken mechanic that made Chroma so powerful against eidolons.

You also don't seem to be aware how armor works in this game. You see, the more armor you have, the less effective it is. It comes out to every 300 armor you have, you gain 100% of your health pool. So if you have 500 health, and 300 armor, you have 1000 EHP, if you double your armor, its 1500 EHP. So the more armor you have, the more it takes to gain a noticeable difference. Also the less HP you have, the less valuable armor is. So while 2300 isn't small, the old calculation blew that out of the water and let old chroma reach insane levels of EHP. Now, you can reach, 30-40kish?, which is good, but when you consider than Inaros can get 30k EHP and complete status immunity while only using his 4 charge (which requires 0 energy to charge and has tons of ways to heal and every ability CCs) then Chroma is looking incredibly lack luster. Chroma in that case only has armor and damage.

Now is this broken? Absolutely NOT. If your entire identity is "tank damage, and throw it back", then being that tanky isn't shocking at all. It's akin to saying "vauban has great CC". When the frame's identity is nerfed, then the frame drastically suffers. Imagine if they took Vauban and they nerfed his 3 so that only 3 enemies at max rank, unmodded, can be affected by it at a time. It would be a horrible blow to Vauban since his greatest strength is his incredibly reliable CC. Now you have Chroma, who only has his armor buff and damage buff, who is only known for taking crazy amounts of damage while dealing high amounts, and both are nerfed. You end up with a fairly lack luster frame who can't stand out. Chroma isn't like Rhino who actually has 4 decent skills and can provide amazing CC while having reasonable builds that let his other loadouts fit whatever he wants. Chroma, due to his gates on his abilities, always had pretty strict builds. Now its even more restrictive as DE tried to shove Chroma's tank status into a support role where you can't range or eff without swallowing energy pizzas.

You should read the notes, even DE said that before eidolons, vex armor wasn't a problem and gave chroma a strong identity of being a strong solo-tank. However, then they also said that at it's simplest, DE did not want their eidolons one shotted. NO WHERE did it say DE had a problem with Chroma being an actual strong tank.

 

a nice buff to elemtal ward would be that: poison blocks all status procs for chroma and electric prevents being knocked down.

that would make them way more viable and immunity to slash procs would help with the biggest problem chroma has as a tank - slash ignores armor

[Obe-Ron-Kenobi]

1 hour ago, DeadlyCreation said:

a nice buff to elemtal ward would be that: poison blocks all status procs for chroma and electric prevents being knocked down.

that would make them way more viable and immunity to slash procs would help with the biggest problem chroma has as a tank - slash ignores armor

I do like the status immunity! Fits his tank theme, and would be a great buff to allies. What do you think about it in inclusion with the holster and reload speeds? Just to round out the ability a bit more as all other elements have multiple effects.

If we're talking status immunity like Inaros's Negation Swarm, then immunity to knockdowns is included already, making that be an inclusion on electric redundant. I'd say change the shield mechanic so that its not just a flat shield buff, but instead introduce a pseudo-shield gate. I say a nerf to the amount of shields total, but allow power strength to affect shield recharge rate and recharge delay; that way, shields are constantly regenerating: providing a much more consistent tanking with shields (albiet still weaker than health and armor). Plus it gives me more of a reason to finally slap on Arcane Ageis, fortitude, or Fast Recharge instead of let them gather dust like a lot of other mods of mine.

Edited September 20, 2018 by Oni_Spartan4

[DeadlyCreation]

vor 29 Minuten schrieb Oni_Spartan4:

I do like the status immunity! Fits his tank theme, and would be a great buff to allies. What do you think about it in inclusion with the holster and reload speeds? Just to round out the ability a bit more as all other elements have multiple effects.

If we're talking status immunity like Inaros's Negation Swarm, then immunity to knockdowns is included already, making that be an inclusion on electric redundant. I'd say change the shield mechanic so that its not just a flat shield buff, but instead introduce a pseudo-shield gate. I say a nerf to the amount of shields total, but allow power strength to affect shield recharge rate and recharge delay; that way, shields are constantly regenerating: providing a much more consistent tanking with shields (albiet still weaker than health and armor). Plus it gives me more of a reason to finally slap on Arcane Ageis, fortitude, or Fast Recharge instead of let them gather dust like a lot of other mods of mine.

i think holsterrate is redubdant because with melee 3.0 its beeing removed. actually i think this could be another chance for us to see a rework announced. but the reload speed can be inclouded. that a nice addition.

 

also maybe give electricity a movement speed buff. this shouldnt be as strong as volt but having faster shield regen + movementspeed increased would make it more fun to use. especially if you could switch between elements in mission.

[Obe-Ron-Kenobi]

58 minutes ago, DeadlyCreation said:

i think holsterrate is redubdant because with melee 3.0 its beeing removed. actually i think this could be another chance for us to see a rework announced. but the reload speed can be inclouded. that a nice addition.

 

also maybe give electricity a movement speed buff. this shouldnt be as strong as volt but having faster shield regen + movementspeed increased would make it more fun to use. especially if you could switch between elements in mission.

Good point about melee 3.0, forgot about that.

Agreed with movement speed. plus with effigy's buff on top of it Chroma would go from one of the slowest frames to something respectable in terms of speed. That also supports electricity's shield properties as in order to recharge shields you gotta be running away a lot. I'm gonna include this (and credit you) in my rework suggestion. 

[DeadlyCreation]

vor 6 Minuten schrieb Oni_Spartan4:

Good point about melee 3.0, forgot about that.

Agreed with movement speed. plus with effigy's buff on top of it Chroma would go from one of the slowest frames to something respectable in terms of speed. That also supports electricity's shield properties as in order to recharge shields you gotta be running away a lot. I'm gonna include this (and credit you) in my rework suggestion. 

yeah nice. hopefully this reaches pablo

[Obe-Ron-Kenobi]

1 hour ago, DeadlyCreation said:

yeah nice. hopefully this reaches pablo

At this point, anybody.

[lullul1635]

chroma's 1 should work as how beam weapon does and allow players to use any weapon(or at least melee weapon) while using 1.

chroma's 4 augment should make effigy to follow chroma instead of holding 4 and making it move.

[ZodiacShinryu]

At this point I would go just for the basics and fundamental issues...

1. He gets a beefed up passive. I mean I'd even go for the simplistic triple jump passive I've seen people suggest. It would at least put him on par with Equinox. I am personally for him ignoring elemental mismatches (meaning he never loses damage to elemental resistances but can still benefit from exploiting elemental weaknesses).
2. Elemental swapping (tied to whatever). Honestly I don't understand the resistance to the idea because generally everyone only talks about Cold and Heat for serious matters and even than they perform nearly the same function/role (heat is honestly thee best right now because of how armor works, and the calculation changes). Assuming you can't have other elements on at the same time (currently true now even with multiple Chroma in the squad), I don't see where he gets so powerful/broken. Maybe people can actually enjoy the elemental forms when the situations arise (and you don't need to abort if you accidently pick the wrong load out), at the very least no one swaps anyway. Another semi important aspect is freedom to pick whatever energy color you want (#fashionframe).
3. Spectral Scream should be "exalted" class. People will groan but it is the simplest answer. Then give it access to the Beam class mods (it is basically an ignis anyway, a way worse one) and beam class damage mechanics. You can't fire your own weapons or melee, drains energy and locks most energy recovery options so it may as well count as your weapon like all other exalted class abilities. Honestly, I'd settle for even just giving it beam damage mechanics could be a major step up for now. Switch its power position with Effigy if that is so important sticking point for some people (aka SS becomes his 4th).
4. Effigy should be duration based. It can keep the health bar (and the limitations that brings). It could even share statistics with Spectral Scream/Vex (it might kind of now). A full power strength Chroma Effigy can actually do a surprising amount of damage but Effigy can only do single target damage (and he switches targets a lot making his killing speed that much slower). That being said a fully armored Corrupted Bombard (single, in the simulacrum) still takes something like 2000-2500 energy to kill. Some people will be like "well Effigy isn't meant to do damage" and that's fine but the cost effectiveness of it is way off. In realistic situations Effigy isn't going to focus kill a target and spread that damage out among all near by targets (I suppose it reinforces Heat dominance due to panic procs) AND he takes 50% of my armor. 2500 energy is about 4 full energy refills with P.Flow and you still technically need to worry about Ward and Vex. At least as a duration he is free to do what he wants while minimally affecting my own performance.

In his very own quest, Lotus remarks that Chroma is "One of the most powerful Warframes… His adaptability is unparalleled."  And yet he is competing closely with at least 6 other frames on weapon damage capabilities (and losing in some situations; Rhino being almost a superior clone). Then there is the lack of adaptability because his elemental capabilities are near non-functional. He mechanically plays like a lesser Frost, Ember/Nezha, Volt, or Saryn; I can understand them being specialist elemental frames but without elemental swapping he doesn't get an edge in the field. Then you have Excalibur running around with an augment that plays his own mechanic even better than himself and Equinox which plays adaptability roles better.

Simply, I don't see how Chroma (Prime) can be a "True Elemental Master" when he can neither wield a single elemental to the highest caliber nor access more than one of them at a time (let alone he can't access all of the elementals, base or combined, anyway).

---

For people interesting in more long-winded ideas with various possible OP aspects but generally just additive to what Chroma already is for a more enjoyable and fluid play then I'll just leave my old rework thread from awhile ago. He is my favorite frame so I am biased.

 

[Birdframe_Prime]

Chroma's survivability was, and I'm sure I've said this too many times, actually broken. More so than his damage. But the problem with Chroma was that his ability multiplied the after-mod results, not the base, like every other ability in the game does.

DE deemed this wrong. Because the calculation was wrong from the start and they hadn't changed it because they didn't realise it wasn't operating as intended for too long.

Now, if you compare it to the other ability-based damage-mitigating frames, like Mesa, Gara, Trinity, Nezha, Nova, they all have something specific in common; none of them can exceed 95% Damage Reduction without another Warframe's abilities to boost them. Chroma can now, when modded for the ability, achieve between 90-95% damage reduction.

That was what they intended from the start.

Kind of doesn't matter that it's a nerf when it was broken ability that's been fixed.

Also... Fire Chroma? Why would you not be running Ice? You can literally bounce Bombard rockets back, give them a taste of their own medicine.

[maddragonmaster]

5 hours ago, smooth.operator said:

I would like to be able to change elements at a whim.

On a petty note: His elemental colors clash with my fashion frame.

i understand and i believe dumping spectral scream is not the dam answer like everyone says it would be. i absolutely hate the fact everyone suggests removing the only active ability you can do that feels dragony and replacing it with a equinox like ability cept with 4 elements, me personally i rather see them dump effigy cause i hate that ability and feel like its the main thing holding the frame down. anyways though i can think of a way to either add element changing in without removing an ability or how to keep a less effective version of effigy (depending on if it keeps said credit booster). and it is to put it into that new gear wheel that they intending to do. hey its not perfect but if they are thinking about using that new gear wheel mechanic to expand how much gear you can have  on person then hey have a exclusive slot or slots on the gear wheel for chroma that allows for that function. 

Edited September 20, 2018 by maddragonmaster

[(XBOX)Kaldwin1571]

Ahahaha like every other abilities. 

I can name a lot that is moltiplicative... 

First of all? Rhino m's roar

And I'm pretty sure that mesa can resist longer than Chroma

[(XBOX)Kaldwin1571]

Ahahaha like every other abilities. 

I can name a lot that is moltiplicative... 

First of all? Rhino m's roar

And I'm pretty sure that mesa can resist longer than Chroma

Nah, completely sure, and have a minigua that can destroy everything she sees ( peacemaker) 

If this is balanced I'm santa Claus ahahah

[DeadlyCreation]

vor einer Stunde schrieb ZodiacShinryu:

At this point I would go just for the basics and fundamental issues...

1. He gets a beefed up passive. I mean I'd even go for the simplistic triple jump passive I've seen people suggest. It would at least put him on par with Equinox. I am personally for him ignoring elemental mismatches (meaning he never loses damage to elemental resistances but can still benefit from exploiting elemental weaknesses).
2. Elemental swapping (tied to whatever). Honestly I don't understand the resistance to the idea because generally everyone only talks about Cold and Heat for serious matters and even than they perform nearly the same function/role (heat is honestly thee best right now because of how armor works, and the calculation changes). Assuming you can't have other elements on at the same time (currently true now even with multiple Chroma in the squad), I don't see where he gets so powerful/broken. Maybe people can actually enjoy the elemental forms when the situations arise (and you don't need to abort if you accidently pick the wrong load out), at the very least no one swaps anyway. Another semi important aspect is freedom to pick whatever energy color you want (#fashionframe).
3. Spectral Scream should be "exalted" class. People will groan but it is the simplest answer. Then give it access to the Beam class mods (it is basically an ignis anyway, a way worse one) and beam class damage mechanics. You can't fire your own weapons or melee, drains energy and locks most energy recovery options so it may as well count as your weapon like all other exalted class abilities. Honestly, I'd settle for even just giving it beam damage mechanics could be a major step up for now. Switch its power position with Effigy if that is so important sticking point for some people (aka SS becomes his 4th).
4. Effigy should be duration based. It can keep the health bar (and the limitations that brings). It could even share statistics with Spectral Scream/Vex (it might kind of now). A full power strength Chroma Effigy can actually do a surprising amount of damage but Effigy can only do single target damage (and he switches targets a lot making his killing speed that much slower). That being said a fully armored Corrupted Bombard (single, in the simulacrum) still takes something like 2000-2500 energy to kill. Some people will be like "well Effigy isn't meant to do damage" and that's fine but the cost effectiveness of it is way off. In realistic situations Effigy isn't going to focus kill a target and spread that damage out among all near by targets (I suppose it reinforces Heat dominance due to panic procs) AND he takes 50% of my armor. 2500 energy is about 4 full energy refills with P.Flow and you still technically need to worry about Ward and Vex. At least as a duration he is free to do what he wants while minimally affecting my own performance.

In his very own quest, Lotus remarks that Chroma is "One of the most powerful Warframes… His adaptability is unparalleled."  And yet he is competing closely with at least 6 other frames on weapon damage capabilities (and losing in some situations; Rhino being almost a superior clone). Then there is the lack of adaptability because his elemental capabilities are near non-functional. He mechanically plays like a lesser Frost, Ember/Nezha, Volt, or Saryn; I can understand them being specialist elemental frames but without elemental swapping he doesn't get an edge in the field. Then you have Excalibur running around with an augment that plays his own mechanic even better than himself and Equinox which plays adaptability roles better.

Simply, I don't see how Chroma (Prime) can be a "True Elemental Master" when he can neither wield a single elemental to the highest caliber nor access more than one of them at a time (let alone he can't access all of the elementals, base or combined, anyway).

---

For people interesting in more long-winded ideas with various possible OP aspects but generally just additive to what Chroma already is for a more enjoyable and fluid play then I'll just leave my old rework thread from awhile ago. He is my favorite frame so I am biased.

 

this right here! this is the best simple fix ever. nothing to rediculous but it would make everythign more viable!

id add that poison and electric get a reworked buff with elemental ward. as often said poison could give immunity to status effects and electric could increse movement speed, while making the electric shock chain from enemy to enemy.