Jump to content

Recommended Posts

3 hours ago, Shaden73 said:

I think they should just scrap the whole system and do complete rework.

Just make missions with different modifiers every every round/5waves. Some challeging, some fun. 

To give an example: The floor is lava/ Kill the matching color/ Immunity to ranged weapons but melee is insta-kill etc.

 

Keep it challenging but make it fun too, I likey.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

i feel it would be more fun if:

you would tripple the spawn amount in arbitration.

give the option to do an elite one: no revives, none-elite = revives

change the automatic pickup, we don't wana be stuck with 100 hp. basically 1 dead guy will lead to the rest of the team dying.

if not #2 suggestion. bring back no revive mode. i appreciated we had such a mode and it was never "not fun" to not have a can't revive challenge. in fact, you killed the suspense.

also is it true drones have more hp now? they had a ton before, it took so much time to kill them when you're at 30 min + that if an enemy was capturing a node at interception it was mostly because the drones didn't die fast enough. 

TL;DR. reconsider your changes, most of these were not for the better, and actually reverting them all is preferred.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Perma Death was the only thing that made it at all interesting.  Adding revives is a terrible idea.  Adding burden on top of that is an even bigger fail.  Sure it may be no fun for a low level player to die and be forced to quit but the content wasn't supposed to aimed at the low level player in the first place.

People complained about players dying because of the host migrations being broken.  As I said when arbitrations first came out: Adding a game mode that will force host migrations when host migrations are so terrible should have been an easily foreseen fundamental flaw. And these host migration issues are not limited in the slightest to arbitrations. they exist in EVERY game mode.  WHy not spend some time and resources addressing the problem not trying to gloss over it.

Archgun rivens - not a reason for players to come back. Seriously - who cares about arch guns?  They are only used in one gimmicky fight. They are slow to deploy. They are slow to unequip. They do less damage than a large portion of weapons already in the game.  There are no ammo pickups outside the orb fight -and with a 5 minute cooldown most missions are over before you could use them again.

Sorry DE - these changes miss almost every mark. badly.

 

  • Like 2
  • Upvote 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

I played the last days arbitrations exclusively.

1) The new revive mechanic leads to grief and lazy gameplay putting stress on the shoulders of the players who play properly.

2) Drones are not a fun enemy. Especially if you are not the host and see those drones warp around.

3) Endo doesn't feel rewarding if you consider the long times between rewards.

4) Game modes differ greatly in effort for rewards.

5) The drop rates for aura forma (and ephemera) are too low.

6) Archwing rivens: Not worth it until the underlying problems with archguns are solved.

All in all, the additions didn't really change the arbitrations or make them more fun. And while the addition of aura forma is great, the low drop chances and the frustrating long times between these chances lead to burn out.

Edited by Sahansral
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

I've only played a few so far, but I'd say the changes are alright.

It's definitely less thrilling than before, now that permadeath isn't a thing anymore, but I do like the new scaling. Also, less host migrations, of course.

Before I'd often bring Nezha with Warding Halo's Safeguard augment, a big reason for that was to protect others so a run wouldn't be cut too short. Now that's less of an issue, so I guess that gives me more options.

Also, even if most of the time you can play it safely, there are still these cases when you get instagibbed by something. Recent example:

Spoiler

This case here was me on a Nyx P. with full hp and shields, Primed Flow, QT and most of my energy, I think. It was cleanup time in an Interception and the enemies were under Chaos. They weren't facing my way and I think I just missed that one of them had thrown a grenade, and I died to a shock proc or even the grenade itself because I was close enough. Not entirely sure how that went. Log excerpt:

3601.068 Game [Info]: Kontrollo - new avatar: TennoAvatar723
3601.083 Game [Info]: Kontrollo was downed by 1,017 / 1,016 damage from a SHOCK using a NpcThrowGrenadeWeapon
3601.103 Game [Info]: Kontrollo was killed by 1,735 / 718 damage from a SHOCK using a NpcThrowGrenadeWeapon
3601.106 Game [Info]: Enabling spectator mode
3601.118 Script [Info]: *** Enabling spectator mode ***
3601.121 Sys [Info]: Created /Lotus/Interface/SpectatorHUD.swf
3605.832 Net [Info]: IRC out: PRIVMSG #S5cc2ee3fa38e4a23601e6664 :oops
3616.835 Net [Info]: NAT bound for server to ***.***.***.***:*****
3624.980 Net [Info]: IRC out: PRIVMSG #S5cc2ee3fa38e4a23601e6664 :something oneshot me, not sure what

Edited by Kontrollo
meant the augment
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I do agree guys arbitration is long tedious and 3 rotations is about as rewarding as  1 hour on kuva survival with any boosters and kavat buffs both need revamping more so kuva survival with its poor rewarding it needs to scale with each harvester completed not just a flat 200 base kuva per harvest every time and 25 rotations for 1 riven is a real time waste It should be at least 12 or 15 not 25

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2019-04-28 at 2:33 AM, Sahansral said:

I played the last days arbitrations exclusively.

1) The new revive mechanic leads to grief and lazy gameplay putting stress on the shoulders of the players who play properly.

2) Drones are not a fun enemy. Especially if you are not the host and see those drones warp around.

3) Endo doesn't feel rewarding if you consider the long times between rewards.

4) Game modes differ greatly in effort for rewards.

5) The drop rates for aura forma (and ephemera) are too low.

6) Archwing rivens: Not worth it until the underlying problems with archguns are solved.

All in all, the additions didn't really change the arbitrations or make them more fun. And while the addition of aura forma is great, the low drop chances and the frustrating long times between these chances lead to burn out.

Super agree with 1,2, and 4. 

3) I think endo is a very worthy reward in my opinion, because its a resource you can use endlessly. Even if you have every mod in the game maxed, simply maxing Serration or other essential mods can net some decent plat. I think proper scaling of rewards is needed, if you are killing level 200 enemies for 10 waves, you shouldn't earn the same amount of endo as level 90's. Maybe increase both the endo and credit drops from kills in arbitration, scaling based on level or something. 

4) This is bolded because if there was ever 1 thing I want noticed by a dev, its this. How is it ok that the entire weekend Arbitrations were nothing but defense and survival, 10 minutes per Vitus Essence, then when weekdays come, for some god awful reason, thats when the efficient modes comes. Where you can get 1 per 5-7 minutes or whatever the exact average is, there is 0 point it is RNG that only hurts the playerbase, there is NO POSITIVE to this. Instead of offering Defense and Survival, why not offer nothing at all. It seems to stay the same modes all day too, swap them, in a 12 hour span I should see every type of endless. There is clearly no thought being put into this as of the current system, I do not understand it.  

5) They are rare and meant to be that way, Aura Forma seems OP, so it should be a grind, properly scaling rewards would make staying in Rotation C a better choice, therefore making it more realistic to earn.

6) They are neat and honestly twice as encouraging as the other rewards available. But if that was meant to have anything more than add a small bit of hype and a taste of whats the come, then its disappointing. 

Number 4 needs to be fixed... Why does each day only seem to offer 1 or 2 different modes all day, and why are certain modes so much less worth it with an easy fix right there. 8 Waves, reward. 8 minutes, reward. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
On 2019-04-25 at 12:59 PM, -Temp0- said:

How funny that the only people that dare say it happen to press the wrong button at times ALL OF THE TIME?

Like literally what the ****? I played Arbitration for hours and hours, only died 2 times, once because of my own mistake which I never repeated and second time just a random death out of nowhere with full health and garas 2 active. While people around me died all the freakin gtime, and some of them didnt give any effs, they were those frosts who leave the safety of the bubble and leave excavators to potentially die - and not because they needed power cells but because they needed some "action", so you got that guy with a not that tanky frame standing 10 meters away from lv 100+  grineer bombard shooting those grineer whn he could've shoot them from 30 meters away from the bubble - and it so "happens"  thathe dies. Wow. Shocking.

Fry-Im-Shocked-Futurama.gif?fit=360,210&

Who might have though that would happen?

And now his teammates with iq higher than 20 are burdined to revive him, risking to lose their own rewards. Great. Splendind. Thast what you get for your trouble cause by other people.

Literally makes me not ever want to play pubg or anything other than infested excavation ever.

Literally hope no one will ever revive those.

MAYBE ENDGAME ISNT FOR squishy players with the worst load out HAVE THAT THOUGHT NEVER CROSSED YOUR MIND.

Oh hey, people aren't perfect machines, more are ten o'clock this evening. I am not excusing bad and or irresponsible players.

 

I am excusing human error. Gosh forbid some of us have distractions like kids, pets, or infirmed parents, or maybe being tired because we spent all day being productive members of society instead of focusing on playing a video game perfectly.

 

Edited by PeripheralVisionary
  • Like 1
  • Applause 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, -KyloRen- said:

Like i would bother myself to revive anyone hahaha

That's why they're automatic pickups - it's a stick, but there's no carrot. 

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is a nice idea and prevents people from quitting due to dying thanks DE ^.^

  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Honestly, there are some types of people that I don't want to rez. However, unless the burdens are picked up like ayatan stars, I find I am forced to grab 5 of them if I am unlucky. Even without vacuum affecting them, I sort of have to kill the hammers, and when the burden drops I will be close to it.

 

OTOH, my boyfriend has made the point that the ayatan star thing would make squishy characters drop fast trying to pick them up if they did want to rez someone.

 

I feel like there has to be a more eloquent solution to this, though personally I would prefer you remove the rez capability entirely. That is part of arbitrations and made them more high risk.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Nothing that you introduced here, has made any change to actually come back to play more. Even so, these changes instead of incentive, had dropped my team friends rate in this mode of interest to 0. Thanks.

  • Applause 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A little feedback on Arbitrations for controller schema. Please change the button to leave the mission (X on PS4 controllers/A on Xbox Controllers) for the cancel button, it leads to leave the mission by mistake.

Thanks in advance!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

I've played a few more since last time I commented here, and I think the revive mechanic -- while not perfect -- works well enough that you should increase the starting difficulty a bit. Just a few levels.

 

Edit: And by the way, can you do something about the rubberbanding of the drones? I'm not talking about them drifting around, but when you're client they're often not completely in sync with the host, making them move very erratically.

On top of that, I really hate how they teleport around when at a distance -- that optimisation you introduced with Fortuna. Almost feels like no one at HQ cares what these things do to the popularity of non-hitscan and non-AoE weapons. I mean, the fix shouldn't be that difficult: simply exempt enemies with small hitboxes and/or erratic movements from that optimisation.

Edited by Kontrollo
  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I say arch gun rivens are interesting but the highest disposition 1.3 is the same as .9 on pistol it needs to be at least 1.1 on rifle not a really weak stat cap for rivens that take 25 rotations to get and the 1 vitus essence per rotation with trashy rewards isn't helping we need at least 1k kuva per rotation as a drop from a boss to make up for it thanks for understanding de 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just to see how things would go I went and did a few Arbitrations with a meme loadout on a forgiving Warframe:

  • Rhino
  • Braton Prime
  • Hikou
  • Nami Solo
Spoiler

R75a3yJ.jpg
7nIas5l.jpg
wXWA4Mq.jpg
a8SJCbD.jpg

I normally don't use Rhino but did play actively -- i.e. didn't just stand in the enemy's fire without moving -- but tried to refrain from using Zenurik unless to make sure to keep the Skin up. No Specters. No Archgun. Operator sparingly. Companion was a Smeeta that died repeatedly (RIP).

Results:

  • Failed a solo Survival (Infested) because spawns were messed up and I ran out of Life Support. 🙄 Ok, I should've run to the last one sooner. Lesson learned: Do PUGs instead.
     
  • PUGs:
    • Defence (Void): 1st round was alright, the guy died during the 2nd round. Should've used a pizza and stomped, but oh well. I wasn't the only one around anyway. 1 Vitus Essence.
       
    • Excavation (Infested): Some minor hiccups, then we simply decided to leave after 12 excavations. Could've stayed longer: 6 Vitus Essence.
       
    • Survival (Corpus): Only got killed after 30 minutes when trying to go against a drone to revive another guy. I thought I was outside a Sapping Osprey mine's radius. Oh well. Last guy extracted anyway: 3 Vitus Essence.
Spoiler

Forgot to take screenshots of the first two runs. The latter two:

ETSurOV.jpg
K7mciVr.jpg

It's definitely easy enough to do these without top-level gear. With that Rhino build I can get a comfortable Iron Skin of 4-6k and recast it almost on a whim.

 

=> Now that we have a way to revive allies, increasing the enemy starting level by 5-20 would make these missions more interesting faster, and even those with mid-level gear can easily attempt to run them when using some of the more sturdy options. Overall the build is of course weak, but Rhino being Rhino, he also brings a 65% team damage buff just like that -- and is far from useless.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

In this thread ive seen  a lot of complaints about arbitrations taking too long or being boring, specifically bc of needing to wait 10 minutes rather than 5. Wouldn't the easy fix be making the rewards for 5 minutes only available at 10? In this way it keeps the  difficulty of an endgame mode but makes the time investment feel more worth it?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

With ability to rerive member, now it's bring another problem to us. An Leecher. So far i encounter on random player will got someone who really keep die again and again, Why not, he keep afk he not bother on death cause ppl will rerive him, or some who is really not ready for Abrit.,One round i rerive same ppl for 3 round in 20 turn of infest excavation. Then i notice why he down so often, so i keep eye on him and see he just stand there no move in abirit!  Somthing that plan for help ppl turn to somthing ppl use for rest while other work harder. This system must be limited to Friend only or Invite only. Take it off form public cause it's lead to more problem than merit. What happen now is if got someone die, some ppl will leave than keep going and let's dead one rot there no matter it's accident or not, unless you found really good ppl. 

Idk this idea can happen or not but I suggest my idea on down in Abrit. 

If ppl down on Abrit, He will be on Shade mode, On this mode He still can attack mob, and mob still can attack him. But he can't progress on mission if he solo, or not get any reward if mission progress on team mode. What he need to do is collect a token himself on rerive! Yes let's ppl who down get punishment on burdern team work, not let's team work harder for someone mistake. and if he die again during shade mode, he lost one obtained reward for each time down. No more rerive if no more reward to pay. So this will be fair, one who make a mistake can recover if he really want to be. not punish their teammate on other mistake.

 

Edited by LumilSilvermoon

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If host migration is the problem with arbitrations....

Why not make servers to host them so that NO ONE hosts the arbitration, only the server does? How?

There are dedicated servers for Conclave. See the following: https://www.warframe.com/news/player-dedicated-servers

No one plays Lunaro or Conclave in general (at least no one who hasn't gone crazy trying to farm the amazing skins), so why not make Dedicated servers available for Arbitration? And don't just make it a 'possiblity'. Let folks know YOU ARE ON A DEDICATED SERVER. Give folks good rewards for hosting servers. I'd probably host a server during my work if it meant helping something good in Warframe and it gave rewards to folks who helped provide those servers.

Seriously, Dedicated Servers are already available, just make it so it's not Conclave but Arbitrations.

 

Yes? Maybe?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Salenstormwing said:

If host migration is the problem with arbitrations....

Why not make servers to host them so that NO ONE hosts the arbitration, only the server does? How?

There are dedicated servers for Conclave. See the following: https://www.warframe.com/news/player-dedicated-servers

No one plays Lunaro or Conclave in general (at least no one who hasn't gone crazy trying to farm the amazing skins), so why not make Dedicated servers available for Arbitration? And don't just make it a 'possiblity'. Let folks know YOU ARE ON A DEDICATED SERVER. Give folks good rewards for hosting servers. I'd probably host a server during my work if it meant helping something good in Warframe and it gave rewards to folks who helped provide those servers.

Seriously, Dedicated Servers are already available, just make it so it's not Conclave but Arbitrations.

 

Yes? Maybe?

Not like that, no. But yes to the idea that they could enable them for Arbitrations and some other specific nodes (said that before e.g. here).

Seriously, what is it with people trying to take away from that part of the game, or malign it when making this kind of proposal. Do you think that makes this suggestion look better in other people's eyes?

The dedicated Conclave servers only have a leaderboard and people are hosting. It just works. (Back when they introduced them, it was even too much at first -- too many hosters and you'd get put in the nearest one.)

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2019-05-04 at 3:29 PM, SpicyDinosaur said:

Honestly, there are some types of people that I don't want to rez. However, unless the burdens are picked up like ayatan stars, I find I am forced to grab 5 of them if I am unlucky. Even without vacuum affecting them, I sort of have to kill the hammers, and when the burden drops I will be close to it.

 

OTOH, my boyfriend has made the point that the ayatan star thing would make squishy characters drop fast trying to pick them up if they did want to rez someone.

 

I feel like there has to be a more eloquent solution to this, though personally I would prefer you remove the rez capability entirely. That is part of arbitrations and made them more high risk.

It would be easy if you were to go into operator mode and pick it up while in void mode. Plus if each one had a waypoint that would be a great way to pick them up easier or to assign that role to a specific squad member that's using a tanky warframe. Let's be honest, pure tanks are more or less leeches cause they don't serve any role besides surviving. They may contribute, but pure tanks tend to do very little for a team. At the very least, they're worse equipped for mission objectives than most frames. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Can you fix entering an arbi a little bit before the hour and then staying past the next hour only to have it say you did the current hours arbi so you have to wait til tge next hour to play. Example start 2:50 stay for 80mins, get out at 4:10, cant play another arbi until 5.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
On 2019-05-16 at 7:02 AM, (PS4)Kaneki9597 said:

It would be easy if you were to go into operator mode and pick it up while in void mode. Plus if each one had a waypoint that would be a great way to pick them up easier or to assign that role to a specific squad member that's using a tanky warframe. Let's be honest, pure tanks are more or less leeches cause they don't serve any role besides surviving. They may contribute, but pure tanks tend to do very little for a team. At the very least, they're worse equipped for mission objectives than most frames. 

Here's a simple solution: When a team member goes down, it reduces the max health of everyone else by 25%, stacking up to -75% if everyone else is down. In return, when a member is revived, everyone gets back that 25%, plus a team-wide full heal and maybe even a short damage reduction buff (-50% for 5 seconds or so) so that the resurrected player can pick up the pace. This would actually encourage players to rez each other through multiple layers of incentives.

You can even combine it with the current system to add a further layer of risk vs reward element: you still need to collect resurrection charges, but they drop from the drones all the time. When a player goes down, you can choose how many charges you want to use to revive them. Use five charges, and they get back to the game, but not at full health, and the rest of the team doesn't get a healing charge either. Use ten, and everyone gets healed to full. Use 15, and everyone gets healed to full and get their energy bar filled too.

Alternatively, DE could do away with the resurrection charges altogether, and instead make it time based: when a player goes down, they cannot be resurrected for 3 minutes. Each enemy killed by the team reduces this timer by 1 second. Alternatively, when a player goes down, the team has to kill 25 enemies to rez them. Then for the second rez, it would be 50 enemies. Then for the next it's 75, and so on, meaning that death in penalized, but if the team does well, the penalty can be overcome. Or there could be special challenges that have to be done in order to rez the player, like killing X number of enemies with heavy melee attacks, or killing X enemies with headshots. Or you can mix and match the ideas, like earning resurrection charges by doing challenges instead of killing drones.

Really, there are dozens of ways DE could make this better.

Edited by Egathentale

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...