Is it time for a radiation proc rework?

[alenkiss]

We all know the self damage was reworked recently because it was badly implemented: Why it was bad: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qcfkLb52CqA
I am not saying I am the biggest fan of the rework, due to how suddenly a lot of weapons with a little splash aoe were given full self damage staggers.Some people playing Chroma and Mirage also lost some of the tools to proc their self buffs.Still I think it is a mayor improvement over the tenno space program we had before, as the punishment is now way lower.

Now if we can agree that the oneshot self damage was bad then we can hopefully agree that radiation procs the way they currently affect the tenno are bad too. Namely we have so much damage we can also easily oneshot (or burst down) other players and objectives. Now radiation proc sorties can at least announced in advance so we can prepare accordingly, yet still there are other sources like the lasers in the void, kuva liches, and probably more I cannot recall.

I wish the devs they changed the radiation procs work, namely the punishment, if any should be way lower. One of the main arguments as to why, is that game mechanics should always encourage team play, and radiation procs do the opposite as radiation hazard sorties are best done solo. I think we should not punish other players by killing them or failing their mission if we happen to get radiation procced. Instead the punishment should fall onto our selves. Like self stagger if we hit other players or defense objectives, better yet something different so we have a different feedback.

I would love the hear your thoughts and ideas on the issue 🙂

Edited April 29, 2020 by alenkiss

[Marine027]

Hard to say what it shoudl changed to, sicne we have CC, Dot, slow, stun, knock, etc. already.

Radiation Sorite i suually take Oberon and palce his grass to make status immune so, it encourages me to think outside the damage meta.

I dare to say this should occur more outside sorties to make people think more, of coruse adjusting to a new playstyle without slowing things to much.

Radiation Lichs are the best example, only thing reworking tho is powers turning deadly right when you get the proc, Magnetize as example, it should count as its own entity when casted and not adjsut to your procs while it runs already, that often one shotted me on lichs.

And if you really wanna go deep use the arcane to prevent rad procs at all, i mena they are kinda useless already, so this way they exist at least for some reaosn unlike very old mods by now.

[Tovon]

After playing around with borderlands 3, I like the way they did radiation procs. It does small damage over time which can spread it to nearby enemies and when an afflicted enemy dies, they explode. Doubt DE would want to straight up copy it but I like the idea of exploding enemies.

[Tesla_Reloaded]

2 минуты назад, Tovon сказал:

After playing around with borderlands 3, I like the way they did radiation procs. It does small damage over time which can spread it to nearby enemies and when an afflicted enemy dies, they explode. Doubt DE would want to straight up copy it but I like the idea of exploding enemies.

That's very close to how Gas proc works now.

[bad4youLT]

100% chance to resist radiation status affect

Radiation plays importal role as it can strip ancient healer aura , confuse enemys and make them agro each other and of course as a way to put some sort of chalange to content .

[Numerikuu]

Arcane Healing. Use it in radiation heavy missions, and you'll never have to worry about being self-proc'd again. Or better yet? Use an Oberon or Titania during a radiation mission. Or hell, even a Hydroid if you have his augment. Procs-b-gone.

Other than that? Just be aware of it. We already get a graphical and sound notification when we get proc'd. Just don't be a tit and use any aoes if you're under the effect.

[Wyrmius_Prime]

1 minute ago, Numerikuu said:

Arcane Healing. Use it in radiation heavy missions, and you'll never have to worry about being self-proc'd again. Or better yet? Use an Oberon or Titania during a radiation mission. Or hell, even a Hydroid if you have his augment. Procs-b-gone.

Other than that? Just be aware of it. We already get a graphical and sound notification when we get proc'd. Just don't be a tit and use any aoes if you're under the effect.

You don't even have to have a proc on yourself to get killed though.

[Numerikuu]

2 minutes ago, Wyrmius_Prime said:

You don't even have to have a proc on yourself to get killed though.

Bring an Oberon/Titania/Hydroid/any number of frame with the ability to protect against or cure status effects on your team, and that'll never happen.

Edited April 29, 2020 by Numerikuu

[trst]

I'm pretty sure Sorties, Orokin Lasers, Radiation Liches, and Radium barrels on Jupiter are the only places/things that can proc radiation on us. IMO that isn't enough sources to justify changing its functions as you should be aware that it's a possibility in these areas/missions. If it was a generic enemy or if hostile Liches could spawn in any mission then it would be a bit of a different story.

If it had to get changed though then rather than changing how it functions I'd propose a telegraphed grace period where you have a 1-2 second window before a radiation proc takes effect and make it cancel all active abilities. That way it's the player's fault for not reacting to the proc taking effect and active abilities won't suddenly turn on their squad and gaining some effect in solo missions.

Edited April 29, 2020 by trst

[0_The_F00l]

I would like if they had a uniqe interaction with armor

Radiation proc:

Convert a % of enemy armor into radiation damage in an area around the enemy (not DoT , single instance like blast),

anyone within 5 meters can also get radiation proced when it goes off (like a literal chain reaction which is you know how nuclear reactors work),

but every additional person only does half the earlier damage and the radius is halved too.

Every additional stack does what it does now , add faction damage to self.

[Berzerkules]

But radiation hazard sorties are the closest thing we have to PvP in WF. Too much fun. Please don't take this from me. Always puts a smile on my face when I see rad hazard sortie. 

[HoustonDragon]

19 minutes ago, trst said:

I'm pretty sure Sorties, Orokin Lasers, Radiation Liches, and Radium barrels on Jupiter are the only places/things that can proc radiation on us. IMO that isn't enough sources to justify changing its functions as you should be aware that it's a possibility in these areas/missions. If it was a generic enemy or if hostile Liches could spawn in any mission then it would be a bit of a different story.

If it had to get changed though then rather than changing how it functions I'd propose a telegraphed grace period where you have a 1-2 second window before a radiation proc takes effect and make it cancel all active abilities. That way it's the player's fault for not reacting to the proc taking effect and active abilities won't suddenly turn on their squad and gaining some effect in solo missions.

I like this idea. There should be some element of danger, but the rad procs hit like trucks when people are spamming AoEs. I'd like to see it work like the gas clouds, where you take damage over time, but not an immediate kill.

[(PSN)drollive96]

But thats no fun, killing teammates is hilarious

[ShirakawaNaoya]

Rad proc is one of the thing that actually makes you pay attention to debuff and not making the mission a snooze-fest. Besides since shield gating, Scarlet Spear and access to Arcane Healing max rank (SS give tremendously huge progression on listed Arcanes and Railjack it is a no brainer not to do it albeit repetitive) it kinda mitigate the proc in a way.

[SneakyErvin]

Only place where it is annoying is in sortie missions with defendable objectives since there is always someone failing and blowing the objective up, either resulting in a full fail for mobile defense/defection or a pointlessly dragged out excavation. There is a tool though to keep yourself 100% safe both from getting procced yourself and getting killed by procced players, that tool is Revenant.

[Berzerkules]

1 minute ago, SneakyErvin said:

Only place where it is annoying is in sortie missions with defendable objectives since there is always someone failing and blowing the objective up, either resulting in a full fail for mobile defense/defection or a pointlessly dragged out excavation. There is a tool though to keep yourself 100% safe both from getting procced yourself and getting killed by procced players, that tool is Revenant.

Could you drain a Revenant players energy with a mag proc so they could not recast mesmer skin? Mod something like an ignis wraith for mag dmg so it hits a lot real fast. Draining them of energy and stripping away their mesmer skin quickly. 

[Sunai_Moonswing]

Personally, I love the way it works, just not the fact that the radiation status can keep reapplying when downed. 

 

In all honesty, some of my friends wouldn't mind a gamemode with friendly fire, just to enforce a tactical crawl through levels. 

 

For most players that bring indiscriminate AOEs, it sucks, same for their victims. But if you bring your own team mates, and you bring some status immunity and crowd control, you're fine. 

 

Examples of status immunity are:

Titania with Spellbind, Nezha with warding halo augment, Oberon with Hallowed ground, Revenant if he casts Mesmer Skin and Reave through your warframe, Hydroid and Tidal Impunity (only protects the caster against radiation), Rhino and Iron Skin (only protects the caster), Limbo (protects from all but abilities. Not status protection, but protection from environment). I think that's all of them. 

 

 

[SneakyErvin]

1 minute ago, Berzerkules said:

Could you drain a Revenant players energy with a mag proc so they could not recast mesmer skin? Mod something like an ignis wraith for mag dmg so it hits a lot real fast. Draining them of energy and stripping away their mesmer skin quickly. 

Nope, only if he doesnt have mesmer skin up. If it is active he'll just lose a charge plus stun, damage and inflict whatever status was used against him. The sad part is that shield gate exsists now, so it isnt as fun playing Rev now as before, because people that try and kill you will just hit their shield gate state and be stunned for several seconds. Prior to shield gate anyone that tried to kill you with a high damage weapon would insta gank themselves.

[Berzerkules]

1 minute ago, SneakyErvin said:

Nope, only if he doesnt have mesmer skin up. If it is active he'll just lose a charge plus stun, damage and inflict whatever status was used against him. The sad part is that shield gate exsists now, so it isnt as fun playing Rev now as before, because people that try and kill you will just hit their shield gate state and be stunned for several seconds. Prior to shield gate anyone that tried to kill you with a high damage weapon would insta gank themselves.

Back to the drawing board I guess. thx for the quick response though. 

[Lutesque]

Honestly... Radiation Procs on Tenno aren't really that bad...

I think the purpose of Radiation sorties is just there to make Consider the consequences of your actions... even with out Using a Loadout Specifically for Radiation Procs they can go smoothly in a group.

The Problem with Rad Procs is not how they affect us so much as how they affect Enemies... but thats a topic for another thread.

[Veridian]

It's a change up to the trigger happy play style we are used to and it's extremely rare.

If you want to totally avoid any consequence of a Rad sortie Nezha is always there.

[Hexsing]

To be honest I feel like Trinity of all frames should have a cleanse of some type.  No one uses her 1 at all.  I wish her augment did pulses of immunity which would give her more of the "Combat Medic" or "Support" frame vibe.

[Tiltskillet]

4 hours ago, SneakyErvin said:

Only place where it is annoying is in sortie missions with defendable objectives since there is always someone failing and blowing the objective up either resulting in a full fail for mobile defense . . .

Does this still happen?  It's been maybe half a year or more since I saw it last and I'd just assumed it was fixed.

[--EC--Adrenaline]

Life quality in Sorties is not even an excuse to even propose radiation rework, when DE's attention is needed a LOT more on other aspects of the game. Radiation rework isn't even needed, easily avoided/countered, if anything it should be more punishing to who isn't careful enough or too lazy to pay attention.

[SneakyErvin]

Just now, Tiltskillet said:

Does this still happen?  It's been maybe half a year or more since I saw it last and I'd just assumed it was fixed.

It still happens. Latest time it happened for me was an irradiated numbnut Grendel that just had to try and kill a player with his #3 and hitting the mobdef console aswell. The of course there are still those that just need to stand next to the objective and flail their melee while getting irradiated.