Do you also grow attached to npc allies during invasions?

[NeverToReturn]

Might sound a bit like a silly question, but do you ever just look at your allied Corpus or Grineer during an invasion mission, and just can't help but to try and keep them alive?

Its quite a bit hard a task, as it seems allies take a huge amount of damage for no reason, up and dying out of the blue while if they were of the enemy side it'd be the opposite. Yet that just makes me even more attached to them. I tend to side with the Corpus against the Grineer a lot, and seeing a whole squad of those boxheads and their moas make it to the end of the mission with me feels so rewarding for some reason. I know they are just NPCs, but I can't help but to say "You'll live to see another paycheck" or "You're going home today" when saving them from a whole gang of soldiers or even infested.

Just something I wanted to share and ask people how they feel on it. Do you also try your darn hardest to keep that one NPC fighting an entire squad solo alive, be it with a support warframe or not?

Also feel free to post your record of allies alive at the end of the mission. In this pic we have 6, but my friend counted 7. He's the wisp prime.

[Merkranire]

Yes. Sometimes I play a frame like Trinity to keep them alive, and part of the fun is in doing so even if it means I move at their pace; I find that their willingness to fight everything aligns with my own, and we have a good ol’ time

I was sad to learn that the stims we can make in the dojo only work on specific allies in a specific mission, otherwise I’d be making a lot more of them.

In general I like feeling like I’m fighting alongside someone else, and allies in this game can be quite adequate in the fighting-alongside department, and the freedom of build and loadouts we get in this game means I can tweak to compensate for things like dumb AI that any game has to deal with or I can adjust my damage and survival according to how much I want to rely on them (it’s mainly gets frustrating in other games just because I lack options to so thoroughly customise the experience and I’m at the whim of the game design, which is a lot less of a problem in this game)

Edited February 21 by Merkranire

[(PSN)robotwars7]

I used to as a newbie (first time around I thought "maybe there's extra rewards if I keep them alive?"), but then it got to the point where I was only running invasions for potatoes on the very rare occasion they're offered, and since then, they're expendable cannon fodder. usually i end up leaving them for dead when the mission starts and none of them make it to the end. the Grineer commanders and Corpus Officers don't care about their grunts, why should I?

been playing helldivers 2 a lot recently, so I know what it feels like to be an expendable grunt sent into an absolute hellhole. if you're not making it out alive, take as many of the enemy as you can with you! FOR DEMOCRACY!!!

 

[UnstarPrime]

My experience with these NPC's is that I get very confused why they aren't dying as I continue to swing at them, only to eventually recall what it means to play an Invasion mission.

[sly_squash]

I don't even grow attached to my own operator.

[Merkranire]

🤔 Honestly, and this topic just sort of reminded me, this is one of the few games I actually enjoy doing escort missions in.

Usually I hate escort missions and having to babysit an NPC (still got memories of things going horribly wrong in WoW), but I’ve got so many options to deal with whatever the game throws at me, and when I opt to customise to actually fight alongside a rescue target or whatever, it’s a different perspective that I experience; instead of frustration at mission failure, mission failure is just part of the experience I’m actively seeking.

It makes me think of the difference between being forced into escorting some NPC at risk to losing them, and actively choosing to escort some NPC at risk to losing them, and the differences in mindset can result in a very different interpretation of the outcome regardless of what it is

[MrDugan]

No.  They're lucky that friendly fire isn't turned on.  I'm there for the pay, not to help either side.  If friendly fire WAS on, the only way I wouldn't thoughtlessly massacre the ones on "my side" would be if the pay was higher for not killing them, and also worth the hassle.  3k credits?  They're still dead.  Couple thousand endo?  I can be a little careful.

[(XBOX)Big Roy 324]

5 minutes ago, Merkranire said:

🤔 Honestly, and this topic just sort of reminded me, this is one of the few games I actually enjoy doing escort missions in.

Usually I hate escort missions and having to babysit an NPC (still got memories of things going horribly wrong in WoW), but I’ve got so many options to deal with whatever the game throws at me, and when I opt to customise to actually fight alongside a rescue target or whatever, it’s a different perspective that I experience; instead of frustration at mission failure, mission failure is just part of the experience I’m actively seeking.

It makes me think of the difference between being forced into escorting some NPC at risk to losing them, and actively choosing to escort some NPC at risk to losing them, and the differences in mindset can result in a very different interpretation of the outcome regardless of what it is

I think part of that is also how the game does escorting. For things like drones they have a fixed path and you can use abilities to rush them along or protect them as needed.

NPC's they tend to follow you and often teleport closer so you don't have to move at their pace. 

If handled in the same way as our operatives and rescue targets.  I wouldn't mind a mission where you escort an NPC to an objective and then to extraction. 

[Hobie-wan]

I used to wait for them to catch up, but then I became more of a vet and more jaded and got tired of waiting for them to shuffle into an elevator or stop being interested in a piece of fluff in some corner somewhere. If they're near where I'm fighting, great, they can be a distraction for the enemy. Otherwise I don't worry about them.

Likewise with the helpers on syndicate missions. Though sometimes I specifically tell them to stay put so they don't alert enemies on spy missions and such. If one gets downed, it was probably lagging behind and I don't even notice until it's a bit late to save it or I happen to notice during the calm of an elevator ride that I now have 1 or 0 blue dots on the map now.

[Merkranire]

2 hours ago, (XBOX)Big Roy 324 said:

I think part of that is also how the game does escorting. For things like drones they have a fixed path and you can use abilities to rush them along or protect them as needed.

NPC's they tend to follow you and often teleport closer so you don't have to move at their pace. 

If handled in the same way as our operatives and rescue targets.  I wouldn't mind a mission where you escort an NPC to an objective and then to extraction. 

Honestly I find the teleporting a little odd; they’re not meant to be as agile as we are and so we need to travel at their pace, which includes all the chances for getting into scrapes and doing things like having to fight in an area that come with not being able to rush through.

It doesn’t usually crop up too often since I’m typically fighting stuff and that gives them a chance to catch up without teleporting too much, but it’d be a little weird if they were meant to be injured or something. The fixed path drone has definitely given me some fights when I have to watch all sides while it toodles along.

(as an aside and a little offtopic, I get what DE were doing with teleporting a Nyx mind-controlled enemy, but I often find myself wishing that I didn’t keep accidentally teleporting my melee-based temporary ally when I’m just trying to keep on the move; I’d prefer an option to teleport them when needed and otherwise they just do their own thing without being interrupted)

[Hexerin]

5 hours ago, NeverToReturn said:

it seems allies take a huge amount of damage for no reason

There's an actual reason for that, they are. It's so that the allied forces aren't effective, to prevent AFK'ing the mission.

As for the topic itself, I still occasionally run one like that for fun. In fact, I did that in a Rescue mission the other day:

That's one of the MOAs that spawn from the hackable spawners (you get one MOA from each spawner you hack).

I'm... not sure why I was on normal star chart at the time though. Although, to be fair, it's pretty much impossible to keep allies alive on Steel Path.

[NeverToReturn]

5 hours ago, Merkranire said:

Yes. Sometimes I play a frame like Trinity to keep them alive, and part of the fun is in doing so even if it means I move at their pace; I find that their willingness to fight everything aligns with my own, and we have a good ol’ time

I was sad to learn that the stims we can make in the dojo only work on specific allies in a specific mission, otherwise I’d be making a lot more of them.

In general I like feeling like I’m fighting alongside someone else, and allies in this game can be quite adequate in the fighting-alongside department, and the freedom of build and loadouts we get in this game means I can tweak to compensate for things like dumb AI that any game has to deal with or I can adjust my damage and survival according to how much I want to rely on them (it’s mainly gets frustrating in other games just because I lack options to so thoroughly customise the experience and I’m at the whim of the game design, which is a lot less of a problem in this game)

That's something real sweet. And sometimes even a learning experience as well.

For example, I didn't know why the corpus took so much damage and if their shields were broken, I wondered why they wouldn't regenerate. Turns out these fellas taught me about how armor works! Playing Oberon, giving them the healing aura (wish it would pass on to anybody in range, it only affects them on cast) and putting the grass patch would give armor to the corpus humans. Well they went from dying in two shots to being able to tank an entire squad of grineer and survive, since my healing with the armor buff would overwhelm the grineer damage! It was such an epiphany and something I brought even to my own gameplay.

[Merkranire]

1 hour ago, NeverToReturn said:

That's something real sweet. And sometimes even a learning experience as well.

For example, I didn't know why the corpus took so much damage and if their shields were broken, I wondered why they wouldn't regenerate. Turns out these fellas taught me about how armor works! Playing Oberon, giving them the healing aura (wish it would pass on to anybody in range, it only affects them on cast) and putting the grass patch would give armor to the corpus humans. Well they went from dying in two shots to being able to tank an entire squad of grineer and survive, since my healing with the armor buff would overwhelm the grineer damage! It was such an epiphany and something I brought even to my own gameplay.

Hey that’s a pretty fun way to learn something, good on you. I never considered that, but maybe I’ll try using NPC allies to test some things like that (I’m impressed that you noticed the difference amongst all the fighting)

[0_The_F00l]

Maybe in the early days , but then I remember that i might kill the same guy I fought besides if the opposite faction has better rewards.

After stabbing your former allies in the back you start to develop a slick coat of apathy.

[SneakyErvin]

13 hours ago, Merkranire said:

🤔 Honestly, and this topic just sort of reminded me, this is one of the few games I actually enjoy doing escort missions in.

Usually I hate escort missions and having to babysit an NPC (still got memories of things going horribly wrong in WoW), but I’ve got so many options to deal with whatever the game throws at me, and when I opt to customise to actually fight alongside a rescue target or whatever, it’s a different perspective that I experience; instead of frustration at mission failure, mission failure is just part of the experience I’m actively seeking.

It makes me think of the difference between being forced into escorting some NPC at risk to losing them, and actively choosing to escort some NPC at risk to losing them, and the differences in mindset can result in a very different interpretation of the outcome regardless of what it is

Same. I'm one of those odd people that actually enjoyed (and still enjoy) defection as a mission type, and prefer arbitration and archon defense over the other types. Really hated escort missions in WoW and other MMOs. I still have unfond memories of the guy above Lakeshire in the cave. Sooooo sloooooow! And everytime another escort quest was handed to me all I could think of was that slow ass cave dweller fellow.

Hmm I'd like more defection types now that I think of it. Versus grineer and corpus instead of the infested, or helping researchers escape from the void towers or a culverpocalypse inside the labs. It just sucks those few times when that fellow Larry isnt really up to snuff and gets stuck in some stairs or at a guard rail, or when Bob decides to sniff and lick every corrosive or poisonous cloud he can find. Other than that, mellow mode.

[Merkranire]

6 hours ago, SneakyErvin said:

Same. I'm one of those odd people that actually enjoyed (and still enjoy) defection as a mission type, and prefer arbitration and archon defense over the other types. Really hated escort missions in WoW and other MMOs. I still have unfond memories of the guy above Lakeshire in the cave. Sooooo sloooooow! And everytime another escort quest was handed to me all I could think of was that slow ass cave dweller fellow.

Hmm I'd like more defection types now that I think of it. Versus grineer and corpus instead of the infested, or helping researchers escape from the void towers or a culverpocalypse inside the labs. It just sucks those few times when that fellow Larry isnt really up to snuff and gets stuck in some stairs or at a guard rail, or when Bob decides to sniff and lick every corrosive or poisonous cloud he can find. Other than that, mellow mode.

Some common ground and agreement, Ervin, mellow mode or not. I’m surprised.

I’d go for some additional escort mission types as well (in this game), and wouldn’t say “No” to DE expanding Defection to more than like the one node. I agree that the pathing can be a bit of a nightmare, though secretly I treat it like another puzzle to solve (though can respect that it’s not in the design). I want more chances to support someone else and move at their pace, and escorts give me that chance

[Loza03]

I like them well enough. I do my best - ok, well, I do try to - OK, I occasionally attempt to ensure they make it home mostly intact.

 

That being said, I deeply shocked that nobody has mentioned that at least one person got very deeply attached to an invasion NPC, and that resulted in our good friend, Clem.

[NeverToReturn]

9 hours ago, Loza03 said:

I like them well enough. I do my best - ok, well, I do try to - OK, I occasionally attempt to ensure they make it home mostly intact.

 

That being said, I deeply shocked that nobody has mentioned that at least one person got very deeply attached to an invasion NPC, and that resulted in our good friend, Clem.

Not only that, but weren't for the chain of efforts of our fellow tenno, we wouldn't have the legend John Prodman gracing us in the Index every now and again. To think he not only helped in the fight against Phorid but also SURVIVED is a great story.

[NeverToReturn]

On 2024-02-22 at 3:00 AM, Merkranire said:

Hey that’s a pretty fun way to learn something, good on you. I never considered that, but maybe I’ll try using NPC allies to test some things like that (I’m impressed that you noticed the difference amongst all the fighting)

Hehe yeah! Could be a neat way to experiment interactions for runs with friends or random players.

And I'll be honest, when it comes to invasions if I see a single blue pip on the map, that one ally will become my focus for the entire mission. The rescue target is the whole squad, they are the mobile defense objective, we exterminate together, so on and so forth. I swear I pay more attention to their health bars than my own.

[Circle_of_Psi]

On 2024-02-21 at 11:50 PM, sly_squash said:

I don't even grow attached to my own operator.

I'd remove my own operator if I could, so I could keep my drifter 

This is why my operator stays in the shadow realm and only pops up to say something cringe in a quest

Edited February 23 by Circle_of_Psi

[TARINunit9]

"Attached" is too strong a word. But since I play this game for the story, I do feel a general sense of "I am being paid to win this war theater and my clients will usually be happier if more of their soldiers survive"

[(PSN)slightconfuzzled]

I can and often intuitively do.

Its also not too silly a question. There is a lot of interesting and fascinating research and understanding around why and how we can empathise. Including some pretty interesting real life scenarios, of high ranking military personal, "over" empathising with robots/drones whose purpose function will involve their destruction or partial destruction. Like mine clearing robots, that might get bits blown off, but struggle to keep doing their job, provoking strong emotions from officers who with to cease the testing. 

Granted its also more complicated in a video game sense as well, as far as motivations. Like can be the result of seeking challenge, or finding an interesting gameplay mechanic, or empathy for characters, that fulfils and satisfies feelings of camaraderie. Even if acknowledged and put into context (as in not taken to an extreme), and so on. 

Its probably also why I like Defection so much, despite it not being too popular. Sometimes on Syndicate missions, if I am worried they might die (the allies you get), I will have them hang out in a safe location, but sometimes i'll forget, and have to backtrack to get them, because a part of me, would feel bad at "abandoning" them. That being said, I can also apply context when necessary. Empathy in some ways can be a finite resource. Plus obviously some people much prefer the context of "this is a video game, they are obviously not real" and thats valid too. 

[ClockworkDirge]

I used to try to save allies quite often, and would get pretty attached to the ones that lived. But these days the most I’ll do is try to find a prod crewman to try to take all the way to extraction for old time’s, and old meme’s, sake.

Edited February 23 by ClockworkDirge