Players afraid of playing Kuva Survival and other endless missions.

[(PSN)nedlogkid]

My Clan and Alliance run events like longest survival and give out rewards. Now when this last event was completed, all the players that completed the event got trade banned. I don't know the reason why this is done.  I just hope DE fixes this.  This really hinders my Alliance and Clan events. It is not fair to players to get punished for playing the game.

Edited May 21, 2020 by (PS4)nedlogkid

[kyori]

They want you to play their game.. but not play it for too long. They are concern about your health, your eyesight, your electricity bill etc. lol

[Traumtulpe]

10 minutes ago, (PS4)nedlogkid said:

all the players that completed the event got trade banned. I don't know the reason why this is done.

Supposedly there is an automatic anti-cheating system in place, that dispenses trade bans if you get too many rewards from a single mission.

[(XBOX)Calliber]

9 minutes ago, (PS4)nedlogkid said:

My Clan and Alliance run events like longest survival and give out rewards. Now when this last event was completed, all the players that completed the event got trade banned. I don't know the reason why this is done.  I just hope DE fixes this.  This really hinders my Alliance and Clan events. It is not fair to players to get punished for playing the game.

Long runs on Endless missions tend to trip their anti-cheat/exploit detectors because they are statistical anomalies.  Abnormally high resource collection will also cause this to happen from what I've seen.  It's not that they cheated, it's what they did looked like cheating according to their computers.  Wait the ban out, have everyone submit a report, not much else you can do.

[(PSN)IndianChiefJeff]

37 minutes ago, kyori said:

They want you to play their game.. but not play it for too long. They are concern about your health, your eyesight, your electricity bill etc. lol

That's some concern they're showing. There's no better way of saying "Stop playing my game" than banning them for little to no reason, right? If they were that concerned about our health, grind in this game would be halved. Getting punished for playing the game is quite a leap in logic, but who am I to question this?

Edited May 21, 2020 by (PS4)IndianChiefJeff

[(XBOX)x ARTaco x]

are you surprised with the ridiculous amounts of unskippable time gates? they want you to play the game a long time to fluff their stats but don't like actual progression because then you're able to take long breaks then come back (obvious they want people glued to their tv on a daily basis, not a few hrs a day, for a couple days out of the month.)

[(PSN)bauer5266]

We are currently did an Alliance event and everyone who went endgame in ODS survival was also trade banned. DE plz fix

[(PSN)northern_rebal]

1 hour ago, (PS4)IndianChiefJeff said:

Getting punished for playing the game is quite a leap in logic, but who am I to question this

I would assume DE put the cheat detector in place because people complained. I would also assume that if they got rid of it, people would complain about cheating  again.

So what would YOU do, specifically, to stop cheating but allow people to "play the game"?

As a programmer I can tell you how hard it is to write code for every possible event. I think setting a trigger for going over some set amount of rewards is reasonable.  You did something unusual so it set off the trigger. I understand how frustrating it is, but a computer can't know your intent.

I'd personally would like DE to fix the things truly broken before trying to refine logic most people won't encounter.

[(PSN)IndianChiefJeff]

2 hours ago, (PS4)northern_rebal said:

I would assume DE put the cheat detector in place because people complained. I would also assume that if they got rid of it, people would complain about cheating  again.

So what would YOU do, specifically, to stop cheating but allow people to "play the game"?

As a programmer I can tell you how hard it is to write code for every possible event. I think setting a trigger for going over some set amount of rewards is reasonable.  You did something unusual so it set off the trigger. I understand how frustrating it is, but a computer can't know your intent.

I'd personally would like DE to fix the things truly broken before trying to refine logic most people won't encounter.

Define cheating. I understand DE has systems that detect macros & bots, but we're talking about normal gameplay that's being punished. Though the community is small, there's all sorts of people that enjoy running endurance missions for much longer than I care to. I find it thrilling that there are players that dedicated to running as long as they can, there's an abundant lack of incentive to go past 5-10 minutes, let alone several hours. What do we even consider "reasonable" in terms of rewards? There's no scaling loot to match enemy level scaling, so you aren't gaining an enormous amount of anything. Why players are even punished for playing the game is a situation I never thought I'd have to look at.

[(PSN)northern_rebal]

59 minutes ago, (PS4)IndianChiefJeff said:

we're talking about normal gameplay that's being punished. Though the community is small, there's all sorts of people that enjoy running endurance missions for much longer than I care to.

I have no idea why they put it in, but they didn't do it for no reason. My point was, maybe you'd say a mission over 30 minutes is suspicious ... But then I'd say no make it over an hour, the the next guy says no make it 3 hours ...  So DE picked some level.  You or I may not like that number but it's not that it's broke. 

From what I've heard the number of players is not a small number. That just makes it harder to satisfy everyone.

[(XBOX)Tucker D Dawg]

I've done plenty of 5+ hour survivals -(and defense and interecptions to wave 100ish)  of course I have no idea if i was trade banned since I generally avoid trade as I find it tedious - so maybe I was.

But if in fact DE  put in an auto ban that sweeps up players who do endurance runs is beyond stupid.  If they don't want people doing long endurance runs, just end the mission at wave/round X - don't leave it to the players to find out with no warning that playing the game as designed is actually a bannable offense.

 

Edited May 21, 2020 by (XB1)Tucker D Dawg

[Sevek7]

6 hours ago, (PS4)nedlogkid said:

My Clan and Alliance run events like longest survival and give out rewards. Now when this last event was completed, all the players that completed the event got trade banned. I don't know the reason why this is done.  I just hope DE fixes this.  This really hinders my Alliance and Clan events. It is not fair to players to get punished for playing the game.

I'm not sure why the developers would design auto-bans for people who like to push themselves. It sounds absurd, hopefully we get an explanation.

[-Degu]

Just now, Sevek7 said:

It sounds absurd, hopefully we get an explanation.

We got an explanation from support actually! 
They don't give a damn.
Many a' times I've been banned, my friends have been banned. We asked, what gives? 
They just said "lol don't do it we don't want you to, you will keep getting beans". There is no actual reason as not to do it. They just don't want you to do it.

 

[Tokens210]

the explanation is ppl abused the system, we had ppl glitching out of levels on endless runs so enemies couldnt reach them but they could still kill enemies, back when mags greddy pull worked on everyones loot it made it even easier cause you didnt have to glitch back in mag could pull life support and other things to everyone out of the map

 

had ppl doing afk like multiple hour survival runs and such, leaving with so many resources they would probably never need to get more again, atleast back then

the old void key system was effected to as you could stay in a "relic" missions forever and leave with 1,000s of prime parts

Edited May 21, 2020 by Tokens210

[Loxyen]

6 hours ago, (PS4)nedlogkid said:

My Clan and Alliance run events like longest survival and give out rewards. Now when this last event was completed, all the players that completed the event got trade banned. I don't know the reason why this is done.  I just hope DE fixes this.  This really hinders my Alliance and Clan events. It is not fair to players to get punished for playing the game.

Yet another reason why Warframe needs a pvx endgame where the players can sink time into and give themselves a challenge. A reason for Dark Sectors or something alike.

[(PSN)Unstar]

DE does care about the health and well-being of its players.  And while I wouldn't go so far as to say that your clan doesn't care about that, there is undeniably a certain degree of negligence in incentivizing clan members to do things for arbitrarily long periods of time.  So my speculation is that it's possible that DE may have removed the ability to trade to prevent the transaction of such incentives.  There are certainly plenty of other possible explanations, though.

[GreyDeath789]

Long runs (over 5 hours?) usually (?) leads to trade bans because DE auto detect shows too long/too many items collected and assumes it is a bot or some other 'cheat' system.

This has been documented in videos and threads as a thing so strange a clan/alliance that is interested in long runs would not have known about this in the past.

But nice bait title on the thread...got me to click on it...

 

[(PSN)starfigter-44]

I speak for the francophone community :

Many players complain and have sent specific tickets (date, time, squad members) and also have videos of long hours of play on a mission despite the exchange restriction. It's getting very annoying.

If there is a kickbot, it must have a reason but it's a shame to penalize players who don't cheat.

[CoCoLarge]

It may be hard to program for all possible events because of obvious reasons but they could come up with an equation for mission time and bonuses

Edited May 24, 2020 by CoCoLarge

[Graavarg]

On 2020-05-22 at 12:26 AM, GreyDeath789 said:

Long runs (over 5 hours?) usually (?) leads to trade bans because DE auto detect shows too long/too many items collected and assumes it is a bot or some other 'cheat' system.

I am not sure about this theory that it is the overall time or the number of items collected. In my experience what might be detected is mainly two things:

• Someone using glitches, "out of bounds"-ing and/or other gameplay that triggers as glitches/exploits.
• And gameplay that the game detects as something that could be described as "repeated/continuous afk'ing", or possibly as "movement/gameplay scripting". Which is why it is a good idea for all players to kill stuff occasionally/repeatedly when using a camping and/or "hiding" strategy, as only moving around in a camping room might be detected as "afk movement scripting" (which is not allowed). Just standing there as a Nekros with Desecrate on or as a Volt now and then popping off a Discharge is...  let's just say "not the way to go about an endurance run" (not even if occasionally taking a few steps).

So, I don't think it is the length of the mission or a player's normal rewards/drops that trigger this ban, it is a "style" of gameplay that, rightly or wrongly, is detected as "cheating"/"exploiting" (in order to get more rewards/drops than you deserve). 

A lot of players use "legit" stuff for endurance runs, but there is a subset of endurance players (and squads) that come up with stuff that is decidedly borderline (or beyond). And no, not going to explain/describe any such sh*t, I can understand the technical fascination in breaking the game, but while there is stuff you can do without actually hacking/scripting the game I personally think it is a form of cheating. And it is clearly against DE's general "as the game is meant to be played"-policy.

Instead of auto-kicking and banning a player immediately on "detection" (and thus breaking the mission in the progress) DE seems to use a sort of "best-of-two-worlds"-approach: you can use these methods for the time-connected bragging rights/challenge (or whatever), but you will be banned as a signal that it is not a legit way to play the "normal" game. And to stop some players cashing in as a result of "team exploiting" the whole squad is affected.

Anyway, that is my theory. And a trade-ban is actually a pretty mild punishment at that, hardly even a slap on the wrist. Won't (and shouldn't) stop a dedicated record-breaking endurance runner, but might stop someone using questionable methods for farming purposes.

Edited May 28, 2020 by Graavarg

[arolust]

Was Plat among the rewards? Cause thats a common way people are getting banned as its not allowed.

[KnightKrawlur]

I've been away from WF a few weeks now, playing something else.

I decided to check in on the forums and it reminded me the thing I hate most about WF.   How toxic DE is and how badly they treat their customers.

[(PSN)ZephXiii]

I just got trade banned, I afk twice legitimately to take a pee break and a fridge run both not lasting longer than 40secs  on arbitration survival. It was just a casual 160 minute game testing out my kronen prime build. The vitus drops were very low, got 5 arcanes and just Endo. And still I get this crap?? Strike 1 DE. 

[Lutesque]

On 2020-05-21 at 3:46 PM, Traumtulpe said:

Supposedly there is an automatic anti-cheating system in place, that dispenses trade bans if you get too many rewards from a single mission.

Who the Hell is programming this Half Assed Systems ? 

lol... this one is even worse than the Condition that Trips the AFK TImer.... and even then.... 

[Chicken-Biryani]

On 2020-05-21 at 7:09 PM, kyori said:

They want you to play their game.. but not play it for too long. They are concern about your health, your eyesight, your electricity bill etc. lol

lol 😂 

 

To the OP, I have never ran anything this long to have first hand experience but people I have talked to said that long fissures tend to trigger something with anticheat and you gotta ask support to take care of it. But usually by the time support steps in, it's duration has already ran out. 

[Chicken-Biryani]

On 2020-05-30 at 5:44 AM, (PS4)ZephXiii said:

I just got trade banned, I afk twice legitimately to take a pee break and a fridge run both not lasting longer than 40secs  on arbitration survival. It was just a casual 160 minute game testing out my kronen prime build. The vitus drops were very low, got 5 arcanes and just Endo. And still I get this crap?? Strike 1 DE. 

Wow! So you are getting it for runs lasting 180 minutes too? I suppose something is really broken because I haven't heard anyone going less than 6-7 hours complain about this before.