Dev Workshop: Beam Weapons Revisited!

[SnuggleBuckets]

Interesting read, on paper those changes look like fun, also appreciate the added diversity to the weapons with damage types, beam behaviour, reload behaviour etc.
We'll have to see how these play out ingame.

[Lakyus]

1 minute ago, Cicasajt said:

nice amprex really needed a nerf as the only potent beam weapon.(no, i didnt). excuse me but where is the rework in this? status is still bad, ammo economy is better and now they cant be built neither status or crit since status is bad and crit got nerfed.... couldnt be more disappointed. and that delay to wait almost a whole second to get 100% dmg... what is that?

The beam mechanic was changed. And 32% crit chance for Amprex is still one of the highest base crits for primary weapons in the game.

[Punk3r7]

34 minutes ago, Scaleguard said:

Opticor getting no changes?

The Opticor isn't a beam weapon. Its a charged launcher. Beam weapon means a constantly firing beam.

[AuroraSonicBoom]

Man, that takes me back. Spent months trying to help you guys trouble shoot the beam weapon lag bug until you had to change the damage model. Loved the ignis back then, still love it now. For anyone who's interested in seeing the primary reason why beam weapons changed all those years ago:

Spoiler

 

Really want to say thank you for finally doing something about beam weapons, but any comparison is going to severely lack context, so I'll wait and see. I am curious about whether we will be able to mod our beam weapons for status application now. Does anything affect that statistic?

[Valiant]

13 minutes ago, MrHanBrolo said:

Maybe the Cycron won't be garbo now :D Eh...We'll see.

Hopefully.

Really liked the weapon due to its appearance and sounds but that reload speed and stats..

Also, moar glaxion! Glaxion Vandal!

Looking forward to melee weapon revisits and I hope they're closer than it seems. Skana Prime hungers for blood. As does the olden days Fang Prime.

[DecadeX]

32 minutes ago, Scaleguard said:

Opticor getting no changes?

Technically that's a semi auto rifle not a continuous beam. If it got any changes they would have happened in the last set of weapon changes.

[Serinexxa]

I'm quite excited to see these changes finally coming around, especially my lovely Flux Rifle no longer having the fault of abysmal ammo.

 

My only primary concern would be if it's swapping it's primary damage type, if my current polarity/riven setup would still be viable. I've for 8 forma on that laser, just managed to forcefully resurrect it fairly recently.

Aside from that, this makes me excited to toss off primed ammo conversion and get back to work on saving the Glaxion.

[TonnoTuna]

FINALLY!

I just have a doubt: what Fire Rate stands for?

[Giantconch]

gonna be a lot to go over here...hopefully this is good!

[DecadeX]

This would be a lot more readable if you had old stats next to new stats instead of having me look it up elsewhere. Otherwise, as others have pointed out, there are a few beam weapons and beam weapon like weapons and effects that aren't addressed.

[PoisonHD]

51 minutes ago, Rekalty said:

Would you kindly add current stats? Makes it a lot easier to tell if you're improving or nerfing them.

They are getting massive changes mechanically/behaviorally, so seeing the old stats in comparison to the new is sort of useless.

@DecadeX ^^

 

@StrongCrayon @Cicasajt Did you read the top part of the post? The changes are more then just stats, but how the weapons work as a whole.

[Omega-Shadowblade]

Just now, DecadeX said:

This would be a lot more readable if you had old stats next to new stats instead of having me look it up elsewhere. Otherwise, as others have pointed out, there are a few beam weapons and beam weapon like weapons and effects that aren't addressed.

Problem is the mechanics are so different that a direct stat comparison is misleading. They mentioned this.

[Lakyus]

Just now, Omega-Shadowblade said:

Problem is the mechanics are so different that a direct stat comparison is misleading. They mentioned this.

Damage per tick didn't change. Nor Crit. Fire rate changed the logic but you could convert them. So that ends up with Status/sec and ammo/sec being the only big different ones. And the 10% to 100% mechanic as well, of course.

[DecadeX]

2 minutes ago, PoisonHD said:

They are getting massive changes mechanically/behaviorally, so seeing the old stats in comparison to the new is sort of useless.

@DecadeX ^^

Although in most cases I agree, I'd say there is a definite exception for some stats like range. Crit damage is another. Like I know status is changing massively, but I should at least be able to see comparsions for stats like those.

[DarkDullahan]

Thanks!!

@[DE]RebeccaI hope Melee weapons get re-balanced soon, the Skana family, Bo family, and Cronus really could use some of the love the Lato family got!

40 minutes ago, Scaleguard said:

Opticor getting no changes?

Opticor doesn't fire like a beam weapon, it's acts like a hit-scan projectile based weapon even thought it's not.

[Soup2504]

@[DE]RebeccaIf the way damage ticks work is all you’re changing, all this will do is make beam weapons more responsive to use, which don’t get me wrong! Is very good! But it won’t fix the biggest issue with them.

status/sec needs to go. Depending on how fast the ticks are, maybe status/tick would be a bit much. I don’t know. But something besides status/sec needs to happen. Status/every 2nd tick, status/0.10sec, just. Something. Status application on beam weapons is going to be the thing that holds them back the most if left unchanged.

[Guest]

I really think it would benefit greatly showing BEFORE and AFTER stats.

Looked up some are overall seems like overall nerf to Synapse, while increasing its damage, 50% crit to 39% crit, while crit damage goes from 2 to 2.7? And from 12.5 damage to 18 damage? This is quite a large difference, in addition to 100 magazine to 70 magazine. 

Also saw up on Quanta, 220 damage with 1 fire to 20 damage to 12 fire rate, seems to me it'll burn up ammo faster than it'll deal damage, so in short; higher burst, lower sustained?

In addition, nothing is stated about Status or poorly explained about status? I mean, I haven't seen any beam based weapons being used, and just by looking at this blog... Makes them seem they'll go extinct (at least for me...).

[Cicasajt]

13 minutes ago, Karmaworks said:

The beam mechanic was changed. And 32% crit chance for Amprex is still one of the highest base crits for primary weapons in the game.

it is but still its a beam weapon and it has very low dmg, very short range and low-med status. didnt need this nerf

[greenblazes]

Super excited to see how this plays out. Could be amazing 0_0

[PoisonHD]

1 minute ago, Clinnger said:

I really think it would benefit greatly showing BEFORE and AFTER stats.

Looked up some are overall seems like overall nerf to Synapse, while increasing its damage, 50% crit to 39% crit, while crit damage goes from 2 to 2.7? And from 12.5 damage to 18 damage? This is quite a large difference, in addition to 100 magazine to 70 magazine. 

Also saw up on Quanta, 220 damage with 1 fire to 20 damage to 12 fire rate, seems to me it'll burn up ammo faster than it'll deal damage, so in short; higher burst, lower sustained?

In addition, nothing is stated about Status or poorly explained about status? I mean, I haven't seen any beam based weapons being used, and just by looking at this blog... Makes them seem they'll go extinct (at least for me...).

We need to wait and see how they'll work now, how quickly they deal damage etc. 

[Cicasajt]

7 minutes ago, PoisonHD said:

They are getting massive changes mechanically/behaviorally, so seeing the old stats in comparison to the new is sort of useless.

@DecadeX ^^

 

@StrongCrayon @Cicasajt Did you read the top part of the post? The changes are more then just stats, but how the weapons work as a whole.

its only says 0,5 ammo/trace. thats just better ammo economy but no change to status. it doesnt say status is /trace or /ammo consumed. its still /second. no change mentioned

[(PSN)Arkhammer77]

Is the "Poison" damage type referenced on the Embolist meant to be Toxin, or is this an entirely new damage type being tested with Embolist?

[(PSN)Ozymandias-13-]

I know you mentioned that comparing the old stats and new stats were apples to oranges, but for the sake of our understanding can we have the current stats+beam calculation=effective damage vs. new stats+beam calculation=effective damage? That way we could understand what we're actually seeing, otherwise the weapon stats didn't really need to be posted at all.

 

Edit: I have to wonder, if status per second is actually removed like people are suspecting what formula would I use to determine the actual status per second of a particular beam weapon?

For example, if there's 12 projectiles per second, each with 35% chance of proc...what does that actually come out to in a second for one of them to proc?...I never studied probability. Or is that not now it will work?

[ReDRoS]

[Remove]

[DecadeX]

1 minute ago, Cicasajt said:

its only says 0,5 ammo/trace. thats just better ammo economy but no change to status. it doesnt say status is /trace or /ammo consumed. its still /second. no change mentioned

They said they'd be making them work more how they used to way at the top of the post. Status/sec didn't exist back then. Obviously if it's still around the status buffs won't matter, but they're heavily implying that it's gone, and if it is then we're about to have some AoE proc monsters.