Dev Workshop: Corpus Proxima & The New Railjack

[JimmuTanno88]

Just now, (PSN)Overtkill21 said:

Why should we need to use an Orokin Reactor on the Plexus?

It's not like we have a choice of various Plexuses so we have to decide which to use a reactor on.

We are all going to have the one Plexus, it should already have be maxed on points.

According to the updated post, it will come with one built-in now

[(PSN)Overtkill21]

Just now, JimmuTanno88 said:

According to the updated post, it will come with one built-in now

Well that's good at least, but the Forma thing is straight robbery for anyone that has a maxed Avionics grid.

[(PSN)Overtkill21]

Heck, the mods are going to be straight robbery as well, unless you're telling me 39000 Endo is going to be enough to max out an entire Avionics Grid's worth of those mods - and based on the look of some of them 39000 may not even cover one. Endo to Dirac is not 1:1 in this system you propose unless those mods are cheap as heck to upgrade.

That's not even mentioning the credits cost which isn't addressed as an issue at all.

[JimmuTanno88]

Just now, (PSN)Overtkill21 said:

Heck, the mods are going to be straight robbery as well, unless you're telling me 39000 Endo is going to be enough to max out those mods - and based on the look of some of them 39000 may not even cover one.

That's not even mentioning the credits cost which isn't addressed as an issue at all.

Indeed, it's certainly offputting since such a major focus seemed to be on "reducing grind" in the rework.

[Althaline]

On 2021-03-09 at 7:03 AM, [DE]Rebecca said:

Does the Plexus Need Forma?
While the new Plexus can indeed be upgraded with additional Forma (much like any other equipment you may use), it does come with 3 Base Polarities already. There’s also more Mod Points available without Forma due to the Aura Slot - which gives Modding Capacity like on Warframes! While it is possible to add additional Forma later, the amount of items you will be able to slot from the get-go are quite generous.

In the immortal words of Sprag: "Big mistake, big mistake!"

Seriously, this is an awful change. You're killing build diversity with the usual limitations of Forma, forcing every player to repeatedly re-level their dumb Railjack battery pack, and forcing us to invest a resource that's already over-required for literally all other content.

And you have the gall to use the word "generous"? Nothing about this change is "generous" in the slightest.

[stoty]

Does it means that I need spend 5 formas to 40 lv. like the kuva lich？Please dont!!! Reduce the Attributes of every Plexus mod plz. I hate 5 Polarization.and  Level 40.I spent too much time  for Railjack.I do not really really really try it again .It's too stupid and bored.

On 2021-03-09 at 4:03 AM, [DE]Rebecca said:

Does the Plexus Need Forma?
While the new Plexus can indeed be upgraded with additional Forma (much like any other equipment you may use), it does come with 3 Base Polarities already. There’s also more Mod Points available without Forma due to the Aura Slot - which gives Modding Capacity like on Warframes! While it is possible to add additional Forma later, the amount of items you will be able to slot from the get-go are quite generous

 

[raxorsignus]

I forget one more thing.

Can we move the razorback armada and formorian sabotage into railjack? In the future update?

It's just, we will have our railjack already in the relay. Grinner and Corpus ship will be finished. Maybe the next thing you do is move them.

[(PSN)InSaiyanOne]

I'm sure I'm not the only one saying this, but Gian Point had multiple reasons why it was used so much...let's say the fact that Pennant probably dropped 1 time in almost 50+ missions but I wasn't counting (even when you speed ran it and quit). Let me also point out the malarkey that are Derelicts in Veil Proxima...to get parts for one 'gun' that isn't worth the frustration.

I'd hope I'm not the only person asking what will happen to the completed wreckage we have worked to max (or if we kept certain parts and built them...for their non-maxed stats)? For instance, I have a shield array that I keep because it has low shields (but good stats elsewhere and a matching trait) so when they are down, I do more damage (+25%) and I basically had a set of parts for when I wanted to fly in to railjack missions this way. I'm sure there will be updates on the unique traits that need to be changed (the ones that deal with breaches), but please do not change anything besides the traits on our completed components/armaments. If you want to randomize the bonuses on uncompleted wreckage, I'm sure I'd have an issue with at least one piece but w/e, just not the ones we've already built. I don't know what to even ask about the materials we've already used to repair the parts if repairing parts in the future will cost less. Though I'd rather give those materials up than have you mess with what I fought RNG for and repaired already.

Finally...what about the avionics (not the grid) that are maxed out? Do they all go to 0 endo and we have to level those (mods) up again also? I sure hope the conversion from Dirac to Endo is not unreasonable considering the crazy amount of Dirac I have from farming railjack for Spectra Vandal parts.

 

Good luck DE, I'm rooting for you but just know that I've lost some of the faith after being told that it was too hard for DE to add Legacy Movement Options to consoles. Can't figure out how much work it really takes for that to be "too hard" and it took 7 years to give that answer (and I'm not ignorant to programming). In 7 years it could have been figured out how to swap/remap ["Look Up" & "Look Down"] with ["Move Forward" & "Move Backward"] on the right or left analog controller stick. Did anyone even think of adding it (Legacy Movement Options) to PS5?  Sometimes I think DE is standing too close to the elephant that is Warframe that even things that benefit them get overlooked. It's simple Digital Extreme Developers, add Legacy Movement Options (yes just swap up/down with forward/back on one analog stick and make it an option in configurations) and allow more people to be able to play your game on consoles.

[Leqesai]

3 hours ago, (PSN)Overtkill21 said:

Well that's good at least, but the Forma thing is straight robbery for anyone that has a maxed Avionics grid.

This is pretty dramatic. Forma are very easy to obtain and using them to upgrade our stuff is a tried and true tradition.

I say bring it on.

 

Especially when they are giving endo and other rewards for investing time in maxing the avionics grid. So yeah... cool your jets, Charlie.

[__jag__]

13 hours ago, PublikDomain said:

Does it really solve this? Since the captain determines the engines/hull/shields/reactor/weapons, if they have starter gear it's still a starter ship with starter capabilities no matter what mods you bring as crew. You're not going to be taking this captain into content their ship isn't ready for. And is this even a problem that needs to be solved? If a player has a starter ship, they ought to be doing starter content with starter enemies balanced for their ship. If a stronger player comes in with a maxed Plexus they're going to faceroll that type of content and make it that much less enjoyable for our new captain. Right now if you join a starter ship you're able to help out as a stronger player by boarding or repairing or being helpful, but the mission still runs at the pace of the newer captain. It's akin to down-leveling in a game like Guild Wars 2 to make sure stronger players can't completely ruin the experience for the newbies.

"Starter ship" was pushing it to make a point, but you're right, it's unrealistic. By the way, I don't particularly agree with this change, but I'm trying to understand their point of view. So, let's say it's a ship with some Mk III stuff on it and some choice avionics, (barely) able to survive early Veil Proxima nodes. At that point it'd be nice if you could contribute a bit more, with your vast experience and earned power. So I can see a place for something like the Plexus. Maybe it gives you a flux boost, reduced overheating, maybe an aura with shield/speed boost (I'm sure there are more/better options), all in addition to what the Railjack has, but it appears that the pendulum has swung too far in its direction, taking too much away from the ship.

On a side note, there really ought to be some barrier-to-entry to the higher Proximas for the Railjacks themselves, not just the owner's Intrinsics level(s).

9 hours ago, Leqesai said:

This is pretty dramatic. Forma are very easy to obtain and using them to upgrade our stuff is a tried and true tradition.

I say bring it on.

Robbery of our time, not just the resources. Imagine them saying: "Hey, so we've come up with this new grid system for Warframes, polarity is no longer a thing, you can now rank up slots in addition to mods, so we're going to reset all your Warframes to unranked. No worries though, we'll refund all the resources you needed for those Formas."

[vegetosayajin]

3 minutes ago, __jag__ said:

Robbery of our time, not just the resources. Imagine them saying: "Hey, so we've come up with this new grid system for Warframes, polarity is no longer a thing, you can now rank up slots in addition to mods, so we're going to reset all your Warframes to unranked. No worries though, we'll refund all the resources you needed for those Formas."

You are right, also ... you are wrong to invest time in the previous railjack in the first place, after seeing what a boring pile of ...*beep* it was.
 

[Leqesai]

9 minutes ago, __jag__ said:

Robbery of our time, not just the resources. Imagine them saying: "Hey, so we've come up with this new grid system for Warframes, polarity is no longer a thing, you can now rank up slots in addition to mods, so we're going to reset all your Warframes to unranked. No worries though, we'll refund all the resources you needed for those Formas."

Except they arent doing what you describe. You ate creating a false equivalency to try and compel a dramatic reaction to a very minor inconvenience.

[__jag__]

9 hours ago, vegetosayajin said:

You are right, also ... you are wrong to invest time in the previous railjack in the first place, after seeing what a boring pile of ...poop it was.
 

I actually had fun in Railjack, I've just been waiting for new content and further integration.

 

In fact, I think if they change Flux from a shared pool to an individual pool, and make the side turrets more attractive*, they really don't need to make all these other changes to the Railjack itself once the content and integration is there.

*) Maybe have combat periods where you have to sit still or move slowly, similar to towing the satellite near the Murex but without its fragility (have your ship's shield protects it). Alternatively make the side turrets more of a "spray and pray" thing where accuracy (and thus network latency) is less of an issue.

 

9 hours ago, Leqesai said:

Except they arent doing what you describe. You ate creating a false equivalency to try and compel a dramatic reaction to a very minor inconvenience.

I do like to exaggerate to make a point 😀 Maybe you're right and all we need to do is upgrade our mods and put them into our Plexus and we'll be right back where we were, or close enough. If not though, any Formas I need on top of that will feel like more than a minor inconvenience to me.

[Leqesai]

4 minutes ago, __jag__ said:

I do like to exaggerate to make a point 😀 Maybe you're right and all we need to do is upgrade our mods and put them into our Plexus and we'll be right back where we were, or close enough. If not though, any Formas I need on top of that will feel like more than a minor inconvenience to me.

Honestly it is nice to have something to grind. Having put between 2 to 6 forma on everything in the game i enjoy it. Railjack was a lot of fun until maxing everything out. I would be pretty disappointed if we went into this new patch with nothing to do.

[CoffeeElemental]

11 часов назад, (PSN)True_Reclaimer сказал:

Imagine not wanting PVP and clan wars with frames, in a game called "War Frame" lmao

Been doing exactly that since The Silver Grove update (since then I started actively playing this game). 🙃

But I do agree with you that Warframe is in desperate need of AI improvements.
I was hoping that Steel Path would bring some of that, but noep - it's just a gear check with bullet sponge enemies (tried several SP missions and now I can confidently say - I detest SP).

[(XBOX)ShonOfDawn]

33 minutes ago, CoffeeElemental said:

But I do agree with you that Warframe is in desperate need of AI improvements.

To be fair, the AI is good enough. If you let enemies live for a while, they perform fairly complex actions, like moving inside Nullifier/Ice eximus domes, using cover, etc. The main issue is a lack of complex mechanics- everything dies by being shot in the head, everything kills you with bullets. The only contemplated mechanic is a damage trade, the only stats that matter are survivability and dps. DE should employ many more enemies like the Kuva Guardian (without invulnerability though, just very high dr), Nox and Saxum, which require a small loop to be killed, and the game desperately needs some amount of reaction-based defense: currently most attacks from enemies are hitscan or non-telegraphed AoE, and that reinforces a meta of perma-invincibility by any means necessary. Adding attacks that cannot be tanked reliably, but offer a telegraph and a time window large enough to maybe squeeze in a dodge, can raise engagement in moment to moment combat, and incentivize an active use of mobility, which is arguably the game's strongest aspect. 

[CoffeeElemental]

8 минут назад, (XBOX)ShonFr0st сказал:

If you let enemies live for a while, they perform fairly complex actions

IF 🙂
But yeah, I notice that from time to time too.

 

9 минут назад, (XBOX)ShonFr0st сказал:

DE should employ many more enemies like the Kuva Guardian (without invulnerability though, just very high dr), Nox and Saxum, which require a small loop to be killed

I think, enemy Necramechs can also be included in this list. But then again there're enemy Voidrig's (former) inconsistent invulnerability and mines with - as you said - non-telegraphed AoE. Still pretty fun to fight them tho.

Anyway, I agree with what you said.

[(PSN)Anathema66693]

They nerfed Tether??? Damn, No reason for me to play Railkack anymore

 

[Sebith]

Dear @[DE]Rebecca The only thing that irks me is that energy change. I have no idea why you (devs) forcing that in. I know you want streamline the experience, but i think you pushed too far. It just doesn't make any sense! With so many ways to have infinite energy pool? (dispensary + arcane energize, energy dash) Are people who decide this play the game? Forcing this in, creating specific "meta" that excludes your favorite warframe, creating ability spamfest and imbalance (nerfing battle mods or warframes in result?), having to explain it in game lore. Instead you could just tweak some Flux Energy numbers and get the same result! Reducing energy cost of abilities, having mods increasing energy pool or regeneration rate... You can get same result without this warframe-powering-up-railjack nonsense... It will also be easier to balance later.

On 2021-03-08 at 9:03 PM, [DE]Rebecca said:

This will come pre-installed, no player Reactors required.

Can we also have it leveled to 30, so we don't have to do anything? 🥰

But seriously we have Nightwave going on! Everyone can get a reactor...

[(XBOX)ShonOfDawn]

On 2021-03-08 at 9:03 PM, [DE]Rebecca said:

This means that in addition to existing player strategies, the Forge itself will be regularly outputting large pools of Warframe energy with Player use.  

The problem is the existing player strategies. They are so overwhelmingly powerful that no system "in addition" will ever matter. It doesn't matter if the forge can fully replenish everyone's energy in one click, which I highly doubt it will, as long as it has a cool down, and as long as the forge even is in another room compared to the turrets, energy pad spam + hyldrin/protea + p flow/preparation will be mandatory for anyone pursuing efficiency. And please, don't make us choose between using the frames we like and being efficient. Three separate flux pools, one per battle avionics-capable seat, + forging/passive regeneration achieves the goal you are pursuing without introducing unnecessary balance issues.

But, the tether change looks great. It can now fulfill a proper utility role, and that is great, as it doesn't compete with turrets, it directly encourages their use. 

[chaotea]

On 2021-03-08 at 8:03 PM, [DE]Rebecca said:

o while Tether has changed, so too has most of Railjack. All things in balance, Tenno.

Yea im ok with this. Once i figgured this out RJ became to boaring to bother doing.

[cliffghost]

vor 11 Minuten schrieb chaotea:

Yea im ok with this. Once i figgured this out RJ became to boaring to bother doing.

I'm not ok with this. Tether was the only reason to even play through the Railjack bullS#&$ quickly. To this day, Railjack has not brought me the slightest bit of fun. But since it's now a fixed part of Warframe, I am forced to play this part as well, even if I don't really want to.

Please DE: Can't this part of Warframe be made into its own game, so that we would be rid of part of the player base - especially those who constantly cry that everything is too easy?

[Loza03]

On 2021-03-08 at 8:03 PM, [DE]Rebecca said:

Energy Generation

- The Battle Forge can make Warframe Energy now! This means that in addition to existing player strategies, the Forge itself will be regularly outputting large pools of Warframe energy with Player use.  

With respect, this misses the problem.

The issues innate to Warframe energy as a whole - at first it is too hard to get energy, true. However, it rapidly becomes too easy, universal, and spammable, with energy cost becoming basically a complete non-entity. Without a cost to abilities, the most powerful can be spammed ad infinitum, resulting in the game mode becoming spammy. This is not unique to tether, either.

 

This change does not fix this issue.

[fr4gb4ll]

8 hours ago, cliffghost said:

I still miss some official clarification about the transfer from avionics including ranks to the corresponding mods including corresponding ranks.

I have 53 out of 55 avionics, mostly ranked, and I still fear that they will go into oblivion without proper compensation.

hmm, if it's like with mods, my guess is that we will lose a bit of endo when the maxed avionics are dissolved/changed to an unranked state - meaning when compared to mods, you spend more endo to max them out than you would get back when dissolving this maxed mod afterwards... not sure but i think it might be a loss of about 1/4 of endo spend... might be more for those with more ranks possible.

but ofc, DE just could exchange the maxed avionics with a equaly maxed mod (if they still have the same 'rank' that is...)

but even if we lose some endo this way i won't complain with my 750k of spare endo and the 350k-400k (or more) of dirac adding to this... afterall, we would never have any use of dirac for anything else but to feed helminth (oh damn, that was one resource he didn't want to eat, that picky bugger ^^)

[fr4gb4ll]

ah hell, i'm not going to read through 50 pages for this one:

i'm a bit confused about the the tier-rewards for us 'early' birds on RJ.... is the amount of wreckage the one we actually HAVE in build AND in our possesion (meaning not those we cracked up later when we got better gear) or is it the TOTAL amound EVER that we did build? and if so, where can i see that number (for i'm sure know that i trashed some build stuff quite soon after release and before we got the 'fusion' option for improving). or (and/or?) maybe is the amount just the same as the 'slots' for the wreakage? that at least would be easier to track and also more fair for those who spend the plat on that, even if they don't fill all those slots up - not that it really matter to me if i have to build some silly guns now to reach that 30 wreaks, just wanted to know...