Teshin Gameplay is how Warframe Gameplay supposed to be.

[PublikDomain]

7 minutes ago, AlexMercer said:

Would that also mean that i would be able to survive as much and take dmg as before like with you said with the dmg just lower numbers but feeling the same power?

Ideally, yes.

ETA: And I don't think it'd be that hard to cater to both preferences. Steel Path already puts mechanics in place that could let players choose whether they want a casual or hardcore experience. For example, if everything were balanced and consistent the regular starchart could be tuned to be "power fantasy where you chew through enemies" then flipping on SP could put you in the "challenge where you need to use your skills and will lose if you mess up" pool. This is what SP was intended to actually do, though because the game is so unbalanced and inconsistent it quite predictably failed to accomplish much of anything.

[AlexMercer]

1 minute ago, (XBOX)YoungGunn82 said:

So you like to hold the button down and spin in a circle kill everything? Or get shot by the enemies regardless of your movements or if you anticipant theirs?

They can remove hitscan weapons on the enemies i would not care but i would prefer that i still be able to use as i don’t care about skill in this game i find the power fantasy fun and i never said i like spin to win i enjoy seeing the weapon animations.

[_R_o_g_u_e_]

Teshin gameplay will be a fun change of pace, however if warframe combat in general was that basic, I would never have become a warframe player. I would’ve instead played one of the numerous identical games made with a much higher level of polish.

Im excited to play as Teshin, but I do not support warframe giving up what makes it different.

[(NSW)Greybones]

46 minutes ago, AlexMercer said:

Thank you for the postive comment :) and im ok with other players wanting this game to be more challenging as long as it is not forced and it is optional.

As optional as the game being a chill experience 👍

edit: 🤔 Multiplayer experience is a consideration

[_R_o_g_u_e_]

12 minutes ago, PublikDomain said:

Ideally, yes.

ETA: And I don't think it'd be that hard to cater to both preferences. Steel Path already puts mechanics in place that could let players choose whether they want a casual or hardcore experience. For example, if everything were balanced and consistent the regular starchart could be tuned to be "power fantasy where you chew through enemies" then flipping on SP could put you in the "challenge where you need to use your skills and will lose if you mess up" pool. This is what SP was intended to actually do, though because the game is so unbalanced and inconsistent it quite predictably failed to accomplish much of anything.

Why did you say Estimated Time of Arrival?

[Redthirst]

3 hours ago, TheArmchairThinker said:

Is it though? Considering how often people complain the thing you have is power grinding on every season, not to mention gating content through power level grinding and pinnacle nonsense where RNG decides if you're hardcore enough in grinding just to play a part of content that is "made for 1%"

It absolutely is. The issues with power grind and pinnacle RNG has nothing to do with actual balance. It's just something that Bungie pushes to make people grind, they could remove it and balance wouldn't be affected.

3 hours ago, TheArmchairThinker said:

Also, the balance itself isn't that balanced as you said. More often than not the "balance" is making you under leveled to make it "harder" so I don't think so

It's still balanced, though. It lets them create vastly different types of content, difficulty-wise. It lets them make actually challenging content, something that Warframe never managed to do.

[(PSN)max141064]

You can like it, that's fair.

But it's not how the game SHOULD be. 

How the game should be it's only DE to decide..i'd surely hate it if the game was like that. 

[CephalonCarnage]

On 2021-07-18 at 7:27 AM, 0_The_F00l said:

that I personally would enjoy

you can enjoy it almost as-is. Just leave your warframe at the mission start and complete it all using only your operator. you'll have the same squishiness, the same slow movement, the same need to be careful. You'd have the ability to void dash instead of Teshin's grappling hook thing, the only real difference is the lack of cool-animation melee weapons in favour of void blast.

[(NSW)Greybones]

1 minute ago, gbjbaanb said:

you can enjoy it almost as-is. Just leave your warframe at the mission start and complete it all using only your operator. you'll have the same squishiness, the same slow movement, the same need to be careful. You'd have the ability to void dash instead of Teshin's grappling hook thing, the only real difference is the lack of cool-animation melee weapons in favour of void blast.

Doesn't even need to be an operator. Keep bulletjump in the back pocket and replace the high-power survival mods with something else

[TheArmchairThinker]

2 hours ago, PublikDomain said:

Turns out that being so absurdly overpowered that nothing interesting ever happens or ever will... might be kind of boring. Maybe you don't see many games doing this because it doesn't result in good gameplay and makes further development harder?

Is it though? Or it happens that you find it boring while for others find it's fun being overpowered so it's not a universal and uniform view that absurdly overpowered = boring?

2 hours ago, Dreddgrave said:

What nerfs? What can possibly even be nerfed anymore? Warframes are already useless besides tanks. Don't say nukers or DPS! They fall off the face of the Earth after level 80 and are relegated to sapping the gameplay out of XP farm nodes

Are they though? Or you happen to don't know how to make them not falling off the face of the Earth after level 80?

What can possibly even be nerfed? Damage boost ability (Vex Armor, Sonar, Void Strike, etc), Damage reduction ability and mods (Iron Skin, Warding Halo, Null Star, Desolate Hands), Energy gain bonus (Arcane Energize, Rage/Hunter Adrenaline, Energy Restore), Line of Sight (LoS) on warframe abilities and area damage weapons, Ability damage scaling, an so on

Also, relegated to sapping the gameplay out of XP farm nodes? Maybe, just maybe, you happen to not knowing that there's more than just sapping the gameplay out of XP farm nodes?

2 hours ago, Dreddgrave said:

Boring as hell!!

I'm questioning how do you play because your history can be seen in profile and it's not that hard to tell if someone spends time only in Hydron when you can see so many weapons with 450k EXP and zero kill. That's not playing

2 hours ago, Dreddgrave said:

provide high-end players with something to, at the very least, kill time with.

At this point I'm really questioning what are these "high-end players" want when they say one thing and quickly bounce off their words, dismissing anything they listed as "something" as "not something". It happens too often that they don't seem to know what they want themselves

2 hours ago, Dreddgrave said:

Gameplay has been so supplanted by grinding that anything else is completely forgotten about. Nightwave, grind Nora Coins. Liches, grind Mewmews. Steel Path. Grind Rubix Cubes. All in service of what? So you can do those things faster. So little content has been designed to be just fun that we more often than not get enemies that are just immune to all crowd control or abilities. Just kill them. Grind up the meat and kill some more. There is no gameplay, only grind.

And other online games don't do this? Grind this so you can do things faster?

2 hours ago, Dreddgrave said:

functioning PvP and satisfying combat

When the so-called functioning PvP is filled to the brim with problems from garbage matchmaking that puts you against someone from the other side of the world, stasis dominating PvP only to be nerfed with bungie knowing it will be a problem in the first place, to cheaters and such? Satisfying? What part of it being satisfying when it's not much different to other shooter games such as CoD?

2 hours ago, Dreddgrave said:

Events are interesting, varied and frequent

Doing the same thing with no variation for 4 years is interesting, varied and frequent? Are you sure you're playing the same destiny? Not to mention the recycled content

2 hours ago, Dreddgrave said:

The loot system actually rewards you with LOOT not pieces of loot you need to craft for 12 hours and then another 24-72 hours. And then fill with XP for several hours...

Yeah, how many of that loot will end up being used instead of being dismantled? I prefer this pieces of loot you need to craft for 12 hours and then another 24 - 72 hours and then fill with XP for several hours and never need to get any "better gear" which is the same item but with higher power score to make you grind again every time the power cap increases

2 hours ago, Dreddgrave said:

The GUNS actually feel like GUNS! 

I'm happy with warframe trying to make things with effects than having the same guns with different casing in destiny as "different weapons". And it's not like we don't have basic guns that "actually feel like guns" such as braton, karak, lato, lex, etc

2 hours ago, Dreddgrave said:

Oh yeah, and your powers don't suddenly stop working when a guy with a purple shield shows up

You never see champions in destiny? Unless you use the correct mod your power and guns suddenly stop working and it's all over the game or tell me that you can suddenly kill that one champion with shield not taking damage without the correct gun and mod to reliably disrupt it, shoehorning you to one weapon and one mod as "build"

2 hours ago, Dreddgrave said:

remotely challenging

What is "remotely challenging", if not the game stacking odds against you with massive health enemies, heavy damage if not one hit KO, and other things that for some reason despised in warframe?

2 hours ago, Dreddgrave said:

A game where you might want a healer to keep you alive instead just of being invisible. Where your choice of weapon has an actual impact on the situations you can deal with. A place where Bane mods might actually be useful, heck imagine if 97% of the gear mods weren't actual compost. A freaking stealth game where there's viable options other than genocide or invisibility. Ninja's play free, right?

Back to the second point, everything needs to be nerfed to the point Trinity is a mandatory teammate, tank being only slightly tougher, DPS being glass cannon and such. You can always have that by either not equipping your OP or wait for DE to nerf everything that if someone knows who's behind the reasoning of the nerf that person might disappear completely without trace

[TheArmchairThinker]

2 hours ago, PublikDomain said:

It means you can take your Hydroid and your Harpak into Steel Path and still be successful.

You can already do this though, we have a long list of things to make this trivial even with two things you listed

[TheArmchairThinker]

54 minutes ago, Redthirst said:

actually challenging content

If the "actually challenging content" is making you underleveled to the point of one shot fiesta like GM Nightfall, I rather take no challenge than that when it's already dismissed by the community as cheap and not an actual challenge

[Redthirst]

8 minutes ago, TheArmchairThinker said:

If the "actually challenging content" is making you underleveled to the point of one shot fiesta like GM Nightfall, I rather take no challenge than that when it's already dismissed by the community as cheap and not an actual challenge

It's dismissed by people who are too bad at the game. Everyone else runs and actually enjoys them. There are very few things that can one-shot you in GMs, if you have a proper build, and it promotes more tactical gameplay, where enemies are actually scary, cover is needed and you have to create entirely new strategies to beat the GM.

But the main point I'm making is that Destiny's system allows something like GMs to exist alongside easy content. If you want to stomp through enemies with zero difficulty, you can go do Altars or Blind Well, or run playlist Strikes. If you want content that requires you to coordinate with others, then you can do Raids. If you want content that is just really hard and requires you constantly be on your toes, then you can do GMs. There's different content for different styles of play, and it lets different people enjoy the game.

Comparatively, Warframe only really has content for stomping enemies and "power fantasy". If you want challenge, then you can #*!% right off. You can, of course, try self-imposed challenge, but then you're basically stuck playing this ostensibly co-op game solo(unless you can somehow find other people who are also into the exact type of self-imposed challenge that you're trying and agree to not spoil it by being too strong).

[TheArmchairThinker]

11 minutes ago, Redthirst said:

It's dismissed by people who are too bad at the game. Everyone else runs and actually enjoys them. There are very few things that can one-shot you in GMs, if you have a proper build, and it promotes more tactical gameplay, where enemies are actually scary, cover is needed and you have to create entirely new strategies to beat the GM.

But the main point I'm making is that Destiny's system allows something like GMs to exist alongside easy content. If you want to stomp through enemies with zero difficulty, you can go do Altars or Blind Well, or run playlist Strikes. If you want content that requires you to coordinate with others, then you can do Raids. If you want content that is just really hard and requires you constantly be on your toes, then you can do GMs. There's different content for different styles of play, and it lets different people enjoy the game.

Comparatively, Warframe only really has content for stomping enemies and "power fantasy". If you want challenge, then you can #*!% right off. You can, of course, try self-imposed challenge, but then you're basically stuck playing this ostensibly co-op game solo(unless you can somehow find other people who are also into the exact type of self-imposed challenge that you're trying and agree to not spoil it by being too strong).

And warframe doesn't really need cover when you can zip away to safety and have abilities to control the battlefield to your favor. Also, I find that one-shot in GM isn't really challenge. If I want challenge, I'll take PUBG or any PvP game where your awareness matters, not shoehorned to "proper build" and pretty sure the entirely new strategies isn't much different than "keeping distance and whittling down enemies from afar"

Destiny system, which is not the system warframe has so what are you going to do? Scream at DE to change the system? Raids may be possible to apply with super tight execution window but I don't find bullet sponge with one shot as challenge. Don't know about you, maybe you'll find Zealoid Prelate Steel Path fun

Warframe itself is a god-warrior able to stay alive solo so why must DE change that? Also, you may want to find challenge that isn't just one-shot fiesta as "challenge"

[RichardKam]

Just go solo and you can cosplay anything you want, the way you want it.

I always take cover when reloading.

[(NSW)Greybones]

Sure would be nice if it was easier to find like-minded players

[Redthirst]

3 minutes ago, TheArmchairThinker said:

Also, I find that one-shot in GM isn't really challenge.

Only snipers really one-shot, and only if you don't have sniper resistance mod equipped. Beyond that, you can tank quite a few shots.

10 minutes ago, TheArmchairThinker said:

and pretty sure the entirely new strategies isn't much different than "keeping distance and whittling down enemies from afar"

Every GM has an entirely different approach to most mechanics. You often have to use paths that you normally ignore, or find the best pieces of cover. Or find a way to control enemy spawns in your favor.

15 minutes ago, TheArmchairThinker said:

Raids may be possible to apply with super tight execution window

They had raids in WF, but they were quite a bit of a joke because enemies basically weren't a factor at all. It was still the only piece of content in the entire game that required actual teamwork(and naturally, many in the community whined that they can't solo them).

5 minutes ago, TheArmchairThinker said:

Warframe itself is a god-warrior able to stay alive solo so why must DE change that?

Because it makes it impossible for them to just add new content to the existing systems. That's why we have all those half-baked "content islands" like Railjack or Necramech. They can't really add content that feels fresh to core Warframe portion of the game, because when everyone is a god-warrior slaying everything with zero thought or strategy, all content feels identical.

 

 

[Hypernaut1]

Super jump was once an ability on their main character. That's all you need to know about early Warframe gameplay. 

I think the coptering bug was the "gateway drug"  to making Warframe the super fast paced game it is now. We went from having stamina and not even a double jump, to being able to glide/fly through the air at will while shooting. 

When I first saw a bullet jump and aim glide, I remember thinking "cool, but isn't that kind of OP? We're practically flying as a basic moveset" . I was skeptical until I played the movement 2.0 update. It really did breathe new life into Warframe. I don't know if it was necessarily "better", but it was definitely fun and engaging and made WF feel new and different. 

I think WF is supposed to be what Warframe is. It evolved to stay alive. Some of you don't appreciate that. After 3k+ hours, I do. This is the only game I've played for that long. We've gone from single jumping and slashing at enemies to flying capital ships, AWing through space, entering a base and aimgliding while shooting enemies all in a single mission. 

[0_The_F00l]

1 hour ago, gbjbaanb said:

you can enjoy it almost as-is. Just leave your warframe at the mission start and complete it all using only your operator. you'll have the same squishiness, the same slow movement, the same need to be careful. You'd have the ability to void dash instead of Teshin's grappling hook thing, the only real difference is the lack of cool-animation melee weapons in favour of void blast.

Been there done that. Not as fun if you pick the right school , amp and arcanes throughout the star chart ,

Void dash makes traversal trivial as you are for all intents and purposes invincible during that time and anytime you choose to crouch with near instantaneous repositioning.

Also no melee weapon or finisher capability as of now is kinda the point why it's different than operator mode combat.

It looks fun cause there are greater limits set and you need to analyse the terrain to be effective.

Not the same as operator combat.

[(NSW)Greybones]

6 minutes ago, Hypernaut1 said:

Super jump was once an ability on their main character. That's all you need to know about early Warframe gameplay. 

I think coptering was the "gateway drug"  to making Warframe the super fast paced game it is now. We went from having stamina and not even a double jump, to being able to glide/fly through the air at will while shooting. 

When I first saw a bullet jump and aim glide, I remember thinking "cool, but isn't that kind of OP? We're practically flying as a basic moveset" . I was skeptical until I played the movement 2.0 update. It really did breathe new life into Warframe. I don't know if it was necessarily "better", but it was definitely fun and engaging and made WF feel new and different. 

I think WF is supposed to be what Warframe is. It evolved to stay alive. Some of you don't appreciate that. After 3k+ hours, I do. This is the only game I've played for that long. We've gone from single jumping and slashing enemies to flying capital ships, AWing through space, entering a base and aimgliding while shooting enemies all in a single mission. 

I remember Excalibur's super jump. I wanted to get really good at using it, leaping up to surprise enemies and get the edge, but I couldn't really clear a lot of the railings or next level floors.

Movement 2.0 is my favourite update 🥳, because they took the rather clunky wallrun and wallclimb that originally hooked me and made them so much more fluid and useable to get places. To this day when I'm not playing Warframe, I may find myself thinking about all the practice I'll probably be doing forever to move through the tilesets without touching the ground

[Ace-Bounty-Hunter]

"Teshin Gameplay is how Warframe Gameplay supposed to be."

There's nothing wrong with the gameplay. It's fast and exhilarating and a lot of the weapons have unique functions and fun playstyles.

The only real issue is the AI which are easy to win against.

On 2021-07-18 at 5:20 AM, Krion112 said:

The gameplay of the demo definitely shows how much more impactful things are when they're at a controlled pace, and it reminds me of how badly the game has been lobotomized over time to be less engaging because of the excessive conveniences in power creep and mobility.

Go play any other shooter game if you want those experiences.

[Hypernaut1]

5 hours ago, Ace-Bounty-Hunter said:

-snip-

A.i and enemy design isn't even that bad honestly. The problem is that the enemies have been nerfed too much because players hate to lose and WANT mindless fodder to shoot. 

All this talk of Warframe being too easy didn't mean anything when fortuna was released and people kept whining about how hard it was. 

If the enemies actually had their abilities tuned to be effective, Warframes would definitely be more challenging, even with our mobility. 

[Ace-Bounty-Hunter]

6 minutes ago, Hypernaut1 said:

All this talk of Warframe being too easy didn't mean anything when fortuna was released and people kept whining about how hard it was.

lol. The enemies in Fortuna aren't difficult. Just annoying with the amount of nullifiers and knockbacks they use.

They're still mindless and drop like flies with the right loadouts. 

[TheArmchairThinker]

5 hours ago, Ace-Bounty-Hunter said:

-snip-

The AI can't do anything when we're blazing through maps like rockets and wipe everything in 50 meters around us though, so it makes sense

[dodyouserious]

after watching that i realized how op warframes are and how grounded our enemies are, were like a god or hacker to them lol