Deluxe concept dissonance between players and Developers

[(PSN)Yes-Man-Kablaam]

So we see this just about every deluxe skin honestly and while it might be futile to really even try. A lot of times people say this skin is suited for another frame since it doesn't remind them of the original frame. Though honestly that isn't the point of it. It's supposed to look pretty different and a big departure as it is a way to spin the concept of the frame into something new looking. If we just got a skin that just looks like the same frame (example would be the thread about the Ivara Deluxe where they show a fanmade Deluxe that is just Ivara with some accessories) that's a little silly we have Tennogen covering that there isn't too much of a point to it. It is frustrating to see on here people actually now just blindly parroting that a skin would be better for a different frame honestly at this point without them having a reason or knowing why. Be open minded about a frame as a concept especially if you're touting around about how "as a main" this and that if anything a new skin for a frame could inspire a new kind of build or way to play it. Try to take some inspiration like the devs do.

 

Now if you just don't like the look of a skin that's fine. Taste is subjective and I don't like every skin out there I'll admit some don't look great for my taste. But this misunderstanding of Deluxe skins as a concept is silly in my opinion that's all and it's more of a bother each time I see it. That's all for my little rant, it likely won't do anything except invite trolling and arguments but hey why not try.

[PhazonMagala]

taste is subjective but deluxe skins sucks

[Lost_Cartographer]

Wish more people would get this.

Deluxe is meant to look different.  Granted, I don't care for a lot of deluxe skins (the shown Excal Prime art for example looks like a deluxe to proto-excalibur to me) but some people like a frame's powers even though they're not big on the look.  Can't blame them.  I feel the same way about Gara (Gara deluxe, please?  Anyone?)

It might help however if DE allowed Tennogen creators to create skins for deluxe forms of Warframes.

[Iludra]

I don't mind deluxe skins being very different from the original, but I do mind when a deluxe skin of one frame looks very much like the default/prime skin of another frame. I believe that's what most players complain about.

[(PSN)Yes-Man-Kablaam]

2 minutes ago, Lost_Cartographer said:

Wish more people would get this.

Deluxe is meant to look different.  Granted, I don't care for a lot of deluxe skins (the shown Excal Prime art for example looks like a deluxe to proto-excalibur to me) but some people like a frame's powers even though they're not big on the look.  Can't blame them.  I feel the same way about Gara (Gara deluxe, please?  Anyone?)

It might help however if DE allowed Tennogen creators to create skins for deluxe forms of Warframes.

I feel like the requirements would be so massive and there's even changes that need to be made when just making tennogen items going through multiple revisions. the amount of checks they need in place i would think just make it too hard or slow to ever really get it unless like they've done in the past pull an outside artist in house which i think has happened and they may have even made a deluxe. So basically that's how tennogen artists can make a deluxe lol.

[(PSN)Puckish_Rogue125]

People will be people. 

Edited July 20, 2019 by (PS4)Puckish_Rogue125

[(PSN)Yes-Man-Kablaam]

Just now, (PS4)Puckish_Rogue125 said:

Remember that no matter what the overwhelming opinion of the forums and twitch are the extreme minority and most people that play do not use these things and may very well be perfectly happy with all of these things. The vocal community may feel huge but it will always be the vocal minority. 

Oh i know it it's why i somewhat changed my things from saying the majority. though i still left the title in there saying playerbase huh... ah well. Either way I know it's a vocal minority but that doesn't mean it hurts to try to help people be more open minded about a concept especially with some of the other threads I see on here lol. 

[kyori]

16 minutes ago, (PS4)Yes-Man-Kablaam said:

just blindly parroting

There is no cure for the zombie parrots.

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

Sometimes a Deluxe skin is better off following the Frames appearance as an example. Other times the skin is better off going it’s own direction.

[Gabbynaru]

I mean, I personally prefer stuff that keeps the theme but gives the frame a whole new look. Like, Rhino Palatine, it's a slicker, more aerodynamic Rhino, but it's still bulky and heavy, to retain the tank essence for the frame. Then there's Nidus, a fleshy, disgusting frame. My opinion for a deluxe skin would be more flesh and more disgust. Instead, he just got turned into random metallic frame #72946. Bleugh. Tennogen should be for stuff that differs from the norm, but I'd much rather Deluxe skins have a level of consistency with the original theme of the frame.

[(PSN)Elvenbane]

Different is fine. It's disappointing when your favorite frame gets a deluxe you don't want, just because it's a lost opportunity to get something very different from what tennogen can deliver. Disappointed people complain.

The Ivara skin looks good to me, but I can relate to the detractors because of Nova's deluxe. I didn't buy it, but enough probably did that it worked out well for DE.

[Joltyboi]

what i want for a titania delux skin is a skin which is more technology based, ide love to use her 4 and be kind of like a small drone/ship looking thing flying about shooting enemies with small drones replacing the razorwings, or at least a technology based delux to not have a giant archwing looking thing sticking out the back so i can use a jetpack or wings and actually have it look like its the jetpack or wings enabling me to fly instead, which is what i dont like about normal titania

[AncientWendigo]

They really should use a different word. To me deluxe implies a better version of the original, not something unrelated. I think a descrptor like Deviant might be better phrasing for the ones that have a significantly different design.

[DrakeWurrum]

3 hours ago, (PS4)Yes-Man-Kablaam said:

now just blindly parroting that a skin would be better for a different frame

People will say that because there are certain aesthetic themes for each frame.

For example: If you saw an alternate helmet design that had a mohawk of curved spikes for Volt, and no horn-like thing on the face. You would probably think "Um, but that looks like Ember"

There aren't any real hard-and-fast rules, of course. And Deluxe is meant to completely overhaul the look rather than being based on the same aesthetic. That's just why that happens.

[(PSN)NemitheNem]

For me it's a flavor/theme issue. 

Sometimes they are pretty much the same--if you can swing 'ancient egyptian' it can probably pass for inaros. 

The new samurai/ronin skin for excalibur. 

Theme wise it's spot on, lone swordman. Flavorwise.. Well the hat needs to. Be more pokey--he needs a 'horn,' okay?

[Lost_Cartographer]

6 hours ago, (PS4)Yes-Man-Kablaam said:

I feel like the requirements would be so massive and there's even changes that need to be made when just making tennogen items going through multiple revisions. the amount of checks they need in place i would think just make it too hard or slow to ever really get it unless like they've done in the past pull an outside artist in house which i think has happened and they may have even made a deluxe. So basically that's how tennogen artists can make a deluxe lol.

 My wording was poor.

While tennogen including NEW deluxe skins (and armors) would be sweet, what I really meant was being able to create skins using the Proto-Excalibur geometry as the canvas, instead of normal Excalibur's geometry.  Or skins using Rhino Palatine's geometry.  That sort of thing.

[(XBOX)zThulsaDoomz]

7 hours ago, PhazonMagala said:

taste is subjective 

/thread

[FlyingDice]

I don't care that most of them are radically different from the base frame, I care that most of them are fugly.

And not in the good industrial-biological grungy way.

[(PSN)Yes-Man-Kablaam]

39 minutes ago, Lost_Cartographer said:

 My wording was poor.

While tennogen including NEW deluxe skins (and armors) would be sweet, what I really meant was being able to create skins using the Proto-Excalibur geometry as the canvas, instead of normal Excalibur's geometry.  Or skins using Rhino Palatine's geometry.  That sort of thing.

I could see that being more reasonable I suppose if a bit unorthodox. might get really complicated with a couple of the deluxes we have though and the different effects in some cases. 

[Lakais]

Aren't Delux skins basically passion projects for developers? Basically some artist in DE has an idea for a skin in their head and they pick at it on the side until it's ready. Meaning the concept of that Deluxe skin is entirely subjective based on how that one or few artists interpret the theme of the frame. 

In many cases, the idea was specifically to go for something radically different from the base frame visuals. Quite a few Deluxe skins are not to my liking, but so are an ever greater many standard frame looks. 

Edited July 20, 2019 by Lakais

[TARINunit9]

Sometimes yes, there can be a huge disconnect between the fans, the artists, and the project managers. Have you seen the original concept for Ember Deluxe? And if so, have you seen the edits DE tried to impose on it? Contrast both of those with the Ember Vermilion we actually got

[(PSN)Yes-Man-Kablaam]

3 minutes ago, TARINunit9 said:

Sometimes yes, there can be a huge disconnect between the fans, the artists, and the project managers. Have you seen the original concept for Ember Deluxe? And if so, have you seen the edits DE tried to impose on it? Contrast both of those with the Ember Vermilion we actually got

That is an incident with an artist getting fired adn de not using the concept that got him fired to just be hands off of the whole debacle afterwards and not you know rub it in, for the record imo the edits are minor not a big deal. and ember vermillion is one of the ones i actually like since coloring base and prime amber is really tricky vermillion allows some color to come to her but not be overly bombastic.

[(XBOX)RPColten]

You forget that the 'players' are also the customers.

[Cubewano]

23 minutes ago, (PS4)Yes-Man-Kablaam said:

That is an incident with an artist getting fired adn de not using the concept that got him fired to just be hands off of the whole debacle afterwards and not you know rub it in, for the record imo the edits are minor not a big deal. and ember vermillion is one of the ones i actually like since coloring base and prime amber is really tricky vermillion allows some color to come to her but not be overly bombastic.

The firing which was a result of edits to his concept he didn't agree with by DE, and to which a lot of people in the community also largely agreed were pretty bad changes when it was discovered, not the most seamless of connections. They then proceeded to reveal a new design to massive disapproval from the community, and following made no changes to said design and quickly threw it out with no regard for the communities reception. Fabulous understanding all around. (and you're better off just getting any tennogen skin or even the immortal if you're having trouble coloring ember, they'll look better and not make her model look like she's anorexic)

[(PSN)Yes-Man-Kablaam]

1 hour ago, Cubewano said:

The firing which was a result of edits to his concept he didn't agree with by DE, and to which a lot of people in the community also largely agreed were pretty bad changes when it was discovered, not the most seamless of connections. They then proceeded to reveal a new design to massive disapproval from the community, and following made no changes to said design and quickly threw it out with no regard for the communities reception. Fabulous understanding all around. (and you're better off just getting any tennogen skin or even the immortal if you're having trouble coloring ember, they'll look better and not make her model look like she's anorexic)

The community didn't really have many comments on the changes themselves just about the whole firing and were more or less if it was gonna lead to a firing were bad changes which kind of takes out the objectivity of it. And as before basically every deluxe is under fire from the community here though it's generally a vocal minority at the end of the day so they didn't make changes.

 

I have gotten graxx and that's ok. i've tested coloring the tennogen and i dislike them IT's why I have one setup for her prime which a barely use as deviating form the colors there kills it. Vermillion which i quite like adn a graxx I haven't used since i got the vermillion