Why the community division?

[(XBOX)Ampathetiic]

1 hour ago, (PSN)isbergen said:

Because some people (include devs) refuse to accept that Warframe (as designed) is not an MMO or skill-based rogue-like or whatever other category there is. It's a horde shooter.

You do realize that the developers are the people who make the game, right? They don't have to accept what the game is; they can change it to be what they want it to be. If you don't like the kind of game that Warframe is (or is becoming), you might just have to accept that your interests don't align with what the developers and the community want.

[TARINunit9]

2 hours ago, Champagne_23 said:

Why are people so selfish in a PVE game for actually no reason at all?

Warframe requires an extreme level of grinding, to the point where being able to play without skill is a reward for the grind. This turns into something called abnegation, which in layman's terms is a gameplay loop allowing the player to relax and minimizing intense focus

The AoE nerf has resulted in a slight but noticeable decrease in abnegation while simultaneously increasing time spent in each mission for some players

Basically many users have to spend more effort for the same result, in a game where that result might just be another roll on the drop table. This, combined with many new brainstorming strategies coming out that supposedly invalidate the nerfs (there's been some development in max range Xaku) is leading those disgruntled users to exclaim the update is pointless and they would be better served just rolling the nerfs back

[Finlaena]

1 hour ago, AbyssalSerpent said:

Because some people act like smart-alecks thinking everyone who's mad about the update is mad about either the Wukong nerf or about AoE, when not all us Wukong players were lazy-afk'ers like they believe (I personally don't mind the nerf since I'm glad DE didn't touch his 2nd ability), that DE gutted most AoE and pseudo-AoE weapons (like the Amprex, Vermisplicer Primary and the Kuva Nukor) without adressing the core issue, that being this game being too horde shootery even though it was never this bad before mid-2017, and DE gutting ammo drop rates and unnecessarily nerfing the Merciless Arcanes, which in the process destroyed non-"meta" weapons that people used for fun such as the Kuva Seer, the Euphona Prime and the Twin Grakatas, just to name a few.

Look, I may slag on the Wukong players that have been bellyaching about the nerf, but I do feel legitimately bad for the Wukong players that *didn’t* abuse the Celestial Twin skill.

It’s a classic case of a few rotten apples spoiling the barrel for everyone else, which is unfortunate. A necessary change depending on who you ask -I won’t be sorry to no longer have squads of deadweight monke men do absolutely nothing while I and another player do the heavy lifting in non-Exterminate/Defense nodes- but an unfortunate one for the legitimate Wukong mains that play him fairly. 

[kamisama85]

4 hours ago, Champagne_23 said:

This is just a bad update- aoe nerf, not needed ammo rework, merciless nerf, battery weapons crippled, operator propa nerf, glaive prime nerf, archon hunts are low efort sorties and arbi combined, and rushed content for no reason..

Yet here I am with my Stahlta living the single target and AOE life simultaneously and it couldn't be better. You know there are many combo weapons that didn't get axed living the life of both worlds right?

[Spe_de_mix]

29 minutes ago, (NSW)Finlaena said:

Look, I may slag on the Wukong players that have been bellyaching about the nerf, but I do feel legitimately bad for the Wukong players that *didn’t* abuse the Celestial Twin skill.

Sry but this makes zero sense to me.

 

If a Wukong player wasn't abusing the Celestial Twin mechanics then the Celestial Twin changes should have minimal impact on their playstyle right?

[AzureScion]

3 hours ago, (NSW)Finlaena said:

Its a classic case of a few rotten apples spoiling the barrel for everyone else, which is unfortunate. A necessary change depending on who you ask -I won’t be sorry to no longer have squads of deadweight monke men do absolutely nothing while I and another player do the heavy lifting in non-Exterminate/Defense nodes- but an unfortunate one for the legitimate Wukong mains that play him fairly. 

In this case it's "the barrels of rotten apples spoiling the few that aren't". I'm willing to bet you there are more afk Wukongs than there are genuine Wukong players. 

[Champagne_23]

1 hour ago, AzureScion said:

In this case it's "the barrels of rotten apples spoiling the few that aren't". I'm willing to bet you there are more afk Wukongs than there are genuine Wukong players. 

Now, leaving the meme aside which people must've be taking seriously at this point about wukong which is hilarious, did you really encountered them in missions doing nothing in a corner? because I, in over 2000k hours, honestly don't remember doing so. Were they on solo? Disrupting the gameplay there?

[TARINunit9]

1 hour ago, AzureScion said:

In this case it's "the barrels of rotten apples spoiling the few that aren't". I'm willing to bet you there are more afk Wukongs than there are genuine Wukong players. 

Wukong's problems run a lot deeper than just AFK vs not-AFK.

I do not like his extra lives mechanic, either in lore or in gameplay. It's a passive that can be spent but not regenerated (they buffed Vazarin for exactly this reason), it produces terrible habits in new players, and it doesn't even match its own numbers (FIVE paths to immortality gives THREE lives)

Cloud Walker is both really fun and too strong, which is a hard decision to make. Do you nerf something that's really fun? And no that's not a metaphor for the AoE changes yesterday.

Actually on that note, Celestial Twin has the same problem: it's really cool but so overpowered you didn't even need to play the game. That clearly needed a nerf, I'm just not sure they nerfed it correctly yet

[MutoManiac]

6 hours ago, BR31 said:

it seems that a nerf part of community is a minority.

That's what I said and some d!ck called me stupid. Which I may be, but nobody calls me that 😉

[PhxRising123Prime]

10 hours ago, Champagne_23 said:

Why is the community divided between single target and aoe and in favor of the update and against it? This was a nice and chill community and now it's just divided. With each update, everything is going downhill.

I really liked the bramma because it's an explosive shooting arrow, you can't tell me this is not metal af and it was efficient at clearing stuff because OF THE GAME CONTENT. Single targets have a place in my heart too for their sheer damage that some can pack. (just look a knell prime. LOOK AT IT)
If single target would've got nerfed i would not be celebrating because some people now are forced to adapt and their investment in those weapons may be big. (formas, potatoes, time, rivens, endo). Imagine griding all these kuva and tenet weapons and max them out so you can receive a few formas and some potatoes so you will cry less..

Why are people so selfish in a PVE game for actually no reason at all?

This is just a bad update- aoe nerf, not needed ammo rework, merciless nerf, battery weapons crippled, operator propa nerf, glaive prime nerf, archon hunts are low efort sorties and arbi combined, and rushed content for no reason..

Unless you post an unpopular opinion or idea, then the video game elitists come out. 

[AzureScion]

3 hours ago, Champagne_23 said:

Now, leaving the meme aside which people must've be taking seriously at this point about wukong which is hilarious, did you really encountered them in missions doing nothing in a corner? because I, in over 2000k hours, honestly don't remember doing so. Were they on solo? Disrupting the gameplay there?

You want to know my personal experience? Lich murmur fights. Defense mission. Teams of 3 Wukongs and me. Sometimes a Lich with rad proc would appear, proccing their clone with radiation which turns them hostile, then starts barraging the other teammates AND the objective, if they happen to be close by (which in most case they are). So what happens next is of course predictable: clone barrage the hell out of us with Zarr over 100k damage, we die, and them, not being in the game, of course don't revive us, leaving us to revive on our own, most of the times end up using all 4 because we can't escape their Zarr, the lich isn't gonna die anytime soon because nobody is killing them, and the rad procs continue so the clone is permanently rad procc'd. Same goes with Radiation Hazard sorties. This forces me to bring Oberon every single time I want to play public lich defense missions which technically should help, but it slows down the wave killing because I can't use my Saryn to speed things up and the Wukongs ain't gonna leave the pod anyway so they're limited to the immediate vicinity. 

Some other examples which aren't as disruptive include survival missions - which can actually be helpful were it not for them sitting still at spawn and not moving to where everyone else is so we can bottleneck the enemies from a fortified position. 

Also Eidolon hunts. When I started tackling Eidolon hunts (which is pretty recent) I can't tell you how many times I've encountered a team of 3 Wukongs trying to hunt an Eidolon with an Ignis Wraith or Kuva Bramma. 

I play in Asia. It is more likely for you to meet a team of 3 Wukongs than it is to meet a team without Wukongin here. And I'm not even exaggerating.

[RichardKam]

10小时前 , BR31 说:

Do ingame surveys and we'll see.
For now it's just speculations, but according to the recent overall feedback and steam reviewbombing:
it seems that a nerf part of community is a minority.

If you look at the recent steam reviewbombing "comments", you will notice that 99% of them share a common mindset and.....use of words......(reading them is entertaining, btw)

What they want from Warframe can be boiled down to mindless left click and big explosion and tiny dose of dopamine. If you take away the entire arsenal, focus school, companions, and just left them with Monkey Prime and k.Zarr, they won't even notice because they don't care to use them. But if you slightly touch these two gears, they go reviewbombing and rage quit.

 

[AzureTerra]

The community has always been a herd of kavats, impossible to predict where its going at any given time.

[Marvelous_A]

12 hours ago, (PSN)isbergen said:

Because some people (include devs) refuse to accept that Warframe (as designed) is not an MMO or skill-based rogue-like or whatever other category there is. It's a horde shooter. If everyone could agree on this there would be no division. Instead you have people whining about skill and the devs then attempting to inject "skill" into the game by taking away your warframe/void powers (TNW -- looking at you) or making "bosses" invulnerable bullet sponges with mission modifiers that take some of your abilities away.

Aiming and ammo management belong to skill-based rogue-like games? Is walking and thinking happen to be really difficult to you too? Cause you seem having difficulties grasping the 101 of doing things.

[RichardKam]

4小时前 , TARINunit9 说:

Wukong's problems run a lot deeper than just AFK vs not-AFK.

I do not like his extra lives mechanic, either in lore or in gameplay. It's a passive that can be spent but not regenerated (they buffed Vazarin for exactly this reason), it produces terrible habits in new players, and it doesn't even match its own numbers (FIVE paths to immortality gives THREE lives)

Cloud Walker is both really fun and too strong, which is a hard decision to make. Do you nerf something that's really fun? And no that's not a metaphor for the AoE changes yesterday.

Actually on that note, Celestial Twin has the same problem: it's really cool but so overpowered you didn't even need to play the game. That clearly needed a nerf, I'm just not sure they nerfed it correctly yet

May I take this chance to further elaborate what's wrong with Monkey.

His 1 is the only continuous damage output ability in this game that requires zero energy to upkeep, has infinite duration, and is an aimbot.

His 2 is a combination of invulnerability, invisibility, intangibility (bypass laser), CC, healing, healing his 1 (further duration), status cleansing, 360 degree high speed movement, all-in-one package, at 25 energy cost.

[Tyreaus]

"Why the community division?"

Reads the first two posts.

Hmm, yes, I wonder... Baffling, quite.

[0_The_F00l]

Let's just acknowledge these points first 

1) The community is not a hive mind , each players has his own reasons to play the game and has preference and dislikes accordingly.

2) The community is not as rosy as you may think , largely the community is indifferent , it's again individuals that react based on whatever change or issue is currently being faced.

3) Calling others selfish ,cause they don't enjoy your playstyle, is hypocrisy, try to avoid it. Yours is not the only right way to play , and any disruptions to other players should be avoided.

4) This game is made by DE , it is not a democracy , even if it was requested by majority of players DE will still do only what DE feels like doing. Let's not try to blame people for having opinions.

[Prexades]

I hated the Bramma from day 1. It's particle explosions blinding everyone in the team and how the bows AoE made everyone else basically redundant. Even more so when I got put into teams with all Wukong/Bramma users. It wasn't the Warframe I used to enjoy and ironically the AoE spammer often argue too that Warframe is not fun (anymore), therefore they are entitled to easy 90% afk mode.

A nerf was very long overdue and if you can adapt your playstyle, switch weapons and actually aim some times you will hardly notice any difference.

[Currilicious]

14 hours ago, Corvid said:

Indeed, I too wonder why AOE users are selfish enough to ruin the gameplay experience of others.

I came here to play Warframe, not a walking simulator.

Lol this savagery is only rivaled by its timing.

[Skoomaseller]

15 hours ago, Champagne_23 said:

Why is the community divided between single target and aoe and in favor of the update and against it? This was a nice and chill community and now it's just divided. With each update, everything is going downhill.

I really liked the bramma because it's an explosive shooting arrow, you can't tell me this is not metal af and it was efficient at clearing stuff because OF THE GAME CONTENT. Single targets have a place in my heart too for their sheer damage that some can pack. (just look a knell prime. LOOK AT IT)
If single target would've got nerfed i would not be celebrating because some people now are forced to adapt and their investment in those weapons may be big. (formas, potatoes, time, rivens, endo). Imagine griding all these kuva and tenet weapons and max them out so you can receive a few formas and some potatoes so you will cry less..

Why are people so selfish in a PVE game for actually no reason at all?

This is just a bad update- aoe nerf, not needed ammo rework, merciless nerf, battery weapons crippled, operator propa nerf, glaive prime nerf, archon hunts are low efort sorties and arbi combined, and rushed content for no reason..

I believe battery weapon ammo nerfs are being reverted so that's good I guess.

Honestly the community being wholesome is just surface level. Discussing things that relate to game health etc and the ugly side really shows its face.

In my opinion they really should start reworking the other two physical statuses. A lot of the ballistic/bullet hose based weapons (think Quellor primary fire, Prisma Gorgon etc) have IPS, but if isn't slash heavy it's not that good. 

Bandaids like Hemorrhage aren't the solution to making ST weapons better.

The recent headshot multiplier is a good change but it just isn't enough.

Puncture and Impact need to be reworked to be as powerful as slash.

[Finlaena]

6 hours ago, RichardKam said:

If you look at the recent steam reviewbombing "comments", you will notice that 99% of them share a common mindset and.....use of words......(reading them is entertaining, btw)

What they want from Warframe can be boiled down to mindless left click and big explosion and tiny dose of dopamine. If you take away the entire arsenal, focus school, companions, and just left them with Monkey Prime and k.Zarr, they won't even notice because they don't care to use them. But if you slightly touch these two gears, they go reviewbombing and rage quit.

 

Majority of the review bombs are coming from from the Asia region, which as someone mentioned above, has a major AFK Wukong problem and perhaps the big reason why he was nerfed in the first place. Considering they are… passionate about certain games (the Genshin Impact players there can make the Western fan base look docile in comparison, and I’ll leave it at that) it doesn’t surprise me they’re going ballistic over the Wukong nerf in particular.

[Blaudari]

Its because this time the AoE needed the nerf after the dev team showed the laziness side of explosive weapon users & that they weren't playing the game at all. if your gonna play the game, play the game. Also genuinely, i think its because the lazy life isn't being catered too. that part i don't actually know.

[SneakyErvin]

13 hours ago, TARINunit9 said:

Wukong's problems run a lot deeper than just AFK vs not-AFK.

I do not like his extra lives mechanic, either in lore or in gameplay. It's a passive that can be spent but not regenerated (they buffed Vazarin for exactly this reason), it produces terrible habits in new players, and it doesn't even match its own numbers (FIVE paths to immortality gives THREE lives)

Cloud Walker is both really fun and too strong, which is a hard decision to make. Do you nerf something that's really fun? And no that's not a metaphor for the AoE changes yesterday.

Actually on that note, Celestial Twin has the same problem: it's really cool but so overpowered you didn't even need to play the game. That clearly needed a nerf, I'm just not sure they nerfed it correctly yet

Let's not get to litteral on his theme, he is in the end not Wukong, he is a frame called Wukong since his theme is based on Wukong. Themes are never accurate, or remotely accurate, which is why we have things like Loki, Oberon and Titania that are very far from their theme when you look at it. I highly doubt Titania is running around with massive machinegun pistols in A Midsummer Nights Dream, and I dont think Oberon is depicted as a deer druid dude cow paladin either. Loki has some deception theme going in his skills, but more in the veins of the Marvel butchery of the actual god. Stealth, teleports, decoys, what? A Loki frame should probably have an exalted melee, ability to fly and potentially confuse his surroundings along with some form of shapeshift.

[Surbusken]

Only one side is flaming, belittling and raging.

I guess it's in the spirit of the times, that people want a safespace, and feel the world should conform to what they are offended by.

 

None of it has anything to do with AOE or 'game balance' though.

My main thing is nerfing items people spend time and money on. And the top items at that, trying to sell new items, looks like a cash grab to me,

At minimum a refund for forma, reactor, time wasted etc. but really, why should other people pick up the bill for those people's problems?

 

Just create a 'karen game mode' script, where those people can play with singleshot weapons only, instead of ruining the whole game for everyone.

 

For wukong, same deal. You can't let him sit for 4 years, then after people invest their time and money, you delete that content.

Outside the more immediate reaction, nerfs just create apathy long-term.

It's simply impossible to get attached to anything when it's just randomly deleted, cannot care about the game then.

Especially in game, that is so grind heavy, it's now asking you to accept it's all meaningless, nothing has any worth.

 

[Prexades]

vor 35 Minuten schrieb Surbusken:

Only one side is flaming, belittling and raging.

I guess it's in the spirit of the times, that people want a safespace, and feel the world should conform to what they are offended by.

 

None of it has anything to do with AOE or 'game balance' though.

My main thing is nerfing items people spend time and money on. And the top items at that, trying to sell new items, looks like a cash grab to me,

At minimum a refund for forma, reactor, time wasted etc. but really, why should other people pick up the bill for those people's problems?

 

Just create a 'karen game mode' script, where those people can play with singleshot weapons only, instead of ruining the whole game for everyone.

 

For wukong, same deal. You can't let him sit for 4 years, then after people invest their time and money, you delete that content.

Outside the more immediate reaction, nerfs just create apathy long-term.

It's simply impossible to get attached to anything when it's just randomly deleted, cannot care about the game then.

Especially in game, that is so grind heavy, it's now asking you to accept it's all meaningless, nothing has any worth.

 

and you disqualified yourself with every sentence. Calling people who dont want to use a trio of meta AoE spam weapons Karens is disgusting.

I also still have Wukong in my inventory, even if I never use him, so no content was deleted. If you are salty that the game requires you to do a bit more than just rushing for the exit while spamming AoE, then by all means.. leave.