Release Excalibur, Lato, Skana Prime To Public, Give Founders Something Else.

[OniDax]

How's this for a tradeoff? Founders get their Codices (that's the plural, I think) filled automatically, past, present and future.

They get all new cosmetic options for free, faster crafting, and unique cosmetic stuff. Their Extractors never lose health, and they can fill the starmap with them.

They have an infinite-duration booster of all types.

Would that be a good enough deal to make everything that gives Mastery available to all players?

 

Or Founders can keep the exclusive stuff they paid for instead of switching out for some new exclusive stuff that the same complainers are going to whine about.

[Yezzik]

Or Founders can keep the exclusive stuff they paid for instead of switching out for some new exclusive stuff that the same complainers are going to whine about.

 

Actually, it'd be a different group of complainers.

[TC-Guardian]

Hmm I don't know I mean this is the stuff we paid for. I am kind of keen to get new stuff which is founder exclusive, but I am a fan of the current stuff and the fact it is exclusive even though none of it really gives that much of an edge over the other weapons or frames. They all have relatively average stats but the look and exclusiveness of them make them stand out without it being like "Oh its a founder he going to steal all our kills"

[Valiant]

No thanks. It's a massive slap in the face to other Founders who care and completely destroys the original point of the packs. 

 

I don't want trade-offs. I want what I paid for. 

 

Why can't people just finally leave this topic alone and complain about/request something else?

Edited February 27, 2014 by Naith

[Crusifiction]

i just want to be able to update my current founder level since i am a founder but i wanna pay for grandmaster since i have the money now

[Edgedemon]

I myself like the fact that my contribution garnered me an exclusive warframe, and while i did not wish to spend the money on grandmaster i felt that my dedication and trust by giving a beta game was being returned in the form of an exclusive warframe. While i sympathize with those either unable or unwilling to buy the founders pack when they were available I can only say life isnt fair. I dont mean this in the negative way that it will most likely be taken but I believe the Exclusive founders items should remain exclusive. I  could not justify spending that much money (whatever grand master cost) on a game in Beta. I dont regret this at all, I feel that my 50 dollars on Hunter and 10 on plat was more then enough.

im kinda sure a lot of people has spent way above those 50$ and dont have prime to show for it, while your trust is to be rewarded for buying on beta, should their loyalty and continued support be not?

[ObviousLee]

i just want to be able to update my current founder level since i am a founder but i wanna pay for grandmaster since i have the money now

i cant really be on either side of the fence with you on this because well, while you ARE a founder, and being able to upgrade would indeed be awesome, the deadline was set and if you didnt meet it, its your loss.

 

Food for thought though: i had rent and a car payment and other nonsense bills that made it flat out impossible to get a founders pack. so i took on sidework to make SURE i had the money without taking away from my responsibilities. which is why i have such a "shoulda bought it then" attitude towards this topic. I didn't have the money i would need to get it, so, i made the money to get it.

[Tsukinoki]

@Edgedemon
We were rewarded for paying into a game that had absolutely no promise of making it anywhere as far as it has currently and is so different now as to be unrecognizable.
There was a rather large risk that we put into this that isn't there for anyone wanting to buy it now.

We got rewarded for taking a large risk.
I dont see why you should get the same rewards for a much smaller risk.

[ObviousLee]

@Edgedemon

We were rewarded for paying into a game that had absolutely no promise of making it anywhere as far as it has currently and is so different now as to be unrecognizable.

There was a rather large risk that we put into this that isn't there for anyone wanting to buy it now.

We got rewarded for taking a large risk.

I dont see why you should get the same rewards for a much smaller risk.

VERY valid point right here. we had NO idea this game would be around at this point, and seriously, go back and look through the OLD update videos and see just how much different this game is now, as opposed to say, u7?

[Tsukinoki]

@ObviousLee
I remember back when this game used the battle deck system.  It was a huge change to switch to a star chart, and the changes have kept coming.
You could put the original version of the game next to this one and beyond the warframes there is very very little that remains of the original (and even the warframes have changed quite a bit).
We had no idea if this game would catch on, and yet we paid 50-250$ into a game where you used cards to 'craft' a mission and take part, and now that game has turned into what people are playing currently.

I think that the reward should equal the risk.  And putting in 250$ into the game now has nearly no risk, so why should the reward be so good?

[Lumireaver]

So no, the fact that they cant complete the prime set of frames and weapons is not the majority of complaints. Its the fact that it shows up in the codex and they can see it but can never get it.

No matter what they rename the founders items to people will always throw a fit because they can see it but they can never get it.

And before they go down any route with changing names or something they first need to change how excal prime looks. I mean its the plainest prime in the game and really needs a graphical overhaul.

 

Right, but on the codex these things are showing up right next to all of the other Primes they can have. ...You've been here a while. You know the deal with the Founder's Primes. However, you need to take a step back and imagine the situation from the perspective of a new player. (Like any of the thousands of new PS4 players.) ...As they're learning about the game and about Prime parts, it's not immediately obvious to them that there are three which they'll never get. (That they get to learn about them in advanced because of the codex complicates matters.)

 

Calling our Founder's Primes "Founder's Things" in-game would help. This could also be done by appending a different word besides (or in addition to) "Prime" just to hammer home that they're unobtainable.

 

Or they could just design a distinct Excal Prime for the masses while we keep our awesome Founder's gifts.

 

The Founders items are actually exclusive. They aren't a part of a set that's 96% available to everyone. That's exclusivity.

 

You're thinking of exclusivity as in "limited to a small group," I'm using exclusivity as in "excluded from." Subtle distinction. Very important for understanding what I'm getting at.

 

No, not for everyone.  Things would be sweet solely for a very particular group - collectors who care about having all Primes, but who don't care about having everything.  And founders who care not only about exclusives they paid for, but exclusive Primes they paid for, are out in the cold.

 

The more I think about this whole proposal, the more I see it as an attempt to please a few members of a very specific group at the expensive of a few members of another very specific group.  I don't think I can really back this.

 

The sweet part is that they'd (we'd) still have our Founders junk that non-Founders cannot ever have, but everyone else would have a different gold-trimmed Excal. Theirs (which could also be ours) would just be different, but it would still match their collection of gold trimmed junk and allow them to fill the gap.

 

I can't speak for everyone (like those guys asking for infinitely renewable potatoes), I'm just trying to reason towards the best possible outcome for the broadest possible audience. The status quo is great though and I wouldn't mind if things didn't change. Just speaking my mind because internet.

[evafan002]

Missing the point. Founders have exclusive Primes, part of a series which non-Founders can't complete.

 

If they as much as renamed Exal Prime into Excal Origin then released a new, different Excal Prime, everything would be sweet for everyone.

no it wouldnt because then people would start complaining about the fact that we founders still have something they cannot get  the long and short of it is that as long as founders have anything no matter what it is called that the rest of the playerbase cannot get then people will complain and demand to be allowed to have it

[Phatose]

 

The sweet part is that they'd (we'd) still have our Founders junk that non-Founders cannot ever have, but everyone else would have a different gold-trimmed Excal. Theirs (which could also be ours) would just be different, but it would still match their collection of gold trimmed junk and allow them to fill the gap.

 

I can't speak for everyone (like those guys asking for infinitely renewable potatoes), I'm just trying to reason towards the best possible outcome for the broadest possible audience. The status quo is great though and I wouldn't mind if things didn't change. Just speaking my mind because internet.

 

Either the "Prime" part is valuable, or it's not.  If it's not valuable - well, no need to give it away, and keeping the promise of that particular stuff being exclusive trumps all other concerns.  If it is, then there's certainly no grounds to take it away from any of us. 

 

If we're going to give away gold frame things to others, that's fine.  But, ours should get to keep the Prime name.  We were, after all, promised it, and we paid for it.  I do not believe for an instant "Screw the founders to please the collectors" is even close to acceptable.  Nor is pleasing the widest possible audience a goal.

 

 

I wonder if perhaps making the items tradable might work.  The number of these items remains the same, so exclusivity isn't exactly affected.  Arguable perhaps, but the rarity is unchanged.  No founder would lose the value of their items because the rarity is maintained.  Those who don't value them particularly high could trade for something they do value, while collectors would have an opening if they were willing to pay for it.  The cynic in me tells me it wouldn't be enough for the collectors though - that having the items available wouldn't be enough.  They'd need the item reissued to drive the price down.  But I might be wrong there.

[Katotsu]

This thread has turned into "I'm a founder and therefore I'm better than you."  Yes they gave their word they'd be exclusive, but all I'm reading now is "I paid for it."  Its really sad that the only people who matter in this game are the grandmasters. 

 

This isn't to the forum people, its to DE.  Why ONLY listen to Founders?  Am I not worth your time?  I've spent $400 and I'm one of the lower spenders yet the only people who matter are those who paid $250.  If I keep reading this thread I'm gonna just stop playing Warframe entirely so I'm done.

[Phatose]

He's right.  Don't listen to Founders, don't listen to non-founders.  Listen to society at large.  They'll tell you quite clearly that it's unethical to change the terms of a sale a year after you've made it.  Which, well, you know already.

[Drakontis]

16 pages of back and forth on this issue. I'm not entirely sure what to think of that. As far as I'm concerned, though... I don't know. As opposed to something like the Brakk or even re-releasing a vandal or wraith weapon, this is something I paid for. If it was released in the void, I'd be a little irked, certainly. I'd be pretty annoyed. I'd understand, but I'd be annoyed. I wouldn't threaten to quit the game, but I don't think I'd offer to support it financially again. If it was made available for purchase once again, minus the founders badge, minus the Design Council access, but maybe as a bundle with platinum for the same price as what I paid in, then I wouldn't mind so much. But it would have to exclude the badge and the design council access, and I'd even go so far as to say that if there was some sort of exclusive cosmetic, that it should be released to founders as well for free. I wouldn't mind that nearly as much. 

 

Just my 2 Cents. I really don't care much either way. Apathy is mostly what I feel on this subject. On the subject of "exclusives" in general, really. 

[Valiant]

This thread has turned into "I'm a founder and therefore I'm better than you." Yes they gave their word they'd be exclusive, but all I'm reading now is "I paid for it." Its really sad that the only people who matter in this game are the grandmasters.

This isn't to the forum people, its to DE. Why ONLY listen to Founders? Am I not worth your time? I've spent $400 and I'm one of the lower spenders yet the only people who matter are those who paid $250. If I keep reading this thread I'm gonna just stop playing Warframe entirely so I'm done.

Founders, specifically GM's paid $250 up front, in one go, sometimes at the early stages of the game. There's a difference there compared to 'Well I've spent $400 so far, so listen to me as well', that wasn't all in one go was it? That's the difference and it is pointless trying to use that viewpoint to justify the release of the Founders gear. I simply care because it was stated to be exclusive and a lot of money was spent, but that wasn't for the exclusivity. It's just the principle, you don't clearly state something as an advertising point to your community and then completely change your mind. It's insulting, rude and clearly unfair. There's was plenty of time to purchase the packs, if you weren't here too bad, really. It happens everywhere all the time. Perhaps if we could trade them? Not sure about that, but seeing how other exclusive things exist in this world - cars and other various items - the same should apply here and people should stop complaining about it so damn much and complain about something else.

Why not listen to Founders? They're the ones who actually paid for the content. GM's aren't the only ones who 'matter' in this game, if you think so that's rather naive, but when it comes to this Founders opinions should count for a lot because again they paid for it in the circumstances and to an extent, they're the 'minority' it's going to affect. To further nullify your point; people were complaining about not having event weapons released publicly, did DE only listen to those who participated in the event? Evidently not. Edited February 28, 2014 by Naith

[Tsoe]

As a grand master I can't help bit sit and stare at the three exclusive primes I have and have mixed feelings about them. I commend DE for sticking by their word when they said these would be exclusive to the founders pack and would never be released to the public, but I would like to post this thread to get support from other founders whom would gladly take some alternative exlusive item over the three primes.

 

Honestly I feel a little bad for the collectors out there whom simply didn't have the money at the time or even knew of warframe at that time to get the founders pack. Things like weapons/warframes shouldn't be truely exclusive, perhaps tied to special events but they will come around again.

 

It just feels weird to have something that affects gameplay directly, I.E. a weapon/warframe, that no one will ever have. If it was a awesome skin for that weapon I'd completely be fine, but the fact that it has altered stats that make it...well better than the default bothers me a little bit and has been bothering me for a while now.

 

Now what would someone consider a fair trade to no longer have the exclusivity of the three primes? Perhaps a reusable Orokin Catalyst and Reactor Blueprint? Permanent Booster of some kind? That's all I can really think of at this time, aside from another syandana. I mean we already have the design council, our name in the star map even, the shirt and headband are awesome as well.

 

But please, if you support this idea, or have some suggestions on what to give the founders instead of the primes, post in this thread.

 

 

you made my day

 

 

Lato prime and skana prime are allmost the weakest weapons in the game

 

i understand you want something else (you're doing it wrong) but lato and skana being founder gear make total sense

 

Maybe a litle buff could be welcome, cause we Founder are sometimes ashamed of using our gear..

 

Or Worst like trying hard to make them viable but dont succeed..

 

 

 

Thoose two weapons who represent the Past glory of Tenno ... actually are full of shame

 

Design is awesome but they are unusable at high lvl

 

and OFC allmost all Founders are Veteran now Lurkin for stronger ennemies and hallenges..

and we end up looking our founder gear getting dusty

 

 

 

That said weak and dusty... dont try to get ride of that exclusivity

 

You may not see it like this but even for those who dont have those item , to know that a game sometimes give real exclusive gears it's a given and it's appealing

 

 

 

 

 

 

egg:

 

needed at least 4 format to kill something with lato prime and yet  dont reach half the power oof a magnus

dont have critical (5%) and statu proc low

Edited February 28, 2014 by Tsoe

[Llyssa]

you made my day

 

 

Lato prime and skana prime are allmost the weakest weapons in the game

 

i understand you want something else (you're doing it wrong) but lato and skana being founder gear make total sense

 

Maybe a litle buff could be welcome, cause we Founder are sometimes ashamed of using our gear..

 

Or Worst like trying hard to make them viable but dont succeed..

 

 

 

Thoose two weapons who represent the Past glory of Tenno ... actually are full of shame

 

Design is awesome but they are unusable at high lvl

 

and OFC allmost all Founders are Veteran now Lurkin for stronger ennemies and hallenges..

and we end up looking our founder gear getting dusty

 

 

 

That said weak and dusty... dont try to get ride of that exclusivity

 

You may not see it like this but even for those who dont have those item , to know that a game sometimes give real exclusive gears it's a given and it's appealing

 

 

 

 

 

 

egg:

 

needed at least 4 format to kill something with lato prime and yet  dont reach half the power oof a magnus

dont have critical (5%) and statu proc low

That's actually a thing that makes me feel more okay about it.

 

It's not like OMG, BEST WEAPON IN THE GAME, AND IT IS FOUNDER ONLY!

 

They're just mediocre gear pieces, in a sea of gear pieces. The fact that there's over 120 other weapons out there, many of which are far better, makes it okay.

 

Yeah, we got them exclusively. No, you really aren't losing anything if you never get them.

 

They're blingy for when you don't mind playing with blingy stuff. Otherwise, they don't do much.

 

Since having them is no huge advantage, and not having them is not any disadvantage at all, it works out. If they actually became covetable for something beyond "I am bad at math and logic, so I think I need these for meaningless mastery ranks", there'd be a ton of justification in all of the whining. At that point, it becomes a valid concern. Until then, it's just whining.

[Telogor]

I feel sorry for the Founders:  all of the exclusive Primes SUCK.

[StevangarCronox]

I was going to say then people would complain that they do not get what the founders get then, but then realized this was proposed by a GM founder and what they recommended. 0.o

[Mcl_Blue]

You know, I agree with OP. I feel sad for new players that will want to have all Prime frames, and won't be able to because of a technicality like this.

 

If the majority of Founders disagrees with this proposal, I understand. If, regardless of who agrees or disagrees, DE disagrees with this proposal, I understand also. But this is my opinion: I like having my Excalibur Prime, exclusive or not, and I would be happy if other people could have a shot at having him as well.

 

Ultimately, this is DE's decision. These are just my 2 cents.

 

On a slightly related note, I find the nonexistence of an "Aklato Prime" mildly weird.

[Sev7n]

Give Excalibur prime to the public and replace it by making rhino prime exclusive for the founders?

[OniDax]

Give Excalibur prime to the public and replace it by making rhino prime exclusive for the founders?

 

Or Excalibur Prime can remain exclusive to the Founders, and Rhino Prime can be available to the public.

[ObviousLee]

Or Excalibur Prime can remain exclusive to the Founders, and Rhino Prime can be available to the public.

/agree