Archon Hunts Midcore player experience (Rant)

[nslay]

You don't even need to one-shot the Archons... just bring a sentinel with a 100% Cold status weapon like Verglas, Cryotra or Artax. This will slow an Archon so much that you can kill it before it even makes its first move! Fancy one-shotting setups are completely unnecessary! But you do at least want appropriate and powerful multi-shot weapons like shotguns to pull this off.

Someone with a hardened Taxon/Artax (Artax gives guaranteed cold procs) and a good shotgun can probably beat Archon hunts solo in 5 minutes too! Well, never tried that... I bring Dethcube or Oxylus with Verglas and a Felarx shotgun with a basic Revenant with no Helminth stuff. I'll try it with Taxon/Artax next time.

[(NSW)Free_Aetharus]

On 2023-08-31 at 7:06 PM, Julican said:

So after 6 hours of attempting to get an Archon kill, trying both solo and in a squad, I can officially say that Archon Hunts ARE #*!%ING HARD, I have great mods but holy #*!% why is this fight unnecessarily tedious

Why is the Archon getting tickled by my 5 forma'ed weapons?

Why does the Archon have random invulnerable windows?

Why is there a cap on the status stacks?

Why does the Archon keep healing?

Why is dying extremely punishing?

Why am I punished for my squad mates' mistakes?

Why are NONE of the Warframe abilities working on the boss?

Why are there add phases?

Why are almost ALL the enemies Eximus?

Why are objectively weak Warframes getting a bonus in health and damage?

 

I don't care who exploited this fight and when they did so DE "had" to buff the fight

I don't care if the top 0.02% would get bored if this fight was made more reasonable

I don't care which Twitch stream that no-lifed this game thinks about content

 

This crap needs a nerf in any capacity, I don't even care how they nerf it but at this point; I will take anything

Or...

you can learn how to fight them properly.

You can avoid single-shot weapons and learn to use multi-hit and how to mod properly.

You can learn what damage attenuation is. It's not that your weapons are strong, it's that your weapons are redundant to their resistances. You're throwing bricks at a brick wall.

[(PSN)Unstar]

On 2023-09-03 at 5:19 AM, (XBOX)Player244024418 said:

On 2023-09-01 at 4:03 PM, (PSN)Unstar said:

I use a heavy attack build

Silly question from a MR30 but a build like this does, or does not, need to build combo count first, to be effective? I duplicated this on my azothane and didn't worry about building combo, went into ESO and the blue shield eximus were still standing after three heavy attacks, then i shot them dead. 

The specific build I listed is intended to be used without any normal attacks, so no, there's no need to build combo.  Due to their hardiness Eximi can take a few hits (and once you gauge that they have an adequate amount of Slash procs, you can leave them for dead even when they're still standing).  If you prefer a gun that's valid, but I dig the nearly 360 degree 6x Slash proc attack as it means I can just jump into a crowd and take them out without doing anything like aiming.

[Kaggelos]

I understand your frustration. Here are my thoughts;

On 2023-09-01 at 4:06 AM, Julican said:

Archon Hunts ARE #*!%ING HARD

Yes, because its endgame territory.

On 2023-09-01 at 4:06 AM, Julican said:

Why is the Archon getting tickled by my 5 forma'ed weapons?

 

We gotta use the right tool for the right job. Also, Archons use a mechanic called Damage Attenuation (my headcanon is that it makes sense since he's a sentient enemy, therefore can adapt).

On 2023-09-01 at 4:06 AM, Julican said:

Why does the Archon have random invulnerable windows?

 

I'd hardly call them random. They are for the most part, if not always telegraphed.

On 2023-09-01 at 4:06 AM, Julican said:

Why is there a cap on the status stacks?

Why does the Archon keep healing?

Cause they're Bosses. Basicaly cause they can.

On 2023-09-01 at 4:06 AM, Julican said:

Why is dying extremely punishing?

 

Again, endgame, therefore increased difficulty and stakes.

On 2023-09-01 at 4:06 AM, Julican said:

Why am I punished for my squad mates' mistakes?

 

This is a matter of team cohesion, what each member brings to the fight, how good they are etc. their, or your mistakes have an impact to the rest of the team. It is the nature of co-op games. And if they make mistakes, as a teammate, you're obligated to help them and carry the burden of those who find it hard. 

On 2023-09-01 at 4:06 AM, Julican said:

Why are NONE of the Warframe abilities working on the boss?

 

Again, Boss. Can do whatever it wants. They stronk.

On 2023-09-01 at 4:06 AM, Julican said:

Why are there add phases?

 

Additional phases to the Bossfight i presume? Because from a pacing and tension perspective, there need to be highs and lows in a mission. Same even applies to storytelling, as well as level design in videogames (there's a video that details how Bioware made the Cure the Genophage mission based on narrative structure).

On 2023-09-01 at 4:06 AM, Julican said:

Why are almost ALL the enemies Eximus?

 

Personal, subjective opinion incoming;

Ah yes, my favorite enemy types in the game!

No, really. They are the only "normal" enemies that offer an actual modicum of challenge (LR2, 5 year player here). Easy to counter, hard to take down. Chef's kiss.

On 2023-09-01 at 4:06 AM, Julican said:

Why are objectively weak Warframes getting a bonus in health and damage?

 

First time hearing this. If anyone knows something i dont, please tell me.

 

Final thoughts;

There are obstacles that can be overcome with luck, or patience, research, or practice. This is a matter of practice and research. And maybe sometimes trial and error. 

 

^{Basically Git Gud, but less condescendingly and elitist}

 

Good luck Tenno. 

[Tiltskillet]

13 minutes ago, Kaggelos said:

First time hearing this. If anyone knows something i dont, please tell me.

Probably talking about the Arbitration style specific frame bonus in Archon Hunts.

Which is random or weighted random, and not  limited to weak frames.  Though conceivably it could be weighted toward less popular frames or ones that are less used by that individual.

[Kaggelos]

7 minutes ago, Tiltskillet said:

Probably talking about the Arbitration style specific frame bonus in Archon Hunts.

Which is random or weighted random, and not  limited to weak frames.  Though conceivably it could be weighted toward less popular frames or ones that are less used by that individual.

Oh yeah right, makes sense, ty ^^

[(PSN)Nelsconey]

6 Hours???

 

You can run Pub Archon Hunts on PSN and be done in 15-20  minutes. 

[(NSW)jhj82]

Archon sortie is a gear check. The archon itself can be easily taken down with felarx/kuva hek or other high pellet weapons (built for dmg and radiation) to bypass the attenuation. Pair with roar/madurai's 1 and they'll be 1-2 shotted. 

Edited September 5, 2023 by (NSW)jhj82

[ChaoticEdge]

U think archon hunts is annoying, try Kahl's mission, repeat get depressed and become the greatest side character never going to get loved like clem.  They aren't being told their side of the story more for we just ditch like the other character.  *sigh* I wonder the dev even cares about Archon Hunts or why they don't want to continue the with how these archons that keep coming back or knowing how they made the crystal explain lore.  I guess void magic weed keeping this stone moving.

[quxier]

On 2023-09-01 at 3:06 AM, Julican said:

 

Why does the Archon have random invulnerable windows?

Why is there a cap on the status stacks?

Why does the Archon keep healing?

Bullet sponge aside, why it's so weird that bosses fights back? It may not be perfect but it's reasonable.

On 2023-09-01 at 3:06 AM, Julican said:

Why is dying extremely punishing?

Because some people find it "challenging". It's not. Without any Focus school or Inaros/Sevagoth there is no way to revive yourself (solo at least). Random bullet killed you? OH, snap, I've learned a lot. Let's pick immortal frame so nothing can touch me. I like experimenting but Archon are just meant to be tedious.

On 2023-09-01 at 3:06 AM, Julican said:

Why are almost ALL the enemies Eximus?

And why there is armor boost? To give you more challenge. Sadly it's overtuned.

 

On 2023-09-01 at 8:57 AM, (PSN)slightconfuzzled said:

 

A Warframe with good survivability isn't absolutely necessary, but will help you learn and practice the fight, make it feel easier then over time you can experiment and change it up, possibly go back to your favs. Revenant, Rhino, Nezha, Wukong, are all good choices. Citrine, Wisp, Protea as well. I personally like the latter 3, because they can buff team mates and help them survive better, and offer some other sorts of utility (though so can Revenant and Nezha with their Augments). 

I've tried Wisp solo. I've been jumping like crazy guy and when I get tired jumping I've died soon. Not worth the effort.

Revenant is the easiest pick imho, except stuff like recasting and toxic bypassing shield you have pretty good time to survive.

On 2023-09-02 at 12:17 AM, (PSN)robotwars7 said:

On 2023-09-01 at 3:06 AM, Julican said:

This crap needs a nerf in any capacity, I don't even care how they nerf it but at this point; I will take anything

this will be a hard pill to swallow, but it's a skill or gear issue; the fights themselves are not that hard, even without one-shot builds (which don't seem to be as common anymore from what I've been seeing, done like 5 weeks of hunts and not seen a single Kuva Hek!)

Yeah, It's just gear check. No big skill needed.

On 2023-09-02 at 12:17 AM, (PSN)robotwars7 said:

On 2023-09-01 at 3:06 AM, Julican said:

Why is dying extremely punishing?

because DE wanted this to be the next "endgame" mode, and to be fair, it's one of only 2 places that punishes you for dying, the other being Arbitrations which are way easier.

On 2023-09-03 at 12:18 PM, (PSN)Pablogamer585 said:

On 2023-09-01 at 3:06 AM, Julican said:

• Why is dying extremely punishing?
• Why am I punished for my squad mates' mistakes?

• Because this is meant to be high tier content where the player should be prepared to (not) die.

1 death from random "bullet" isn't challenging. "Being prepared" is just mostly cheesing. I don't feel too much challenge equipping Revenant. I need to recast it and being aware of toxic proc. That's it.

I feel much more challenge in normal bosses or even eximus than this. Leech eximus put "energy draining field"? Move. Archon & co puts myriads of traps? Move to the moon.

 

[(XBOX)sinamanthediva]

On 2023-09-01 at 3:17 PM, (PSN)robotwars7 said:

that's co-op gaming for you, you either win or lose, succeed or fail, as a team. a chain is only as strong as its weakest link.

But the Archon Hunt doesn't award a "TEAM REWARD" thus it doesn't follow conventional TEAM guidelines that all other missions in Warframe do follow.  All Team based missions in Warframe award a shared Team Reward, except the Archon Hunt! And yes, before you say it, Fissures are not the same Mission type, as it requires a player to give something to receive something, so it has different mission parameters, making it unique.

I only mention this because, even if as say you were the "weakest link" on the TEAM/SQUAD you could still get the supreme reward of a Tau Shard whilst all other Team Mates get the lessor inferior prize, Super Fun Right?!  Not sure how that is a punishment in the context of the mission as the OP mentions?  Just food for thought with no disrespect to you or the OP!

Have a pleasant tomorrow!

[(XBOX)Player244024418]

4 hours ago, Kaggelos said:

Why am I punished for my squad mates' mistakes?

 

4 hours ago, Kaggelos said:

This is a matter of team cohesion, what each member brings to the fight, how good they are etc. their, or your mistakes have an impact to the rest of the team

Yeah this was me as of yesterday when I got my first archon one-shot in forst phase. Second phase a squad mate one shot it as well. Teamwork! It was weird. I shot and boom, got the bear hug and yellow waypoint...then a big grin. It was nice.

 

4 hours ago, Kaggelos said:

Why is the Archon getting tickled by my 5 forma'ed weapons?

My weapon has 6 or 7 formas and sucked, until I found out the "trick". Hopefully can confirm next archon hunt, which i will be doing solo.

[0_The_F00l]

I do absolutely hate the Damage Attenuation that exists for archons , it is a bad design choice to counter worse balance problems that the game has. And it doesn't even fix it , only pigeon holes players into specific weapon types , 

That being said , i do think the rest of it is more about getting the right tool for the job. 

I do also dislike the random invulnerability phases, but there are usually ways to get the archon out of it , so it's about understanding the mechanics.

I have completed these solo as well as in groups with frames that were squishy as well as tanky (tanky is definitely better). And have failed maybe a handful of times (no enemies nearby to use last gasp)

And the longest I have taken is 24 minutes , and the shortest I have is 7 minutes.

If your 5 forma weapon is not effective , you need to either mod it different or use a different weapon.

Edited September 6, 2023 by 0_The_F00l

[Monolake]

Typical DE giving no flying f*cks about any balancing so the archons are instantly killable with some specific weapons (which is not fun either) but plenty of other great weapons deal very weak damage to them. The phases with ads spawning aren't properly balanced/spaced either (its a no brainer to add more gates and only spawn them at certain % and not time, but DE wont do it)

I dont know, maybe keep making threads every day to force DE to finally balance it.

Edited September 6, 2023 by Monolake

[(XBOX)ECCHO SIERRA]

On 2023-08-31 at 8:06 PM, Julican said:

So after 6 hours of attempting to get an Archon kill, trying both solo and in a squad, I can officially say that Archon Hunts ARE #*!%ING HARD, I have great mods but holy #*!% why is this fight unnecessarily tedious

Why is the Archon getting tickled by my 5 forma'ed weapons?

Why does the Archon have random invulnerable windows?

Why is there a cap on the status stacks?

Why does the Archon keep healing?

Why is dying extremely punishing?

Why am I punished for my squad mates' mistakes?

Why are NONE of the Warframe abilities working on the boss?

Why are there add phases?

Why are almost ALL the enemies Eximus?

Why are objectively weak Warframes getting a bonus in health and damage?

 

I don't care who exploited this fight and when they did so DE "had" to buff the fight

I don't care if the top 0.02% would get bored if this fight was made more reasonable

I don't care which Twitch stream that no-lifed this game thinks about content

 

This crap needs a nerf in any capacity, I don't even care how they nerf it but at this point; I will take anything

Heres a humble suggestion. 

Get felarx or kuva hek. Build for as much radiation damage as possible. Use a frame that is really good at not dying, like inaros, wukong, or better yet revenant. 

Use primary deadhead. Use a damage boosting ability like roar. Headshot the archon. Laugh when like half his health bar goes down at once even if he doesnt get 1 shot out right. 

They have something called damage attenuation. A lot of weapons just dont work very well for that reason. They will "adapt" to your DPS. But you can avoid that to a large extent if you just pile on a buttload of multishot and "jump" the attenuation.

 

Theres youtube guides that go into more detail just search like "archon build" or something you should find it.

On 2023-08-31 at 8:15 PM, Leqesai said:

It may be helpful to look at what strategies are most effective against Archons. You're struggling because you're likely not using the right type of weapon. 

 

Archons are in the endgame content category. You're expected to know how they work in order to do them effectively. 

Yeah like he said. Theyre meant to be difficult. 

 

But with the right loadout theyre still a pushover.

[Mr.SpookSpook]

Players: "This game is too easy. Give us more challenging content!"

DE: *releases archon hunt, which is SLIGHTLY challenging if you are properly built. 

OP: *😭

[fo3nixz]

Steelpath archon when ? With more mechanics