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[DE]Bear

Dev Workshop - Cannot Cast in the Air: Friend or Foe?

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I can imagine a Rhino with and augment that allows for a aerial stomp/slam that also displaces his iron skin as additional explosion or impact damage for the amount of armor removed. So similar to equinox you could cast iron skin take damage to build armor leap into the air then cast stomp to slam the ground and release the damage accumulated.

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Trinity's skills being castable in the air would be nice, yes. Making them one handed would be even better.

Frost Avalanche, I believe, shouldn't slam him into the ground since there are no stomps involved and it is perfectly reasonable as an aerial cast. Ice wave would benefit from directional slam.

Atlas's Tectonics and Rumblers would benefit as well from the air cast. Maybe scale the petrify radius of rumblers and the health of the wall with fall height too? (More height = more hulk smash...)

Wonder if we can have some other QoL like making Banshee's 1 into a one handed action too.

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Make separate animations for legs so frames cating in mid-air would have proper look.

Nekros floating DJ Desecrate being the best example of current awkwardness. 

 

Improving below-the-belt action would be also great for general aiming animation - currently when you shoot and move mouse around, frames slide in place like it's 2005.

I think Paragon had great "turning around" movement and it's now free to use their assets so just copy paste it into Warframe and buy them a large pizza for their hard work.

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i've been having this kind of thought recently too. Its great and maybe put gravity and weight into consideration. Take rhino for example, if he cast the stomp higher from the ground, the range/strength of the stomp could be increased slightly. oh and dont forget the animation for casting mid air too. This is going to be cool XD

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8 hours ago, [DE]Bear said:

 

 

Been trying to get my question asked on Devstream since ~2014 (I don't always make the thread), but it seems topical here given the above gif.

The standing in the air looks kinda silly, any chance an IK update is in the pipeline, and by extension an animation overhaul (like splitting the torso and legs, à la Uncharted, so they animate independently - No reason Trinity can't keep her floating leg pose, while her torso animates the cast animation)?

Good stuff though, sometimes it hurts when you are barely off the ground yet the cast wont go off.

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Posted (edited)

Doesn't change a lot, but QoL changes are always nice. Always nice if the game flows smoother. Would have to see the exact implementation to see how good it actually is, because there might be scenarios where you rhino stomp off the map or into your death by accident, where you'd want to cast as you land. But overall looks like a postive thing to apply the new slam attacks to ground cast abilities.

Edited by Scissorsmith

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15 minutes ago, MillbrookWest said:

Been trying to get my question asked on Devstream since ~2014 (I don't always make the thread), but it seems topical here given the above gif.

The standing in the air looks kinda silly, any chance an IK update is in the pipeline, and by extension an animation overhaul (like splitting the torso and legs, à la Uncharted, so they animate independently - No reason Trinity can't keep her floating leg pose, while her torso animates the cast animation)?

Good stuff though, sometimes it hurts when you are barely off the ground yet the cast wont go off.

They can already do separate anims for air and ground, Razorwing has that.

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Now I can scream "SUUMMAASSHH!" whilst jumping from a 10m height expecting to decimate everything on the ground.

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Can we also finally be able to cast abilities on ziplines please?! O.O

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10 hours ago, [DE]Bear said:

Aimed Ground Slam:

You'll need to use the 'long fall recover' (getting up from falling from a high place) animation which then bleeds into the stomp. Looks off like that - fake-lagging to a flat surface and then stomping. Another way to fix this is to make it so that when he lands, it's a mix of the recover animation and the stomp, plus his passive auto-procc'ing.

Speaking of his passive, I recommend it be altered to accomodate:
-Larger AOE slam radius.
-Armour increases health, shields.
-And the passive 'blast' from landing's damage being affected by his max armour, being procc-able from any slam attack.

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Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, [DE]Bear said:

 

So in both these cases, please note, this is still early days. This is a 'proof of concept' obviously, but suggestions like these will certainly help towards what we would need to look at.

How about having only the upper body play the animation while in the air? in Trinity's case for example. Just turn the whole body like she kinda does already, but keep the legs in the "Jumped" position while the hands and upper body do the Link animation!

Also have Rhino's passive trigger on first ground contact when Air casting directional Stomp!

Edited by Antris

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really cool change, but animations can still seem a little weird then at times (like in this trinity footage, she clearly seemed to stand in the air), so if the animations could be changed to cover ground and air usage, then it would be perfect! other than that, great step in the right direction

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Considering that Parkour 2.0 has existed for a while and emphasizes that you stay in the air a lot more then you do on the ground...I don't see why this hasn't been done sooner.

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when you change Trinity's abilities can you also make them all one handed since they all use only one hand anyways

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Datam4ss said:

They can already do separate anims for air and ground, Razorwing has that.

Not what i was referencing.

Uncharted is a good example since the ND devs tend to do a lot of GDC talks on this very subject (You can find them all the way back to UC1). But if ND want to animate a single arm, they can do so, irrespective of what the rest of the body does - read as: the entire body doesn't need to be updated, or interrupted.

Currently, if Warframe wants to animate a single arm, the entire body needs to be animated to do so, interrupting whatever was animating before (as seen in the clip i quoted).

Warframe is a million miles away from Uncharted (animation-wise), and while i wasn't implying parity with my comparison, it would be nice to see Warframe implement more modern animation methods. Where, in the case with the Trinity above, the "cast" animation does not override the principal animation being performed.

Edited by MillbrookWest

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Posted (edited)

Why don't do a ratio on distance with increasing of range and/or power when touching the grownd after the air cast. (just an exemple for rhino ult (rhino nuke) ) 

Edited by Eidann

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Il y a 11 heures, [DE]Bear a dit :

 

 

 

Il y a 11 heures, [DE]Bear a dit :

Look, Trinity freely casts Link in air!

Let’s see your thoughts, Tenno!

I've been waiting years for this, thanks ❤️

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Yes, this is the perfect fix for those types of Abilities.   
It'd also be cool for some Abilities to have an altered use from the air, for example; an aerial Soundquake could be a continuous downward echo, letting her hover and Soundquake enemies below her in a more condensed radius. Whether or not that would be desired over a directional ground slam-cast is up for debate.  

Can we get a list of all Abilities that cannot be cast in the air? Possibly organized by "remove check", "ground slam candidate", "would like to experiment/get suggestions".

While we're on the note of borrowing mechanics, I think that Ember's Fire Blast could benefit from the aimed-casting mechanics of Limbo's Cataclysm.

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20 minutes ago, MillbrookWest said:

Not what i was referencing.

Uncharted is a good example since the ND devs tend to do a lot of GDC talks on this very subject (You can find them all the way back to UC1). But if ND want to animate a single arm, they can do so, irrespective of what the rest of the body does - read as: the entire body doesn't need to be updated, or interrupted.

Currently, if Warframe wants to animate a single arm, the entire body needs to be animated to do so, interrupting whatever was animating before (as seen in the clip i quoted).

Warframe is a million miles away from Uncharted (animation-wise), and while i wasn't implying parity with my comparison, it would be nice to see Warframe implement more modern animation methods. Where, in the case with the Trinity above, the "cast" animation does not override the principal animation being performed.

Warframe does already have blended animations, you can tell simply from all one handed cast anims and all shooting-while moving. The problem is that this frequently results in odd looking composites with very little weight and also requires a lot of work to "generisize" the composite sections.

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Now if we can just fix the fluidity of other abilities that 'stop us' when we cast them while moving....

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