What is up with this sudden need for a Chroma rework?

[JackHargreav]

il y a 23 minutes, taiiat a dit :

Mirage could do okay via Blinding for Stuns, but sadly Eclipse will always be in some level of Damage side on Venus, it's bright just about everywhere there.
unless you wanted to fight inside of a Base or a Cave.
either way there's two complications for Mirage because Eclipse dynamically scales with the "intensity" of the bright/dark area you're in, and in the same regard that it picks whether you will be Offense/Defense for you.

we'd all love it to be more applicable in general, but we can only wait. granted unlike most i'm not asking just for being able to specifically choose light/dark, but for the other Abilities to be able to create light/dark zones so that you can always create what you're looking for.
and for the UI to show us what the Buff currently is  instead of only what the max is hbrhrbhrbhrhrbhbrrhrb

Well it seems like not every warframe can survive that much then.

[(PSN)Silverback73]

1 hour ago, JackHargreav said:

Another type of post that I saw times. And again. I don't get it.

Apparently one of the argument for his rework is that players only use him for his 2nd and 3rd abilities.

And? I mean a lot frames are used for two of their abilities usually. There is Loki, Zephyr, Vauban, Rhino, Equinox, Mesa, Excalibur, Valkyr.

Rhino players sometimes use his 4th but mostly I see players use only the 2nd and 3rd abilities. And also these two frames are constantly compared and I saw ppl referring to Chroma as "Rhino 2.0". Which is fair enough considering that in a way they are sameish.

Also these same ppl put a big emphasis on his 1st and 4th ability. Some says that the 1st should be totally swapped out for something else cause? Can't remember only few frames that have actually useful 1st abilities.

I think he's fine. Not the most interesting or fun but I can't really see why he would need a rework.

The simple answer is that the new standard for frames is that all 4 powers need to be situationally relevant in some capacity at all levels of play.

If I could “breath” his 1 onto my Melee and add elemental damage, for example, I could use that throughout the game.

Edited January 29, 2019 by (PS4)Silverback73

[JackHargreav]

il y a 15 minutes, BL4CKN0ISE a dit :

With Chroma, the vast majority of players will literally never use his 1 or 4. They're not less useful. They are nonexistent.

Alright with this point I can agree kinda. I never use those abilites at all. But as I stated there are many 1st abilities that are weak and not used. So I don't see his first ability being weak a problem. And sincs many players would compare him to Rhino, there is Rhino Charge which is an ability that I never saw anyone using ever.

[(PSN)psycofang]

1 hour ago, Gabbynaru said:

I dunno

Yes. You dont know and apparently numerous others dont either. People are kind of tired of his 1 and 4 being nothing more than useless energy drains that give nothing back but very very very niche very specific scenario rewards. 

But the hyperbole that people want the old even more narrowed down Chroma is just people self wanking to some weird high ground.

Edited January 29, 2019 by (PS4)psycofang

[(PSN)psycofang]

2 minutes ago, JackHargreav said:

But as I stated there are many 1st abilities that are weak and not used

And thats not an excuse, Frost has one of the best first powers in the game. It doesnt always need to be damage, utility makes it strong as well.

-it can pop his bubbles

-freeze mooks

-plant an instant freeze puddle on the ground for hallway trapping

 

There are other ways but other skills being useless will never be a valid reason to let further first/secondary skills be useless

 

That line of thinking is why Vauban sucks now 

[(XBOX)Skippy575]

I just want his 1 and 4 to be better. And from the responses so do a lot of other people here.

[JackHargreav]

à l’instant, (PS4)psycofang a dit :

And thats not an excuse, Frost has one of the best first powers in the game. It doesnt always need to be damage, utility makes it strong as well.

-it can pop his bubbles

-freeze mooks

-plant an instant freeze puddle on the ground for hallway trapping

 

There are other ways but other skills being useless will never be a valid reason to let further first/secondary skills be useless

 

That line of thinking is why Vauban sucks now 

Hmm... I can see where you're coming from. But also what does a 1st ability matters really? If it's weak or mediocre no one will use it. If It's too powerful then It will be nerfed because of course...

[DrBorris]

Sudden? You're kidding, right? People have been asking for a Chroma rework since he was released with two useless abilities. The conversation comes and goes from the front page, but it has always had a presence. 

 

Also, just being useful doesn't  mean a Warframe is well designed or "good". Not dieing and amplifying damage is not enough for a Warframe, they need to have some character. 

 

Edit: Also, keep in mind the word "fine" intrinsically means that it could be better. 

Edited January 29, 2019 by DrBorris

[SneakyErvin]

Chroma needs a rework badly because he is only useful in one type of content i.e hunts/heists. He is a complete waste to bring to anything else. He is also a pain to mod because he has short duration, expensive skills and short range. And for him to be fairly energy neutral you will have to invest in narrow minded to get the duration up there, making his short range buff even shorter. Luckily they are auras, so it is up to others to run to you when they are active. He doesnt suffer like Rhino if he misses a group member with his Roar.

And the reason to go beyond 500% damage from Vex armor is because Vex also provides massive amounts of armor the further up you get, this in turn lets you completely ditch steel fiber or umbral fiber along with cold energy and go heat instead. This means more health and more for rage or hunter adrenaline to work with to keep your energy sustained.

He needs a massive overhaul to make him useful. He isnt even fun to play in the content he is good, because it is all about hitting your buffs every 50 seconds or so. Not really what I'd call engaging gameplay.

[BL4CKN0ISE]

57 minutes ago, JackHargreav said:

Alright with this point I can agree kinda. I never use those abilites at all. But as I stated there are many 1st abilities that are weak and not used. So I don't see his first ability being weak a problem. And sincs many players would compare him to Rhino, there is Rhino Charge which is an ability that I never saw anyone using ever.

Normally I would agree, but I just think players are thinking differently about Chroma because of recent reworks. Anyways, I agree that first abililties can be weak in general, but Chroma is in a really weird place with his 1. It's just a way to burn energy. He has a channeled first ability that doesn't do anything useful. It's not just a cheap ability that you can spam. 

At least Rhino Charge has a strong synergy with his augment and 2nd ability. 

[(PSN)psycofang]

53 minutes ago, JackHargreav said:

Hmm... I can see where you're coming from. But also what does a 1st ability matters really?

The building the identity of a warframe for 1, the use and cycling of a play style for the second reason. 

Limbo and Frosts 1s are a perfect example of a 1 done right vs 1s like necros / ember where they are there just to be there. The 1 who designed the abilities has a set way they design them its very apparent.

But giving them further use once damage falls off, while having them interact with other skills that benefit you ala Limbo or Gara is a better alternative to useless.

[xcenic]

1 hour ago, JackHargreav said:

I can't see him as trash tbh. (Also I would like to see you surviving with Titania on Vallis.)

jesus christ i can even carried you to whole content with my titania, i dont knw what you talking about.

[taiiat]

1 hour ago, JackHargreav said:

Well it seems like not every warframe can survive that much then.

i didn't suggest as such. provided that the landscape was considered a fully dark area, Mirage would survive quite well.
we must ofcourse, remember that maxed out, Chroma realistically has 93.76% Damage Reduction (94.8% if we're talking about Prime) from Abilities.
which is comparable to Eclipse in an area that is full strength. while Trinity has 93.75%, Baruuk 95%, Equinox.... well it's complicated (amount of Damage Reduction differing depending on distance, plus whether you include the Slowing in that, Et Cetera), Gara 90%, Mesa 95% against most things, Nekros 90% (plus some from Health Conversion if we want to include that because of Desecrate?), Nezha 90% (plus some from Health Conversion if we want to include that because of Chakram prolifically creating Health Orbs?), Nidus 90%, Nova 90%, Nyx technically an unknown about from Passive (does Absorb/Assimilate count? shrug), Titania technically 50%, Valkyr (does the bonus Armor from Warcry count?), Zephyr technically by being mostly invulnerable to Ranged Weapons.

that formats like hell but anyways the point was that there are many other Warframes that also have very significant Damage Reduction available to them. and there's alternative mechanics that don't reduce Damage taken but increase survivability in other ways.

 

if we want to look outside of that, i could talk about how Quick Thinking + Guardian + Adaptation makes basically anything durable. but that's a different matter.

[JackHargreav]

il y a une heure, xcenic a dit :

jesus christ i can even carried you to whole content with my titania, i dont knw what you talking about.

The whole content huh? I'm not talking about staying on lvl 45 levels sunshine. I'm talking about enduring for as long as possible. So would you able to survive on our most unfair map the Vallis against lvl 100+ enemies?

Edited January 29, 2019 by JackHargreav

[JackHargreav]

il y a 55 minutes, (PS4)psycofang a dit :

The building the identity of a warframe for 1, the use and cycling of a play style for the second reason. 

Limbo and Frosts 1s are a perfect example of a 1 done right vs 1s like necros / ember where they are there just to be there. The 1 who designed the abilities has a set way they design them its very apparent.

But giving them further use once damage falls off, while having them interact with other skills that benefit you ala Limbo or Gara is a better alternative to useless.

Alright I support this idea.

[JackHargreav]

il y a une heure, SneakyErvin a dit :

Chroma needs a rework badly because he is only useful in one type of content i.e hunts/heists. He is a complete waste to bring to anything else. He is also a pain to mod because he has short duration, expensive skills and short range. And for him to be fairly energy neutral you will have to invest in narrow minded to get the duration up there, making his short range buff even shorter.

That is you build him for team support. Which I don't. And never saw the reason to build for a team buff build.

[(PSN)FriendSharkey]

 

2 and 3 should just be combined..I always pop both at the same time...While I'll just use effigy to save a downed player, that's about it with his ULT...but,... After Khora came out I was like we need a Kubrow version and Chroma does have a neat pelt..so I thought perhaps it could act as an armor that could combine with a companion or just become a companion outright...hence the "Old Spice" pose for number 4..which given how small he his without the pelt... It would be totally funny if you could ride it around like Beast Cat from He-Man...

[DrivaMain]

People have started asking for a Chroma rework/tweak ever since his release, but now it became a very hot topic ever since his prime release because it’s basically a missed opportunity for DE. I dont get it why people still want to nerf chroma to the ground, he is already expensive to build and cost a S#&$ ton of energy to keep his buffs up. Yes, I am a Chroma main and use him a lot, I even bring him to sorties (not assasination) and normal missions too. His 1 is one of the worst ability in the game and his 4 is pretty weak and very punishing and drains a lot of energy for Chroma because of the -50% total armor reduction and high energy drain. 

And also, he doesn’t even have a true passive. Being an elemental master he should be able to switch his element ingame not in our arsenal (because it ruins fashion frame for some people) . It would be nice if his passive fits his dragon theme like “Chroma’s mere presence shakes the enemy causing them to focus their fire to chroma with a reduced accuracy” this should help chroma tank his teammates

 

Edited January 29, 2019 by DrivaMain

[Mr.SpookSpook]

"sudden need"

Lol thats cute

[AzureTerra]

people just want more from the vomit dragon

[spirit_of_76]

this is my two cents but If Chroma is Reworked the damage and armor Buff from his 3 will be nerfed into the Oberon (if changed to flat) / Valk  (if it stays a percentage) / Rhino levels (for damage only).  The best case for his rework is if they make him an offense based Oberon where he is ok On his own but is better with a team and will be unable to coexist with necros.  

[LightZodiac]

I can't remember seeing Chroma outside of hydron and eidolon/orb hunts, at the same time I can't remember teams not using Chroma in eidolon/orb hunts. So yeah I'd say he needs a rework.

I would change his 3 from working as + damage% mod to damage buff, and nerf it. So there is no need to make specific weapon builds for Chroma buff.

His 1 spends energy and works worse then a badly modded weapon. Change it into exhaled weapon that has base damage corresponding to the Chroma element color.

Have his 4 use the same exhaled weapon.

Lower his ability costs, buff the duration and range. Add augment which makes his buffs "stick" with the teammates.

This way there is more variety for DPS in eidolon/orb hunts, and Chroma can be built as a support/buff/DPS/exhaled... builds.

 

[DanteYoda]

Half his kit is useless and people ask why others want fixes lol, i will say though there way more important warframes that could use fixing...

[Tiltskillet]

8 hours ago, JackHargreav said:

Apparently one of the argument for his rework is that players only use him for his 2nd and 3rd abilities.

With only four abilities, is it really so much to ask that all four be interesting and viable? 

8 hours ago, JackHargreav said:

And? I mean a lot frames are used for two of their abilities usually. There is Loki, Zephyr, Vauban, Rhino, Equinox, Mesa, Excalibur, Valkyr.

Other frames being as bad off or worse doesn't make Chroma well designed or even ok.

And why settle for "ok", let alone worse than that?

[(XBOX)zThulsaDoomz]

8 hours ago, Makunogo said:

chroma can wait we have much worse off frames that need to be touched up first lol

 

7 hours ago, Legion-Shields said:

I though chroma was the go-to frame for killing eidolons and orbs.

This

While it is true that Chroma is completely cheeks anywhere other than open world boss bounties, he at least has some use.  Wukong, Vauban, Ember, Nyx and Titania (still) need to be addressed first.

And even after them I'd begin to look at Atlas and maybe Banshee.