July 2020 Riven Disposition Updates

[Galuf]

tl;dr I don't recommend anyone to invest in rivens atm. They are not relevant on steel path at all, and considering the u turns the game is consecutively taking without finding its balance since few monthes, your riven may end up completly obsolete in 6 monthes.

Rivens don't make any sense any more with steel path for most weapons:

- Melee is about specific builds that care about base stats (crit, status) to make busted hybrid builds or heavy attack ones. Riven disposition don't prevent those weapons to be dominant or 1 to 2 shoting anything.

- primaries/secondaries suck in steel path for most and when they are good it is from stats and design as well. For instance oyu could give 5 dispo to soma prime, it would probably be S#&$ in SP.

Before steel path you could justify a Riven to push the scalling of a particular weapon because you like its gameplay. With powercreep from SP it is more than even about game mechanics and not about riven stats at all.

They are still relevant for boss damage, etc...

[Gandalf_White]

My cassowar now has -1% CC LOL

[Gandalf_White]

33 minutes ago, Galuf said:

tl;dr I don't recommend anyone to invest in rivens atm. They are not relevant on steel path at all, and considering the u turns the game is consecutively taking without finding its balance since few monthes, your riven may end up completly obsolete in 6 monthes.

Rivens don't make any sense any more with steel path for most weapons:

- Melee is about specific builds that care about base stats (crit, status) to make busted hybrid builds or heavy attack ones. Riven disposition don't prevent those weapons to be dominant or 1 to 2 shoting anything.

Speak for yourself. Without my dokrahm riven I wouldn't be able to do red crits most of the time with exodia contagion which deal around 500k damage to steel path enemies easily taking them down in a single shot instead of 2 or 3.

[(XBOX)KrazeeTre]

On 2020-07-14 at 11:06 AM, [DE]Connor said:

Rattleguts (primary): 0.5->0.6

Oh wow, it's only slightly better than it was before... 😐

 

On 2020-07-14 at 11:06 AM, [DE]Connor said:

Akmagnus: 1.28->1.35

Oh lawd, them stats! 

 

On 2020-07-14 at 11:06 AM, [DE]Connor said:

Dual Keres: 1.35->1.2

My Dual Keres! DE! You fiends!!! 😭

[(PSN)Omnes__Morimur]

1 hour ago, The_Xtreme said:

Because they want for DE to never nerf, always buff.

- They want for lower tier weapons to be buffed ignoring that DE reworked weapon damage to be tiered and grouped them based on the damage ballpark for their MR.

- They ignore that if base stats are adjusted, Riven stats just push them further.

- They mention that it's unfair to get a nerf based on popularity when Connor says in the OP that there's an internal power ranking as well.

- They say that low disposition makes Rivens compete with regular mods ignoring that if a weapon has a low disposition it's most likely powerful-enough as to not need a Riven to begin with.

- They focus in outlier cases edging out variants as to invalidate the rest of the balance pass. "If A is unbalanced, then B-Z should be unbalanced as well".

- They say that DE is "killing fun" when Rivens offer nothing but efficiency. Rivens don't change sound, visual effects, animations or add secondary fire modes. The perfect Riven is an instant-death stat, which of course they'll try to put in a weapon with punch-through and a high fire rate "because it's fun".

- They point out their plat and Kuva investment, yet ignore that you are opting into the system.

- They say DE is doing this to push Riven plat sales, yet they are against preventing Rivens from being traded with plat.

- They ask for a Riven system rework, yet when asked how would the "reworked" system ensure it doesn't benefit high tier weapons disproportionately more, they move the goalpost to "Bad weapons should just be buffed".

- DE changed the disposition system so new weapons don't get an artificial power boost, thus avoiding a very early nerf. They complain that the minimum disposition is too low.

So what do you get when you put all of that together in a single box? You get the truth: They will always complain as long as Rivens are not max disposition for the higher-tier weapons. There is no argument you can present for them to make peace with the system.

Warframe is known in the gaming community as nerf central. It's an almost decade old game that acts as if its still in beta mode. Constant changes to weapons aside (Synoid Somulor buff,nerf,buff,nerf,buff,nerf,buff, visual change, nerf, buff history is comical) The game remains extremely buggy on a regular basis, with a new bug effecting OLD & new content with every single update or "hotfix" Sorties requiring players to repeat nodes they have already completed to participate in the sortie is the most recent "bug" to appear. You sit here and write this storybook about a bunch of other player's input while the forums are exactly for that reason. What did you even come here for? To criticize the players expressing their discontent with the instability of the game? No other major game make drastic changes to both old & new content on a regular basis, hense the beta reference. How many Reworks, buffs, nerfs, bugs does this game have to go through until they get it right and leave it alone? Well, the answer seems to be countless. Attached is the hotfix/buff/nerf/changes made to ONE WEAPON ALONE over the years, its actually pathetic.

(Copied and pasted from Wiki)

Patch History

Update 27.4

• We have made the following changes to the Simulor:
  • Increased per stack damage for stacked orbs:
    • Synoid Simulor: 20 to 80
  • Increased damage of exploding vortexes:
    • Synoid Simulor: 75 to 240
• Increased the duration of active vortexes to 20 seconds before they explode (unless done so manually).
• Reduced the lifetime duration of a single Orb before it explodes.
  • This allows single projectiles to be used offensively as they now detonate quickly and have had their damage increased significantly.
  • Creating vortexes now happens rather quickly. Shoot 4 orbs in quick succession to create a fully powered vortex. With this we also added a max number of active Orbs to 4.
• Added a max number of active vortexes at a time to 3 and increased the orb stack count to reach a fully powered vortex from 3 to 4.
  • With the significant increase in damage and lifetime of active vortexes, and with the added bonus of individual orbs providing more utility, adding a cap to the number of active vortexes and increasing the orb count for maxed vortexes felt appropriate to strike balance with the changes.
  • Once 3 fully maxed vortexes are active, the Simulor will now default to single-shot orbs - with the reduced lifetime of a single orb, there are now more ways to use the Simulor against enemies!
• Removed the initial stagger on enemies that would occur on vortex creation.
  • We removed this effect so that enemies aren’t pushed out of range of the vortex as much.
• Updated Simulor's FX!

Hotfix 27.2.2
Reduced the following AoE weapons Radial Damage Falloff from central impact that were all previously 90%:

• Synoid Simulor: 60%

Update 27.2

Self Damage Changes

 

We are getting rid of Self Damage and replacing it with something else: instead of Self Damage, it’s now ‘Stagger’. This change completely removes the chance of killing yourself, and instead now creates scenarios where you will interrupt yourself - or ‘Stagger’ - to varying degrees if you aren’t careful.

The degrees of Self-Interrupt start with a small stumble all the way to full knockdown depending on how close you are to the center of explosion. Any Mods referring to Self Damage will be converted to acknowledge Stagger.

With this Self-Interrupt system, we have added dozens of new recovery animations that harness a ninja-like recovery experience. By pressing ‘Jump’ at the correct time, you can execute a ninja-skill-based knockdown recovery to ALL in-game knockdowns. This ninja recovery window is indicated by a glowing FX on your Warframe.

In addition to Self Damage being removed, some of the more powerful AOE weapons without Self Damage presently will have the Stagger added, but it should only be noticeable in cases of extreme inaccuracy on the player’s part. The Weapons include:

• Synoid Simulor

In the original Dev Workshop, we said:
As a result of this overall systemic change, Weapons with Stagger will be getting approximately a 20% buff in Damage, with any weapons with AOE receiving a 50% Radial Damage Falloff from central impact.

This is no longer accurate after continued testing. What we are doing now is:

No damage buffs have been added, but any weapons with AOE are receiving ~20% increase in Radius. Additionally, AOE weapons are receiving a 90% Radial Damage Falloff from central impact. This means on the very outer section of the explosion Radius 10% of the Damage will be dealt. Tactics will be deadly - aim true, Tenno.

Why: Several players brought up the history of the Tonkor and we want to make sure we ship this change in a place that’s conservative in its starting point from a balance perspective. The complete removal of Self Damage does change the pace of destruction with some of the game’s most powerful weapons, so we want to make sure we can iterate upwardly instead of releasing a bonanza of explosions with no other choices.

Update 25.8

October 2019 Riven Disposition Change

• Simulor: 1->1.1

Update 24.2

• Simulor series changes:
  • Changed from semi-auto to automatic.
  • Added a small amount of recoil for feedback when firing.
  • Now has proper accuracy stats so mods will effect it.
  • Firestorm and Terminal Velocity Mods can now be equipped.
  • Reduced Aim Zoom from 2.23 to 1.6x.
  • Damage-over-time damage is now affected by damage mods.
  • Updated the overall FX.

• Synoid Simulor
  • Fire Rate increased from 2.67 to 3.33.
  • Ammo capacity increased from 75 to 96.
  • Clip size increased from 15 to 16.
  • Critical Chance increased from 5% to 14%.

Update 20.0

• The Status Chance increased to 35%
• The amount of Orbs required to make a full stack has decreased - it used to take 5, now it takes 4.
• A critical chance of 5% has been added.
• The AoE Explosion range (based on stack when expires or manual detonation) increased from 0.5-2.8 meters to 1-8 meters.
• The Explosion Damage has increased from 50 per orb to 75 (300 at full stack).
• On an orb stacking event (when orbs combine), damage range decreased to 1-8 from 3-8
• On an orb stacking event, damage decreased from 150-250 to 20-50
• The Synoid Simulor has had its max Ammo Capacity reduced to 75.

Hotfix 19.5.4

• Reduced volume and cleaned up audio of Synoid Simulor when being used by other players.

Update 18.8

• Tweaked the Stug and Simulor projectiles to properly appear stacked instead of hovering over each other. This also improves the projectiles landing position on objects.

Update 17.3

[-Kittens-]

23 hours ago, Noobly said:

Ninkondi Prime: 1.25->1.1
?
 

It's pretty obvious at this point that popularity has rather little to do with most of the nerfs, it's also pretty hilarious to see they're monitoring trade chat and then lowering artificially boosted by deliberate trader machinations without even actually testing the weapons, and this is only going to get worse once certain individuals start making content videos again.

The simple fact is if a riven can't replace any or all mods in a build, it's worthless. Literally not worth the server data it occupies.

Also literal lol at "we're making riven changes more transparent so you're not mad, oh btw magical made up arbitrary power ranking that are illuminati top secret".

:960eyeroll:

[Avalon2105]

I'm sure I still have couple of rivens that are not complete garbage but I have faith that DE will get to them soon. Keep nerfing everything until blunderbuss becomes better option than riven mod.

[(XBOX)KayAitch]

On 2020-07-14 at 5:06 PM, [DE]Connor said:

Catchmoon (primary): 0.5->0.75

Gaze (primary): 0.5->0.65

Rattleguts (primary): 0.5->0.6

Stahlta: 0.5->0.7

Tombfinger (primary): 0.5->0.6

So, this new thing of starting off weapons with really low - I get it, I really do. However, it comes with a need to increase those weapons rapidly once it's clear they haven't taken over the meta Bramma-style.

In the original announcement:

You included the statement:

"Prime Access balance passes will increase dispositions on newer weapons by larger values, when warranted"

OK, so the Stahlta's a really good gun, .7 is fair enough, but the kitgun primaries? Not one is even close to being meta (or even ½ as good as their secondary variants) - I don't think anyone thinks they're overpowered.

The only gun to get over .2 is the Catchmoon primary (a low damage rapid fire shogun with a tiny clip, low ammo reserve and poor range) which gets a .25 increase. Wow, your really taking a big risk there 😐

It's the lowest DPS kitgun that it's possible to build even before you account for crippling ammo issues, and it doesn't even get up to .8 or .9, never mind 1? I can promise you this one isn't going to become the stale meta.

This isn't really about that though - if the riven disposition is supposed to promote weaker weapons then you need to rapidly increase it when they are weaker, you know, like you said you would?

[-SMV]

On 2020-07-14 at 5:06 PM, [DE]Connor said:

Redeemer Prime: 1->0.8

 

... Rip Saitama

[(XBOX)StarK19971999]

Thank for dispo changes de and everything u guy's did and for everyone else please stop complaining and just play game

[R.E.B_99]

Dear DE , thank you for respecting my time and not making months of grind worthless .

[danitot]

There goes the majority of the playerbase's effort and investment...

Hey DE!? Wanna know why we use those nerfed items?
Because the rest is bad!
You keep nerfing the usful and fun stuff you keep kicking yourself in the nutzies.
Soon™ this will backfire so much, that not the players will be the one crying for their fun, but you for the players to come and play this endproduct of yours.
26 million registered looser.

[MagikarpOnRoids]

i couldn't care less about the big new reveal for tennocon 2020...  honestly just fix the kuva system. 

[Makunogo]

okay suprised to to see vectis go up. and wait. they didnt touch rubico for once lmao.

[Makunogo]

3 hours ago, danitot said:

There goes the majority of the playerbase's effort and investment...

Hey DE!? Wanna know why we use those nerfed items?
Because the rest is bad!
You keep nerfing the usful and fun stuff you keep kicking yourself in the nutzies.
Soon™ this will backfire so much, that not the players will be the one crying for their fun, but you for the players to come and play this endproduct of yours.
26 million registered looser.

they didnt hit much besides over-used weapons that honestly do not even need rivens anyway. lol. 

these changes were pretty expected - i know this and im not even actively playing the game -

[kevoisvevo]

9 hours ago, Gandalf_White said:

Speak for yourself. Without my dokrahm riven I wouldn't be able to do red crits most of the time with exodia contagion which deal around 500k damage to steel path enemies easily taking them down in a single shot instead of 2 or 3.

Oh no, I have to press a button twice now in steel path the horror lol.

[Sahiratu]

Wait, so you guys buffed Silva & Aegis dispo (which was already op) but no Sigma & Octantis? lol 

.................

I dunno.

[Galuf]

Il y a 11 heures, Gandalf_White a dit :

Speak for yourself. Without my dokrahm riven I wouldn't be able to do red crits most of the time with exodia contagion which deal around 500k damage to steel path enemies easily taking them down in a single shot instead of 2 or 3.

I consider exodia contagion kind of boss damage but it is true that some people use it for everything, too... Nice damage btw :).

[Dueliest]

On 2020-07-14 at 10:03 AM, kxZyle said:

Increase the lower dispo cap to 1.0.

 

[---Sgt.Dan.Bilzerian---]

14 hours ago, The_Xtreme said:

You use grace 🤣

I m using it when no one know how to use it 

[LagAddict]

I wonder why we have rivens and weapons seriously

[(PSN)oMeybi]

stop

#*!%ing

ruining

my

rivens

A******

You spit in my face from the time and plat ive invested in my rivens.

Rivens below 1 shouldnt exist period. 

[(XBOX)HollowCube987]

On 2020-07-14 at 12:06 PM, [DE]Connor said:

Kuva Bramma: 0.8->0.65

Good riddance. Lenz is Love. Lenz is Life

[(XBOX)HollowCube987]

5 hours ago, (PS4)oMeybi said:

stop

#*!%ing

ruining

my

rivens

A******

You question the words of the mighty 

C O N N O R ?!?

[TyrannisPax]

19 hours ago, (XB1)KayAitch said:

So, this new thing of starting off weapons with really low - I get it, I really do. However, it comes with a need to increase those weapons rapidly once it's clear they haven't taken over the meta Bramma-style.

In the original announcement:

..but the kitgun primaries? Not one is even close to being meta (or even ½ as good as their secondary variants) - I don't think anyone thinks they're overpowered.

I dunno about that. Catchmoon primary is quite bad, but honestly I've had pretty good experiences with Gaze and Tombfinger. They're amongst my best weapons, easily able to compete with my meta equipment.