Who Farms Better

[Zabyr]

This topic is inextricably linked with my other article:

 

The video version in Russian is under a spoiler. Include subtitles with translation if you want to watch.👇

Спойлер

 

It makes no sense to measure who is the best farmer. Hydroid, Nekros, Khora, Atlas or Ivara - they all, one way or another, can provide you with additional resources.

 

But... a bunch of people are trashing my Hydroid, saying that with Khora "Pilfering Strangledome" augmentation, she replaced it and it's not good at farming resources. Well, thanks to IBreedBagels, with Reddit [His article - Hydroid vs Nekros for Farming], who did a comparison of who is the better farmer, Hydroid or Nekros, it turned out that Hydroid is getting resources better. What a surprise! No, it's not a surprise to me though. But, I decided to do the comparison myself, and since I now have Khora Prime, I decided to compare it with Hydroid and Nekros. Ivara and Atlas, I did not include them in the statistics.

 

The conditions for statistics were as follows:

1. You can not open boxes and break them so as not to receive resources from them.
2. The time on the mission should be approximately the same for everyone, adjusted for the time spent running before the evacuation (Although I tried to make it the same. But, after 30 minutes, all resource gathering was prohibited).
3. No be used Kavats or other pets. Only sentinel "Djinn".
4. Missions were Common and on the Steel Path, to compare resource drops.
5. Each Warframe made three runs per mission, and the best results were included in the statistics.

I've highlighted the key resources I went on missions for, and how much each Warframe got and in what quantity.

 

Normal levels:

Uranus - Ophelia:

 

Saturn - Titan:

 

The Steel Path:

Uranus - Ophelia:

 

Saturn - Titan:

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - 

From all the statistics, you can see that the Hydroid is either superior to Khora, or stands next to it. Although Hydroid has an even resource extraction. Khora had some resources with much less result, and in Normal mission on Uranus, she could not get Tellurium.

It's worth mentioning that on the Steel Path, I killed more enemies with the Hydroid than with Khora or Nekros, because Proboscis Cernos killed, some enemies, outside of the tentacles. So it turns out that Hydroid killed fewer or as many enemies as Khora and Nekros, but still got more resources.

I'm not imposing my opinion on you, I'm showing you the facts I got. If you like playing Khora, play Khora. If you like playing Hydroid, play Hydroid. If you like playing Nekros, play Nekros. And so on. I'm showing you stats to make you understand that Hydroid doesn't lose its ability to farm resources even with the addition of Khora.

[Venus-Venera]

privet,
I've tried all 3. in the group nothing comes close to nekros.
khora and hydroid is nonsense because quick kills are not possible.

I looked at the reddit stuff: the boy has no idea about the game and he's playing SOLO! he's playing loot warframe SOLO! really now.....
because in the past i often farmed resources and nothing works here without top aoe warframes like saryn! because that's the only way to get 1000+ kills in 5 min on sp. with top support warframes of course much more.

[vanaukas]

I like my 70m Nekros, I don't care about "efficency" on random drops.

[trst]

Of course Hydroid would be "better" as Pilfering can guarantee extra loot rolls where Desecrate always has a chance to fail.

But Nekros is still technically better because Desecrate works on all enemies where Pilfering only works on enemies killed while being held by his Tentacles. Do the same test with a group that sticks near you and you ought to find Nekros resulting in more loot.

While the other looting frames have similar restrictions and Khora/Atlas can't guarantee loot rolls (well Atlas can but it requires 400% strength).

But yes, for solo farming Hydroid would be the most efficient. But for organized farming you'd want both Hydroid and Nekros as they can both loot the same enemies.

[Zabyr]

20 минут назад, Venus-Venera сказал:

privet,

Здоров ✋

21 минуту назад, Venus-Venera сказал:

khora and hydroid is nonsense because quick kills are not possible.

21 минуту назад, Venus-Venera сказал:

saryn! because that's the only way to get 1000+ kills in 5 min

Nekros has a ~2 second delay between death and desecration, and he can't get resources from everyone at once. At the same time, a certain number of corpses can lie on the map, and if it is exceeded, then the oldest bodies will despawn to make room for new ones, regardless of their remaining time.

[Numerikuu]

3 minutes ago, Venus-Venera said:

privet,
I've tried all 3. in the group nothing comes close to nekros.
khora and hydroid is nonsense because quick kills are not possible.

I looked at the reddit stuff: the boy has no idea about the game and he's playing SOLO! he's playing loot warframe SOLO! really now.....
because in the past i often farmed resources and nothing works here without top aoe warframes like saryn! because that's the only way to get 1000+ kills in 5 min on sp. with top support warframes of course much more.

Gotta agree that Nekros is best when in a group, especially in a pug group. You'll probably be on the move, something that Hydroid and Khora cannot compete with since their loot abilities require them to stay put. Unless you get a rare pug group like I did yesterday (SP, I was Hydroid and there was a Khora, we combined our powers while everyone stayed put and nuked the tentacle dome), or make a premade that will stay put, then you're gonna have a bad time trying to use those looting abilities. 9/10 times in a pug the group will split off, disrupting the flow of enemies as a result, or see the train of enemies heading for your Swarm/Strangledome and kill them all before they can be primed.

As for Khora and Hydroid not being able to kill quick though...... yeah... you don't play either, do you 🤣 Khora can nuke with her whip, while Hydroid relies more on his weapon loadout and Tenno which is basically no different than Nekros who also relies on his loadout.

Personally, if I ever do need resources, I use Hydroid. If I'm gonna farm then I want to enjoy doing so.

[Venus-Venera]

vor 17 Minuten schrieb Zabyr:

Здоров ✋

Nekros has a ~2 second delay between death and desecration, and he can't get resources from everyone at once. At the same time, a certain number of corpses can lie on the map, and if it is exceeded, then the oldest bodies will despawn to make room for new ones, regardless of their remaining time.

mobility and very high aura range clears away all alleged disadvantages. because it is camped in a large room with many doors.
in addition, nekros can be used in new bounties. even in pub groups he is MUCH better than the other 2.

[Uhkretor]

... I already know I farm better so...

[Venus-Venera]

vor 37 Minuten schrieb LeoniePiggy:

Why are we having this discussion? Just don't gatekeep people of what they like to play what the heck O.o

since when do opinions influence the way you play? or should i not play frost now because some joker is writing something?

[(PSN)slightconfuzzled]

I am personally a big proponent of people playing what they find more/most enjoyable. I myself prefer rotating a lot through the roster of Warframe's and weaponry. Meaning a lot of the time I am off meta. 

I'm also big on statistics. I also highly appreciate and commend it when people test, measure, record data and try to use it as a basis for knowledge and criteria/fact based observations. As opposed to just randomly claiming truths based off common sense or personal opinion disguised as reason. I think this thread and the Reddit one are interesting! That being said, the first thing I always think about when thinking about statistics, is that most people are bad at statistics. Naturally bad, as in takes effort, education and skill to get better at analysing, interpreting, knowing how to frame and present stats meaningfully. Compiling too mind you. 

So some of the choices for testing/comparison are curious. 

For example, the decision for the kill tally to be the same? So is the idea that you are looking for the Warframe with the better looting/farming of resources by the same kills? Like another reply points out, this will favour Warframe's who have abilities have higher percentage based abilities. Its a reasonable variable to measure and go off... its just not the only one. For example, if you just limited it to time, but not kills, then certain Warframes that may kill faster, could make up that difference. There are going to also be a lot of other variables too. Like, say hypothetically, 100 runs of Hydroid with a Vectis Prime vs 100 runs of Hydroid with a Kuva Bramma. In a Survival. Who loots better? 

I don't fling mud at Hydroid or any Warframe, or any player or fan of any Warframe, nor do I think Warframes replace each other in that way. I can see why many would consider Khora or Nekros a better loot frame, if they think those Warframe's have certain advantages that Hydroid doesn't. That doesn't mean Hydroid is inherently bad or sucks or etc A lot of former Khora fans, aren't as big a fan of her after some of her whip claw LOS changes/nerfs from a while back. That being said Whipclaw is very powerful and potent and can work well with Strangledome. Hydroid doesn't really have an ability synergy like that. Both Khora and Hydroid can suffer on certain maps with their abilities interaction with the map, though again this can be potentially mitigated by weapon choice (like a potent AOE weapon for example...).

Also 10 hours (Reddit post) can seem like a lot of time, for an individual, to gather data, but... eh... its not really a lot as far as the amount of variables involved with such comparisons. There wasn't much mention of play style issues, weapon choices, modding, builds, maps, and other issues around variables, like talking about methodology, reasoning for highlighting certain variables to control, and just a lot of other issues, that all ultimately help give context. Again though, there are interesting points and its better than a lot of players who just make up stuff... Also to be clear, sometimes this is more just for casual fun. After all as individuals who probably have other stuff going on... not very realistic to expect statistics on the level of a scientific team. 

That all also being said, and again, if you prefer one Warframe over another for an activity, that is way more important... a lot of people probably intuitively consider Khora/Nekros the better looter/farmer if they **feel** better, and much of that may have to do with either their overall kill efficiency or mechanics. Nyx is one of my favourite Warframes. Not very popular. I am happy when I see other people playing Nyx. One time, I was helping a friend farm SE in a Survival, they happened to have a Nyx Invigoration, it was range... they made a very long range build and my own build was good, but I needed to group enemies to kill fast... our synergy was really bad. That can apply in general in lots of situations. 

Good work though too, in both outlining goals, keeping records, etc oh and yeah my sympathy about the amount of people that are overly harsh towards Hydroid/Hydroid players too. That sucks. 

[Defion]

I used to love Hydroid for farming till they nerfed him to drop more ammo and credits when nekro prime got released, plus hydroid doesnt really work proper unless your host.

Nekros is decent enough is you use him proper (fun fact:  cutting a enemy in half with high slash weapon can often result in loot from both body parts).

Khora suffers less from not being host i suppose, but I just dont really like using her as I find her ugly.

I personly prefer going with one of my decent dps frame's that work great when your able to funnel enemys through a small corridor like Protea, excal, (use to be vauban aswell but he also got nerfed so his turret balls are S#&$ as they dont scale proper anymore). and nidus. Also I always make sure to make good use of taunt mods especialy against infested.

 

PS. If you really serious about the loot thing, you would look at the stats at the end of a mission about the amount of loot pick-ups cause thats wat really counts then.

[taiiat]

Tentacle Swarm is better as long as all Enemies are susceptible to the Abilitys' requirement and/or it's able to Kill the Enemies and/or Et Cetera.
in practice though, it's often not as practical because of that. 

but why choose just one, anyways? if one really wanted to grind hard, they'd have a Nekros, an Ivara, and one of the others, all working together.

[Venus-Venera]

Gerade eben schrieb taiiat:

Tentacle Swarm is better as long as all Enemies are susceptible to the Abilitys' requirement and/or it's able to Kill the Enemies and/or Et Cetera.
in practice though, it's often not as practical because of that. 

but why choose just one, anyways? if one really wanted to grind hard, they'd have a Nekros, an Ivara, and one of the others, all working together.

I agree. reality looks different.
Statistics on paper means nothing either. and 10 hours is a joke. especially solo. and solo the whole thing looks different, because it's about 55% vs 100% chance and damage in a small area. So it's just embarrassing what he's doing and it's exactly such jokers that confuse new players.

and in the end, loot warframe doesn't matter because only new players need it and important resources can only be doubled with boosters. or drop chance is needed.
rest comes on the side if the game is fun.

[Drasiel]

Really the only frame that's bad at looting that has a loot ability is Atlas. His ore gaze is a PITA to get enough power strength to get reliable drops, you can't increase the angle it affects only the length of the beam, You have to have high duration because the extra loot only occurs when you kill them while they are still statues, and worst of all the animation to turn them into statues is too long to use in anything but a solo game because other players will kill them before you can finish casting wasting your energy and getting no extra loot.

outside of never picking atlas every loot frame works well enough that unless you are hyper optimizing it doesn't matter what people pick. You can even still use atlas if you really want to and all the luck to you if you do.

[Slayer-.]

7 hours ago, vanaukas said:

I like my 70m Nekros, I don't care about "efficency" on random drops.

I just use Despoil on my 70m Nekros best forma I've ever used in an Aura slot. lol

-----------

I use what suits the mission either Nekros or Khora, Hydroid is one frame I don't really play so cannot gauge the usefulness of it, at least with Nekros and Khora you can kill fairly quickly.

[Raarsi]

Love how this doesn't factor in that Petrify from Atlas is his helminth ability, so you could potentially get more loot via Ore Gaze.

[Slayer-.]

3 minutes ago, Raarsi said:

Love how this doesn't factor in that Petrify from Atlas is his helminth ability, so you could potentially get more loot via Ore Gaze.

On Khora that'd be three Augment mods equipped. 

[Raarsi]

4 minutes ago, Slayer-. said:

On Khora that'd be three Augment mods equipped. 

And on Hydroid, that'd be enough Augment mods equipped to make you question life choices. 😁

[RichardKam]

Everyone is asking how Hydroid farms, but no one is asking how Hydroid feels.

Dear Hydroid, you are doing great. I love you. I am proud of you. God bless you.

[Numerikuu]

4 hours ago, RichardKam said:

Everyone is asking how Hydroid farms, but no one is asking how Hydroid feels.

Dear Hydroid, you are doing great. I love you. I am proud of you. God bless you.

Despite needing some tweaks and fixes, he's doing fine. The recent Focus School rework opened some much needed doors for him 😎

[(PSN)Madurai-Prime]

Putting roar on hydroid is a guaranteed kill for most low level enemies. Whatever it doesn't grab you just cast it again.

The only people that actually need to farm with loot frames are new players anyway.

I've helped a few new people farm Hexanon for wisp and hydroid will get them hundreds in a short amount of time. 

[LillyRaccune]

I still promote non-kill-farming. So instead of survival/interception/disruption where the farming is dependant on how many you kill, you use high-range Limbo, Gauss, or Xaku to open containers in capture/exterminate/sabotage missions. One benefit is time, because you can still complete missions in less than 5 minutes and do not need to commit to a minimum of 20-30 minutes of hoard killing.

[(PSN)Unstar]

The frame that farms the best is the frame you have the best time playing while farming.

Your farm might take twice as long, but if you dislike playing as (insert farm frame here), then for both your enjoyment and your mental health you should probably play as a different frame.  So if you enjoy Hydroid, farm with Hydroid.  If you enjoy Nekros, play Nekros.  Etc.  And if you enjoy none of them farmers, then play what brings you joy.  Because so much of Warframe is farming, and that means you're going to have a bad time if you approach farming as something to speed through at the cost of enjoyment.

[Zabyr]

45 минут назад, (PSN)Unstar сказал:

The frame that farms the best is the frame you have the best time playing while farming.

Your farm might take twice as long, but if you dislike playing as (insert farm frame here), then for both your enjoyment and your mental health you should probably play as a different frame.  So if you enjoy Hydroid, farm with Hydroid.  If you enjoy Nekros, play Nekros.  Etc.  And if you enjoy none of them farmers, then play what brings you joy.  Because so much of Warframe is farming, and that means you're going to have a bad time if you approach farming as something to speed through at the cost of enjoyment.

В яблочко!

[Zabyr]

В 12.03.2023 в 22:27, Skoomaseller сказал:

Your test is a bit flawed. In the first place you shouldn't have a kill limit – this obviously favours Hydroid, as Pilfering Swarm's drop chance is 100%. A more accurate test would be time limit, and with a proper farming squad (not necessary) with no kill restriction. I have a good feeling that, with proper build, Khora will end up farming more. 

@Skoomaseller 📝 You wanted better statistics. Especially for you, I made "no kill limit".

- I highlighted the key resources for which I went on missions, and how much each Warframe extracted them, and in what quantity. -

 

Normal levels:

Uranus - Ophelia:

Saturn - Titan:

 

The Steel Path:

Uranus - Ophelia:

Saturn - Titan: