Remove "Friendship Doors"

[(PSN)Tactless_Ninja]

2 hours ago, Sloan441 said:

Or you could stick with your team and actually play the game and not attempt to avoid playing. 

 

You seem to want to pin the blame on the people lagging behind. You go pub, you're playing roulette. If you just want a quick game, no teammates will definitely serve your efficiency needs. Or a premade. 

If you act self serving in a group, don't be surprised if they see you as selfish. I'm sick of people in relic missions like that when they're standing on extraction and I need more reactants. 

[Sentinel-14]

I see two sides to this, each with merits and demerits.

On the one hand, friendship doors are annoying when the guy at the door is miles ahead of the rest of the team. "Hurry up already, we have things to do!" In a game about maximizing the acquisition of loot, it's frustrating when you're made to wait.
On the other hand, if you're the guy lagging behind, or you were loading in while the rest of the party is moving, it's nice that the game has a built-in mechanic to help you get caught up.

I play with some pretty slow people. Sometimes it's slow frames, at least compared to my Nezha. Sometimes it's inexperienced players who dont know the parkour controlls or don't know their way around the map. One person I play with is easily distracted by anything shiny and will go full "SQUIRREL!" when the rest of us are waiting. And then there's another friend, who bless him and all his good qualities, he's just slow. That kind of slow. He plays the game well enough but simply can't think fast enough, react fast enough, to keep up with speed runners. So, when we play together I inevitably end up waiting at every friendship door on the map.

I dont get mad. I dont get impatient. I alt-tab and watch youtube until he catches up.

The point of this post?
Friendship doors have been in the game a long time and are unlikely to go anywhere; complaining about them won't help any. Slow people also exist. So, either learn some patience, find something else do while you wait, or play solo. Those are your options.

 

[(PSN)Hiero_Glyph]

27 minutes ago, Sentinel-14 said:

I see two sides to this, each with merits and demerits.

On the one hand, friendship doors are annoying when the guy at the door is miles ahead of the rest of the team. "Hurry up already, we have things to do!" In a game about maximizing the acquisition of loot, it's frustrating when you're made to wait.
On the other hand, if you're the guy lagging behind, or you were loading in while the rest of the party is moving, it's nice that the game has a built-in mechanic to help you get caught up.

I have to ask, what is the benefit to the player in catching up? You make it sound like this built-in mechanic is advantageous.

[Sentinel-14]

Just now, (PS4)Hiero_Glyph said:

I have to ask, what is the benefit to the player in catching up? You make it sound like this built-in mechanic is advantageous.

Affinity gain. If you're too far behind the team there is nothing for you to kill, so no affinity to gain. If you can catch up to within 50 meters of the party, even if you dont get any kills yourself, you can at least get affinity from being nearby when they get the kills.

[sitfesz]

27 minutes ago, Sentinel-14 said:

Affinity gain. If you're too far behind the team there is nothing for you to kill, so no affinity to gain. If you can catch up to within 50 meters of the party, even if you dont get any kills yourself, you can at least get affinity from being nearby when they get the kills.

Except they give pathetic amount of affinity because of the fewer enemy count, so waiting for a better reason.

[(PSN)Hiero_Glyph]

51 minutes ago, Sentinel-14 said:

Affinity gain. If you're too far behind the team there is nothing for you to kill, so no affinity to gain. If you can catch up to within 50 meters of the party, even if you dont get any kills yourself, you can at least get affinity from being nearby when they get the kills.

Which is why I suggested having objective completion affinity bonuses similar to Spy instead. Also, the shared affinity amount is so small on maps that require following a path it might as well not exist.

[Hypernaut1]

10 hours ago, (PS4)Hiero_Glyph said:

What are you even talking about? I would never expect players to stay for 20 waves so I know that I would need to use recruiting chat to find a group or may have to carry solo. That's not complaining about others not doing what I want, that's just the way the game works.

As for the opposite, which is searching for all 3 caches, that requires a specific build to optimize and almost no one in public groups will have it. So why would anyone expect others to wait the 15-20m while the search the entire map? Asking a player to hurry up when the mission was done in under 5 minutes is complaining now? I think you are just about as out of touch with the community as DE.

It's public. Be prepared to not stay for 20 waves or to wait for people to find caches. 

If that causes too much angst for you, create a group or go solo. 

At least you can't be held hostage in endless anymore. 

[844448]

7 hours ago, (PS4)Hiero_Glyph said:

I have to ask, what is the benefit to the player in catching up? You make it sound like this built-in mechanic is advantageous.

Void fissures, too many times people rush in, going full blender and not letting the fissures corrupt the enemies first and all standing at extraction while you're trying to get 10 reactants, and time's out, you don't get your relic opened, you just stare at your screen with emptiness while your teammates selecting the parts. Worse if they turn out have a rare part you need

[(PSN)Hiero_Glyph]

3 hours ago, 844448 said:

Void fissures, too many times people rush in, going full blender and not letting the fissures corrupt the enemies first and all standing at extraction while you're trying to get 10 reactants, and time's out, you don't get your relic opened, you just stare at your screen with emptiness while your teammates selecting the parts. Worse if they turn out have a rare part you need

That's so situational though and it's more a L2P issue than something friendship doors actually fix. As for not collecting enough reactant, that's a different issue due to player spawning in late and has nothing to do with friendship doors.

[ShortCat]

16 hours ago, Sentinel-14 said:

Affinity gain. If you're too far behind the team there is nothing for you to kill, so no affinity to gain. If you can catch up to within 50 meters of the party, even if you dont get any kills yourself, you can at least get affinity from being nearby when they get the kills.

Debunked pages ago:

On 2020-02-24 at 12:57 PM, ShortCat said:

1. They usually separate the squad in short missions or inbetween mission objects, where enemy densitiy is low or the misison itself is not used for Affinity gains in the first place.
2. You assume that squad consists only of 2 people, a rusher and a snail, which is not the case.
3. For the 3rd time, if a slow player could not keep up, chances are high he will be left behind again (if point 2 is not applicable).
4. Friendship doors are not even present in every misison

 

[vegetosayajin]

If I'm speedrunning, I just play solo.
If I'm on public I'm there to help if needed.
I do not see a problem, there isn't a single mission type you can't solo with ease if you know the game when you want to speedrun.

[Sloan441]

20 hours ago, (PS4)Tactless_Ninja said:

You seem to want to pin the blame on the people lagging behind. You go pub, you're playing roulette. If you just want a quick game, no teammates will definitely serve your efficiency needs. Or a premade. 

If you act self serving in a group, don't be surprised if they see you as selfish. I'm sick of people in relic missions like that when they're standing on extraction and I need more reactants. 

I'll clarify:

If you're one of the rushrushrush lot, then you're avoiding playing the game. There's no real endgame you're rushing to. The journey is the game. You're avoiding the game. 

The prevalence of this sort is why I rarely run anything that isn't an endless mode in PuGs. There's no point, since they're going to race to the end and not do a damned thing. Why even be there if you're not going to engage the enemy? Powercreep has made it worse, but it's always been an issue. 

There's no good answer to this and I'm certainly not going to cater to those that insist on this type of 'play'. If I can't keep up with speed modded 'frames or whatnot, then I go into scavenger mode since there'll be nothing else to do. That'll mean someone waiting at friendship doors and extraction. Just the way of it. 

[(PSN)ErydisTheLucario]

Friendship doors? What are those?

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

57 minutes ago, (PS4)ErydisTheLucario said:

Friendship doors? What are those?

The ones that have buttons on both sides and require activation to proceed. If there are 2 or more players in a mission, the first person to get there triggers a notification to the others that a "squadmate needs help to open a door". 

When playing solo activating either side will open the door. 

[(XBOX)Dee Dubbalyoo]

Playing hive last night with another guy, both trying to get all the caches for high voltage. Since I'd already learned all the cache locations (RNG really hasn't liked me this week) we agreed that he would concentrate on the hives and I would check the cashe locations. Invariably the friendship doors turn up when we are in different parts of the map. Very frustrating and totally counterproductive in a situation where we are cooperating. 

[IceColdHawk]

4 hours ago, (XB1)Dee Dubbalyoo said:

Playing hive last night with another guy, both trying to get all the caches for high voltage. Since I'd already learned all the cache locations (RNG really hasn't liked me this week) we agreed that he would concentrate on the hives and I would check the cashe locations. Invariably the friendship doors turn up when we are in different parts of the map. Very frustrating and totally counterproductive in a situation where we are cooperating. 

Pretty much, yeah. That's one of the very few instances where actual cooperation happens in a non-endless Warframe mission. And then these doors work so anti-coop that you can't help but wonder why do they even exist?

[(PSN)ErydisTheLucario]

20 hours ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

The ones that have buttons on both sides and require activation to proceed. If there are 2 or more players in a mission, the first person to get there triggers a notification to the others that a "squadmate needs help to open a door". 

When playing solo activating either side will open the door. 

Oh thats what that is...is that really a problem?

[IceColdHawk]

16 minutes ago, (PS4)ErydisTheLucario said:

Oh thats what that is...is that really a problem?

Problem eh, more of a nuisance really.

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

20 minutes ago, (PS4)ErydisTheLucario said:

Oh thats what that is...is that really a problem?

For some people, it's apparently on par with the end of the world as we know it. 

Basically they seem to want to be able go really fast, and that's slowing them down. The fact that it only applies if you are in a group, and is only an issue if the rest of the members in the group move significantly more slowly than you, forcing the group to only be able to move as fast as the second fastest person.... suggests that it is functioning exactly as intended. Some people seem to not like that. 

[Hexsing]

I like it.  

Not all frames are made with the same speed in mind.   

I was playing with a Frost.  He was leveling and such.  I was on Nyx.  So really.  I can just Stun and Run straight through a mission if I want too.  

Poor Frosty is not built for speed.  Many frames are not.

So these are working as intended.  

Also. 

Maybe this is the soldier in me.  But no Tenno left behind.

If a member in my squad is behind and taking hard hits.  Then I am a pretty crappy Squadmate and perhaps I should consider playing Solo.

So I go back and help. 

Cuz that's what Nyx would do.  And she is best Grrl.

[(PSN)Hiero_Glyph]

What if friendship doors had an option to manually override them and that process took 30s but could be done solo? That way if 2 players are at the door it can be opened immediately, but if 1 player reaches the door and the rest of the group is either far away or doing other activities it can still be opened albeit slowly.

[MagPrime]

4 minutes ago, (PS4)Hiero_Glyph said:

What if friendship doors had an option to manually override them and that process took 30s but could be done solo? That way if 2 players are at the door it can be opened immediately, but if 1 player reaches the door and the rest of the group is either far away or doing other activities it can still be opened albeit slowly.

Or just let us hack the doors.  No waiting, just double tap the interaction button and get a hack puzzle.

[(PSN)Hiero_Glyph]

27 minutes ago, MagPrime said:

Or just let us hack the doors.  No waiting, just double tap the interaction button and get a hack puzzle.

While I agree, I think the general census is that friendship doors are intended to waste players' time and allow less experienced players the ability to catch up. That's why I suggest a 30s timer as it allows players the chance to catch up, but doesn't stop all progress by the player trying to proceed. Also, as friendship doors can spawn along secondary paths, it avoids having to backtrack to help players that are exploring side areas. That being said, a slightly lower 20s wait timer would be fine too.

[MagPrime]

1 hour ago, (PS4)Hiero_Glyph said:

While I agree, I think the general census is that friendship doors are intended to waste players' time and allow less experienced players the ability to catch up. That's why I suggest a 30s timer as it allows players the chance to catch up, but doesn't stop all progress by the player trying to proceed. Also, as friendship doors can spawn along secondary paths, it avoids having to backtrack to help players that are exploring side areas. That being said, a slightly lower 20s wait timer would be fine too.

Honestly, this ENTIRE thing would be moot if DE just put in better matchmaking. 

The complaint is the doors slow down speeders and are an incinvience when you get explorers or AFK'ers, and the value if the mechanic is 0 because of that. 

So, remove the circumstances that create the frustration and let people pick speed, farm or casual settings and group based off average mission times.  All your slow pokes get put with slow pokes, speeders with speeders, etc. 

Done. 

Part of the reason I don't support just removing the doors is because it doesn't fix the core issue; awful matchmaking.   The doors are less of an issue when the team is "happy"

The other part is I want people to suffer. 😈😗

[Voltage]

On 2020-02-27 at 1:27 PM, MagPrime said:

Or just let us hack the doors.  No waiting, just double tap the interaction button and get a hack puzzle.

I could live with this type of bandaid. However, the best solution to me is still removing them from every corner of the game except where absolutely necessary.

Edited March 1, 2020 by Voltage