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[DE]Rebecca

Nightwave: Series 1

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2 minutes ago, Rawbeard said:

yeah, I intended to lowkey throw shade, but didn't want to be mean before actually playing it. seeing as there are no actual missions, just "play whatever, get your weekly", I must say the removal of alerts was a bad move, probably. will see how it plays out.
there has to be more, right? something? anything? there was supposed to be story. but... right now all I feel that shutting down Nora for knowing too much would be the most sensible course of action

For sure. Give it some play and tell us what you think. This is the first event of its type, so it is expected there will be some course-correction as we tread new ground. 

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2 minutes ago, [DE]Bear said:

We have a multitude of players, and Warframe is fundamentally a co-op game. While a majority of these events can be completed in a solo setting, we wanted to be able to reward those who also spend time playing this game with friends and allies. We are going to be looking at feedback with many eyes as this new system is rolled out, so keep your thoughts coming. For everyone who has these concerns, what else would you like to see? Feedback is important, but keep it constructive, please.

True, Warframe is a co-op game, but not everyone plays with friends or adds the random people they play with. Co-op doesn't and shouldn't only mean "Play with Friends" it should mean "Play with other people."
And some people, myself included, are in our own clan that we've built from the ground up but we're the only people in our clans. (I'm a bit of a completionist when it comes to warframe.) And as much as you'd like to believe it, not everyone adds everyone they play with as a friend, most of my friends don't play warframe, and I don't like adding random people to my list that I played within 1 or 2 missions. I like playing in random squads, but I don't really have any friends in warframe, and the very few I do have are either in their own clans or haven't been on warframe for months. So this challenge is a strong no-go.

Removing alerts is kinda disappointing, I started doing them not for the rewards but just so I could just... play the game... I used it as a form of matchmaking.
If there was some form of randomized matchmaking, such as you choose a level range, a mission type, maybe even a faction then hit go and get randomly put into a mission of other people then I'd be all good with removing them. But as of now, I'm just... disappointed and annoyed.
I'll just stick to repeating invasions, onslaught, or those 10 nodes that everyone plays and avoid the rest of everything that has zero squads.

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18 minutes ago, Udinbak said:

I think I'm leaning towards "bring back alerts" for starters, then probably "replace nightwave cred offerings with.... New/interesting content?".

you cannot imagine my smug face right now, since this system turns out exactly what I expected. more grind, less content.

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24 minutes ago, Enialyx said:

↓....↓

If I'm understanding it reasonably accurately:

1) Is "Wolf of Saturn Six" a new syndicate [Kind of?] with perpetual standing just like other syndicates?
I think the standing we get goes towards 'Tiers' which give rewards at each tier.

2) The acts provide standing. But how do I rank up with it?
I assume it just rolls over without a "rank up" between tiers (could be wrong(I'm not))

3) Does the rank go all the way to 30?
Yes, then you can "prestige" back to 0

4) Does the standing reset after a little over 4 days?
No, the standing and (as far as I can tell) Wolf Cred lasts until the next part of the story which will be in (unknown) number of weeks. Unless it's just the wc that gets reset and we keep the nightwave standing/tier between chapters... The daily/weekly acts are basically challenges to complete in that week, then they reset. Whether they will be different challenges or not, is impossible to know until next week

OR

I have absolutely no idea what's going on...

Edited by Udinbak
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2 minutes ago, [DE]Bear said:

For sure. Give it some play and tell us what you think. This is the first event of its type, so it is expected there will be some course-correction as we tread new ground. 

I can already give you first feedback: making it look like a syndicate standing grind, but it not being listed as a syndicate is both confusing and opens a lot of questions that a player might need to know without accidentally wasting weekly standing missions.

a) when I reach the cap, is overflow carried to next rank? or do I have to puzzle out exactly how to get all my standing?

b) when I reach the cap, do I have to manually level it up, stopping any other activity that might finish another weekly mission, or does it just jump to the next rank?

c) did it have to be "fill Ayatans" on the day I filled the Ayatans I collected over the last few months? seriously. 😛

d) could missions of appropriate type to challanges get a marker on their node to more easily find them? one thing nice about alerts was "click the tab, start the mission", now there are way more steps that also reward far, far less. so some quality of life would be really a nice trade back for us

e) eh, I'll probably forgotten something already.

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So it's going to take 2 months to get a SINGLE UMBRA FORMA assuming you don't miss a single challenge. Did DE go completely insane?

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I love the rewards in it but I hate how it's time gated. Pretty disappointed. 

I got to fight Wolf once but sadly pub - teammates timed me out.

I wish you could let people grind it in a limited time frame as well, not all of us have every day to spend ya know. Some get sporadic gaps where we can play for a few hours while sometimes not be able to log in at all.

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Reminds me of Destiny bounties and the grinds to level up weapons with specific requirements.  I guess at least it's not random.

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1 minute ago, Rawbeard said:

I can already give you first feedback: making it look like a syndicate standing grind, but it not being listed as a syndicate is both confusing and opens a lot of questions that a player might need to know without accidentally wasting weekly standing missions.

a) when I reach the cap, is overflow carried to next rank? or do I have to puzzle out exactly how to get all my standing?

b) when I reach the cap, do I have to manually level it up, stopping any other activity that might finish another weekly mission, or does it just jump to the next rank?

c) did it have to be "fill Ayatans" on the day I filled the Ayatans I collected over the last few months? seriously. 😛

d) could missions of appropriate type to challanges get a marker on their node to more easily find them? one thing nice about alerts was "click the tab, start the mission", now there are way more steps that also reward far, far less. so some quality of life would be really a nice trade back for us

e) eh, I'll probably forgotten something already.

I'm concerned about exactly this as well. I can't find any info on whethere there is the usual limit or no. Neither ingame nor google.

 

Otherwise I like it. I dig checklists, That sortie one should be changed to just "complete X sorties" because why should the game care about me doing it with a certain group of people instead of pugging them or doing them alone? Makes no sense.

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I just had this very big and nasty man appear during a ODS mission who took quite a while to die... I guess that's part of this update too? I liked it 😄

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2 minutes ago, Rawbeard said:

I can already give you first feedback: making it look like a syndicate standing grind, but it not being listed as a syndicate is both confusing and opens a lot of questions that a player might need to know without accidentally wasting weekly standing missions.

a) when I reach the cap, is overflow carried to next rank? or do I have to puzzle out exactly how to get all my standing?

b) when I reach the cap, do I have to manually level it up, stopping any other activity that might finish another weekly mission, or does it just jump to the next rank?

c) did it have to be "fill Ayatans" on the day I filled the Ayatans I collected over the last few months? seriously. 😛

d) could missions of appropriate type to challanges get a marker on their node to more easily find them? one thing nice about alerts was "click the tab, start the mission", now there are way more steps that also reward far, far less. so some quality of life would be really a nice trade back for us

e) eh, I'll probably forgotten something already.

A) Yep - Overflow carried on into next rank.

B) Nope - Rank up is automatic.

C) RIP - No, seriously we have seen some comments on this. Again, this is the kind of feedback we are reviewing for future events.

D) Will add to notes - QoL suggestions are always welcome. Again, nothing like this is a quick fix, but certainly worth some review.

E) I feel you - Coffee is good (or tea -- whatever's clever).

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1 hour ago, Udinbak said:

Am I misunderstanding something or....

Instead of doing a thing and receiving the associated reward immediately, I now have to do a currently uncountable number of things to get to tier 3 just to get 50 Wolf Creds, so that I can buy 1-3 something from the offerings, or do an unmentionable number of things to reach tier 6 to get another 50 WC's just to buy 1 reactor/catalyst and 25 WC worth of another thing, followed by Another 6 TIERS for my next 50 WC? 

I must be mistaken right? 

Like,from "do a thing for something" to "do a fk ton of things for a thing"...???

Please tell me I'm wrong, because I can't see any other source of WC.

Also: Shouldn't "Nightwave Standing" be listed in the "Standing" Tab at the end of a mission? And the "Standing" Tab have been updated to list the standing acquired for all factions in a mission instead of a maximum of 4?

Also: "3 captures in a week"="challenge"="kill 500 enemies... in.. a.. week?"

Seriously? 

Yeah, this was my fear when they announced it, and it's true. They downgraded the old system hard.

If only we had missions that would give standing and wolf creds directly (like 5-10 each), on an hourly rotation like arbitrations. That would probably be a good way to replace alerts with this system, otherwise they managed to get an improved challenges system, but again failed to make it as good as it could be. And failed utterly to adequately replace alerts.
 

My suggestion for improving this would be:

  • Have a mission on an hourly rotation, like arbitrations, or even half hourly. That mission would reward some standing for the Nightwave and a small amount of wolf creds (5-10). To avoid making wolf creds too cheap, they could be a random reward along with some of the stuff removed from nightwaves that we'd get from alerts, so you'd get creds OR resources OR endo OR void traces, but always some standing.
  • Make creds permanent. I know you don't want to trivialize potatoes, because plat. So, maybe remove them from the shop, and add it to the cycling missions (suggested above), or limit the number of potatoes we can buy per week?

As it is now, the system while having some cool rewards, does a poor job of replacing alerts. Alerts had three main functions: they were a source of fast rewards, they served as a aggregator for the community, you'd always find people doing alerts, and it served as a guideline for those times when people don't have any major objective, they could just "pop in for some alerts".

Nightwave does none of the above, it doesn't get people together, maybe it will promote people joining populated clans a bit more, but even that's having some backlash, its rewards are MUCH slower to get than any alert, and it doesn't really fill in the "bite-size" content distribution that Alerts would.

Adding nightwave missions along with acts would work to fill in that spot left open.

Edited by ReaverKane
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4 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

- Random Alerts are going away and have been replaced with a Rotation of rewards within Nora's Cred Offerings. This allows players to plan, prioritize and access content for free that previously relied on 'right time, right place' often within a 60 minute window.

Actually, no.  You've removed the rewards from alerts, but not the alerts themselves.  I had been imagining a menu of different missions that would reward cred but would still help to cluster random players into groups with shared goals the way the alert system did.  Now, we'll all have our own (Nightwing) objectives in the back of our minds but no unifying goal outside the primary mission objective. 

I liked the way that the Alert missions would allow quick in-and-out gameplay with randoms, where all other public matchmaking runs a risk of incompatible player goals.  For example, if I want to grind 5 minute dark sector survivals for A rotation rewards or credits, but 2 other players are farming Rotation C rewards, I'm either stuck with them for 20 minutes (or more) or I abandon the mission.  Alerts were the one place where I could be reasonably assured that everyone in public just wanted to get in and out as quickly as I did.  

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7 minutes ago, [DE]Bear said:

A) Yep - Overflow carried on into next rank

Just came across this - screwed up my acts and ended up at 9k/10 with nothing under 3k left.

Ranked up, 2k/10k.

'tis a small thing, but eeee this makes me happy.

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44 minutes ago, [DE]Bear said:

We have a multitude of players, and Warframe is fundamentally a co-op game. While a majority of these events can be completed in a solo setting, we wanted to be able to reward those who also spend time playing this game with friends and allies. We are going to be looking at feedback with many eyes as this new system is rolled out, so keep your thoughts coming. For everyone who has these concerns, what else would you like to see? Feedback is important, but keep it constructive, please.

But I play with others, that's why we have the public option right? Those are allies right? To play with anyone in the same clan, which is like, 1 guy, I have to either not sleep or skip work. I guess I have no friends either, even if I had that wouldn't guarantee they would be on to do a sortie or would even wait for me to do it with. If the co-op nature is to be considered, as it should, "with others" would suffice, because it's enough that the acts are menial chores already, waiting for night time in Cetus IF you even have the time when night on Cetus happens or praying to RNGesus for eximus spawns so you don't spend the entire week in some random mission trying to get it or having to play with "friends" isn't a challenge, it's not an act either because nothing is an act, it's just plain boring and troublesome.


The Nightwave already is a system that gets old in a couple of days, for many it's old news already and a pain to grind because they are being forced to do menial tasks, stuff like the ones mentioned above only make it unfun and make it boring twice as fast. If Nightwave is to have no content and reward playing the game then that's fine, but forcing people to get out of their way for something troublesome and boring that still requires waiting and/or scheduling (or even just pure RNG) is just silly. Challenge is fine, those aren't challenging (nor rewarding by themselves, 5k points is worth nothing considering the trouble you go through).

Edited by God_is_a_Cat_Girl
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This seems like one of the most tedious unrewarding directions this game has gone to.
Help me out with the math, how long is this Wolf of Saturn Battlepass supposed to last?
And is it enough time to make 10k x 30 to reach that 30 tier?
(Please provide more info on the prestige thing past tier 30! No info in the game about it!)
Does the tier remain indefinite or does that reset?
There was talk of Wolf Creds expiring after this "act", but I'm wondering about those tier rewards and how obtainable they are if you're not daily/weekly achieving all those busywork menial tasks.
Is there any other way to earn this standing apart from these limited one time daily/weekly chores?
It seems like there's a bottleneck, you get one daily(??) chore for a meagre 1k, then a few weekly ones you can only do once, and then wait a week for more chores to cross off your list.

Is this simply another case of untested balancing and you'll sort this all out after seeing how long and arduous the tasks are?
Or did you really think, that players would be happy, and feel rewarded, by doing a few menial tasks a week, to earn one tier, for one reward, perhaps one x50 Wolf Creds, and then wait for a few more weeks until they can reach more?
Feels like it's really trying to test my patience, and in a free-to-play game, that feels like it's going towards the mobile end of the scale with manipulating players to buy out of frustration as they are not earning anything for weeks of tasks.
Do objectives, over and over, for days, to reach one or more tiers to get a limited 50 Wolf Creds.
Remind me how often a Nitain alert came up again? Was it every hour?
I have a friend with 1.9k hours in the game with 0 nitain at the moment, and now no way to obtain more.
Poor new players who can't get easy potatos in alerts, but have to grind for weeks to buy one, maybe even the entire month, and again, how long is this event available to be completed before replaced?

Also, is there really no story missions? Just a few voice overs? It seems really disconnected from the overall picture.

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Just a quick calculation.

Currently there are 1 daily, 3 elite weekly, 7 weekly.

Assume "daily" resets daily( Though I saw it resets in 2 days for the first daily mission), then weekly we can get 43000 reputation at most.  [Don't consider the wolf prisoners, I encountered a 3-member team and got 150 reputation, one of them bugged out. I only encountered them in 1 out of 10 games on Hydron]

On average 4 levels a week. if this chapter only last 2 months, then you will need to finish nearly every mission to get enough reputation.

The sad thing is that I never do Hydrolyst hunts and I just don't like those kind of hunts. 

I'm afraid I may not be able to reach level 30 before the mission ends.

Please let us know how long the event last, thank you!

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4 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

- Random Alerts are going away and have been replaced with a Rotation of rewards within Nora's Cred Offerings. This forces players to plan, prioritize and wait for content for a large expenditure of time and effort, that previously relied on 'RNG' while rewarding the player instantly.

Edited by Udinbak

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Three things:

The new mods and Umbral Forma can't be [linked] atm.

[Nightwave <reputation_small> standing].

Is there a way to see when the daily act resets once you've completed it?
Mousing-over no longer shows the timer.

 

Edit:
One more thing: Nora's rewards allow you to hide owned. Can you also hide 'crafted'? (And thanks for that indicator, btw.)

Edited by Chroia

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2 hours ago, Daeiavel said:

So it's going to take 2 months to get a SINGLE UMBRA FORMA assuming you don't miss a single challenge. Did DE go completely insane?

No.

While doing missions on Saturn there is a chance of 3 or 4 convicts from Saturn 6 spawning in a tile, capture these for 50 standing each.

Gonna be a slog of a grind to get anywhere with it but it's technically possible to get there much quicker than 8 weeks.

Also the challenges only reset every weekly reset, so if you do a marathon session every weekend you can still get them all done.

Edited by Springlake
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if you play solo and press ESC the game pauses as normal .. but if you click nightwave banner to check tasks screen the game unpause itself and any enemy around will hit you and you can't do anything but press x2 Esc quickly to save yourself ... hope hotfix will fix this

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10 minutes ago, God_is_a_Cat_Girl said:

But I play with others, that's why we have the public option right? Those are allies right? To play with anyone in the same clan, which is like, 1 guy, I have to either not sleep or skip work. I guess I have no friends either, even if I had that wouldn't guarantee they would be on to do a sortie or would even wait for me to do it with. If the co-op nature is to be considered, as it should, "with others" would suffice, because it's enough that the acts are menial chores already, waiting for night time in Cetus IF you even have the time when night on Cetus happens or praying to RNGesus for eximus spawns so you don't spend the entire week in some random mission trying to get it or having to play with "friends" isn't a challenge, it's not an act either because nothing is an act, it's just plain boring and troublesome.


The Nightwave already is a system that gets old in a couple of days, for many it's old news already and a pain to grind because they are being forced to do menial tasks, stuff like the ones mentioned above only make it unfun and make it boring twice as fast. If Nightwave is to have no content and reward playing the game then that's fine, but forcing people to get out of their way for something troublesome and boring that still requires waiting and/or scheduling (or even just pure RNG) is just silly. Challenge is fine, those aren't challenging (nor rewarding by themselves, 5k points is worth nothing considering the trouble you go through).

Anything stopping you from going to Recruit chat, asking something like "LF someone to do the Nightwave Sortie challenge with" and then making a pre-made group were you friend eachother before going in?

You don't need to stay friends afterwards if you won't want to?

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6 minutes ago, Springlake said:

While doing missions on Saturn there is a chance of 3 or 4 convicts from Saturn 6 spawning in a tile, capture these for 50 standing each. 

🤣

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