selig_fay Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 18 minutes ago, [DE]Megan said: Wukong - Defy Armor capped Wait. Why does this ability get nerf? It was in the discussion, but it's very niche even without nerf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)Dex Xean Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 19 minutes ago, [DE]Megan said: Wukong - Defy Armor capped The armor was capped at 1,500 though. Do you mean the armor cap is lowered? like its 1000 or 700 capped instead now? or it is still 1,500 and you forgot? confused a bit here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillyMancer Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 I think it is good. Some of these abilities are so strong that 40+ choices are actually just 5 choices, and that is far less exciting. For example, Nidus's Larva is better in EVERY way compared to Khora's Ensnare. With Larva now having a reduced radius, Ensnare may have the radius advantage, while larva has the energy cost/cast time advantage. Thus, there are now choices, and choices are great! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
---Swaggi--- Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 2 minutes ago, Prince_El-Ahrairah said: Yes, let's turn every single frame, no matter what, in to a complete and total tank. Because that's more balanced than Roar. ???????? What? What is your reasoning for IRON SKIN? That would be an even stronger pick than Roar. Immunity to status effects, including any sort of CC stuff like knockback/down, insane EHP, infinite scaling defense because of its damage-converted-to-skin-health. Seriously, the only thing Rhino could give that wouldn't be considered a meta ability would be Charge. Not really since w/o his 1st augment iron skin is rather weak with its ~6k hp. Also you would need the 2nd augment in order to recast it otherwise you would be vulnerable if it runs out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikakor Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 25 minutes ago, [DE]Megan said: AUGUST 19TH UPDATE: Greetings, Tenno! The launch of Heart of Deimos grows near, and we have some Helminth updates since we last posted! Below are 2 parts of updated/clarifying information that touches both Infused Warframe Abilities and the Helminth Segment acquisition. PART 1 - Changes to select Infused Warframe Abilities Please keep in mind we’re still testing/playing around with the values for each, hence why the values are not present below: The following only apply to Infused Warframe Abilities: Rhino - Roar Diminished Damage increase Mirage - Eclipse Diminished Damage increase and cap Damage Reduction Valkyr - Warcry Attack speed increase reduced Protea - Dispenser Duration reduced Nidus - Larva Radius reduced Wukong - Defy Armor capped Why do these Infused Warframe Abilities have these rules? It was apparent in player feedback and play testing that these Infused Warframe Abilities had the potential to be the overwhelming choice; which is not ideal. Instead of changing the Ability outright due to those concerns, we decided to give them slight rules when Infused. PART 2 - Helminth Segment Acquisition As already indicated in this Dev Workshops original post, the Helminth Segment is acquired in the Heart of Deimos in the Entrati Syndicate. To expand on that, this means you’ll need to progress within the Entrati Syndicate located within the Necralisk to obtain the Helminth Segment before you can start experimenting with everything Helminth. Without spoiling too much, the Helminth Segment is currently obtained in Rank 3 of the Entrati Syndicate. This reminder is simply to set expectations on what you’ll have access to upon logging into the Heart of Deimos. That’s all for now! NO!! you got it so wrong, and it's again the classic DE mentality. rather than to keep the actually useful ones and to buff the other mediocres ones, you make all of them mediocres. there can't be this kind of limiting stupidities in this system. we WORKED to get these frame and subsume them, we deserves to have the full benefit. yes, people are gonna put the most useful ones. that means you gotta buff the others!! if you make them lesser, then yeah, it ruins the purpose of this entire system!! you need to backtrack on this decision, it's really not good. you basically nerfed the good ones. the GOOD ones. there's no reason for that, go back to the normal values!! no abilities should get nerfed!! How to kill the hype for a system 101. great job DE. again......... you once again went the way of nerfing the good one, which were in smaller number, rather than to make interesting the other ones. you again took the easy and LAZY way out. please, go back on these nerfs ( that's what they are ) and let us enjoy the system for what it was meant to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PsiWarp Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 Might as well put -25% Ability stats on subsumed abilities so the original frame is always the top dog of that ability (in terms of stats). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V4Vlad Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 I ask anyone who wants to rage at DE for taking community feedback into consideration to wait until we have the system ingame to see the numbers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
selig_fay Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 2 minutes ago, ---Swaggi--- said: Not really since w/o his 1st augment iron skin is rather weak with its ~6k hp. Also you would need the 2nd augment in order to recast it otherwise you would be vulnerable if it runs out You absorb all the damage and convert it to iron skin for the first three seconds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gabbynaru Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 How to ruin a system 101: Over-complicate the hell out of it! Congratulations, DE! Your anti-player repellent just got even more effective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)AotoSatou14 Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 9 minutes ago, --Q--FSK41 said: Its good,its not healthy for the game if everyone is running around with a strong buff (roar/eclipse) on the braindead frames like inaros Maybe, but the changes on protea's and nidus's abilities don't make sense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
---Swaggi--- Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 1 minute ago, selig_fay said: You absorb all the damage and convert it to iron skin for the first three seconds. That only makes sense with the lasers of the void def. From ordinary enemies its still useless since the damage u absorb in 3 sec is also down in 3 sec since the dmg output from the enemies doesnt change xP Still not that good. Roar is still superior Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pendragon1951 Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 I completely agree with buffing the mediocre ones, but I also agree that none oif this should be done until the player base actually uses the system, this way you see what combinations are being used and the one less so that way you can buff those Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Krism- Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 10 minutes ago, KIREEK said: the problem is that we are going to invest time into something that might get changed This a problem that has been here for a very long time now, but DE always turns a blind eye on it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albion_Vortigern Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 26 minutes ago, [DE]Megan said: It was apparent in player feedback and play testing that these Infused Warframe Abilities had the potential to be the overwhelming choice Everyone is going to use these unless they aren't available at all. Roar can be 5% and we will use it . You think we care ? either go all the way or not at all. Don't pretend to give us freedom then snatch it away like you do every update Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikakor Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 @[DE]Megan i urge DE to reconsider what they have done. these are not "RULES" like you pretend. these are NERFS. when you make something less efficient, this is a NERF. period. and this goes completely, kill completely the point of this system. i want to enjoy roar , larva, and other stuff for what they are. not some china knock off copy. this goes completely against the point of the system and why it was mad.e please, PLEASE!!!! stop listening to doom sayers, and let us enjoy our hard work. we farmed for a copy of these frames, we DESERVE the benefits. you killed the hype so #*!%ing badly... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anfuerudo Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 30 минут назад, [DE]Megan сказал: It was apparent in player feedback and play testing that these Infused Warframe Abilities had the potential to be the overwhelming choice; which is not ideal. Instead of changing the Ability outright due to those concerns, we decided to give them slight rules when Infused. Maybe instead of nerfing useful abilities(I know, I know, some of them would be too OP on some frames) you should look at other frames' abilities and maybe, just maybe change them to something more useful. Like Zephyr's Airburst... it's awful! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
selig_fay Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 3 minutes ago, ---Swaggi--- said: That only makes sense with the lasers of the void def. From ordinary enemies its still useless since the damage u absorb in 3 sec is also down in 3 sec since the dmg output from the enemies doesnt change xP Still not that good. Roar is still superior It always makes sense. You get invulnerability and after invulnerability you get large overshields with resistance to status. Iron skin has scaling with enemy damage, which means it is always effective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pendragon1951 Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 Personally speaking for myself, I love being over powered and killing everything in sight and finding the most practical way to do so, if I want a challenge i'll use less force, but that's just me:) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voltage Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 42 minutes ago, [DE]Megan said: -snip- With all due respect, you are treating these like they are Riven Dispositions. The final damage multiplier of Roar doesn't suddenly become less desireable if it's reduced. You are going to end up nerfing this into the ground to "balance" it, and make it worth nobody's time. This will spiral into more nerfs as you observe the best in slot abilities be picked over useless junk like Zephyr or Nyx. Instead, handpick a different ability. Rhino's Charge and Sleight of Hand are better alternatives than just nerfing Roar and Eclipse as if this suddenly changes a players mind who understands damage calculations. You guys completely failed to see the core problem, and you are committing the same mistake you made with Riven Mods. All the abilities you listed reduced changes for are now "below average Disposition", and if you buff anything, that would be "above average Disposition". We now have Warframe Ability Dispositions because you cannot actually balance base mechanics. Rubico Prime is good because of how a Sniper works, for the same reason Roar is good because of how final damage multipliers work. You guys should have learned this from Condition Overload. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fari Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 31 minutes ago, [DE]Megan said: Valkyr - Warcry Attack speed increase reduced Dang, really decided that was the one that has issues, huh? Anyways, iffy on some of these in general, but it depends by how much you're nerfing various things. Like are you talking halving these? worse? hardly affected? etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CopperBezel Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 At that point they'll claim they're entitled to what they earned and whine about nerfs. 7 minutes ago, mikakor said: NO!! you got it so wrong, and it's again the classic DE mentality. rather than to keep the actually useful ones and to buff the other mediocres ones, you make all of them mediocres. there can't be this kind of limiting stupidities in this system. we WORKED to get these frame and subsume them, we deserves to have the full benefit. yes, people are gonna put the most useful ones. that means you gotta buff the others!! if you make them lesser, then yeah, it ruins the purpose of this entire system!! you need to backtrack on this decision, it's really not good. It hasn't even launched yet dude. You can't be upset about having a thing taken away before you even had it. Criminy. The usual miserable self-entitled whining aside, this is fantastic. These abilities will still create extra options but DE's not limited to just treating every ability as a 1:1 swap. Abilities with built-in synergies like Fireblast or Ensnare already lost something by not being used on their original frames; a touch less power to some of these others is a perfectly reasonable choice. Defy surprises me, but considering it's the best damage mitigation ability in the list, they were clearly avoiding anything that allows too much tanking. I imagine it'll still be enough to be crazy on Rhino. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trunks013 Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 Double post huh ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OniDax Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 41 minutes ago, [DE]Megan said: AUGUST 19TH UPDATE: Greetings, Tenno! The launch of Heart of Deimos grows near, and we have some Helminth updates since we last posted! Below are 2 parts of updated/clarifying information that touches both Infused Warframe Abilities and the Helminth Segment acquisition. PART 1 - Changes to select Infused Warframe Abilities Please keep in mind we’re still testing/playing around with the values for each, hence why the values are not present below: The following only apply to Infused Warframe Abilities: Rhino - Roar Diminished Damage increase Mirage - Eclipse Diminished Damage increase and cap Damage Reduction Valkyr - Warcry Attack speed increase reduced Protea - Dispenser Duration reduced Nidus - Larva Radius reduced Wukong - Defy Armor capped Why do these Infused Warframe Abilities have these rules? It was apparent in player feedback and play testing that these Infused Warframe Abilities had the potential to be the overwhelming choice; which is not ideal. Instead of changing the Ability outright due to those concerns, we decided to give them slight rules when Infused. PART 2 - Helminth Segment Acquisition As already indicated in this Dev Workshops original post, the Helminth Segment is acquired in the Heart of Deimos in the Entrati Syndicate. To expand on that, this means you’ll need to progress within the Entrati Syndicate located within the Necralisk to obtain the Helminth Segment before you can start experimenting with everything Helminth. Without spoiling too much, the Helminth Segment is currently obtained in Rank 3 of the Entrati Syndicate. This reminder is simply to set expectations on what you’ll have access to upon logging into the Heart of Deimos. That’s all for now! So will there end up being any point to using any of these abilities? The whole appeal of these abilities is to use them on frames that need them. You should only nerf these abilities on frames that are already powerful. Otherwise players just won't use them at all. If you kill the appeal of the system before it even releases, it'll just end up being another system that's forgotten soon after release. These changes won't make people choose the other abilities more. It'll just make people ignore the system as a whole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trunks013 Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 24 minutes ago, -QUILL_PETER- said: Does the updated info say anything about Mag? No. ohhhhhhhhh ^.^ I know it sounds stupid but you were around in 2015 right ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikakor Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 1 minute ago, Fari said: Dang, really decided that was the one that has issues, huh? Anyways, iffy on some of these in general, but it depends by how much you're nerfing various things. Like are you talking halving these? worse? hardly affected? etc they're not gonna be worth using, probably. nerfing Nidus larva ability? WHAT? you mean nerfing the whole #*!%ing point of this ability? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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