Remove "Friendship Doors"

[(XBOX)YoungGunn82]

2 hours ago, MagPrime said:

Honestly, this ENTIRE thing would be moot if DE just put in better matchmaking. 

 

1 hour ago, Voltage said:

is still removing them from every corner of the game 

[October0Night]

On 2020-02-21 at 7:12 PM, Miser_able said:

but that's not what the game is about, that's just how many people choose to play.

 This statement is dead wrong and incorrect.  The devs have said repeatedly the game is all about high mobility and making the player feel incredibly powerful.  The game was literally designed from the ground up to make you feel fast and powerful.

Edited February 28, 2020 by October0Night

[MagPrime]

2 hours ago, (XB1)YoungGunn82 said:

 

From DE; yes.

They still haven't figured out how to make people want to play as a team when you throw 4 randoms into a fast mission, this is probably the only thing they could come up with and just haven't found anything to replace it.

[(PSN)Hiero_Glyph]

2 hours ago, October0Night said:

 This statement is dead wrong and incorrect.  The devs have said repeatedly the game is all about high mobility and making the player feel incredibly powerful.  The game was literally designed from the ground up to make you feel fast and powerful.

No it wasn't. The game was actually pretty slow in 2013/4. Wall running was about the best mobility the player had and it wasn't until coptering became a thing that movement became even remotely close to what we have today.

The fastest frames back in the day were Volt and Arcane Vaguard Helmet Rhino, although technically Nova was faster due to Wormhole (Molecular Prime used range back then, not duration).

 

[(XBOX)YoungGunn82]

26 minutes ago, MagPrime said:

From DE; yes.

They still haven't figured out how to make people want to play as a team when you throw 4 randoms into a fast mission, this is probably the only thing they could come up with and just haven't found anything to replace it.

 From what I know about DEs development and implementation style and how they have been developing,  nothing they have done, designed or implemented require any sort of team synergy whatsoever; other than those stupid ass doors.

Those doors can't force team play, maybe 8 years ago they could. But in no way can they now, at least not in its current iteration. Like elevators they are a relic of a dated and simple past, and completely contradict Warframe's current fast paced core gameplay design. Ultimately like elevators, they either need to be redesigned or out right removed. Like everything else they need to evolve in one way or another. 

Edited February 28, 2020 by (XB1)YoungGunn82

[(XBOX)YoungGunn82]

8 hours ago, MagPrime said:

Or just let us hack the doors.  No waiting, just double tap the interaction button and get a hack puzzle.

This is a good idea. It's a simple fix. 

or let us push the button with our operator and a jump back in our frame and then push the button with our frame and then door opens. Would require some skill and timing. Easy fix. I believe this used to be a thing. 

Edited February 28, 2020 by (XB1)YoungGunn82

[MagPrime]

13 minutes ago, (XB1)YoungGunn82 said:

 From what I know about DEs development and implementation style and how they have been developing,  nothing they have done, designed or implemented require any sort of team synergy whatsoever; other than those stupid ass doors.

Those doors can't force team play, maybe 8 years ago they could. But in no way can they now, at least not in its current iteration. Like elevators they are a relic of a dated and simple past, and completely contradict Warframe's current fast paced core gameplay design. Ultimately like elevators, they either need to be redesigned or out right removed. Like everything else they need to evolve in one way or another. 

So, yeah, DE isn't good at creating team synergy and haven't come up with anything better so they're leaving it as is until enough people throw up a stink, for awhile.

The doors aren't a big enough issue for the community to make enough noise to get DE to make a change any time soon.  

[(XBOX)YoungGunn82]

27 minutes ago, MagPrime said:

So, yeah, DE isn't good at creating team synergy and haven't come up with anything better so they're leaving it as is until enough people throw up a stink, for awhile.

The doors aren't a big enough issue for the community to make enough noise to get DE to make a change any time soon.  

 

[AzureTerra]

On 2020-02-26 at 4:48 AM, IceColdHawk said:

i'd like to see old problems vanish

The door is not a problem, you may perceive it as a problem. but its just a door. Its not counter productive to have a door in place that is essentially a "here is the next stage of the map/mission", If this were a singleplayer game with a autosave feature the door would be the checkpoint where it saves. What would make more sense with these doors is that they needed to be hacked (the Blowing open of the Seal in Kuva Fortress Assault is a good step forward) to proceed as they are somewhat symbolically bulkheads sealing off the ship/facility from further intrusion, but man you'd hate that because it would slow you down even more then the 0.2% to open a current door. Maybe change it so that tripping a sensor seals all normal doors in this section of the mission rather than a banal effect that they have currently. (Section being possibly defined by the current locations of friendship doors)

[Miser_able]

4 hours ago, October0Night said:

 This statement is dead wrong and incorrect.  The devs have said repeatedly the game is all about high mobility and making the player feel incredibly powerful.  The game was literally designed from the ground up to make you feel fast and powerful.

High mobility =/= rushing through everything as quickly as possible. If DE wanted missions to be done asap, all missions would be like capture and rescue, all tileset would be a straight line, there wouldn't be lockers and crates everywhere to encourage looting, and we would get additional rewards for being fast. 

[(XBOX)YoungGunn82]

2 hours ago, Miser_able said:

High mobility =/= rushing through everything as quickly as possible. If DE wanted missions to be done asap, all missions would be like capture and rescue, all tileset would be a straight line, there wouldn't be lockers and crates everywhere to encourage looting, and we would get additional rewards for being fast. 

But we do. Eidolons and the Sentient Anomaly, Events, Baro and even ESO reward players for being fast. The faster we are the more rewards we get. "Friendship doors" contradict that. And attempt to slow you down, in the end they are a fundamentally dated mechanic and don't do JackS#&$ except frustrate and piss players off. So therefor don't work as intended and ultimately pointless. 

Edited February 28, 2020 by (XB1)YoungGunn82

[DatDarkOne]

31 minutes ago, (XB1)YoungGunn82 said:

The faster we are the more rewards we get

But what about when farming or accumulating crafting mats?  This just one aspect where "gotta go fast" to complete the mission doesn't really benefit at all.    I even just recently realized that I could farm tons of mats in Railjack once the enemies are gone.  Way more than just leaving after the enemies are gone.  

[sitfesz]

8 minutes ago, DatDarkOne said:

But what about when farming or accumulating crafting mats?  This just one aspect where "gotta go fast" to complete the mission doesn't really benefit at all.    I even just recently realized that I could farm tons of mats in Railjack once the enemies are gone.  Way more than just leaving after the enemies are gone.  

Endless missions are much more efficient for farming materials. In railjack it depends what are you farming, but if you are going for asteroid loot, it's also faster if your squad spreads out. Imagine having force fields in loot zones that requires 2 players to go out in archwing to push a button simultaneously to enter.

[DatDarkOne]

1 hour ago, sitfesz said:

Endless missions are much more efficient for farming materials. In railjack it depends what are you farming, but if you are going for asteroid loot, it's also faster if your squad spreads out. Imagine having force fields in loot zones that requires 2 players to go out in archwing to push a button simultaneously to enter.

You really didn't READ my statement did you.  😄  

[ShortCat]

13 hours ago, MagPrime said:

The complaint is the doors slow down speeders and are an incinvience when you get explorers or AFK'ers, and the value if the mechanic is 0 because of that. 

So, remove the circumstances that create the frustration and let people pick speed, farm or casual settings and group based off average mission times.  All your slow pokes get put with slow pokes, speeders with speeders, etc. 

Part of the reason I don't support just removing the doors is because it doesn't fix the core issue; awful matchmaking.   The doors are less of an issue when the team is "happy"

Or, just remove the doors? This seems like the less complicated solution.

They kinda have a purpose right before Rescue rooms, but as random roadblocks...what's the point?

Matchmaking has small influence here, but I would argue it is its own can of worms.

Edited February 28, 2020 by ShortCat

[(XBOX)YoungGunn82]

6 hours ago, DatDarkOne said:

 I even just recently realized that I could farm tons of mats in Railjack once the enemies are gone.  Way more than just leaving after the enemies are gone

All fine and dandy. Coarse would be a shame if you were sitting at a "friendship door" in an astroid base and the nearest player to you was 1700 meters away. 

All powerful Warframe's can delete anything standing in front of them, hack ancient security systems..... stopped by a door. Lol

Edited February 28, 2020 by (XB1)YoungGunn82

[(XBOX)YoungGunn82]

DE: let make Warframe's fast and agile with all these fast parkor moves. 

Also DE: Warframe's are too fast, let's throw a bunch a S#&$ in front of them that makes no sense or is out right broken, that are animations don't account for. Yeeahhh. 

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

1 hour ago, (XB1)YoungGunn82 said:

All fine and dandy. Coarse would be a shame if you were sitting at a "friendship door" in an astroid base and the nearest player to you was 1700 meters away. 

All powerful Warframe's can delete anything standing in front of them, hack ancient security systems..... stopped by a door. Lol

Also stopped by walls, large crates, map boundaries... In b4 "DE remove walls or I quit... Again... I quit 5 times this week... It's only Tuesday". 

[IceColdHawk]

11 hours ago, Miser_able said:

If DE wanted missions to be done asap

If DE DIDN'T want missions to be done asap, they wouldn't make things so grindy or give items super low drop chances. Ivara, Equinox and Harrow come to mind. So do kuva siphon missions. Nobody wants to sit in a nonendless mission for 5+ minutes just for a measly 600 - 1200 (boosted) kuva. What about the vidar reactor grind in DE's latest invention, Railjack?

Action is usually being held on other, mostly endless game modes where killing enemies and taking care of objectives actually matters. Unless you started the game few days ago or haven't seen a new tileset, taking non endless missions slowly is doing nobody a favor. That's why you keep seeing 90% of pubs just rushing.

Time is precious, tenno.

Edited February 28, 2020 by IceColdHawk

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

2 hours ago, IceColdHawk said:

If DE DIDN'T want missions to be done asap, they wouldn't make things so grindy or give items super low drop chances.

That made sense to you when you wrote it out? Really? 

[Voltage]

14 hours ago, Miser_able said:

High mobility =/= rushing through everything as quickly as possible. If DE wanted missions to be done asap, all missions would be like capture and rescue, all tileset would be a straight line, there wouldn't be lockers and crates everywhere to encourage looting, and we would get additional rewards for being fast. 

This is a strawman. If DE didn't want missions blitzed through, they wouldn't have designed gamemodes to be played countless times over for a specific reward.

Imagine needing a specific Unvaulted Neo Relic. You either go to the Void or you go to Fortuna/Cetus to do bounties. You are either spamming Ukko and going as fast as possible through a capture mission, or you are going into an open world to jump into Itzal/Nova/Wukong and blitzing through bounties. Both scenarios are intended gameplay design and both are trying to earn something without wasting time.

In a game like Warframe, mobility is in fact, rushing through tilesets. Mobility does not include wall latches, wall hops, backflips, etc. No, we hit Operator with Naramon/Zenurik waybounds to fly past a gaping hole in the Jupiter tile or hit Gauss/Volt/Wukong/Nova to bypass a large room. There is nothing wrong with going slower than another player by any means, but mastering parkour is in fact rushing through tilesets with accuracy and speed.

Edited February 28, 2020 by Voltage

[(PSN)Tactless_Ninja]

On 2020-02-26 at 9:46 AM, Sloan441 said:

I'll clarify:

If you're one of the rushrushrush lot, then you're avoiding playing the game. There's no real endgame you're rushing to. The journey is the game. You're avoiding the game. 

The prevalence of this sort is why I rarely run anything that isn't an endless mode in PuGs. There's no point, since they're going to race to the end and not do a damned thing. Why even be there if you're not going to engage the enemy? Powercreep has made it worse, but it's always been an issue. 

There's no good answer to this and I'm certainly not going to cater to those that insist on this type of 'play'. If I can't keep up with speed modded 'frames or whatnot, then I go into scavenger mode since there'll be nothing else to do. That'll mean someone waiting at friendship doors and extraction. Just the way of it. 

Ah my mistake. Went off the handle there. Made assumptions. Was having a bad day. Broke my toe after stepping on a lego. Got a bill in the mail.

Yes I am very much about the team element. It happens way too much in Railjack too. People going off to do objectives by themselves. 

[RunningChaos]

16 hours ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

Also stopped by walls, large crates, map boundaries... In b4 "DE remove walls or I quit... Again... I quit 5 times this week... It's only Tuesday". 

Why is there a crate, pillar or wall EVERY time a door opens. DE is evil an stupid.

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

13 hours ago, Voltage said:

This is a strawman. If DE didn't want missions blitzed through, they wouldn't have designed gamemodes to be played countless times over for a specific reward.

This is a strawman. If DE did want us to blitz through missions, they would not randomise the maps. 

 

[IceColdHawk]

2 hours ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

This is a strawman. If DE did want us to blitz through missions, they would not randomise the maps. 

 

Just because they add a little bit of diversity and replayability doesn't mean they don't intend the missions to be rushed.