The price of Heirloom skins is incredibly disappointing.

[TheArmchairThinker]

2 hours ago, Aky.Minowara said:

Remove the time limit and set the price in platinum, in game market and all is perfect. 

This is something I greatly support

[SneakyErvin]

20 hours ago, Genitive said:

No, you won't be able to safeguard against everything, you're right. However, bad habits shouldn't be exploited like that. I don't think your examples are entirely correct either. If your local pizzeria made a time-limited all-you-can eat event and somebody choked to death or died of a heart attack, then they would probably never do it again. Similar with alcohol, in many places it won't be sold to you if you are already drunk. People not being able to control themselves doesn't justify bad practices and companies should be held accountable, they also should bear the burden of responsibility for what they do.

In this specific situation most of the drama could have been avoided if DE had made different decisions regarding the pack. If we had all the existing packs and one cheaper with only the skins, we wouldn't see as many complaints. Or perhaps we would, because it's the forums.

But is this a bad practice? I mean, what is wrong with having some exclusive items in a game or something similar elsewhere? While you might not think my examples are entirely correct, going to the point where someone dies from something is kind of a stretch. And while places dont sell alcohol when you are already drunk I dont see how that changes the similarity when the place still sells to you if you are a known drunk (someone who purchases unnatural amounts of booze per week/month) aslong as you are sober or close to it when making the purchase. It still doesnt make it a bad practice to sell booze since most people enjoy it in moderate amounts.

We would probably see the same amount of complaints with more pack options, just different complaints from now.

[Genitive]

30 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

But is this a bad practice?

I would lean on yes, simply because there is no good reason for these items to be time limited. The accolade could be exclusive for those who want to support the game more, but skins, eh... It's not like they can run out of them.

31 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

We would probably see the same amount of complaints with more pack options, just different complaints from now.

Oh, yes, can't argue with that.

[(PSN)slightconfuzzled]

On 2023-08-31 at 8:53 PM, Circle_of_Psi said:

Overall I have no issues either and I can't recall of similar topics we talked about, my memory is terrible xD but yes my username is an XCOM reference and a slightly off-topic question but have you played it?

 

No worries, that was my assumption. I just happen to have an unusually good memory for this sort of thing, its perfectly alright. 

Tis my shame that I have been recommended X-Com (specifically XCOM 2), I have done a bit of research on it, watched some gameplay, I brought it... brought all the DLC/Expansions for it... Still haven't actually loaded it up yet. Jeez its going to be almost 8 years since its release right? Really Warframe has been a bit of a blessing and a curse for me, since I am the kind of person that really enjoys games, but I like to feel in the right mood for them. I like to feel lucid and relaxed enough to enjoy them, and appreciate the details. Except if I am tired, sleepy or only have like 15 mins, a game like Warframe is great. I usually play one other game aside from Warframe, am working my way through the Souls series on the side. Maybe after that I should make X-Com the priority. I still need to play Final Fantasy XV too, plus Baldurs Gate and Armoured Core just came out too. 

You know, when I was a kid/teen, one of my more absurd worries, was running out of games to play, now I am an adult, I probably have a back catalog of games that will last me until I am 80, even if they were to stop making games. 

Also I pretty much agree with all the other points you made, especially, especially the part about being weary and critical of companies behaviour, and tactics, without them having to actually be illegal. There is a lot of scummy and gross behaviour on display by many companies, and too many countries laws are too archaic to deal with a lot of them, with the pace they should/need to be. 

I think there are also a lot of "fans" who think they are defending DE or supporting DE, without realising that DE like fans are a monolith. Granted I have no idea on the true character of anyone including those that work at DE, but I am a creative person whose career and education covers some creative industries and some business, and many a job have people who don't agree in unison with each other over say price points, or strategies, so on. Depending on the industry/context though, much of those internal disputes are intended to be private/professional, but also there are power imbalances. Some jobs, businesses etc also won't allow its workers to be critical in certain ways either, and can have risks to their positions/careers. People should acknowledge that they may not actually be supporting "DE" when they advocate for and support say, Heirloom bundles. I've butted heads with higher ups in jobs where how we treated consumers could be improved, and should have ways to be better accountable for worker abuse or negligence. I am also an artist. Not good enough to be professional, but if were an artist at a video game company, I'd be internally against bundles like Heirloom skins, even if it were my own work and I was being paid for it. Though if my livelihood depended on it, it would be pretty tough decision, as far as whether I would be allowed to be critical by whoever employed me, and if not, would I speak up anyway and risk my position? In either case, the consumers and fans who complained about such practices would actually be doing me a favour by being so critical. Not to imply or insinuate there aren't artists out there who only want a very limited select wealthy few to have access to their artwork.

Creative types and artists, famously exclusionary types after all who like making others in businesses wealthier whilst limiting who gets to see their work and talent. 

My post ended up being longer than I intended, whoops. Ah well, threads like these can be a bit nicer when some people are just shooting the breeze and agreeing than turning it into an accusatory battleground. The PSA thread is getting pretty heated, I should probably make my way over there to throw some support. Also yeah, I am glad a lot of players, content creators etc aren't being apathetic here, haven't seen this many people vocal since Regal Aya. Its good to send a pretty strong message to DE. Not sure if they will listen, but I am hopeful that its got them seriously reconsidering any possible future plans that may involve such high prince points, FOMO, and how they bundle items. Also, potentially give ammo and talking points to anyone within DE who may be pushing back against certain ideas. 

I do think that DE is more consumer friendly than most, but DE also knows that it has fans like me, who think that, but you know? I use to be pretty positive about Bioware... and Blizzard too, and some other games companies that either resorted to some predatory stuff or got folded into a larger company that did and pushed it on them. I think some people don't realise that many of us, don't want DE to become a memory like that "You guys remember how DE used to be one of the best consumer friendly devs with actually decent monetisation practices and relative ethics for games? Too bad to see what it turned into". I'm personally still optimistic, but I wouldn't blame anyone who was already starting to feel otherwise. 

[PublikDomain]

3 hours ago, SneakyErvin said:

We would probably see the same amount of complaints with more pack options, just different complaints from now.

Yeah, people complain about any Deluxe skin that comes out. Complaints like "this thing is clipping" or "the Signa is misaligned here" or "can you change the color channels" or "it doesn't fit the theeeeme". Kind of tame in comparison idk.

[SneakyErvin]

7 minutes ago, PublikDomain said:

Yeah, people complain about any Deluxe skin that comes out. Complaints like "this thing is clipping" or "the Signa is misaligned here" or "can you change the color channels" or "it doesn't fit the theeeeme". Kind of tame in comparison idk.

Yep and if there was say a pack with just the skins, both of them in one, I wouldnt be surprised if someone claimed that was bad business practice, greed and consumer unfriendly aswell since they'd get forced into a skin they wouldnt want. Or they they were overpriced since they wouldnt come with a big pack discount, same complaint would likely come if they sold them solo for a slighly higher cost per skin compared to a bigger bundle.

[(PSN)slightconfuzzled]

8 minutes ago, PublikDomain said:

Yeah, people complain about any Deluxe skin that comes out. Complaints like "this thing is clipping" or "the Signa is misaligned here" or "can you change the color channels" or "it doesn't fit the theeeeme". Kind of tame in comparison idk.

 

Don't you dare downplay and trivialise the NAS aka Nerfed Ass Syndrome that plagues many skins of our beloved Warframes. Wisp worked hard for that cake, she worked hard for that Platinum (money), so hard for it honey. She worked hard for that Platinum (money), so you all better treat her right. Then what did DE do to the Prime version? Its got 3 mm less rotundness, overall width and lacking the same exact mass. Travesty. People in here ready to call anything and everything FOMO, but what about FONA? Fear of No Ass? Just as serious an issue, when you really think about it. 

I am too traumatised to even talk about the Mesa Prime incident. Sir Mix-a-Lot would be rolling in his grave. I mean... if he was dead, he's not, but if he was... he would definitely be rolling. Thankfully Grendel Prime's bakery looks full and gluttonous, but I worry about my boy Gauss. 

[PR1D3]

I just want a separate Mag and Frost pack. 30 - 35 of just Mag or Frost. I only want Mag's. None of this all or nothing, pad it with premium currency. Just something simple. 

Edited September 1, 2023 by PR1D3

[Circle_of_Psi]

1 hour ago, (PSN)slightconfuzzled said:

Tis my shame that I have been recommended X-Com (specifically XCOM 2), I have done a bit of research on it, watched some gameplay, I brought it... brought all the DLC/Expansions for it... Still haven't actually loaded it up yet. Jeez its going to be almost 8 years since its release right? Really Warframe has been a bit of a blessing and a curse for me, since I am the kind of person that really enjoys games, but I like to feel in the right mood for them. I like to feel lucid and relaxed enough to enjoy them, and appreciate the details. Except if I am tired, sleepy or only have like 15 mins, a game like Warframe is great. I usually play one other game aside from Warframe, am working my way through the Souls series on the side. Maybe after that I should make X-Com the priority. I still need to play Final Fantasy XV too, plus Baldurs Gate and Armoured Core just came out too. 

Yup, I know the feeling.

The games I've been really into as of late are Fallout NV and XCOM 2 (Been playing them a lot) and I do play D2, but since the Paradox update I never really enjoyed Warframe, hell If DE dropped everything and made Warframe only into the Paradox I'll play WF forever lol. I LOVE the Drifter gameplay of being a powerful but limited person, not a stupidly OP god of death that can never die, just makes the game boring as hek.

When you do decide to play XCOM 2 hit me up in an Inbox or so and I'll be happy to help you out inside it (no coop but I can give tips!)

 

As for the rest yeah that's fair, but this topic won't go away anytime soon and even if it does get locked or deleted, people will just make another and another until this is drilled into their skulls

 

[Binket_]

4 hours ago, PublikDomain said:

Yeah, people complain about any Deluxe skin that comes out.

Though usually complaints of "Oh, this is misaligned and such" are usually errors we'll rarely get fixed and can ruin a genuinely good fashion setup.
We don't EXPECT them to be top priority though. Annoying? Yes. Important? Not really.

This bundle on the other is a whole other can of worms.
It's essentially deluxe skins being sold for excessive prices on a time-limited ordeal that DE thought up of in 5 minutes.
I kid you not, they probably got the skins off the press and than rolled some dice for how they want to market it.

5 hours ago, (PSN)slightconfuzzled said:

You know, when I was a kid/teen, one of my more absurd worries, was running out of games to play, now I am an adult, I probably have a back catalog of games that will last me until I am 80, even if they were to stop making games. 

When I was kid/teen, my only concern when it came to video games was "People are gonna make terrible games in future, aren't they?"
Glad to see I was right for more reasons than I thought.

I think you're pretty lucky to even HAVE a back catalog.
I can't think of many games I'd want to play let alone could.

Warframe is one of these few leftover """gems""" that I can at least tolerate, though it's more the "Lesser of Evils" now.
Unfortunately, "Lesser of Evils" only goes so anymore. Since every game under the sun has some kinda Gacha or whatever.

Personally, I can get around Live-Service games. Gives me something to look forward to, but not in today's sense.
Games keep holding back EVERYTHING just a few "updates" down the line.

5 hours ago, (PSN)slightconfuzzled said:

Some jobs, businesses etc also won't allow its workers to be critical in certain ways either, and can have risks to their positions/careers. People should acknowledge that they may not actually be supporting "DE" when they advocate for and support say, Heirloom bundles.

... but the reality is that it reflects on them as a whole.

That was the final decision, so that was the final verdict.
If they refuse to budge further? That only cements the judgement.

I get DE has a done a lot of good, credit where it's due.
But DE has also done a LOT of stupid things, so credit (even if it's negative) where it's due.

5 hours ago, SneakyErvin said:

Yep and if there was say a pack with just the skins, both of them in one, I wouldnt be surprised if someone claimed that was bad business practice, greed and consumer unfriendly aswell since they'd get forced into a skin they wouldnt want. Or they they were overpriced since they wouldnt come with a big pack discount, same complaint would likely come if they sold them solo for a slighly higher cost per skin compared to a bigger bundle.

"Lesser of two evils" is a thing to remember here.

Yes, both situations would probably result in complaints.
... the caveat there is that one side _{(our current situation)} is certainly FAR more brazen with it's vile methods.

Would it be nicer to have the skins JUST be two bundles with either skin in them? Without a doubt.
Is more likely to nudge DE in a direction where we can trim all the fat at the very least? Sadly, yes.
Can we ask for better when all it costs is a few button clicks? I'd be livid if nobody did, especially since DE also gains from this.

4 hours ago, (PSN)slightconfuzzled said:

Don't you dare downplay and trivialise the NAS aka Nerfed Ass Syndrome that plagues many skins of our beloved Warframes.

As someone who has gotten enough people as is who were far too downbad for a character I was playing?
Stop. You have "external sites" for that. I'm sure they'll remedy that in no time.

It's gotten to the point where some games won't even LET me dress a character fully because players require some form of "appeal" 24/7.
The only reason I have Wisp and Citrine with so low use is because I genuinely DO NOT want to deal with the lowest-hanging fruit kinds of jokes.
Especially disheartening on Wisp. Her full kit isn't that bad and I can make use of it fairly often.

I don't really care for it much myself, it's just that many a player can't keep it in their pants and that becomes my problem.

3 hours ago, Circle_of_Psi said:

not a stupidly OP god of death that can never die, just makes the game boring as hek.

I've said it before and I'll say it again:
"Power Fantasy only works if there's a dynamic to it. Warframe fails that dynamic in every way."

Dynasty Warriors _{(Hyrule Warriors comes to mind specifically)} even has this down pat.
99% of the enemies you fight are literal cannon fodder who can't even fight back unless you let them.
Mainly because the ACTUAL threats are the Mini-bosses that take a bit more hits and the Bosses who have a kit much like yours.

In Warframe? The Cannon Fodder units only matter when they get to a point where you outright cannot dodge them.
The "Mini-bosses" are usually so rare that they're dead before anybody cares to notice. _{(See also: Bursa units)}
Bosses themselves are almost always "dead as soon as it turns off invincibility" or "dead before we even get out of bed."

Former being bosses like Lech Kril, Sargus Ruk, Vay Hek, Jackal (both Venus and Undercroft versions), Tyl Regor, etc.
Latter being bosses like Raptor, Hyena Pack, Sergeant, Void Angels, Ambulas, etc.

Honestly? The only thing I can really justify actually DOING in the game with is how much weapon variety we have.
All the different TO kill enemies.

It's less "Power Fantasy" and more the creativity of the kits that sells Warframe.

If they keep leaning on that idiotic Power Fantasy idea? All they got left to develop of worth is cosmetics and uhhh...
... yeah, that bundle is an omen.

3 hours ago, Circle_of_Psi said:

but this topic won't go away anytime soon and even if it does get locked or deleted, people will just make another and another until this is drilled into their skulls

The fact that it's taken THIS MUCH outcry for such a trivial response as is?
Eugh, disappointing on DE's part really.

"I send my Scourge, I send my sword..."

[PublikDomain]

7 hours ago, SneakyErvin said:

Yep and if there was say a pack with just the skins, both of them in one, I wouldnt be surprised if someone claimed that was bad business practice, greed and consumer unfriendly aswell since they'd get forced into a skin they wouldnt want. Or they they were overpriced since they wouldnt come with a big pack discount, same complaint would likely come if they sold them solo for a slighly higher cost per skin compared to a bigger bundle.

Which are both core complaints of the packs as they are. Yes, I think a pack that had the same problems people were complaining about would receive those same complaints.

But do people complain about the paired Mesa and Volt Sentient skins being bundled? No, because you can buy them separately.

[(PSN)Red-Magnet]

I've played Warframe since 2013. One of the biggest selling point I pitch to friends and acquaintances alike is DE's fair microtransaction practice. It's almost always community inclusive and non compulsory. Everyone works at their own pace to EARN what they want. Even those that missed an event can earn access to exclusive items at a later time. I've bought prime access and various merch over the years but this cash only pack just feels wrong and out of place coming from DE.

I'm not so much upset but deeply disappointed by DE.

Disappointed.

[TrouNoir]

This pack is worth $40 at MOST without all the junk.

Tell me, as a player who has bought all of the Prime cosmetics packs and has more Plat than he can use through trading and bundles, what the hell am I expected to do with Regal Aya and Platinum? It's worthless currency to anyone who is remotely invested in the game. I literally cannot spend Aya, there's nothing to buy. At this point you might as well sell mod packs for $10,000 and include $9,999 worth of Regal Aya because that's essentially what you're doing with these packs.

It's a shame because I'd buy the skins otherwise. At this point they can't really reduce the price without causing issues for people who already bought it. Maybe just give them the equivalent value in Plat and Aya 😂

[(PSN)slightconfuzzled]

9 hours ago, Binket_ said:

I think you're pretty lucky to even HAVE a back catalog.
I can't think of many games I'd want to play let alone could.

 

So at the moment, I have purchased but haven't yet experienced... 

Hollow Knight, Dark Souls 3, Bloodborne, Sekiro, Nioh 1 + Nioh 2. Indivisible, Hi Fi Rush, X-Com II, Iconoclasts, Devil May Cry V, Death Stranding, Skyrim, Final Fantasy 13 -2 + Final Fantasy 13-3, Final Fantasy 15, Final Fantasy 16. Last Guardian. the two most recent God of War games, all the Yakuza games, the last two Tomb Raider games, Gravity Rush 1 + 2. A bunch of fighting games, a few driving games. Oh Tales of Berseria, and I think Arise... a few other JRPGS as well. Persona 5. That uh Capcom Monster Hunter like game. 

Also a bunch of remasters, remakes, or HD/upgraded versions of some games I want to play, RE 2 + 3 + 4 Remake. A few of the older FF remasters (especially 9 and 12), plus FF7 Remake, Okami, Shadow of Colossus. 

Then there are a few games, that have no remasters or anything, are just old, but I sort of want to play anyway, and keep my PS2, PS3 around for. Vagrant Story, some older Shin Megami games, older Persona games, Onimushi games, few older Castlevania games. 

Then I have like 40 to unknown smaller indie games I picked up for cheap or free, that look fun, creative, etc I can't remember the names for them all. Then all the games a few different services give me for "free" as a part of yearly subscriptions etc. 

 

9 hours ago, Binket_ said:

Stop. You have "external sites" for that. I'm sure they'll remedy that in no time.

 

It was just a joke, to emphasis and agree with the other persons point. Naturally I care far more about the seriousness and importance of how game devs and publishers handle FOMO than a term I just came up with out of the blue, because I thought it sounded silly and funny (FONA aka the Fear of No Ass). Yes there may always be criticisms and complaints, about anything, but there is also always context and scale. I have seen a single person claim that DE will die and lose its fanbase and fail within a few years if it doesn't start to devote more resources to Kavat armours. Doesn't mean that single take being a bit off, invalidates hundreds more complaints about something thats more thoroughly and reasonably structured. Not all complaints or criticisms are equal. 

"People will complain anyway" is inherently flawed stance, its just way too broad. You can apply to that literally everything. It can and has been used to attempt to suppress peoples rights, voices, and freedom. I can get the sense behind it, but that sense is usually frustration, so a type of vent, because yes, compromise, and balance and trying to find ways to best accomodate a large group of different peoples, can be hard, and tiring, and laborious. I can sympathise with people a little, when they think "it doesn't matter what XYZ people do, people are going to complain and moan anyway", but its also important to remember that, that in itself is a similarly hypocritical and contradicting statement. "It doesn't matter if XYZ actually does improve or worsens, or otherwise changes or becomes fluid... people are going to believe and say things like "it doesn't matter what XYZ people do, people are going to complain and moan anyway"" even if we can demonstrate that things did actually change for the better or got worse or that there was merit and positivity with exerting effort. For some people, their belief that "it doesn't matter" is often self serving and or buried in their conscious for various reasons. It can occasionally be an accurate assessment, just not always. 

Also sometimes its nice to interject some lighthearted absurd humour into a thread that can have a lot of disagreement and tension. Like have we all considered that the reason Wisp Prime has a slightly reduced backside is because she also has feet now? So she is probably walking around a lot more, rather than magically floating, so doing more cardio than normal Wisp, which means, in lore, she should be a little bit slimmer in areas. Which also, and I am just talking pure lore and in game story telling, makes sense, because with less fat and muscle, she will be colder. What do cold people do? They wear scarves... Hence, why Wisp Prime also came with a scarf. Regardless its still FONA. 

[Binket_]

1 hour ago, (PSN)slightconfuzzled said:

It was just a joke

Maybe, but I've seen enough morons that it ain't one for me.

Ya ever get someone (trying to) blackmail you in order to see some tits ya don't have?
I have, it's not a fun experience. While their efforts were lackluster at best, it was still something I'd rather not have.

Internet is a strange place, I'll say.

1 hour ago, (PSN)slightconfuzzled said:

"People will complain anyway" is inherently flawed stance

... yeah, that's kinda my idea on it too.
It's also the fact that even if "People will complain anyway" WAS valid?
The complaints we currently have are far bigger in scale.

1 hour ago, (PSN)slightconfuzzled said:

So at the moment, I have purchased but haven't yet experienced...

Mine are mainly multiplayer games.
The games I WOULD like to play are:

• Ones from retro era that require hardware I do not have or ROMs that are questionably legal. Usually in the context of sharing it with others.
  • I'm not a Streamer and I don't own any capture cards. Y'know, even if I DID have the money to make it happen.
• Multiplayer game I have my eyes on and have been waiting to try it with others. No matter how many friends ya got, very few will actually play it with ya.
• An MMO I can enjoy on my AND with friends that isn't going to make me gouge out my eyes.

A lot of games I'd like play these days are multiplayer ones.
... unfortunately, those experiences tend to be the target for the ungodly amount of garbage that plagues the market these days.

I mean, look up the "MMO" genre on Steam, you'll find at least 3/4th of them are Mobile Ports... the rest are the usual big names like FFXIV and such.
All of them besides the EXTREMELY popular ones have reviews worth a damn.

It's a problem.

[Circle_of_Psi]

11 hours ago, Binket_ said:

I've said it before and I'll say it again:
"Power Fantasy only works if there's a dynamic to it. Warframe fails that dynamic in every way."

-----

If they keep leaning on that idiotic Power Fantasy idea? All they got left to develop of worth is cosmetics and uhhh...
... yeah, that bundle is an omen.

Yup

People have gotten so used to it as well and cry when their favourite frame or weapon is nerfed or  "this is not warframe" but I'm going to end this topic here since I don't want to derail the topic into something else.

11 hours ago, Binket_ said:

The fact that it's taken THIS MUCH outcry for such a trivial response as is?
Eugh, disappointing on DE's part really.

"I send my Scourge, I send my sword..."

Indeed, but knowing them they'll just sweep it under the rug or claim some excuse or "how dare you" 

All that blah blah, we're still waiting for our offer of an official full written and honest Apology along with the promise that the Heirloom Skins will be available permanently in the In-Game Market as a Platinum (And/Or) They put the Skins and other Contents and leave out the Plat/Aya and they -never- do this again. This is what will meet the demands.

[(PSN)slightconfuzzled]

51 minutes ago, Binket_ said:

Maybe, but I've seen enough morons that it ain't one for me.

 

Sure, after all Poes Law is a thing, but the ability to pick up context clues is a thing thats useful for people for different reasons. Satire and sarcasm can be effective in many ways. Out of all the criticisms, complaints, and backlash against the Heirloom bundles, some of the more effective, scathing and concise were sarcastic or satirical, and a small percentage of the overall negative feedback. To so broadly doubt all that under the idea they are all morons, because one might not have necessarily been so considerate or observing to consider the actual meaning attempted to be sent... 

There are other skills as well though, like I have seen sentiment that I couldn't tell was a joke, sarcasm, or satire, and left a bit puzzled, including in this very thread, but this is where communication and clarity can come into play. You can just ask or clarify, that was my attempt here. You can doubt my sincerity, or intelligence, but it was really just a joke. 

90 percent of my posts in this thread have been more serious and sincere and critical of FOMO, whilst its possible that I somehow may have just been insincere all those times, and just waiting my chance to expose the true ills of gaming and DE with Fear of No Ass predatory tactics, the person I quoted who I have agreed with as far as criticisms of DE and predatory practices, and a few others, probably will sense I was joking/kidding. Not all, but thats okay too. Hence, clarification. I also could have just put an /s to denote sarcasm, but ehh, sometimes that ruins the joke, or attempt at the joke, if it didn't land for you personally. 

 

1 hour ago, Binket_ said:

Ya ever get someone (trying to) blackmail you in order to see some tits ya don't have?
I have, it's not a fun experience. While their efforts were lackluster at best, it was still something I'd rather not have.

 

Incidentally yes. I wouldn't call it fun per say, no, can really depend, some were quite creepy and sad, but sometimes there is an element of absurdity and obliviousness its kind of hilarious when discussing with people later, like now. I once came across a person trying to flirt with an AI spambot, just because the spambot had a sexy avatar. They were leaving messages about how they (the spambot) should visit the human dude attempting the flirting. I was tasked with dealing with such spam, and I found the persons inability to realise it wasn't a real person let alone a sexy brunette woman, only for them to get defensive then hostile (I was trying to let them know it was a spambot and not to throw out their personal info to publicly accessible menus), and then they attempting to flirt with me, because my username and writing style seemed like a "hot girl". I agree though, not really something I wish to happen. 

 

1 hour ago, Binket_ said:

It's also the fact that even if "People will complain anyway" WAS valid?
The complaints we currently have are far bigger in scale.

 

Only really in abstracts, hypotheticals, humour, that I can think of, because of what we have both said on the matter. Its a bit ironic, even with self awareness of "complaining about complaining" and usually its motivated by people feeling defensive or frustrated, for ego or emotional reasons, and not really motivated by more genuine or neutral purposes, usually because there are better arguments. Like sympathising and then trying to get people to insert a bit of perspective or something like that. 

 

1 hour ago, Binket_ said:

Mine are mainly multiplayer games.
The games I WOULD like to play are:

• Ones from retro era that require hardware I do not have or ROMs that are questionably legal. Usually in the context of sharing it with others.
  • I'm not a Streamer and I don't own any capture cards. Y'know, even if I DID have the money to make it happen.
• Multiplayer game I have my eyes on and have been waiting to try it with others. No matter how many friends ya got, very few will actually play it with ya.
• An MMO I can enjoy on my AND with friends that isn't going to make me gouge out my eyes.

A lot of games I'd like play these days are multiplayer ones.
... unfortunately, those experiences tend to be the target for the ungodly amount of garbage that plagues the market these days.

I mean, look up the "MMO" genre on Steam, you'll find at least 3/4th of them are Mobile Ports... the rest are the usual big names like FFXIV and such.
All of them besides the EXTREMELY popular ones have reviews worth a damn.

It's a problem.

 

Interesting. Some of the issues you bring up are why I am not a big multiplayer person myself or have been weary. Even though I have nothing against them, and have enjoyed a few. Mass Effect 3 multiplayer was the first I played, and I thought that was great. A friend wanted me to play it with them, so it was as much a way to hang out with them. Ditto Overwatch, but we both abandoned that game for ethical reasons, anti-consumer behaviour we couldn't tolerate. Monster Hunter World a bit similar, but like Warframe, its a game I can enjoy in solo mode often too. Their community, at least as far as the ones I interacted with directly, were very warm, whole and friendly too, much like how i feel about Warframe community generally. Same friend also suggested we might play Final Fantasy 14, but time issues and some other factors delayed that. Potentially indefinitely. 

I empathise and sympathise with your situation. Its why I played with my friend, because I didn't want them to feel that way. I feel quite alright about being born in this period, and gaming could potentially get worse in the future, but I sometimes wonder what a post scarcity future with improved infrastructure, as far as everyone having access to the best internet and the same equal best technologies and the affect that potentially have on the nature of video games, gaming communities and the fun that could be had with all that lining up. 

[Drachnov]

Surely, not the way you want to remember your 10 year anniversary. I also got a 75% coupon on my login but with this situation I m not gonna use it.

[ReddyDisco]

21 hours ago, (PSN)slightconfuzzled said:

 

Don't you dare downplay and trivialise the NAS aka Nerfed Ass Syndrome that plagues many skins of our beloved Warframes. Wisp worked hard for that cake, she worked hard for that Platinum (money), so hard for it honey. She worked hard for that Platinum (money), so you all better treat her right. Then what did DE do to the Prime version? Its got 3 mm less rotundness, overall width and lacking the same exact mass. Travesty. People in here ready to call anything and everything FOMO, but what about FONA? Fear of No Ass? Just as serious an issue, when you really think about it. 

I am too traumatised to even talk about the Mesa Prime incident. Sir Mix-a-Lot would be rolling in his grave. I mean... if he was dead, he's not, but if he was... he would definitely be rolling. Thankfully Grendel Prime's bakery looks full and gluttonous, but I worry about my boy Gauss. 

Indeed, wisp prime's asset reduction was heresy. sadly my protests about it in feedback fell on deaf ears.

[Ke0mA]

Steve's departure marked the end of creative processes in the development of the game.

Now in development, they minimize work and maximize profits.

Developers rest on the laurels of past achievements and forgot about unfulfilled promises.

No wonder they were overcome with greed.

 

[DogsConkers]

Bold move disrespecting the whales who help keep the lights on and the game free for the rest of us. These angels with deep pockets god bless ‘em deserve to be treated fairly.

Please provide something substantial to keep them around I’d rather not have to pay a subscription because they all left the relay!

Edited September 2, 2023 by DogsConkers
Tried reducing font size, failed.

[MirageKnight]

DE is not in any way, shape or form struggling financially right now. They recently hosted an expensive convention with contests that had relatively high value prizes given away. In addition, they dropped $200k on a charity. I can guarantee that they also made a nice tidy profit off convention goers as well.

Keep in mind that for every whale that spends $100 on this game, there's probably 5-6 of us little fish spending $25-30 here and there. If you think our contributions (and numbers) don't matter, you're very much mistaken. If we decide to go swim somewhere else because we feel we're not being respected / valued, I'd argue that's going to mark the beginning of the end for Warframe. A game that caters primarily to entitled, narcissistic rich kids is not one that I'm willing to play, much less support financially. I'm pretty sure a lot of other players feel the same way.

Angels? Really? Gimme a break...I'd say the real angels are all us players that helped kept DE afloat back in 2013 and stayed with them ever since.
Since July 2013, I've logged about 6.3k hours of game time and spent at least $1.6K on plat and items. That doesn't even include the prime access bundles I've bought.

How about showing us "little fish" some respect?

 

[Keithy55]

I've said my piece quite a while back that's transferred to this thread, so I'm not gonna add another essay to this essay-ridden thread. EDIT: It's kind of like an essay now lol, but it's way shorter than what I've seen before! 

I'm going to park this video from a whale whose arguments are what I'm very agreeable with about the collection:

https://youtu.be/YrWsZcqZASA?si=GhB22OvlqS0JX23I

He didn't touch on Regal Aya, but I still believe Regal Aya is versatile enough to not be called "useless" as some people had put it. 

Honestly, I'm at the point where I don't care what people say about the collection anymore... DE trying to remedy it with plat is a bit of a gray area tbh, but they acknowledged it and I'm okay with that for now. I'm buying the Celestial pack soon, because I really love DE and the skins. And I have money.

You do you if you think DE sucks because of this collection, don't start crying when DE stops producing Heirloom quality skins after this fiasco. Heck, I'd probably cry if those two signas end up being the last of its kind. Maybe you wouldn't cry because Tennogen skins are good, sometimes better than DE skins, and "DE shouldn't bother with making super high quality skins anymore" right?

Btw, I get that outcry is about the RA and inflation etc, but I'm talking about the justification of the skins' value; these things costs (probably a lot more than usual) money and man-hours to make. And you guys don't like it. This is the message you're sending across.

Can't believe this is getting more attention than the hype of Whispers in the Walls and 1999. I'm also excited for Dullahan frame lol

Go to Starfield or whatever game you said you rather play instead of Warframe. I'll be with Warframe and DE until it crashes and burns, it's not about the prestige anymore, I just love being a Tenno. 

Edited September 2, 2023 by Keithy55

[PublikDomain]

9 minutes ago, Keithy55 said:

, don't start crying when DE stops producing Heirloom quality skins after this fiasco.

What metric of "quality" are you talking about? What measurable thing sets Heirloom skins apart from Deluxe skins?

[Binket_]

51 minutes ago, Keithy55 said:

these things costs (probably a lot more than usual) money and man-hours to make.

• Frost's skin has weird texture overlays that prevent proper coloring.
• Mag's skin often comes out FAR too bright, due to half of it being emissives.
• Mag's skin has two large metallic pieces on the back that can easily obstruct Syandanas, causing clipping. 
• The quality outside of that is no better than any other Deluxe Skin being sold on the market for 165 Plat right now.
• Signas are like Auxilary Cosmetics, but for all Warframes.
  • Many skins that have Auxilary Cosmetics retain their 165 Plat pricing.
    • These include:
    • Hydroid Rakkam (Burangara Longcoat)
    • Titania Donann (Moyturan Wings)
    • Rhino Deathwatch (Deathwatch Wings, also the respective idle animations.)
    • Gara Kaleida (Starglaze Shards)
    • Chroma Dynasty (Dynasty Wings)
    • Etc.
    • This list DOES NOT include Warframes that have innate Armor Pieces dedicated to them. Also usually at 165 platinum.
  • Many skins that have Exalted Weapons retain their 165 Plat pricing.
    • These include: 
    • Mesa Presidio
    • Mesa Projectilyst 
    • Ivara Skathi
    • Titania Donann
    • Titania Empress
    • Garuda Hinsa
    • Hildryn Einheri
    • Protea Caladrius and Chroma Dynasty also change the respective abilities that use parts of their model dramatically.
    • Etc.
  • This does not include bundles because these "extra" bits are included with the baseline skin.
• Even if Signas can be used on all Warframes, I would much prefer many Auxilary cosmetics getting the same treatment if all else.
  • Starglaze Shards for instance pairs very nicely with the Brising Syandana (Hildryn Einheri bundle) for a very intimidating look.
  • The Burangara Longcoat pairs extremely nicely with Clan Sigils, giving a "branded coat" look to it.
    • (Should've been a Syandana to begin with, but one thing at a time)
  • Ember Pyraxis' Chestpiece can work nicely on many a set without too much hassle involved.
• The Emote is an animation with an image overlay, much like many emotes.
• The Color picker is a set of hexadecimal codes you can apply. This website here can even tell you the specific ones: https://www.warframecolorpicker.app/
• The Glyph is mainly forgettable.
• The Accolade is a static image slapped onto your profile.
• The Sigil is an image with visual effect. Probably the most worthwhile out of all the extra garbage, yet there's still better.
• There is no man-power involved with the Platinum nor Regal Aya. Only the scrutiny to make sure it's spent properly.

Where are seeing such high quality that it requires a price tag of such nature?

1 hour ago, Keithy55 said:

Can't believe this is getting more attention than the hype of Whispers in the Walls and 1999

Why not? It soured the entire presentation.
Hard to look forward to what comes next as a "hypothetical to come" when the now is demanding ludicrous prices for underwhelming bundles.

Also because the community let out a collective sigh that we have to yell at DE again for this to change.
Nobody wants to do this, but it's either this or we find out these skins end up getting worse over time.

I certainly don't want Warframe Y2K to come around and find out that each "Character" costs a paltry 5$ to buy.
Not 5$ of Platinum. 5 CAD right out the gate, in cash.

That's why we're concerned.
It's not silly to expect such if the "now" is trying to do that already.